Why Should Jesus Love Me?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554282 Jul 5, 2013
lil whispers wrote:
you do not like what the Bible reads cause you might find some love in it for mankind.
I have no fear of finding any love in your bible. What you call love, I call extortion and sadism.
lil whispers wrote:
I am very qualified at judging whom I shall choose to walk away from
So is a cat.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554283 Jul 5, 2013
Peace_Warrior wrote:
why is it just the Christian Faith and not any others? I don't 'know'... why Christianity is the religion Atheists seem to battle the most.
You really don't know why we focus on Christianity? In the West, it's the only religion we need to defend ourselves from. Consider this:

[1] "Couple Beat Child To Death With “Biblical Rod”"
http://sparethekids.com/2011/08/christian-cou...

"Kevin and Elizabeth Schatz, a white couple from Paradise, California beat their seven-year-old black daughter Lydia because they believed God wanted them to. The couple tortured the child for seven consecutive hours, taking breaks for prayer."

Every single time you see a headline like this in North America, it always turns out that they are talking about Christians, and not Buddhists, for example. That's why.

Here's another reason we concern ourselves with Christianity, and not Jainism, for example:

[2] "Faith healing parents charged with murder, denied bail"
http://www.examiner.com/article/faith-healing...

"[F]aith healing parents Herbert and Catherine Schaible have been charged with the murder of their 8-month-old son, Brandon, and are currently being held without bail. The couple was already on probation after a jury convicted them of involuntary manslaughter in 2010 for the faith healing death of their 2-year-old son, Kent."

Would you like to see more reasons to focus on Christianity rather than Sikhism, for example?

[3] "Nevada: Parents beat son to death for not reading Bible"
http://www.examiner.com/article/nevada-parent...

"Dina Palmer, 27, and Markiece Palmer, 34, were charged with murder, child abuse and neglect following the death of 7-year-old Roderick Arrington Jr., also known as R.J. Reports indicate the child’s death was the result of severe beatings delivered as punishment for failing to read the Bible."

Do you think that we should concern ourselves with Caodaism, for example, as much as Christianity? If so, take a peak at this, yet another reason why we need to focus our efforts on Christianity and not say Druidism or Bahá'í:

[4] "Georgia: Father uses Bible to justify killing son"
http://www.examiner.com/article/georgia-fathe...

"Benjamin Edetanlen claims he disciplined his son according to the Book of Proverbs as found in the Bible. However, that discipline proved fatal."

It is Christianity that threatens and degrades life in the West, and the reason we oppose it. If you want to pray for something worthwhile, pray on behalf of children like Lydia, Brandon, and Roderick that we succeed.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554284 Jul 5, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
how'd you lose your faith in God?
I noticed that there was no god. As I mentioned, it was after my military discharge and move back to California, I realized that the spirit I had felt in the Hagerstown congregation was not that of a god, but that of the people there.

Furthermore, as I also indicated, I had agreed to suspend disbelief to give this god a chance to reveal itself to me and for the apparent contradictions of the bible to resolve themselves. I used the metaphor of a new pair of shoes that didn't fit well at first, but which I wore for a season to give them a chance to fit better.

Once it became clear that I had misunderstood the origins of the initial euphoria, and because those contradictions never resolved themselves over the fullness of time, I kicked off the shoes. To me, that is good thinking.

Let me rephrase it this way: If your god exists, it remained hidden from me despite years of diligently seeking it in good faith. It didn't reach back to me even a little.

You can tell me that that was my fault. Christians generally do that. But if you do, you will be doing what I never did: justifying the failure of the god to deliver what was promised on its behalf, and settling for too little.

Thanks for your interest.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554285 Jul 5, 2013
BIBLE TRUE JEHOVA wrote:
do you have any personal descency or honor of man??????
It's nice that you took a break form your farting or urinating on people to post on decency and honor.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554286 Jul 5, 2013
Le_le wrote:
I agree. My topix "experience" has also colored my view on " believers".. Another great post! You are speaking the truth.. And I am happy you are here. Happy Independence Day..
Thanks, Le_Le. I am happy that you are here, too.

