Why Should Jesus Love Me?

Since: Jan 08

HAVANA CUBA

#507430 Mar 21, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
Encouraging Words....
Don't worry about anything; instead, pray about everything. Tell God what you need, and thank him for all he has done.
Philippians 4:6
K-Love
think we all know who was responsible for that, the Godless liberals who cannot stand having their immorality shoved back in their ugly face!! The defenders of free thought, the Big Bang theory and evolution, are not only striking out at me, but at all Christians.. Last night, while I was sitting on my front-porch swing, gazing up at Heaven, President Bush appeared to me in a vision. He told me that my work was not yet finished, there were still many liberals who had not yet seen the glory of the coming of the Lord!! President Bush would not be in the White House right now if God didn't want him there. President Bush was put in a position of leadership in order to wipe the devil's religion of Islam off the face of the Earth, so that the Christian God can fill the world with His message of peace and love. President Bush has stated numerous times that he speakes with God in the Oval Office, he even asked God for military advice before the invasion of Iraq. Modern liberalism is the equivalent of atheism, liberals are in favor of killing babies, raising taxes, teaching evolution, and same sex marriage. Jesus is opposed to all of these horrible things

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507431 Mar 21, 2013
NoStress4me wrote:
If you do not understand why what you said was offensive to me, then it is not a reflection of your character imo. If I keep having to explain why I found it to be offensive, I believe that it is a reflection of your character.
Really? If I can't understand you, that reflects on my character? How about you? You don't seem to understand me much. Is that a character flaw in you? Can you be trusted around children and money?

You don't have to explain to me why you're offended. Why do you think otherwise?

Let me point out to you that while offending you is not my purpose, my opinions are offensive to most Christians, and my choices are to stifle them, or to express them anyway. I choose to express them,but have to limit that to safe environments, like cyberspace.

In meat space, I seldom express such opinions to Christians, since as you well know, Christians, though quick to condemn almost anything non-Christian as "the world" (generally spoken while expectorating) or "an abomination to God," tend to be a vengeful group of people when you criticize them or their faith. I guess that probably offends you as well.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507432 Mar 21, 2013
NoStress4me wrote:
As I said in a prior post:
NS: I read you to at times smack at Christians in general, as an example something you said in a prior post:
Ians:“What do you think of a mind that accepts claims without sufficient evidence, the definition of religious faith? Is that an open mind to you? If so, you don't want that kind of open mind. That barely qualifies as a mind at all.”
NS: Why would that not offend me and how is it not slander or a character attack? To me it reads as though you find me as a person, to be brainless simply for believing.
Yes, and I explained that that was a criticism of intelligence, not a character attack. Where do you get that I didn't know that that was offensive to you, or that you had to tell me repeatedly? You didn't. If you say that you were offended, it was offensive to you.
NoStress4me wrote:
In return you have said that you would not listen to me when it comes to prayer. Just so that you are aware, I would not give you advice on prayer unless you asked for it, as I understand that it would be insulting to you as an atheist. You also said that while you would not listen to me when it comes to prayer, that you would listen to me when it comes to restaurants perhaps. While I thank you for that, it still does not address the insult that I feel you gave.
How shall I address the insult? What are you looking for? A retraction? I can't do that. Reword it so that it is less offensive? I can do that. Change "That barely qualifies as a mind at all" to "That's some mighty poor thinking." Better?

Do you also want me to beg your forgiveness like I ask Dim to do? If so, OK. Please forgive me - I beg you.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507433 Mar 21, 2013
NoStress4me wrote:
I said point blank that your comment of “that barely qualifies as a mind at all” was taken by me as anyone that has faith….is questioned to have a mind.
That was hyperbole. I think you have a mind. I know you do. But if your thinking is faith based, it's output is pretty unreliable wherever the faith based belief plays. Better?
NoStress4me wrote:
It was a broad stroke of the brush comment, made after you told me that no unbelievers were using slander and character attacks.
I didn't say that. Why do I have to deal with this problem so often with you Christians? Why is it so difficult for faith based thinkers to read an idea, comprehend it, recall it, and report it without changing it?

Do you have any idea what I actually said? Here it is as it appeared the first time I posted it, which was to Le_Le:

"why can't your religion bring two relatively gentle and kind women who ostensibly love the same god together? And isn't that significant that it doesn't? You don't see irreligious people doing this. The conclusion is obvious to me. Religion is divisive and belligerent.

