Why Should Jesus Love Me?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#534369 May 15, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Typical.
I criticize your church, you take it personally, and try to strike out at me personally. You people have very little character. You don't have much reserve, You decompensate over nothing.
I am so used to this that I just don't care to even try not to offend you. It's impossible if I criticize what you consider sacred. So who cares what you consider sacred, ro how you'll respond to criticism of it?
If you can't take the heat, maybe you should be in places where only Christians go, like church. This isn't such a place.
Incidentally, the Dimwit can mope all he likes.
LOL

You are really going to play the victim now?

Poor ians, he has given up even trying because clearly in the past he has gone so far out of his way not to offend and it hasn't helped!

You have been an aggressive, hateful, bigoted douchebag who has come here to insult people and attack our faith 99.9% of your posts, that's why people have an adverse reaction to you now Taint. It is a little late to make a first impression

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#534370 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
Huh. Interesting concept.

"Our immediate and current actions may not be the result of free will, like having to crossing terrain, physical limitations, or that we do have to eat and sleep, etc. But, reflecting on those actions and what we did once and what we had little choice in during that first encounter, and will do, allows us to modify how we react to those relatively immutable aspects of physical existence we face. So I think we do have a modicum of free will in that respect.

But, no matter how we may choose to traverse or encounter something in the future, and even currently, if it's a mountain, for instance, we still have to cross it, or go around it, or dig a tunnel through it. If we still must go from point A to B and if the mountain or crossing a river is a part of that point A to B trip, we have little free will in that respect." -Scar

Isn't a "modicum of free will" having free will?

If you have two dollars in your pocket, would you say that you have two dollars in your pocket AND you have no money?

When you play chess, the laws determine the moves you can make but not the moves you WILL make. They don’t force a particular outcome for the game. You have free will to play it our however you want - within the rules of the game.

“I.Spirit.Son.God”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#534371 May 15, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL
You are really going to play the victim now?
Poor ians, he has given up even trying because clearly in the past he has gone so far out of his way not to offend and it hasn't helped!
You have been an aggressive, hateful, bigoted douchebag who has come here to insult people and attack our faith 99.9% of your posts, that's why people have an adverse reaction to you now Taint. It is a little late to make a first impression
true thing writer! ironic he come in here attacking you with the most hateful spews, yet is you one of only a few people that even give him the time of day now. whatever he hoped to accomplish on this billboard, he failed so spectacular he is a site to stare at.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#534372 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
if Peter had chosen differently,then the Jesus! would have been a false Prophet, no?
Peter DID choose, scar. You're missing that.

Jesus simply knew what he was going to choose.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#534373 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text> That truly is the literal position of the atheist.
The questions posed by the atheist to the theist regarding the deity you worship are based in your religious mythology stories and deity attributes within that story.
<quoted text>
Isn't that the eventuality you look forward to in your "heaven"? I dunno, there are differing views within Christianity concerning that.
<quoted text>
Sure, as in:
"Never impose on others what you would not choose for yourself." – Confucius 500 BCE.
I understand you view it as "religious mythology".

You don't need to say it or my "myth" every post.

If you like I can preface every single post to you with, "I know you have made yourself into your own God" and "I understand you are too prideful to consider there might be a power in the universe greater than yourself but..."

Or we can simple have an adult exchange. I honestly do think you are trying. I think with some of you, it is just so ingrained into your psyche to be combative when it comes to discussing religion that you almost can't help yourselves

Anyway, no I don't believe we lose free will in heaven. However there will be no desire to sin as it will be an eternal state of bliss. Although I guess it is an interesting question so far as in losing our human nature does certain parts of our thinking go away as well, such as wanting to sin?

It is actually a very good question. Heaven is described as this:

Revelation 21:4, 27
‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’b or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.

Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life."

Does the desire to sin disappear because the situation is so perfect and we are happy or does the desire to sin disappear because we shed our human nature in which we would think differently and be more enlightened yet without losing free-will?