Our original plans had to be scrubbed when our would-be hostess threw out her back in a slip and fall Tuesday night. But our impromptu gathering at the plaza for dinner was excellent. Several friends showed up unexpectedly and joined us. We all celebrated our independence and expressed our gratitude.

I hope you had a nice holiday.

“It's Time. . .”

Since: Jun 13

New Holland

#554287 Jul 5, 2013
G_O_D wrote:
<quoted text>
If 1700 years of mass killing was "small" then the Holocaust was on the molecular scale.
Sorry, RR. You are just pulling the same deceitful crap that Christianity have been excusing its atrocities with for the same 1700 years.
All it does is prove how deceitful and arrogant Christianity and Christians are.
Those people, and the various things they went through, should never be forgotten.

“A Universal Cause”

Since: Feb 09

The Cosmos

#554288 Jul 5, 2013
Part 1 of 2
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You really don't know why we focus on Christianity? In the West, it's the only religion we need to defend ourselves from. Consider this:
[1] "Couple Beat Child To Death With “Biblical Rod”"
http://sparethekids.com/2011/08/christian-cou...
"Kevin and Elizabeth Schatz, a white couple from Paradise, California beat their seven-year-old black daughter Lydia because they believed God wanted them to. The couple tortured the child for seven consecutive hours, taking breaks for prayer."
Every single time you see a headline like this in North America, it always turns out that they are talking about Christians, and not Buddhists, for example. That's why.
Here's another reason we concern ourselves with Christianity, and not Jainism, for example:
[2] "Faith healing parents charged with murder, denied bail"
http://www.examiner.com/article/faith-healing...
"[F]aith healing parents Herbert and Catherine Schaible have been charged with the murder of their 8-month-old son, Brandon, and are currently being held without bail. The couple was already on probation after a jury convicted them of involuntary manslaughter in 2010 for the faith healing death of their 2-year-old son, Kent."
Would you like to see more reasons to focus on Christianity rather than Sikhism, for example?
[3] "Nevada: Parents beat son to death for not reading Bible"
http://www.examiner.com/article/nevada-parent...
"Dina Palmer, 27, and Markiece Palmer, 34, were charged with murder, child abuse and neglect following the death of 7-year-old Roderick Arrington Jr., also known as R.J. Reports indicate the child’s death was the result of severe beatings delivered as punishment for failing to read the Bible."
Do you think that we should concern ourselves with Caodaism, for example, as much as Christianity? If so, take a peak at this, yet another reason why we need to focus our efforts on Christianity and not say Druidism or Bahá'í:
[4] "Georgia: Father uses Bible to justify killing son"
http://www.examiner.com/article/georgia-fathe...
"Benjamin Edetanlen claims he disciplined his son according to the Book of Proverbs as found in the Bible. However, that discipline proved fatal."
Only the tactics of tyrants change... all because ?

A Diran Lyons Political Remix Video: "George W Bush Battles Jesus Christ"
http://www.4thmedia.org/2013/01/28/the-childr...
This is a list of names of innocent children killed by America’s drones.
But behind each name there is the face of a child with a family history in a village in a far away country, with a mom and a dad, with brothers and sisters and friends.
Among the list, are infants of 1, 2, 3 and 4 years old.
In some cases brothers and sisters of an entire family are killed.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-sponsored-gen...
Approximately 3.3 million Iraqis, including 750,000 children, were “exterminated” by economic sanctions and/or illegal wars conducted by the U.S. and Great Britain between 1990 and 2012, an eminent international legal authority says.
The slaughter fits the classic definition of Genocide Convention Article II of,“Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part,” says Francis Boyle, professor of international law at the University of Illinois, Champaign, and who in 1991 filed a class-action complaint with the UN against President George H.W. Bush.
^^^We can't even count anything not reported, or anyone in between.
Barbaric isn't it.