"Yes, the believers and unbelievers are each belligerent to the other. But look more closely at where this comes from. The believers are also belligerent with one another. We are not. We all get along with the other unbelievers here. Happy Lesbo never calls Catcher names, and Hiding and River Tam never say things like what you and Serah, or Quin and whichever Christians he fights with say to one another. "
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/T0N0LOR...

Where does that say that we don't slander?

By the way, the comment is no longer true. Since that was posted, we have seen two unbelievers go at it. Now, I'd have to say that Christian do it much more than the unbelievers rather than that you haven't seen us do it at all. That was true when I posted it.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507434 Mar 21, 2013
NoStress4me wrote:
No its not. Is my looking into the history of the religion that I hold, and to keep questioning it, a closed mind to you? Is my having discussions with people from all walks, reading what they have to say, questioning for my own personal growth, a closed mind?
No. But faith in a god is a close-minded state. How do you reach a mind that is not interested in reason or contradictory evidence? You don't. Mind closed for business.
NoStress4me wrote:
If Christians are so close minded….why come in to a primarily Christian thread and discuss the Church the Bible and God? The only point if you think that my mind is closed for business when it comes to my faith in God, would be to insult in my honest opinion. Meaning: if you have no intention of making your opinion understood because you think that Christians are close-minded, then you are not here to discuss.
I have other reasons for being here than trying to change closed minds. Serah asked me the same question:
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/T0N0LOR...

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507435 Mar 21, 2013
NoStress4me wrote:
<quoted text>
My thinking - it is because they are coming from the aspect of not only knowing about empathy, what it is, or if you do/don’t have it - but to have the personal ability to break down what it is, how it affects you, and how to use the information via critical thinking.
Thank you for the apology Ians, it is truly appreciated. I am trying to understand you…at times I feel like a gerbil running in the wheel trying to stay on point with you. <<my issue>> I am trying to learn how to express myself better on here….I think you are giving me a crash course ;O)
Thank you for that. You are expressing yourself just fine. I think that you have misunderstood me, but you have expressed yourself.

I'm accustomed to not being understood in these threads.

And I'll say it again: my purpose is not to insult you or any other Christian.

But my opinions simply are insulting to people of faith.

I don't respect the things that you consider sacred.

I don't respect faith or faith based thinking, which I consider to be a significant error.

I consider the bible a poorly written and self-refuting book full of nonsense.

I consider the Christian god mythical, and its character as depicted quite immoral.

I consider the church a societal parasite that I want to see weakened and disappear from view.

And I have no patience any more for ignorant comments coming from many Christians about such topics as science, church-state separation, and biblical homophobia.

So, given that, how can I hope to not offend you unless I censor myself? It's inevitable.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507436 Mar 21, 2013
trifecta1 wrote:
Spiritual Experience is what salvation is mostly about. And all you can say to that, is that no one has any experience of a God that you not experience yourself.
I disagree with both sentences. Authentic spiritual experience is unrelated to the Christian concept of salvation. And that is not what I said. This problem of mangling ideas in the process of repeating them appears to be epidemic among you Christians.

Here is what you mangled, at http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/T0N0LOR...

"You have no faculties that I do not also have. And there is no knowledge available only to you, but not me, especially in areas that I have studied and otherwise expended considerable energy exploring.

"Thus you have no more experience of any god than I do because you cannot. You can only claim otherwise. The only experience available to you but not me is your imagination."

What that says is that there is that because you have no unique senses or faculties, no knowledge about gods is available to you but not to me, and that any unique god experiences you might have had came from your own mind.

Compare that to your mangled reproduction of that: "no one has any experience of a God that you not experience yourself."

Do you see a difference or not? What I would say that is closest to your comment is that nobody has any experience of a god, and that the experience of a god that you claim to have is just you experiencing your own mind, not any god.

“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#507437 Mar 21, 2013
Have a great day....God Bless

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507438 Mar 21, 2013
scaritual wrote:
Everyone in a workplace or similar type environment is aware of the "super mega holies", and they avoid them in large part.
That's of their own doing. Over the years, as I've moved to a new job, almost invariably, either by word of mouth, or by interaction with the "super mega holy", you become aware of those and interact as little as possible.
I'm self employed these days, and have been for awhile, but the last facility I worked with for the FAA had a person there that "talked to angels". She was confrontational about her beliefs. You could barely exchange pleasantries or interact with her at all without her bringing up god(S) and religion.
The entire facility avoided her like she had Ebola.
Yuck.

