“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#497003 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I hope you're joking. I don't discriminate anyone.
I think you forgot to try and sell Annie a bridge in the above post.

“I.Spirit.Son.God”

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#497004 Mar 2, 2013
Illuminatrix wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL! I can't decide what's funnier, your post (in a good way), or Chucky calling himself an 'optimist'...
~~~~grin~~~~, Chucky calling himself an optimist funnier. my post was to just to mock that blindness he pushing and if it funny, then that good to.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497005 Mar 2, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Laws that promote religion and the church, or that enforce its preferences. I'd like to see tax law regarding the church amended. And the laws defining the Pledge and national motto. And have a few blue laws removed. There are probably more.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
If you remove the tax exempt status from churches, you have to remove them from all "non-profit" organizattions. Habitat for Humanity would be pissed.
Why tell me? I didn't suggest that.

There's a lawsuit filed now by a non-profit organization against the IRS and the favorable treatment it gives to the church and to the church alone.
http://ffrf.org/publications/freethought-toda...

Habitat for Humanity will likely be tickled if the judgment is for the plaintiffs, the Freedom From Religion Foundation.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Do the laws that define the Pledge & the national motto harm you in any way?
They merely embarrass me.

Using the currency as a promotion for religion probably and promoting faith with the Pledge may have helped me. It was pretty easy to expatriate without much nostalgia or regret, and I probably am indebted to the church for keeping my sense of inclusion and belonging to a minimum. My psychological roots were apparently much less deep than somebody who actually does trust in a god and identified with the "We" on his currency.

Why do you ask?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497006 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Do you understand that MOST Americans like them & want to keep them the way they are?
Once again, did you have a point with this, or did you just intend to imply one? Are you suggesting that what most Americans think is relevant here? If so, try using words and doing so explicitly: "This is what I think and why." Then I can rebut that claim.

It's a real neat way to use language - to express an idea overtly, precisely and clearly. You're going to love it if you ever give it a chance.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497007 Mar 2, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
I think you forgot to try and sell Annie a bridge in the above post.
It's ocean front property in Arizona.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497008 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
You lie. "Simple: the church teaches homophobia."
It should read "Simple: some churches teache homophobia."
Why is it that Christians have so much trouble with the word "church"?

Your church teaches homophobia. Virtually all homophobia in America derives from your church. It's not coming from the government, or the banks, or the schools, or the news, or Hollywood. It's coming from the church.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Please, indulge me. Where is homophobia written in the Bible? What churches promote homophobia?
If you're interest ever becomes sincere, read a book.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Why do you keep ignoring that part of my posts where I tell you I've been to dozens of churches, thousands of times and NEVER ONCE have they talked about homosexuality or homophobia.
Did I ignore that? No.

First, I don't believe it, and told you so. Second, even if true, it's irrelevant. You're wrong, I have no expectation of changing your mind or even getting you to understand what "the church" is, and that means we're at an impasse.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497009 Mar 2, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Why tell me? I didn't suggest that.
No, you didn't suggest removing it, you suggested amending it. My bad.
There's a lawsuit filed now by a non-profit organization against the IRS and the favorable treatment it gives to the church and to the church alone.
http://ffrf.org/publications/freethought-toda...
Habitat for Humanity will likely be tickled if the judgment is for the plaintiffs, the Freedom From Religion Foundation.
Arizona v Winn has already discounted the FFRF's case.

They keep citing the 1st Amendment and tr to use separation of church & state to push their cause. They keep losing.

They recently tried to get a cross removed. It is near me & I used to climb Mt Rubidoux when I was a kid. The land (the top of the hill) was donated to the City of Riverside in 1955, the cross has been there since 1907, it is a city landmark.

The FFRF wanted it gone bye-bye, citing the 1st Amendment again. Riverside's answer was simple, the land is being sold to a private owner that will keep the monument intact instead of taken down like the FFRF wanted.

I talked with a few local atheists about that cross, they said it means nothing to them spiritually, it's just a city landmark. They were pissed that the FFRF feels the need to butt in everywhere they go.

In the end, the cross remains & the FFRF loses again.
They merely embarrass me.
Using the currency as a promotion for religion probably and promoting faith with the Pledge may have helped me. It was pretty easy to expatriate without much nostalgia or regret, and I probably am indebted to the church for keeping my sense of inclusion and belonging to a minimum. My psychological roots were apparently much less deep than somebody who actually does trust in a god and identified with the "We" on his currency.
Why do you ask?
I asked because I wanted to know.

So if the Pledge & the national motto helped you, why want them removed?

Why should we cater to an incredibly small minority?

Roughly 73% of Americans are Christian whereas roughly .07% are atheist.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497010 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Do you understand that MOST Americans like them & want to keep them the way they are?