“A Universal Cause”

Since: Feb 09

The Cosmos

#554289 Jul 5, 2013
Part 2 of 2
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
It is Christianity that threatens and degrades life in the West, and the reason we oppose it. If you want to pray for something worthwhile, pray on behalf of children like Lydia, Brandon, and Roderick that we succeed.
It's called freedom in the name of God by use of the Christian faith to justify! I don't support this. Like I said...“I always see things differently - that what doesn't weaken will only strengthen - and my life stands testimony to that fact. Many feel on both sides it's a challenge of faith and character... what's new ? Peace is my Nature and Warrior the Cause... I don't see the advantage of wasting my breath on pettiness due to the things I've had to deal with and still do!“

&li st=PL2xJspzvHg5lMkzgThjdBIyqkv KDBtiH3&index=17
Nuclear Weapons: A Visual Timeline

http://www.aasc.ucla.edu/cab/200708230009.htm...
“The real mortality of the atomic bombs that were dropped on Japan will never be known. The destruction and overwhelming chaos made orderly counting impossible. It is not unlikely that the estimates of killed and wounded in Hiroshima (150,000) and Nagasaki (75,000) are over conservative.”
“At no time during the period between 1943 and 1946 were facilities allotted, or time provided, for the Medical Section of the Manhattan Engineer District to prepare a comprehensive history of its activities. Regulations forbade notetaking. Official records were scanty. There were few charts and photographs.”

^^^ I'm sorry.

“A Universal Cause”

Since: Feb 09

The Cosmos

#554290 Jul 5, 2013
Chess Jurist wrote:
<quoted text>
Need someone to watch the hut while you're away?
Excuse me Chess... you reckon my home is a hut? lol Last when we were together with OYE you were renovating your family mansion! It's cool heh ? Just imagine no bills. No electricity – except solar 1 light between 6-9 pm - no overheads, free land, food and well water. Take Care Bro... I'll blow the conch when we're ready!

“A Universal Cause”

Since: Feb 09

The Cosmos

#554291 Jul 5, 2013
G_O_D wrote:
<quoted text>
People like you are what give me hope for mankind.
You mean there is hope ? lol Wow mankind's suspended.!

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554292 Jul 5, 2013
Mark wrote:
- How can Paul change the words of God and undo what Jesus promised? These words give the disciples the power to drink deadly poison, and then someone else says this is no more. And that person is not his placetaker, but simply someone claiming to have met Christ in a dream. We only have his word for that.

- Why did the disciples of Jesus deem it not worth writing his words down? Most Jews were literate.

- Why did they wait 300 years to make a compilation of Jesus words? Why was this done by people who were again not the place takers of Jesus, but presbyters, who were no more than street evangelists that told all kind of crazy stories, most of whom they invented themselves.

- Why did Jesus use tricks that can easily be faked by magicians but not something that no man could ever fake. Why not leave undeniable proof, like his name on the moon visible for all to see. He claims to have been able to move mountains at will, why not carve his teachings in the mountainside?

- Why did the holy ghost not simply enter in the mind of all people instead of sending a lot of very dubious people, often liars, into the world?

- Why would the God of the Universe bother with us? He is so big that compared to it, our Earth is less than an atom, and we are not even the smallest particle in that atom. Why does he care? We do not care about any cell in our body, let alone a particle in it. Why would he bother with all us small particles in the universe?

- And why would he bother to punish the particles who do not believe in him? Why does a universal god have such big ego? Why is he so small minded and so easily offended? Why is he so unloving? Why is he so stupid that he want to punish the particles that make up his universal body? And why does the universal god only appear when two or more Christian gather? "If two or more atoms gather, I will be there" Really? That does not make a body or a universe.

- Why would he only show interest after billions of years of life on this planet and only after man had been walking around on it for millions of years?

- And why are churches always collecting money? Why can't the pastors not be volunteers just like other people? Is it not enough reward to bring the Gospel? Why do they want money as well?

Just questions any normal free thinking person should ask when someone wants to sell him this religious product, that is mostly a story.
Those are good questions. Each of us has a choice to either take them seriously, or just chase them form our minds and pray for the strength to keep ignoring such issues.