I don't know. That is actually something i will have to look into

“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#534376 May 15, 2013
Morning.....Oh Wait....It is 1:30 in the afternoon....LOL

“All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent.”

~ Thomas Jefferson

Thought for the Day

“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#534377 May 15, 2013
Today's Prayer

"Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour" (1 Pet. 5:8). Dear Lord, I am so aware of how Satan picks at me and tries to trip me all the time. I know there are spiritual dangers around me. Please help me to remain alert and to be under the Holy Spirit's control at all times. I want to draw near to You, so the devil will flee. Please protect my family and me from harm and evil. Thank You for Your love, concern, and protection. In Jesus' name, amen.

Prime time with God

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#534378 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I need evidence that would convince all theists and nontheists, equally, once they're seen the evidence.
No special conditions required to believe, no suspension of reason or illogical circumstances are necessary, etc..., in order to believe.
I need the same type evidence that suffices for water. Water has a composition, it can be tested, and known to be water. Anyone on the earth can understand using the exact same methods used to verify that water is indeed water, and the result is the same.
That isn't asking for special considerations, that's asking for convincing and unbiased evidence that is compelling to anyone viewing it, to warrant a belief or acceptance of the evidence as what it is said to be.
You will never have the same type of evidence of God that suffices for water.

I know you'll now say that tells you that God isn't real.

But you will also never have the same type of evidence of love that suffices for water.

But since you've felt love, you know it's real. Even though you can't prove it.

THAT is your special pleading, you want evidence of God that's he same as a physical object.

Why?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#534379 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text> Sure, lets remove any deity/religious connotations.
What you pose is still conjecture. Where your situation enters into conjecture, begins with the assumption that if people had no free will, we'd be aware of that. Then you leap to automatic innocence because the assumption is made we'd think, if "Billy" murdered a person:
"Eh, Billy has no free will, he's innocent".
<nods from the people at the murder scene>
"By gum he's right, we ain't got no dang ole' free will, get outta here, Billy, hit ain't yore fault"
So...
There are people in our society, who are insane, psychopaths, sociopaths, mentally deficient or inferior, etc..., who have committed crimes, and it's easy to see we hold them responsible. Even if they aren't aware of what they did.
Do we withhold the death penalty in some instances? Certainly.
Do we separate them from society? Yes, we hold them responsible.
Okay, I don't think if all people had no free will, we'd even know that we had no free will(conjecture of my own, but logical). We wouldn't even know what free will was if we didn't have it, and further, we'd have to know we lacked free will to feel as if we aren't responsible.
However, we do know that when we identify a person who is inescapably compelled, that cannot exert free will to stop doing whatever crimes, or single crime they commit.
We hold them responsible, because we do understand what free will is.
Even when, and especially so, we determine that free will-less person lacks that(free will) and commits a crime, we act accordingly.You know, Arsonists and others might be exemplary citizens, they don't jaywalk, shoplift, break speed limits etc...
But when it comes to arson, for instance, they cannot choose to not commit a crime. In those cases we don't say they are innocent. Because they aren't. They committed a crime. Even though they lacked the free will to not set fire to a building.
Even for those people who are completely unaware of what they did.
We... hold them responsible.
You are not understanding the difference between mens rea and voluntarily. It may seem subtle but it is very distinct and important

If we had no free will, we couldn't be held responsible. That is very different than being insane. Being insane prevents someone from acting with guilty intent but free will would prevent someone from acting voluntarily. They are two very different things

Its no big deal, I am not going to pursue this one further

“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#534380 May 15, 2013
Encouraging Words....

For the Lord God is our sun and our shield. He gives us grace and glory.

