Why Should Jesus Love Me?

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“Paul is a confessed liar”

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#477014
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Grace Walker wrote:
<quoted text>
Now G...How long have we been friends? We have always known that our beliefs dont mesh and we disagree a lot but you cannot say that we havent gotten along with one another and even comforted one another at times. <big hug>.. And YES, YOU are egotistical <smile> I still luv ya G..
Agreed. <smile>

“Become Love!”

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#477015
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G_O_D wrote:
Why did God create sin and a creature that could commit sin ?
God by your definition is evil. It stacked the deck and then accused innocent players of cheating.
Before this gets out of hand...unless it already has...

"God" didn't create sin, as if sin is its own entity. Sin, as you most likely know, is disobedience.

As we can all read, when Adam and Eve ate the proverbial fruit from the proverbial tree of the knowledge of good and evil, it was said that they had become "like us." Obviously, then, evil was known by "God" and the heavenly host. But, does that mean "God" was a sinner, too? Of course, not. What that means is that disobedience was, merely, a concept, being the opposite of obedience, and the heavenly host were well aware of it. Sin and disobedience didn't become a literal, physical manifestation until the devil entertained rebellion in his thoughts and acted upon it. But, even before that, it was known that the opposite of obedience is disobedience, whether any had become disobedient or not.

Every creature was created with the ability to sin. But, along with the ability was given warning and consequence. Because much of the written records of Adam and Eve are symbolic, we don't recognize them. The sin that Eve was enticed with was autonomy, or the desire to govern one's self without "God." Eve accepted the suggestion and exposed Adam to the same. This, in turn, produced guilt and shame, which means that they learned the difference between obedience and disobedience.

Every creature was created with the ability to sin. And because of this, a "fail-safe," if you will, was included. The proverbial "tree of life" was this "fail-safe." Reading the accounts, we can see that mankind was already endowed with everlasting life, from the moment of his creation, but never do we read of them partaking from this proverbial tree prior to their fall. This "tree of life" was in their midst, though. And it was only after they sinned that it was pronounced that they would have to take from this proverbial tree in order to be restored. And rather than believe that "God" knew they would sin beforehand, it makes more sense to believe that "God" included this proverbial "tree of life" just in case. And sadly, it became necessary.

"God" knew man's fall was highly possible, but not inevitable. I mean, one of His own angelic creations fell. But, it's ludicrous to even think that "God" created man so that he could fall, and then administer the most harshest punishment on them. To even think that "God" created man sinful is to also think "God," Himself, is sinful, as only a bad tree can produce bad fruit. But, man was created perfect through and through. Now, I know that there will be many that will oppose what I'm saying, as people can't understand how an all-knowing "God" would create a creature without knowing that His creation would fail. The fact is, He didn't know. Again, He was aware the possibility, but He didn't know it would happen. If anything, He had hoped it wouldn't. To say He did is also to say that He set His Son up, to die. Consider the following, please and if you will...

You're at the top of a snow-covered hill and you make a snowball. You're intention is to roll the snowball down the hill. You predict the outcome of the snowball to your audience. Now, does this mean you know the future, or that you understand the nature of snow, so forth and so on? I liken "God's" foreknowledge to the same.

Predictions and prophecies are based on two things. Knowledge and interaction. Prophecy by knowledge is understanding the nature of the subject and having the ability to tell it's future based on your knowledge of it. Prophecy by interaction is telling the future with the intent of making it come to pass at a predetermined time. That's why our anointed Savior doesn't know the time of his second-advent.

I've ran out of room. Hopefully, I can continue later on.

Until next time...

Shalowm.

“Paul is a confessed liar”

Since: Jul 11

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#477016
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
<quoted text>
Nuh huh! Extreme intellectualism does.
<3
You mean being able to read a book without trying to make the words say what I want them to ? Yes, I am an intellectual.

“Paul is a confessed liar”

Since: Jul 11

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#477017
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
<quoted text>
Personally, I can see it doesn't matter.
<3
I agree. It is only an intellectual persuit and Jesus said to worry about today, not what tomorrow will bring.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

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#477018
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
It can be, yes. I can't speak for others, but I love you, you have a bright mind and it's wonderful that you're here, learning, searching and growing. "God is Love"
<3
Thank you.