I had a Christian employee briefly,an office nurse. I didn't know it when I hired her. She started placing a bible in plain view in the break room. I had just the year before been ambushed for trying to remove bibles from the exam rooms of a clinic that I had worked for, and it had created a hostile workplace environment for me thereafter.

Not surprisingly, I felt that I needed to leave that clinic, and branched out by myself in the same town. And I was busy building a new practice, so, I was quite reluctant to ask her to remove her bible even from my private office, since I didn't want to have one of my employees telling people that I was Satan.

I shouldn't have had to deal with such stupidity in either the group clinic or my in own office, but I did. I had been looking for a way to get rid of her when she announced that she was leaving the state. That was lucky. I replaced her with an unbeliever, which made all four of us compatible. Problem solved.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#507439 Mar 21, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I doubt it. That would be someone that doesn't give a shit whether God exists or not and even if He did, it wouldn't affect their life.
Atheists give a shit.
Atheists don't give a shit whether god exists or not.

Atheists give a shit that religion exists and constantly attempts to inject itself on the rest of us.

Here's where you ask how religion does that.

And that's where I wonder if you live in a cave.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#507440 Mar 21, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Another atheist blaming God (the god he says he doesn't believe in) for dying kids....
Where do you get that?

I don't believe in god.

Those kids are dying from poverty and disease.

Things that some are trying to actually DO something about rather than just attempting to pray it away so they can FEEL like they're doing something.

I'm asking you why the god YOU believe in would allow these things.

You keep avoiding the question.

We both know why.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#507441 Mar 21, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey, all I was doing was expressing my view on the aesthetics of a cross.
I would say the same thing if a neighbor painted his house purple, with orange polkadots.
It's an environmental blight. A barber pole is more attractive.
It has nothing to do with religion.
I have visited many cathedrals in various parts of the world, and have marveled at the beauty. I recommend a visit to Santiago de Compostela, in northwestern Spain, and its beautiful cathedral (it's also the end point of the famous pilgrimage trail). Another example of a sublime cathedral is Chartres (for those who like country music, it's in France). I could name many others.
One thing though: I have often wondered at the magnificence and beauty of these structures, erected to honor something that doesn't exist....
Not only something that doesn't exist, but something that demands as one of its top ten priorities that no graven images of it be produced.

When I found out what graven images were, I wondered why my church wasn't wiped from the earth in a godly rage.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#507442 Mar 21, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
It doesn't bother me at all. I enjoy a rigorous conversation.
I just don't want atheists being bullies, that's all.
We have to coexist, right?
Let's try.
Then you should understand why atheists are wont to discuss religion.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#507446 Mar 21, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
An explicitly stated condition of their tax exemption is that they refrain from politicking from the pulpit.
Many openly violate that with impunity.
That has to stop.
I agree.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#507447 Mar 21, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> No evasion...you are in denial of the facts of history and even of the very writing in your own book...and the atrocities of the Abrahamic religions going on this very minute.
What atrocities?!?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#507448 Mar 21, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
I dunno. Some efforts by groups that sought a "religion" status have been ruled not to be religion for the most ridiculous reasons(primarily, didn't resemble the Jesus! religion).
Others reasons too, of that there is no doubt.
At any rate, I don't think it's simply enough for someone to yell - "RELIGION!...IT'S MY RELIGION!" - and that should suffice.
That's nothing that could be discussed with any depth in this sort of venue, imo. It'd require a long, long, dialog.
But still, what constitutes a religion? Big question.
I know, and agree. I've seen so many excuses being passed off as "my religion" it's ridiculous.

Religion is the belief in and worshop of a deity.

What constitutes that? I don't know.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#507449 Mar 21, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
http://www.topix.com/forum/top stories/T0N0LORUMAROFEJGO/post 506949
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
"just under 6% of totals going to charity"
You seem to have forgotten what we were talking about - what such audits might show, which I predicted might be scandalous. The first audit didn't seem to even include stats on what was collected and how much went to the needy. The second one showed "just under 6% of totals going to charity." These were the audits that YOU chose, and they weren't even of a random, but rather, one proud enough to commission and publish an audit.
"just under 6% of totals going to charity"
That's the take home message. And your reply?
"Don't assume that all churches are rolling in money. There are many throughout America that can barely even pay their expenses."
Then they are not doing the charitable work that you implied, which was the principle value that you seemed to imply they had to the community at large.
My counterargument was that I doubted that they did much charitable work at all, that they merely claimed to do so, that you were unwittingly perpetuating that myth, and that I expected random audits to reveal otherwise. Two audits later, and the little bit of data that YOU handpicked seems to support my contention.
And all you can say about that is "Don't assume that all churches are rolling in money. There are many throughout America that can barely even pay their expenses."
At this point, I have the data from two audits, and they are remarkably close numbers, 6% and 7%. Until I have reason to think otherwise, this is the figure that I will use as an initial estimate for the entire church system, although it may be much lower if "there are many [churches] throughout America that can barely even pay their expenses."
Let us not gloss over that. The loss of the churches will be no loss to the rest of us.
I said more than just "Don't assume that all churches are rolling in money. There are many throughout America that can barely even pay their expenses.".