Psalm 84:11a

K-Love

“Jesus is coming soon”

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#534382 May 15, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
Today's Prayer
"Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour" (1 Pet. 5:8). Dear Lord, I am so aware of how Satan picks at me and tries to trip me all the time. I know there are spiritual dangers around me. Please help me to remain alert and to be under the Holy Spirit's control at all times. I want to draw near to You, so the devil will flee. Please protect my family and me from harm and evil. Thank You for Your love, concern, and protection. In Jesus' name, amen.
Prime time with God
Amen.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#534383 May 15, 2013
Mark wrote:
religious psychopaths

Their God in itself is a pure fictional construct

the Romans rulers were psychopaths

The monotheistic überGod as presented by Christianity is a lie

He was constructed to make people into slaves

a forest spirit will have some control over the forest

The Christian God was created after the image of the emperor

Julius Caesar.(JC = Jesus Christ = Julius Caesar)

Christians are spiritually brain dead

quoting from their "magic" book of God

You talk about God like you know him, but it is a splendid lie.

Christians lack honesty.

Christianity it is nearly absent.

Christianity created an artificial concept of honesty

Christian can thus lie as much as he wants

the truthfulness of the psychopath.
LMMFAO!

You know my favorite part? This:

"You talk about God like you know him"

It's, uh..........spelled "hypocrite", btw.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#534384 May 15, 2013
trifecta1 wrote:
<quoted text>You give new meaning to the word Stupid.
Find me forums on the internet like topix or on topix, where Christians are arguing with thousands of writings against the gods you mentioned, just like the atheists are writings thousands of writings against a God they supposedly believe is a myth. Not the website of the Vatican Church library filled with books and located in Rome, Italy.
You don't see the difference? or do I have to break it down further?
Thank you for demonstrating that you are incapable of having an intelligent conversation. I leave you to your fantasy world.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#534386 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text> Sure, but you're talking about a man made document.
>We< are talking about your assertion the bible is a deity inspired book and world, perfect and without error or free will manipulation or influence...*these days*...(mostly).
<quoted text>
Again, see above.
Again, that Christians believe the Bible to be the word of God has literally nothing to do with my point

My point was we wouldn't sacrifice the Bill of Rights over any one situation, it is too valuable. Our freedoms are bigger than any one person or situation

And in that same way of thinking is how we value free-will. Yeah it would be nice to see a murder stopped or whatever but one situation no matter how big is never more valuable than our free-will.

So just like we may not like someone having a KKK parade, we make that trade-off because Freedom of Speech is too important

And not wanting to be turned into mindless robots is why our free-will is more important than God intervening to stop any one act. Because for God to intervene He would have to kill someone or change how they think or whatever. And God allows us to be who we are,for better or for worse in this life and take the consequences that go with it. And deep down nobody really wants it any different

Whether Christians believe the bible is true isn't connected to this in any way nor does it matter the bill of rights in a man-made document while believers feel the Bible is the word of God. It is simply some things, the bigger picture is always more important

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#534388 May 15, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
True, the Dimwit isn't worth much, but I've made a commitment to help him, and I won't let him down.
Somebody should have taken more interest in him when he was younger, and taught him some manners. He could have learned more easily if he had been gently prodded in the right direction with a little rebuking on the schoolyard.
But now he's a hardened a-hole, so it will take much more love to help him. But I'll be there for him though thick and thin, busting his balls until he learns what contrition means.
Why? Because caring is what I do.
LOL

Its alright "doc"

By the time your retirement is over I will have you at least as good as a doctor coming out of med-school

Too bad for your patients and those "thousands of scripts' you wrote for addictive pain medications that you didn't know what the hell you were doing. Or maybe you knew exactly what you were doing and were just a legal drug dealer. I guess you got your money and took off to Canada which was probably the plan all along. Probably makes you harder to sue too.

