Why Should Jesus Love Me?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#483592 Feb 3, 2013
Drew H wrote:
<quoted text>
Unbelief, not disobeying. That's a good start. And that is what Romans 11 is all about. If one doesn't believe then obeying does not matter. However if one believes, that one has a desire to obey. Moreover, none of us are able to completely obey while we still live in a corrupt vessel.
I have stated in the past that most of the gospel accounts and the first part of Acts were written to the Jews but some passages in them are to all people.
The Gospel is now open to anyone who believes (both Jew and Gentile) in the finished work of Jesus on the cross. Those who truly believe (not just say they believe because anyone can say "I believe" even if they don't) have had their eyes opened by God, and this is not exclusive but inclusive. I have never had the power to open my own spiritual eyes. That is left up to God.
"to the Jew first and then the Greek." Well chapter 11 of Romans goes on to explain that God, has blinded the Jews because of their unbelief, but He is not finished with them yet. He will complete that work when the full number of the Gentiles has come in. In other words, when this age ends, He will again deal with the Jews.
The Bible clearly states that salvation is a work of God. He is the author and finisher of our faith. We didn't start it nor can we finish it.
Now, do you believe that all who claim to be "Christian" are believers? Do you believe that all who claim to be "Christian" are saved? Do you believe that all who say they believe truly believe?
When did this verse apply?

Matt.6
[14] For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father also will forgive you;
[15] but if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Could the Jews before the sacrifice be forgiven simply by forgiving others and if not why doesn't it still apply today? And if so, why would they need the sacrifice?

I can see where you are going with the other question and that is to say now the gospel is open to both Jew and Gentile where it wasn't before so now salvation is the same for them where it wasn't before. I disagree but I will understand better where you are coming from if you address the verses in Matthew as that is what it was all based on including asking about salvation being the same. I believe those verses show the teachings of Christ have always applied to everyone and still do but if you can address the questions asked about Matthew 6 I would appreciate it. Thank you

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#483593 Feb 3, 2013
Qu_innocence wrote:
Continued from last post about gnosticism and simon magus:
What ha' happen was" when Simon accepted becoming a believer... he could not shake himself from his old craft. Because of this compromise he had mixed the gnosticism, sorcery, platoism with Christianity... and Poof! <<<purple smoke>>> a Christian version of gnosticism.
Sometimes Wiccans... witches.. same difference can't shake wicca either so they still chose Jesus as part of their own pantheon and invented Christian Wicca....But going back to Simon Magus...it didn't stop there and I'm barely scratching the surface on this subject... so I guess I'm going to have to add an annex to this part of the study. But anyways, the gnostics believe that the God that Christians and Jews worship (the one in the OT) is basically the devil. They call our God who created everything in which we physically see ---> the Demiurge AKA The Evil Angel. They believe that the being we now know as satan was actually trying to help the human race and that our God had him kicked out. Hence, they hate the demiurge and have sympathy for the being that we know as the devil. They even have sympathy for Cain...(I'll explain more 2morrow, Lordwilling)
Have a good day everyone!
:)
Ya fergot ta mention that SM was most likely Peter, and the 1st pope.
Knowledge

Enfield, IL

#483594 Feb 3, 2013
Evidently, many have not seen a person who was possessed by the devil, or they would be thinking differently. Just by pretending he does not exist, does not mean he will leave you alone.
NOONE is constantly protected from the devil, that is why we should all have the armor of God on at all times. Temptation comes in all areas in life. It takes you to be prayed up with God, and reading His word.
Not all people are who they appear to be. I majored in Criminal Justice and worked at a prison for a very long time, retired. There are cons in this world in every walks of life including the church. The inmates in the prison, are only the ones, "who got caught"... more are on the outside, "not getting caught"...The devil can sit on the front row of church causing problems in quiet ways. Only Jesus Christ will judge every man and woman by their hearts, not by their deeds.If you have a sinful black heart and have led a double life, Jesus will know, and His judgement will be upon you. Noone else can ever truly know another person's heart. Unless, God has given them the gift of discernment.About thirty years ago, I once knew a good man, who never missed church, he had went for over twenty years, before I got there. I had always assumed he was saved, he seemed like one of the nicest people ever. One day when they had an alter call he went before the Throne of God, and repented his sins and gave his heart to the Lord. That taught me a big lesson....never assume anything. The whole congregation was surprised because they all had assumed he was saved, he spoke about God, but he had never given his heart to God. Food for thought.:)

“Messenger w/ a Message”

Since: Sep 07

planet earth, for now

#483595 Feb 3, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
Forgot to answer this
No for both
Although I don't think I have the ability to distinguish
Do you?
I remember you once said you could tell which of your students had been "born-again"
Is that not saying that you know who is saved?
You will know them by their fruit.