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again, did you have a point with this, or did you just intend to imply one? Are you suggesting that what most Americans think is relevant here? If so, try using words and doing so explicitly: "This is what I think and why." Then I can rebut that claim.
It's a real neat way to use language - to express an idea overtly, precisely and clearly. You're going to love it if you ever give it a chance.
Nice way to dodge the question, buckwheat.

I didn't offer up what I think, I asked what you think.

Was that too simple?

Just answer the damn question and quit playing games.

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#497011 Mar 2, 2013
if Jesus did not love you no one will

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#497012 Mar 2, 2013
trifecta1 wrote:
<quoted text>?? can you point to an example on the billboard of a Christian that think if a person does not think as a Christian they are wicked and not a good person?
Seriously. I never see any Christian on here say if you not part of the Christian Religion you wicked and no good. so please, endulge me.
Because I know a lot of Hindus and Muslims and most of them are good hard working law abiding people, so I want to know who you talking about.
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...

Here are 5 posts, and in those, a person is called either a "demon", or, it's said they will "burn in hell".

Noun: demon
1. An evil supernatural being
2. A cruel wicked and inhuman person
3. Someone extremely diligent or skillful
4.(computing) a program that runs automatically or on a schedule without user interaction

Noun: hell
1. Any place of pain and turmoil
2. A cause of difficulty and suffering
3. Violent and excited activity
4. Noisy and unrestrained mischief

Noun: Hell
1.(religion) the world of the dead
2.(Christianity) the abode of Satan and the forces of evil; where sinners suffer eternal punishment

WordWeb Pro 6.6

Take from it what you will. I know what I take from it.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497013 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
You lie. "Simple: the church teaches homophobia."
It should read "Simple: some churches teache homophobia."
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Why is it that Christians have so much trouble with the word "church"?
That has nothing to do with the question.
Your church teaches homophobia.
How? That's a pretty specific accusation, you should have pretty specific answers.
Virtually all homophobia in America derives from your church. It's not coming from the government, or the banks, or the schools, or the news, or Hollywood. It's coming from the church.
Horseshit.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497014 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Please, indulge me. Where is homophobia written in the Bible? What churches promote homophobia?
It aint necessarily so wrote:
If you're interest ever becomes sincere, read a book.
You could've just said "I don't have an answer for that, but it's what I believe."

It would've meant the same.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497015 Mar 2, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
First, I don't believe it, and told you so. Second, even if true, it's irrelevant. You're wrong, I have no expectation of changing your mind or even getting you to understand what "the church" is, and that means we're at an impasse.
Don't believe it? Why? Is it because you're too brainwashed to think any other way?

I think you are.

I think you've convinced yourself that "the church" is the cause of many problems & you think that "the church" is responsible for homophobia in the world.

But you won't stop to consider that maybe homophobia has nothing to do with religion but has more to do with sex. Everyone, mostly, has sex & enjoys sex. Throughout the years, many nations and many peoples have dengrated homosexuals for nothing more than gay sex. It still happens to this day, people get killed just for being gay.

It's a sad and embarassing fact. Something we should be trying to work together on instead of picking these bullshit fights about who's fault it is.

Your misguided views of Christianity have warped your senses about it. The Bible teaches us to be tolerant, regardless of what SOME CHURCHES preach.

Ephesians 4:2

With all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love

Proverbs 16:24

Gracious words are like a honeycomb, sweetness to the soul and health to the body.

1 Peter 3:8

Finally, all of you, have unity of mind, sympathy, brotherly love, a tender heart, and a humble mind.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#497016 Mar 2, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/topstor...
Here are 5 posts, and in those, a person is called either a "demon", or, it's said they will "burn in hell".
Noun: demon
1. An evil supernatural being
2. A cruel wicked and inhuman person
3. Someone extremely diligent or skillful
4.(computing) a program that runs automatically or on a schedule without user interaction
Noun: hell
1. Any place of pain and turmoil
2. A cause of difficulty and suffering
3. Violent and excited activity
4. Noisy and unrestrained mischief
Noun: Hell
1.(religion) the world of the dead
2.(Christianity) the abode of Satan and the forces of evil; where sinners suffer eternal punishment
WordWeb Pro 6.6
Take from it what you will. I know what I take from it.
That would be the views of ***some*** crazy Christians, yes?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497017 Mar 2, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
Actually, I don't. I use the term "god" in it's most simplest definition, which is "ruler."
You said it like it was a bad thing:

BLL sez: "It's been my opinion that every person has a god. For the atheist, their god is themselves. You're proving my opinion to be accurate."

In that is all you meant by "god," then you have cheapened the word.

And yes, using that trivial definition, I am my own god, just like my dog is her own god.

Do you know what autonomy is, besides a cardinal medical ethic, as in patient autonomy? It's related to informed consent and agency. It's an essential aspect of personal development and self-actualization.

