Why Should Jesus Love Me?

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534140 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
And by the same token if we had no free will then man would not be responsible for anything he did. Hitler would be innocent. Stalin would be innocent
What a weak argument. It's the excluded middle or black and white fallacy. You will only consider two options, when there are certainly more.

So, lets look at that, no deity intervened, mankind stopped Hitler, Stalin helped(and Soviet forces lost from 8.7 million to as high as 20 million plus+ by estimates, and time eventually stopped Stalin.

No deity involved.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534141 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
They want it both ways. They want to blame God if man doesn't have free will and blame him if he does
That's your theistic view. I don't intend this as a slight, but I understand it is difficult for theists to conceptualize not believing there is a deity...

..."Somewhere"...

Even trifecta has stated to the effect it must have been a deity, or, an "Intelligent Designer" that created "all".
trifecta1 wrote:
Everything comes from God or an Intelligent designer.
For trifecta, there is no other alternative. Maybe she meant the same thing(the Abrahamic deity), but, within the "Intelligent Design" hypothesis, the proponents clearly state they do not mean "god".

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534142 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
it is so much easier to see that people are responsible for their own actions.
I agree, completely, no matter how much you try to misconstrue what I say. We have limited free will, but within that constraint, we are responsible for, and make every decision or choice.
Skombolis wrote:
And God will eventually hold people accountable for their actions. But He gives everybody a shot with the gift of human life. If we wish to continue past that point, He has told us what needs to happen
That's your theistic belief.

Different from other theistic(different deity) beliefs, too.

All you can do is "strongly assert" your deity does anything.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534143 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
And even more ironic is they really don't even want what they claim. God says homosexuality is immoral. So should God intervene and turn everyone straight? They want God to intervene but only when they say and in the situations they approve of.
I can't speak for all atheists, but I can say that for myself and many atheists, there is no expectation or belief that a deity is responsible for anything.

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#534144 May 14, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Fool.
It's good to see that you're finally seeing in yourself what most of us have known about you for a long long time. That's progress for you little fella.

Remember, baby steps little fella baby steps. You just might get there someday. We'll all be pulling for you.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534145 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
God doesn't answer to man.
Your deity doesn't answer anything. That's the nature of myth and nonexistence. Lots of stories, no evidence.

All the while theists insist it must be true.
Skombolis wrote:
It is the other way around
(T) Peace
Man answers himself. Man oft times creates his problems, and resolves those mistakes and problems. Man has never had assistance from any of the deity figures he imagines there to be.

Unless there is some sort of non biased evidence or proof you're aware of that hasn't been divulged.

If not, you might as well worship Superman, talk about Superman's attributes, tell me that Superman finds my non belief blasphemous, and that I'm an unwitting minion of... THE JOKER!.

To which I would respond, based upon the evidence:

"I don't have that belief"

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534146 May 14, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Don't you dare ever accuse me of forgetfulness, this is an excerpt from YOUR post from about an hour ago.
"It isn't. It's simplistic. It is from the worldview of a people from that time who thought that is what the world was."
===
Did you see the part where you wrote that *you* found it simplistic?? No? Odd...
Then you follow a few paragraphs later with:
"Right, I think it can be safely said that no one understands it, although many claim to understand it beyond a doubt."
===
So I ask AGAIN. Which is it, simplistic or no one understands it?
You obviously didn't or haven't read this post, or if you did, you didn't understand it.

http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/T0N0LOR...

Try reading it again.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#534147 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
1)drug addiction definition
http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.c...
2) Advantages of Opiate Addiction Treatment Method
PHYSICAL ADDICTION to heroin and methadone are removed at once during one treatment that lasts for 4-6 hours.
http://www.doctorhiller.com/en/addiction-trea...
3) pure health group
PHYSICAL ADDICTION refers to the symptoms that occur when substance abstinence is undertaken.
http://www.purehealthgroup.com/harmful-effect...
4) Opiate Withdrawal « Narcotic.net – Call 800-281-9007 For HelpWith narcotics, and especially with opiates, real physical addiction does occur.
http://narcotic.net/opiates/opiate-withdrawal
I don't care what you found on the Internet. If your sources contradict the pain medicine literature, they are wrong.

Every one of the following contradicts whatever nonsense you have found confusing addiction and dependence. Anybody that makes that mistake should be ignored, including you.

Every one of these clearly distinguishes between physical dependence and psychological addiction. Why do you suppose that they do, but that your garbage does not?

http://snipurl.com/271pcl7
http://www.naabt.org/faq_answers.cfm...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Substance_use_di...
http://panicdisorder.about.com/od/treatments/...
addictionscience.net/b2evolution/blog1.php/20...
http://www.prescriberesponsibly.com/topics/pr...

And here's a reference from me at http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/TOCO8TE...

"pain professionals have been trying to standardize the language ... there is plenty of contradictory stuff out there. But the pain people are pretty uniformly doing it like this, and it makes sense. I was in that once. Part of our job was to standardize this language. We also wanted people to know the difference between addiction and dependence, or dependence and tolerance, or tolerance and pseudotolerance, and addiction and pseudoaddiction."

Here's the bottom line, fool. I worked in the field for over a decade. I have written thousands of narcotic prescriptions. I have studied textbooks and journal articles on the matter extensively, and passed the boards for Hospice and Palliative Medicine, which qualifies me to give expert testimony in a court of law on this subject. There is no credential that outranks that one. Addiction medicine specialists are equally qualified to discuss this topic.

But not you. You are a junkie. Got it?

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534148 May 14, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh yeah? Then why do you post a 4000 character post attempting to "prove" that we have no free will from God?
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle

Just going by what is posited in your mythic bible.