Please keep in mind as you read my opinions that my negativity is directed at the church and its leadership, not the rank and file Christian like you and most of the other Christian posters here on Topix.

But I also understand how difficult it is to read such things about what you consider sacred without wanting to attack the source. I guess that I'm expressing both understanding and regret about that now. It seems like the inevitable result of these wedge issues in the culture wars, whether it be the religious v. secular battle, or the conservative v. liberal one.

Also please note that the flurry of recent critical posts were a reaction to a standard that many skeptics want to see changed: the one-way expectation that unbelievers show respect to the religion while at the same time being called fools, no good, corrupt , abominable, and the like. That's unreasonable.

Once upon a time, the two sides were so lopsided in power that the skeptics had to take any verbal abuse that the church chose to dish out. It could call us the moral equivalent of murderers and whoremongers with impunity.

I guess what I want to say is that Christians should note that we don't have to sit by silently and take that any more, and many of us don't want to. Posters like LAWEST100 need to realize this, and think about it before trotting out scripture calling atheists corrupt fools. It's rude. And those are fighting words, even if some of you consider them holy.

How else are we to correct that except to reject it explicitly when we see it? I'd rather see believers policing themselves and one another in this regard than to have to choose between sitting for such insolence and rebuking the source.

Anyway, thanks again for the kind words.

“Paul is a confessed liar”

Since: Jul 11

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#477019
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
<quoted text>
We used to get along, now you don't talk to me anymore :''(
<3
When you come visit we will have lots to talk about. <wink>

“Paul is a confessed liar”

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#477020
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
<quoted text>
Now I have that song stuck in my head...
<3
Tilt your head to one side and jump up and down. LOL

“Paul is a confessed liar”

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#477021
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Qu_innocence wrote:
Edit (Le le): "May you truly receive Salvation one day before it's too late. Bye bye for now."
There is a Jewish insult that goes "May you spend 11 months in Gehenna." It is also in a funeral prayer "May he spend no more than 11 months in Gehenna".

It is one of the Jewish beliefs that the spirit is cleansed in Gehenna and that if it is not clean after 12 months it is anihilated. Islam has a similar belief.

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

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#477022
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
Hi Brother Lee Love :D
Nao tou te disrespeitando mais, que?
<3
Eu nao sei o que voce quer dizer. Voce nao concorda com o que eu postei? Eu sei que muito do que eu acredito que, neste dia, sao considerados altamente controverso, mas tambem acredito que as pessoas tem inventado o tipo de Deus que desejam adorar. Eu baseio minhas crenças sobre metodos rigorosos de estudo e a aplicacao estrita do que esta escrito. Se voce tiver alguma duvida, eu serei mais do que feliz em me explicar para voce.

Ate a proxima vez, meu amigo.

Shalowm.

P.S. Eu acredito que Deus quer que saibamos tanto sobre ele como devemos uns aos outros. Eu acredito que nao podemos saber tudo o que ha para saber sobre Deus, mas eu nao acredito que ele tenha escondido que muito de si mesmo de nos. Nos fomos feitos a Sua imagem. Portanto, muito do que podemos aprender d'Ele, nao precisamos procurar mais do que dentro de si mesmo.

“Paul is a confessed liar”

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#477023
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Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>Come, now, G_O_D.
First, the citation said that heaven and earth were created, specifically, for James. Not "man." There is a difference.
Secondly, heaven and earth were created for man to live, but not to be saved. Nothing in the bible even suggests that man was created with any foreknowledge that he would one day fall. That's preposterous.
I might have just opened a huge can of worms, but hey. Somebody's gotta do it.
1. Yeah, I was just being obnoxious. There is much in Thomas that is just as 'goofy' as any in the Bible.

2. God didn't know what was going to happen ?

3. To be fishers of men you need bait, a can of worms will work.

“Which "god"?”