It is one thing not to care about your patients and clearly you didn't care about the Hippocratic oath (if any of your stories are even true) but you wrote thousands of addictive pain medicine prescriptions and as a doctor didn't know they make someone physically addicted and told yourself they were just mentally weak when it destroyed their lives

Caring is the opposite of what you do Pharm-pimp

We can do better

Since: Apr 08

Watford, UK

#534389 May 15, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, the whole freewill thing is laughable.
This is my favorite example of that.
Matthew 26:34
34.) Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, Peter--this very night, before the rooster crows, you will deny three times that you even know me."
Peter had to do that, no?
But wait, if he didn't, the the Jesus! would have given a false prophecy.
Peter had no choice.
I like when the Jesus! told Peter he would deny him three times before morning.
Could Peter have done any different? If so, how could the Jesus! be a god?
No, if Peter had done differently, the Jesus! couldn't have been the god. Not according to the bible. The moment the Jesus! said it would happen, it became prophecy. Peter had no freewill in the matter, he >had< to deny the Jesus! three times, as specified. If it didn't happen, then the Jesus! would have been a false prophet. And certainly not the god.
That notion of freewill that's said to exist within Christianity is nonexistent. Each time a prophecy is made by the god, there are conditions and requirements that humans are bound to follow or fulfill. There is no freewill within those conditions. If the deity says a thing or things will happen, it must happen as said and the participants must do as foretold, no?
And also, the god is trapped by what it knows it must do. What it can only do. It supposedly has a "plan", and prophesies conditions and components of that plan or prophecy. Then - it - must follow those conditions it has put forth. Whether the Christian wants to say that the god has known what will happen from it's vantage "outside of time", or some other bizarre explanation they'll give, in all instances, the deity must do as it either sees it will do, or does. No matter if it is outside of time, or smack dab in the thick of time, it can only do what it says it will do.
Adds a twist to "I am that I am".
(and only can be)
Great post!

So everytime a prophecy is made, freewill goes out the window.

I'll remember that.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#534390 May 15, 2013
Mark wrote:
We have to kinds of knowledge. Personal (subjective) knowledge and objective (impersonal) knowledge.
For me, knowledge comprises useful ideas - ideas that describe or predict experience.

Ideas that can't do that, such as ideas about angels in other worlds, are not knowledge. They may be entertainment, as with sci-fi or song lyrics. If they are mistaken for knowledge - that is, if one mistakenly thinks that these ideas map some aspect of reality, then they are errors or delusions.

Yes, there is subjective knowledge. I like chocolate ice cream more than vanilla. That's a fact, but doesn't apply to reality until I reword it: "Some people like chocolate better than vanilla," or "there exists at least one person (me) that prefers chocolate."

Nevertheless, for me at least, the idea is knowledge, becasue it describes my experiences in the past with these two flavors, and predicts future experience if I have to make a choice between them.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#534391 May 15, 2013
Why should Jesus not love you?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#534392 May 15, 2013
Mark wrote:
Ever since rational thinking was introduced we tried to create an artificial construct, called "objective knowledge" based on shared definitions, shared axioms, and shared observation. Personal Experience is replaced in this by shared observations.
I still have personal experience. I'd say that it has been supplemented by reports of the personal experience of others,not replaced. If I can identify which ideas of others are likely to describe or predict reality for me as they claim that they have for them, then they have helped me.
Mark wrote:
Experiencing the spirituality of beings can only be done by sufficient spiritual people. The mind itself is the sensory organ here. It is the same as saying, I can hear frequencies of 25000hz, or see ultra violet colours, or taste the most subtle fragrances. That it is not objective (shared observation), but that does not make it untrue, unreal. It is very real.
Even when true, it would be irrelevant to somebody that never has that experience, nor is able to benefit from you having it.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#534393 May 15, 2013
Mark wrote:
Both pastors and flock lack spirituality.
You're preaching to the choir here.
Mark wrote:
Understand that wise men even though they were the most literate, purposely avoided to write spiritual knowledge down. They understood it would be misunderstood and misused by less spiritual people.
That doesn't ring true. Anything worth knowing can also be misunderstood, and possibly misused, but it's no disincentive to write it down, short of things like instructions on how to make a bomb.

But spiritual knowledge? They can write what they know for the benefit of those that can profit from it without worrying about those that can't.
Mark wrote:
They kept there knowledge secret to all except students that showed enough spirituality and character. Because this knowledge, as history has shown us, is pretty powerful and can easily misused.
What part of history shows us how this recondite spiritual knowledge is powerful? When has spiritual knowledge easily been misused?

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