We've been over this before, and yet you'll ask this type question over and over, either actually believing I believe in your deity, or feigning the position for theatrics.

I vote it's theatrics, plain and simple, else you are similar to a stob in the ground.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#534149 May 14, 2013
Thomas doubts.

John 20:26
And after eight days again his diciples were within and Thomas with them:then came Jesus the doors being shut and stood in the midst and said,peace be unto you.

John 20:27
Then saith he to Thomas,Reach hither thy finger and behold my hands;and reach hither thy hand and thrust it into my side;and be not faithless but believing.

John 20:28
And Thomas answered and said unto him My Lord and My God.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534150 May 14, 2013
high end wrote:
<quoted text>
Whoa!
I'm not an atheist but I sure love reading your stuff.
:)
Thanks, now I'm humbled and at a loss for what to say..

hahaa...

Yeah, everyone, mark it down.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534151 May 14, 2013
scaritual wrote: You said it right there:
"Many, many variables dictate our path and what options will be available"
Right, we have the illusion of free will. Within that illusion, we are limited in the choices we make.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
OK, you don't believe in free will and you don't believe in God.
I didn't say I don't think we have no free will, only that it is limited.

I have no belief there is a deity.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Do you believe in fate or destiny?
No.

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#534152 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
You are wrong.
You are wrong.
Skombolis wrote:
Addiction ALWAYS means dependence.
No it doesn't.
Skombolis wrote:
The only reason it can be described as one or thed other is if someone has not yet become physically addicted due to prolonged use.
Addiction is physiological, because psychological is physiological. There is a difference between the psychological aspect and the chemical dependency. Each can exist without the other, which is why it is important to distinguish between the two.
Skombolis wrote:
Once the use reaches whatever timeframe (that varies per individual) they will become physically addicted. That is an absolute undisputed fact.
What are you even talking about?

Caffeine, opiates, marijuana, alcohol? Gambling? Shopping?
Skombolis wrote:
At some point, prolonged opiate usage will turn into physical addiction. There is just no way around that reality
I can agree that prolonged opiate usage should lead to chemical dependency, but a person in a vegetative state could become chemically dependent without ever becoming addicted.

That's why these two words need to be used differently. They refer to different things. If you don't use these words, you will have to use others to describe what they describe, and they will not be technically interchangeable.

If you can agree that "psychological addiction" and "physical addiction" can each exist without the other, your argument is a semantic one. If we can draw a line between these two labels, we can draw a line between addiction and dependence.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#534153 May 14, 2013
John 18:37

Pilate therefore said unto him.Art thou a king then?Jesus answered Thou sayest that I am a King.To this end was I born,and for this cause came I into the world that I should bear witness unto the truth.Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

_-Alice-_

Since: Apr 13

Location hidden

#534154 May 14, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
We have limited options, not just logistically, but also in our perceptions. We have the illusion that we can freely choose among these options autonomously. For the most part, that is not the case.
We may choose to go hiking because we like hiking because we went hiking with the family as a kid because our parents liked hiking because their parents never went hiking but our parents' friends went hiking and told stories about having fun hiking, which they did because their parents lived near a national forest that was saved as a national forest by a man that was concerned about responsible forestry management after witnessing the adverse effects of stripping the land bare by people that wanted to get the most profit out of a piece of land and they could because there was no regulating body to prevent them from doing that plus the demand for lumber was so great because of the.....and so on and so on all the way to the Big Bang, and maybe....BEYOND!
We'll never know how many bazillion contributing factors come in to play for the simplest decisions we make.
I like shiny things.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#534155 May 14, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
It's ridiculous. Creationists based that 6,000 year guess on the assumption that the six days if creation were a literal 144 hours.
So. Then you are saying that your bible is not a reliable source for facts.

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#534156 May 14, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
Edit Tide...and while I can understand a layperson with no firsthand knowledge not being aware of this (many ppl dont understand addiction and think someone can simply will themselves to be healthy) it is unexcusable for a doctor not to know the facts
Your understanding is juvenile.

I would have trusted the internist over the drug addict anyways, but I happen to know a little about addiction. Even if I didn't, I can read and evaluate information.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's teapot

#534157 May 14, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
We have limited options, not just logistically, but also in our perceptions. We have the illusion that we can freely choose among these options autonomously. For the most part, that is not the case.
We may choose to go hiking because we like hiking because we went hiking with the family as a kid because our parents liked hiking because their parents never went hiking but our parents' friends went hiking and told stories about having fun hiking, which they did because their parents lived near a national forest that was saved as a national forest by a man that was concerned about responsible forestry management after witnessing the adverse effects of stripping the land bare by people that wanted to get the most profit out of a piece of land and they could because there was no regulating body to prevent them from doing that plus the demand for lumber was so great because of the.....and so on and so on all the way to the Big Bang, and maybe....BEYOND!
We'll never know how many bazillion contributing factors come in to play for the simplest decisions we make.
I agree, completely.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#534158 May 14, 2013
trifecta1 wrote:
<quoted text>But don't you see the dilemma? if your threshold is the holocaust, another person's threshold could be...car accidents, or bank robberies, or an illness.
I think (if your deity is real) he should eradicate any and all life from the planet if the very slightest infraction(like calling someone names) occurs.
Have your deity come and talk with me Trifecta. I think it's the best way, an I can convince him of it. I mean it isn't like he hasn't already done this before, is it?
Let me know what he says, and where he wants ya meet me.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#534159 May 14, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Well said. I was going to respond to Catcher, but you beat me to it.
It must really feel good not ta have ta climb out of that box yer in with that crank on the side of it!
hahahahah!

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