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G_O_D wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean being able to read a book without trying to make the words say what I want them to ? Yes, I am an intellectual.
I didn't mean just you. Many, including myself, have at times complicated something that is simple, some say that's because some people cannot believe in something that is so simple and easy, it could be that this, in part, has contributed to the development of so many branches of the same religion. Sometimes, some people can drive themselves 'round the bend; looking for something they've already found. You may not be the only intellectual here and I mean no offence, just expressing my point of view.
Peace G <3

“Paul is a confessed liar”

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Interesting, but then it means God is not omniscient. If God didn't know what man would do then there is no such thing as prophecy. If God can't see the future then man certainly can't. Right ?
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>Before this gets out of hand...unless it already has...
"God" didn't create sin, as if sin is its own entity. Sin, as you most likely know, is disobedience.
As we can all read, when Adam and Eve ate the proverbial fruit from the proverbial tree of the knowledge of good and evil, it was said that they had become "like us." Obviously, then, evil was known by "God" and the heavenly host. But, does that mean "God" was a sinner, too? Of course, not. What that means is that disobedience was, merely, a concept, being the opposite of obedience, and the heavenly host were well aware of it. Sin and disobedience didn't become a literal, physical manifestation until the devil entertained rebellion in his thoughts and acted upon it. But, even before that, it was known that the opposite of obedience is disobedience, whether any had become disobedient or not....EDIT FOR SPACE ONLY...
Shalowm.

“Paul is a confessed liar”

Since: Jul 11

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#477026
Jan 15, 2013
 

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Juicylu wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't mean just you. Many, including myself, have at times complicated something that is simple, some say that's because some people cannot believe in something that is so simple and easy, it could be that this, in part, has contributed to the development of so many branches of the same religion. Sometimes, some people can drive themselves 'round the bend; looking for something they've already found. You may not be the only intellectual here and I mean no offence, just expressing my point of view.
Peace G <3
I think there are few human problems going on with reading scriptures.

Rather than underdstanding that the writers made mistakes or had different opinions, people try to make everything in the Bible agree and fit their own preconcieved doctrines, dogma and biases.

IMHO Christianity has become more about "proving" the Bible and defending Paul than it is about Jesus' living message about the here and now.

“Which "god"?”

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Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>Eu nao sei o que voce quer dizer. Voce nao concorda com o que eu postei? Eu sei que muito do que eu acredito que, neste dia, sao considerados altamente controverso, mas tambem acredito que as pessoas tem inventado o tipo de Deus que desejam adorar. Eu baseio minhas crenças sobre metodos rigorosos de estudo e a aplicacao estrita do que esta escrito. Se voce tiver alguma duvida, eu serei mais do que feliz em me explicar para voce.
Ate a proxima vez, meu amigo.
Shalowm.
P.S. Eu acredito que Deus quer que saibamos tanto sobre ele como devemos uns aos outros. Eu acredito que nao podemos saber tudo o que ha para saber sobre Deus, mas eu nao acredito que ele tenha escondido que muito de si mesmo de nos. Nos fomos feitos a Sua imagem. Portanto, muito do que podemos aprender d'Ele, nao precisamos procurar mais do que dentro de si mesmo.
Eu concordo com quase tudo que voce escreve, todo o dia. So fiquei duvida com o que voce falo de Deus nao sabendo que (sin) ia entrar no mundo, porcauso de passagems na Biblia (Rom 9:22-23)(1 Cor 15:22)(1 Cor 15:45)(Joao 1:1-14) e acho que fala disso tambem no Rev, mais nao lembro qual passagem. Achei que Deus sabia sim e era parte do plano dele so a gente poderia saber a differencia de um mundo com Deus (Luz) e o mundo que nao tem deus (Luz nao), e porcauso do Adao era primeiro e Jesus era ultimo. Tenho umas coisas que eu aprendi no meus estudos de Biblia e que achei na internete que me confusou tambem porque muitos falam que Ele sabia sim, mais se eu nao entendi mesmo o que voce falou, dai minha desculpa. Paz <3

Since: Sep 10

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#477028
Jan 15, 2013
 

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simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand where you are coming from.
God is a SPIRIT. God sent His only Son, Jesus , to dwell amongst us and to show us our Heavenly Father,
This is where Faith comes in, Faith without seeing , the ones Jesus picked out to be His diciples, got to see Him and Hear His teachings. They captured it for US, and the Bible was born.
I love to read the Bible, It does have some STRONG stuff in it, but when you read the Bible ask (pray) for God to help you understand it. It comes ALIVE to you, it is Amazing.
God does work in mysterious ways and perhaps will someday you will
be drawn to want to know more about Him. I hope for you.
You seem like a very nice person, and that is a very good start.
But God will take you as you are, with all your faults, it also could happen at anytime, anywhere,
His ways are not our ways.
Thank you for the kind words.