Riverside Redneck asked me why I gave up on the Christian god. I mentioned the cognitive dissonance that questions like these created, which I had hoped would abate with further learning, i.e., "continued wearing of the poor fitting shoes."

The path we take depends on how we process these matters.

“A Universal Cause”

Since: Feb 09

The Cosmos

#554293 Jul 5, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
It's never about age. It's about discipline. It's about learning. It's about me taking care of myself because nobody else can or will.
Would you like to try to take care of me? I'm a handful and more.
lol I think in a way I already am, wild child! <3

'I'm a real wild one
An' I like a wild fun
In a world gone crazy
Everything seems hazy
I'm a wild one
Ooh yeah I'm a wild one'

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554294 Jul 5, 2013
Dr shrink wrote:
You suppose to stimulate masturbate own clitoris before IANS posts
I get that a lot.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554295 Jul 5, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
you have not answered the question WHEN does it go from zygote to fetus to baby? Why is getting an straight answer from you so difficult? Going backwards from 8 months and 29 days when you consider it too far along in the process and it to be an unborn child, what day does it suddenly transform from an unborn child to zygote and based on what in your opinion?
Your argument is the poster child for the continnum fallacy.

From http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Continuum_fallac...

The continuum fallacy ... is the fallacy of assuming that a continuum of possible states between two states means they are not meaningfully different.

The form of the argument is as follows:

X is one extreme and Y is another extreme.
There is no definable point where X becomes Y.
Therefore, there is no difference between X and Y.

When does life begin?

This is possibly the single biggest application of the idea behind the continuum fallacy - because when life begins is, indeed, a very fine continuum. It applies both to the origin of life and also to personhood and abortion. The short answer to both of these is that life does not begin at a single point - hence the continuum.

Where the fallacious use of this continuum occurs is in the anti-abortion argument that life begins at conception - at the stage where a sperm fuses with an egg. But at this point, the emerging embryo is not too dissimilar to any other stem cell. It lacks the complexity of an adult person, and so abortion at an embryonic stage destroys life only in the same sense scratching your own skin and removing (and killing) some cells does.

==========

IANS: The fallacy is also common in evolution arguments. Christians use it to argue that species cannot evolve from other species, as when they ask who were the first humans born to nonhuman parents.

Here is a nice illustration of the fallacy at http://i.imgur.com/xWpvw.jpg where one could use the argument to insist that red is the same as blue because there is no instant when red distinctively becomes blue.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554296 Jul 5, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
i actually should have said "kill" not "murder" to be technical as abortion is legal
We continually hear Christians complaining about murdering babies to describe what is not murder being done to what are not babies. It's par for the course.

As with your continuum fallacy, it's all equivocation, or blurring significant distinctions and treating two different things as if they were the same thing.

“A Universal Cause”

Since: Feb 09

The Cosmos

#554297 Jul 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You really don't know why we focus on Christianity? In the West, it's the only religion we need to defend ourselves from.
If that is the reasons why skeptics or atheists or whatever anyone calls their own belief systems feel, I can appreciate the distress. But I cannot ignore the bigger picture that has been shaping up since the 2nd world war which would be considered 'our time' and not history of 1,000 or 3 or even 10.000 years ago.

Consider this... You worry about the little things while I/we - believers or not - deal with the big ones. If you only care about life in the west, we care about the planet as a whole.

Christianity like all things is no more exempt from their guilt and lack of morality when it exists than anyone one else on the planet.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
It is Christianity that threatens and degrades life in the West, and the reason we oppose it. If you want to pray for something worthwhile, pray on behalf of children like Lydia, Brandon, and Roderick that we succeed.
I will have nothing more to say on these matters nor account for anyone outside of myself when it comes to my faith. But I will defend the innocent children of this earth, for they truly do suffer the mistakes of their fathers. So don't tell me who to pray for if even you are included in the planet. As everyone is somebody's child.

Faith without works has always been dead, but many of us act on what we believe, and always have.