“Thank you GOD for JESUS”

Since: Jul 07

And thank you JESUS for caring

#483596 Feb 3, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>I can think of three, right now, off the top of my head.
Adam, Eve, and Judas.
Did they turn their backs on GOD or succumb? Adam & Eve turned back if they did turn away, and Judas was so desolate he took his own life.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#483597 Feb 3, 2013
lil whispers wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you ever taken a real close look at non believers.Believe it or not your choose you can find some of God in them.Oh I know they say this and that goes with the territory but then you see them do some action of God.When I speak of personal walk I mean what is in the heart,soul,spirit only you can do that walk cause it is your heart your soul and your spirit.God's word is the truth and that why I say do not follow man even the bible so states this.God is not of the confusion it is mankind that does this.It is a human emotion to agree or disagree and opinion is alot of it all.Ever notice how many aruments start just from a simple opinion.oh heck thoses many sects of christianity been around forever.If you go and dig around in history you see what I talking about here.
Brilliant!

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#483598 Feb 3, 2013
Drew H wrote:
<quoted text>
Generally speaking, I avoid leading questions and yours is a leading question. However, I will attempt to answer the best I can. I will state that all people should learn from all the teachings of Jesus. I will go on to say that most often Jesus was speaking directly to Jews, and that is irrefutable. However, the mystery of the cross was not revealed until after the death, burial and resurrection. This is discerned through the context of the Bible, not any particular verse or verses. While Jesus was alive, on earth, in the flesh, He had not yet been crucified, buried and resurrected. And even after that, the Jews still didn't believe. And even when He sent the Holy Spirit, the vast majority still didn't believe. It was through their unbelief that the Gospel became available to the Gentiles (Romans 11).
It is a pretty straight forward question Drew

Either you believe the all the teachings of Christ apply to us or you do not. What does it being leading have to do with anything? Of course it is leading. I am trying to get you to specifically answer that. You still haven't

Yes or No, Do all the teachings of Jesus Christ still apply today?

And if not (which I think we can safely assume you don't think they do) can you provide the verses that show that only some teachings still apply today

Respectfully someone shouldn't have to pin you down to get a straight answer Drew. You have done this many times in the past where I just give up because i don't want to look like i am badgering you. But you know when you aren't answering what you are being asked imo

If someone doesn't believe all of Christ's teachings apply to us I think they ought to be able to point to the scripture that tells them that

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#483599 Feb 3, 2013
Adam wrote:
No one ever saw God the Lord. Not even Adam or Moses. Are you saying Jesus is Jahweh, the god of the jews who became a human? The Father the son and the holy ghost in one? And Mary is the mother of god?
According to the words men wrote about it all, GOD changed costumes and names so often no one can ever tell the truth about it all.
Question is...was "GOD" really responsible for these deceitful actions or was it "men"?
GOD needs ta step out of the closet so the bicker'n o' biddies can end.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#483600 Feb 3, 2013
Drew H wrote:
<quoted text>
You will know them by their fruit.
Yes we are able to discern right from wrong and that verse to me means if someone is a Christian they should be acting like it

But the bible doesn't say we can know who is saved and says only God can see the heart

Can you give an example of what you would see someone do that would allow you to know that they are saved for a fact? What is it you can observe when the bible says we can only see the outside that would give you the same insights as God as to who is saved?