You chose to ignore it.

But it's the truth.

And what they don't give back to communities as far as money goes, they give in volunteer work and in hope.

You don't have to like it and you don't have to agree, but that's the way it is.

I think it bursts your bubble to see that not all churches are filthy rich.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#507450 Mar 21, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Why are the claims always of the form that we just need to take somebody's word for it? Your claim was that the church does a significant amount of valuable charitable work. I asked for accounting data, and that failed to confirm your claim. Now it's reduced to volunteers doing I don't know what, and people who visit the church. Of course, these are just empty claims as well.[[[SNIP]]]
All I did was google it, man. I left it to your own accord to find more data yourself.

You failed to do so.

It isn't my responsibility to show you church audits. If that's something you want to look into, go for it.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#507451 Mar 21, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey IANS.
I've been following along on other threads, but they're getting boring.
Good to see you and hiding taking on RR. I think he has potential, but not a lot.
I got a chance to engage some YECs in person the other day.
They were protesting a play put on by a high school called The Most Fabulous Story Ever Told. It's the story of genesis from a gay perspective. Adam and Steve and Jane and Mabel.
I got some good video before the cop asked me to leave them alone. I'll be posting it on my facebook page.
I got a couple of blank stares that were a highlight for me. It was pretty fun. I wish I could have spent more time. There were a couple of teens there that I really felt sorry for.
Religion like that really is child abuse.
Hey, Aero.

Please let me know when the video is ready.

Do you know why the YECs objected to you filming them?

"Jane and Mabel" is good. So is "Madam and Eve."

“I.Spirit.Son.God”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#507452 Mar 21, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I disagree with both sentences. Authentic spiritual experience is unrelated to the Christian concept of salvation. And that is not what I said. This problem of mangling ideas in the process of repeating them appears to be epidemic among you Christians.
Here is what you mangled, at http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/T0N0LOR...
"You have no faculties that I do not also have. And there is no knowledge available only to you, but not me, especially in areas that I have studied and otherwise expended considerable energy exploring.
"Thus you have no more experience of any god than I do because you cannot. You can only claim otherwise. The only experience available to you but not me is your imagination."
What that says is that there is that because you have no unique senses or faculties, no knowledge about gods is available to you but not to me, and that any unique god experiences you might have had came from your own mind.
Compare that to your mangled reproduction of that: "no one has any experience of a God that you not experience yourself."
Do you see a difference or not? What I would say that is closest to your comment is that nobody has any experience of a god, and that the experience of a god that you claim to have is just you experiencing your own mind, not any god.

[QUOTE who="It aint necessarily so"wrote:
Authentic spiritual experience is...
spir·it·u·al
/&#712;spiriCHo&#862;o &#601;l/
Adjective
Of, relating to, or affecting the human spirit or soul as opposed to material or physical things

spir·it
/&#712;spirit/
Noun
The nonphysical part of a person that is the seat of emotions and character; the soul

OK. So you claim [Authentic Spiritual Experience] But you deny the soul exist, even in the face of science. You're getting as contrarian, confusing and on shaky foundational ground to any argument as your fellow secular humanist[wilderide] and [hiding from you] writers.

Once again, resorting back to the hypocritical essence of your belief system.

Your [subjective] opinion of a Jesus Follower [subjective] experiential lifetime spiritual experience with Almighty God YHWH through The Spirit of Jesus Christ, is noted.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Prove there's a god. (Mar '08) 6 min Chris Rathers 981,451
News Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 39 min Jedi Master 673,422
The Christian Atheist debate (Jun '15) 1 hr Barking Hillary 104,837
Obama Pays Muslim Brotherhood Yearly Membership... 3 hr Godly Godlike 2
CNN: Bill Cosby past away today after long batt... (Dec '08) 3 hr What Was That 85
News Judge allows Oregon resident to be genderless 4 hr discocrisco 3
News Michael Jackson broke down racial barriers (Jun '09) 5 hr Mojo Hojo 1,562
More from around the web