Thank you for caring about the children.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554298 Jul 5, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
I am not going to search for your post
Then your claim about it is rejected out of hand.
Skombolis wrote:
The relevant point is you continue to stereotype and engage in blanket bigotry despite the fact on even a place like Topix there a quite a few Christians you like.
You just shot your argument about me being an anti-Christian bigot in the foot. I have said repeatedly that it is Christianity that is my target, not Christians. You just confirmed that.
Skombolis wrote:
So how can anybody being honest with himself still justify his bigoted positions? Although I suppose expecting a bigot to answer is pointless or he wouldn't be a bigot in the first place. It takes hatred and ignorance to be a bigot and the truth plays little to no role.
Keep shooting.
Skombolis wrote:
You don't need an old post for this question. You like Epi, Grace Walker, Irrira, Blind Man, LeLe and consider them Christians right?
You have been an amazing specimen to examine.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554299 Jul 5, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
Sure your problems are with Christians You are a bigot an an a$$hole to people of faith...what do you expect?
Your foot is still bleeding from the last time you made this claim. You just finished enumerating many Christians that I have little or no problem with.
Skombolis wrote:
I simply don't like you because I don't like bigots.
No, you don't like me because I of the way I treat you, which was a reaction to the way you treated me and continue to treat me. I have never cared for your slander, usually in the form of "bigot" or "liar."

As usual, you have forgiven yourself and see yourself as an innocent. As usual, you have shifted the blame to others. Nothing is your fault. Doctors made you a drug addict, and bad lawyers put you in prison. And by your reckoning, our problems with one another have all been my fault as well. You see the two of us as nothing more than a great Christian and an anti-Christian bigot.

Of course, if there were any truth to that, either you would be on the list of Christians that I like, or nobody would be. The reason I have a list of Christians I like and that you are not on it is obviously because of who you are, not because I hate all Christians. Obviously.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554300 Jul 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
I'm not really interested in trying to discuss anything with you any more. It's not possible. I can only contradict your comments or post about you.
Skombolis wrote:
Anything else you are capable of discussing?
Another fine example of your difficulty with language, and why it is pointless discussing matters with you as if you could understand my words and give meaningful replies to them. You can't.

So, I merely correct your errors, as I did with your continuum fallacy and your argument about me being an anti-Christian bigot rather than a critic of Christianity, or I editorialize about you as I am now and as I did when I referred to your shifting the blame for your own mistakes onto others.

How did you like this discussion?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#554301 Jul 5, 2013
Khatru wrote:
Great post! One which shows just how afraid religious leaders were of believers asking questions.
Here are a few more:

"Empty your minds of secular knowledge." - John Chrysostom, Holy Hierarch of Constantinople

"Scripture gives no false information." - St Augustine of Hippo

"Since God has spoken to us it is no longer necessary for us to think." - St Augustine of Hippo

"Ignorance is the mother of piety" - Pope Gregory I
It's easy to see how believers were brainwashed people with those sort of teachings.
Thanks, and thanks for the quotes. They have been added to my "On Reason and Intelligence in Christianity" file. Here are a few more for you:

[1] "The word brain is not mentioned in the Christian Bible, Old Testament or New" - anon.

[2] "It is the inevitable effect of religion on public policy that makes it a matter of public concern. Advocates of religiosity extol the virtues or moral habits that religion is supposed to instill in us. But we should be equally concerned with the intellectual habits it discourages." - Wendy Kaminer

[3]“I do not think it is necessary to believe that the same God who has given us our senses, reason, and intelligence wished us to abandon their use, giving us by some other means the information that we could gain through them”- Galileo Galilei

[4]”Christianity demands the crucifixion of the intellect.”- Søren Kierkegaard

[5]”Ignorance is to religion what horse manure is to the garden.”– anon

[6]“If the man doesn't believe as we do, we say he is a crank, and that settles it. I mean, it does nowadays, because now we can't burn him.”- Mark Twain

[7]“We would be 1,500 years ahead if it hadn't been for the church dragging science back by its coattails and burning our best minds at the stake.”- Catherine Fahringer

[8] "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin

[9] "As people become more intelligent they care less for preachers and more for teachers." -- Robert G. Ingersoll

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