I am not saying that insincerely. I honestly would like an example of what you could see that would allow you to state with certainty someone is saved

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#483601 Feb 3, 2013
Drew H wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't say, "Check your t-mail." I said, "Be looking for a t-mail." That means I haven't sent it yet, but I promise I will.
In the meantime, I'll ask you the same two questions I asked Lawest100, which he didn't answer, of course.
Do you believe that all who say they are "Christian" are believers? Do you believe that all who say they are "Christian" are saved?
Personally, as I have stated many times before, I don't really care what others think of me. It is of no consequence.
Additionally, I haven't seen you explain the verses that confirm eternal security either.
“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears
my word and believes in Him who sent Me has
everlasting life, and shall not come into
judgment, but has passed from death into life.”
John 5:24
“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.” John 6:47
“These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.” 1 John 5:13
Romans 8, the whole chapter.
And please tell me why the branches in Romans 11 were cut off.
Good afternoon Drew. Hope all is well with you and yours.

Following along this afternoon I notice that while Skom has been going on and on and on over the past couple of days about you not addressing the scripture he has posted (which you have in posts after this one) he continues to avoid the scriptures you posted here. He has yet to even come close to addressing them. All he's done is respond to your answers (and questions as well) with more questions.

I guess he doesn't see the hypocritical double standard he uses that everyone else sees. Nobody should be surprised though seeing as that's the way he's always been.

Have a great day. God bless.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#483602 Feb 3, 2013
Red Apples wrote:
<quoted text>
Good afternoon Drew. Hope all is well with you and yours.
Following along this afternoon I notice that while Skom has been going on and on and on over the past couple of days about you not addressing the scripture he has posted (which you have in posts after this one) he continues to avoid the scriptures you posted here. He has yet to even come close to addressing them. All he's done is respond to your answers (and questions as well) with more questions.
I guess he doesn't see the hypocritical double standard he uses that everyone else sees. Nobody should be surprised though seeing as that's the way he's always been.
Have a great day. God bless.
I haven't avoided anything RA

He posted those who believe will have everlasting life. That is true. But clearly they must remain faithful and that is what Romans is all about which ironically is the exactly what Drew asked me about

And it says here

Romans 11:22
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, IF thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

So yes those who believe will have everlasting life. Nut that verse is just one of the requirements. It doesn't say anything about being born-again or repenting and that is required as well. And Romans specifically warns the Gentiles if they do not remain faithful they ALSO SHALT BE CUT OFF

I have addressed all scripture posed to me
Knowledge

Enfield, IL

#483603 Feb 3, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you Knowledge
I have been enjoying your posts btw
You have a very easy-going and approachable demeanor
(T) Peace
Me? LOL You evidently didn't read any of my posts late last night. I found myself, at an awe at what some people will say and do, and I am a retired Correctional Officer. It takes alot to offend me. I had never in my life became so angry with someone. But the Bible does say be angry and sin not. I got over it after it happened. I look at the persons post now, and just shake my head . I found out one thing last night, that I love the Lord Jesus Christ with all of my heart, and America the land of the free and brave! I love all the Americans and Vets who have fought for our freedoms....I learned that when it comes down to the American people I will stand with them when someone runs our country down. I know that our Country needs prayer.....but it is our American's country. No one else's. Sorry to go on and on, I was just stunned by your answer to my post. I should have just said... Thank you. I am easy going except for when my fellow Americans and country is dishonored.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#483604 Feb 3, 2013
FOOD FOR THOUGHT

I don't believe we can take one verse by its lonesome and not apply the other applicable verses if it is part of a whole

But let's take a verse even by itself

If averse says those who believe will have everlasting life, is someone who loses faith and stops believing still someone who fits that description?

It doesn't say anywhere to suggest you can believe for a minute but then lose faith and still be saved. IMO and with all the other verses it is clearly talking in the affirmative and it is to be ongoing

If you wake up today and you no longer believe in Christ, why would a verse apply to you that says if you believe in Christ you will have everlasting life?

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#483605 Feb 3, 2013
simplyput wrote:
BLL, you are really bad about taking things nd TWISTING them.
And you're really bad at accusing me of things I haven't done, don't do, or won't do.
simplyput wrote:
First off, God will discipline ALL of us. God will discipline
His children in Christ. God shows no favoritism.
Just because we believe that once we have accepted Christ as our Saviour, and we believe we will never LOOSE it, does not mean God will not discipline His children (us) if we SIN, HE WILL!
And I never even implied anything different. I'm well aware of His discipline and His reasons for disciplining us. But, you'll have me believe that just because a person gets disciplined by "God," then that's it. It's the strait and narrow from then on out. But, as I know, that's the furthest from the truth. I mean, yes. That's the preferred outcome, but such a result is not guaranteed.