Look at its etymology and reconsider your comment: from auto- "self" (see auto-)+ nomos "custom, law." Self-rule is freedom and autonomy.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php...

Somehow, Christianity, whose cardinal value is submission, makes that a crime. When a Christian refers to you as your own god, you're being chastised. Or maybe you're different, and were commending me on my godhood.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497018 Mar 2, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
We only capitalize the term to distinguish between the "'God' of gods (Deut 10:17)" and lesser gods.

Lesser gods? Everybody that rules his own life is a lesser god?

You rely heavily on fallacies of equivocation, wherein the meanings of words shape-shift like clouds.

[QUOTE who="Brother Lee Love"]It's the same with the term "worship," too.
That doesn't make sense.
Brother Lee Love wrote:
Now that I think of it, I believe it's possible that you reject the notion [that the condition of society get worse and worse] simply because that's what the bible says. If the bible said that the conditions of our societies were getting better, you'd say they were getting worse.
When you use weasel words like "it's possible," you cannot be wrong, just as I'm correct to say that it's possible that you are planning to shoot up a school this week. It's possible.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497019 Mar 2, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
If what's on our currency doesn't increase or decrease the value of it, then why care, at all?
Since you don't have a preference, can we count on your support to remove the god from it?
Brother Lee Love wrote:
Again, the "God" mentioned could be any "God."
[1] So? Why would you think that would matter to me? I wouldn't care which god you have in mind.
[2] That would have been the time for the lower case "god."
Brother Lee Love wrote:
So, next time you see the motto, just think of yourself as "God."
How about this instead: whenever YOU see that motto, you think about this conversation, and that everybody is his own god, and needs no other.
Brother Lee Love wrote:
As I've read, the "God" on our currency represents not a deity, at all, but "ancient wisdom" without a deity.
And yet another shape-shifting of the meaning of "god." I've never heard ancient wisdom called god. And I sure don't trust any ancient wisdom, either.
Brother Lee Love wrote:
So, in conclusion, I believe that removing "In God We Trust" from our currency would be doing "God" a service
Seconded. All in favor?

“Saved. ”

Since: Aug 12

Like Ice On planet Mercury

#497020 Mar 2, 2013

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#497021 Mar 2, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
That's kind of useless to those of us born after his alleged death, since none of us had any sins at that time. Thanks for nothing, Jesus.
Misunderstood me, you did.

All the sins you've committed, up to the time you come to know of "God" and his only-begotten son, and what they've accomplished for us, are forgiven. From that time on, you must learn righteousness, which is what grace is for. Now, knowing that it's virtually impossible for one to become perfect overnight, the grace we're given is sufficient for us. It's expected that as we learn what sin is, that we refrain from committing not only further sins, but willful sins. But, if we sin by mistake, then we can ask for forgiveness from this sin. Then, we must try harder not to commit the same sin again. The idea, though, is to remove the thoughts and desires of sin from our minds and hearts. This way, it'll make sins harder to become manifest in our actions, reactions, and speech. In the end, it's the effort you make that's going to matter.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#497022 Mar 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I don't give a red rats ass if you believe me or not. I'm telling you the truth.

Again, in church, I have NEVER heard thm preach that homosexuality and homosexuals are an abomination to the Lord.
And I don't give a rats ass if you are telling the truth. It would be irrelevant to me that you've never heard any of this before.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
THAT is not the focus of a sermon.
That's also irrelevant. It doesn't need to be.

I don't remember if the Christian homophobia I heard in a church that Easter Day a dozen or so years ago was the focus of the sermon or not, but it's the only part I remember. It's shocking.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
We most certainly can discuss the reality of Christian homophobia, as soon as you realize that not all Christians are the same and not all Christian churches are the same.
I know that and don't care. It's irrelevant to my thesis, like everything else you have mentioned. Christian homophobia doesn't need to be present in every Christian or every church to be the problem that I say is.

I don't see any of those irrelevant comments as rebuttal to my claim that the church is homophobic and the largest or only source of homophobia in the West. People who like justice more than organized religion will be glad to see the Christian church fade away because of that among other reasons.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Prove there's a god. (Mar '08) 13 min It aint necessari... 773,451
Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 15 min hojo 558,855
IRA fading away, analysts say (Sep '08) 25 min rock white 14
Which is the Oldest Indian Language? Sanskrit V... (Jul '08) 30 min arabian 5,492
kelly bright 1 hr bigbadwolf91869 1
Teacher back in class after Bush-Hitler comparison (Mar '06) 2 hr Sniper II 95
God is REAL - Miracles Happen! (Jun '11) 2 hr truth 5,704
Was 9/11 a conspiracy?? (Oct '07) 2 hr AussieBobby 264,978
Blaming Israel for carnage (Jul '06) 3 hr AN NFL FAN 119,633
Bush is a hero (Sep '07) 4 hr Catcher1 175,509
More from around the web