Might I suggest the same that I suggested to Grace Walker. Read the bible more. And as much as you can, try to learn it by heart. This way, you might remember more verses than only those you believe proves your case. For example, it's written, "Correction is grievous unto him that forsaketh the way: and he that hateth reproof shall die."

Point #1: The corrected, in this verse, forsook the way. Therefore, we can most easily conclude that at one point in time, or another, the corrected was in the way. But, because they forsook the way, correction became grievous to them.

Point #2: Correction became grievous to them, therefore we can easily conclude that they came to hate correction, or reproof, as it's worded. And as it's written, the one that forsakes the way and comes to hate correction and reproof will die.

And now, this brings us to Hebrews 12:5-11. I suggest you pay close attention to what's written.

"My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby."

I suggest you not ignore that "God" deals with us as His children if we endure His correction. And what's the expected fruit that's expected by "God"? Is it not righteousness?
simplyput wrote:
If you are have accepted Christ as your Saviour, and you sinned and you DIED right after this Sin you did , you would still be SAVED,
Did I say anything about a person that committed one sin and died? Or, did I ask about people that return to a sinful lifestyle and don't repent before they die? There's a major difference between what I asked and what you just said.
simplyput wrote:
now we don't KNOW how God handled that DISCIPLINE after we
died--- Do you?.
So your saying , if YOU had died while you were 'BACKSLIDING
you wouldn't have been SAVED? Am I right? Please tell me.
That's exactly what I said. Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? If I had died before I repented and while I was still engulfed in my sins, I would not have been saved. Saying "Lord, Lord" is not enough to be saved. It's written, "Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil...Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand."

“Jesus is coming soon”

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#483606 Feb 3, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
I personally feel there is an obligation of a believer to give an interpretation when asked and especially if stating they see where another believer is in error.
JMO
(T) Peace
I very much agree, I could respect him more if he would at least attempt to back up what he is saying with scripture, and I can understand your frustration at being called "blind" and not even having it explained why to you.

Peace.

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#483607 Feb 3, 2013
Serah wrote:
Did they turn their backs on GOD or succumb? Adam & Eve turned back if they did turn away, and Judas was so desolate he took his own life.
Are we going to distribute levels, now, to willful sin in order to determine what's turning our backs on "God" and what's not? Adam and Eve were warned that if they turned their backs on "God," that they would die. And guess what? They did.

If I choose to commit adultery while knowing that such behavior is prohibited by "God," then even if but for a moment, I turned my back on "God." I believe it's even worse if I choose to commit such a heinous act with the intention of asking for forgiveness afterward, believing that I'm guaranteed salvation.

It's written, "The sacrifice of the wicked is abomination: how much more, when he bringeth it with a wicked mind?"

It's also written, "Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

And finally, it's written, "For the wages of sin is death."

You seem, to me Serah, to be a sensitive soul. And I can appreciate that. But, regardless of how sensitive we might be, our sensitivity isn't going to change "God."
simplyput

Aurora, CO

#483608 Feb 3, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>And you're really bad at accusing me of things I haven't done, don't do, or won't do.
<quoted text>And I never even implied anything different. I'm well aware of His discipline and His reasons for disciplining us. But, you'll have me believe that just because a person gets disciplined by "God," then that's it. It's the strait and narrow from then on out. But, as I know, that's the furthest from the truth. I mean, yes. That's the preferred outcome, but such a result is not guaranteed.
Might I suggest the same that I suggested to Grace Walker. Read the bible more. And as much as you can, try to learn it by heart. This way, you might remember more verses than only those you believe proves your case. For example, it's written, "Correction is grievous unto him that forsaketh the way: and he that hateth reproof shall die."
Point #1: The corrected, in this verse, forsook the way. Therefore, we can most easily conclude that at one point in time, or another, the corrected was in the way. But, because they forsook the way, correction became grievous to them.
Point #2: Correction became grievous to them, therefore we can easily conclude that they came to hate correction, or reproof, as it's worded. And as it's written, the one that forsakes the way and comes to hate correction and reproof will die.
And now, this brings us to Hebrews 12:5-11. I suggest you pay close attention to what's written.
"My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby."
I suggest you not ignore that "God" deals with us as His children if we endure His correction. And what's the expected fruit that's expected by "God"? Is it not righteousness?
<quoted text>Did I say anything about a person that committed one sin and died? Or, did I ask about people that return to a sinful lifestyle and don't repent before they die? There's a major difference between what I asked and what you just said.
<quoted text>That's exactly what I said. Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? If I had died before I repented and while I was still engulfed in my sins, I would not have been saved. Saying "Lord, Lord" is not enough to be saved. It's written, "Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil...Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand."
BLL, what I meant by twisting things.(and you do)

..you said I contradicted myself when I said they were still saved but there would be consequences or they would be disciplined by God., if they died in their sins...if they BELIEVED before their onset of SINNING.

You have to have TRUST in GOD. FAITH, without seeing HIM, CONFIDENCE in His word. You can't just READ the Bible, and memorize it, You have to FEEL the word.

Even though I BELIEVE that once I accepted Jesus into my Heart, He will never leave me or forsake me or deny me my Salvation, God will still Repromand or discipline me for doing wrong!

We know a true Christian by their fruits they produce, many scriptures are there for us on this....out of space

“Jesus is coming soon”

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#483609 Feb 3, 2013
Drew H wrote:
<quoted text>
1. I have yet to gather that Grace has stated or implied that which you have said concerning the teachings of Jesus. I use the entire Bible in my studies and discount nothing. However all things written must be taken in their proper context to get the full meaning thereof. In other words, no one has the liberty of taking a verse or even a few verses to make a point. It all has to be taken together.
2. To me, it is obvious that a person as you have described was never a believer.
So, how about the questions I asked you?
Do you believe that all who say they are "Christian" are believers? Do you believe that all who say they are "Christian" are saved?
And one more: Do you believe that all who say they are believers truly are believers?
To answer
your question in a more direct way that you will understand it..........NO..........I do not believe everyone that says they are a "christian" are truly one, not in the least nor is everyone who says that they are a "christian" is truly a Christian and your third question is only synonymous with your first two..........NO.

And perhaps like myself you don't carefully read the posts of others if not address directly to you but Gracie did imply that not all of the Lord's teachings are to be obeyed before his D.B.R. and like I said for example when she said that we did not have to forgive those who have trespassed against us. Also the person that I described was a saved individual who fell from grace and was just as saved as anyone else ever was, this is where the OSAS doctrine fails and contradicts it, see Revelation 22: 15 which says for without are Dogs (paraphasing here and not the four legged kind) Gracie and Doc R both answered this question and said yes that that man will STILL be saved in the end regardless, which I found incredible and completely contradictory to God's Word.

Peace.

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#483610 Feb 3, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
I haven't avoided anything RA
He posted those who believe will have everlasting life.
Wrong, he didn't post just about "everlasting life". He also posted about those that believe in Christ "will not come into judgment". And you clearly avoided the verse he posted that talked about that.

Do you really think people aren't seeing the lies you're telling?

John 5:24.

24 Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, AND SHALL NOT COME INTO JUDGMENT, BUT HAS PASSED FROM DEATH UNTO LIFE.
simplyput

Aurora, CO

#483611 Feb 3, 2013
continue BLL

Many scriptures on what a true Chrisian is Mark 12:24-30, 11Tim 3: 15-17, Matt 4:4, Luke4:4, Deut 8:3

A Christian is one who has come to realize that he/she had been under the permanent death penalty and he/she NEEDS a SAVIOR. Romans 6:23

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Prove there's a god. (Mar '08) 2 min Buck Crick 881,512
Poll If you're Christain what kind are you? (Oct '07) 2 min RiccardoFire 8,390
News Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 16 min Liam 603,753
You want REAL PROOF that God is REAL??! 37 min Doctor REALITY 9
The Christian Atheist debate 54 min Lbj 4,127
Which is the Oldest Indian Language? Sanskrit V... (Jul '08) 1 hr sangili karuppan 7,700
News The Latest: Husband: Kentucky clerk is 'standin... 1 hr Lbj 28
More from around the web