Faith is a difficult concept forr me to accept...

“Which "god"?”

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G_O_D wrote:
<quoted text>
I think there are few human problems going on with reading scriptures.
Rather than underdstanding that the writers made mistakes or had different opinions, people try to make everything in the Bible agree and fit their own preconcieved doctrines, dogma and biases.
IMHO Christianity has become more about "proving" the Bible and defending Paul than it is about Jesus' living message about the here and now.
I agree with that, it seems like it was bound to happen.
Divinely Inspired; yes, but still written by man. Translated a bunch of times then interpreted differently by almost everyone.
I think the Bible has retained Its core message for how we should live and how to follow Jesus and I personally gave up trying to decipher it completely, because I don't think we're meant to.
Plus, this is the bit I won't debate on and you know how I feel about debating 'Faith', when you feel It, the Spirit, you just sort of know stuff that you can't rationalise to anyone else unless they feel the Spirit too.
<3

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#477030
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Juicylu wrote:
<quoted text>
You talk a lot about God, considering you don't believe He exists...
I think he is talking of believers, and of the Bible and what it says.

Does it say those things?

They do sound awful.

“Become Love!”

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#477031
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G_O_D wrote:
Interesting, but then it means God is not omniscient. If God didn't know what man would do then there is no such thing as prophecy. If God can't see the future then man certainly can't. Right ?
Isn't it amazing how that all the gods of history and of the world have a striking resemblance to the people that created them? Isn't it more amazing that many so-called "Christians" don't see themselves as doing the same?

The "God" we read about, in the bible, is as much molded, formed, and fashioned, to fit man's criteria as any other. "God" is omniscient because man made Him that way. And then comes the questions that none can answer.

The moment any believer is asked how such a loving "God" could create man with the foreknowledge of his frailties and inevitability to sin, only to administer the most harshest of punishments on him for being too weak and ignorant to remain perfect, they become stuck for answers. The moment any believer is asked how such a loving "God" would, or even could, create man with the foreknowledge that He would, one day, have to send His only-begotten Son to sacrifice himself for them, they get stuck for answers. The moment any believer is asked how such a loving "God" could sacrifice His own Son while prohibiting men from sacrificing their's is another question they can't answer. And while they believe as so, they also can't find a legitimate reason as to how a good tree, as "God" is perfect, can bear such bad fruit! It makes no sense, whatsoever. And this is what troubles me so much about these so-called "Christians" and their contradicting belief-systems. And this is why I chose to separate myself from our modern perceptions of Christendom.

Again, I explained the different forms of prophecy. Prophecy is based on knowledge and interaction. When our anointed Savior was exposing man's ultimate demise, recorded at Matthew 24, he wasn't sharing with them his foreknowledge of the future outside the realm of knowing the nature of man. He was sharing what he knew of man based on man's past and present status. But, during this time, he also revealed that he knew not the time of his return. If memory serves me correctly, only twice during that time did he mention a future prophecy. But, then, this prophecy is based on interaction. In other words, when that prophecy comes to pass, it does because "God" is going to interact at a predetermined time. I believe that if "God" were omniscient, as people must believe it seems, then He never would have had to interact with us, at all. Like time, all He would have had to do was set it in motion and wait.

“Quo Vadis”

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simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>
You can stop your 'belittling attitude' it doesn't work.
If you didn't notice the statments I left of being disrepectable then I don't know what else to say that you could see,
you are very dense in comprehending ( just stating a fact that I have notice in your replies to people) so don't get your feelings hurt.
Your not damaging our emotions, just YOURS.
I think you've got me wrong Mr. Simply Put. I don't know why you believe I'm belittling people. I mean, you've singled me out on a thread where there are heated debates and arguments daily and talk about me disrespecting others. Frankly, I think responding to this post is a waste of time. Usually, the first thoughts and swift judgments you have of people may be something you're seeing inside yourself. So I appeal to you, put down your verbal bricks and clubs and add something of substance to the thread or to the conversation. all I see you doing is casting judgment.

You somehow remind me of Dr. Shrink and his little friends who are just cyber manifestations of his split personality. I don't want to be wrong about you so just do the right thing and challenge the conversation. This is called Topix, where people challenge and discuss several issues and news items, they don't come on here having problems with people. If that's your aim, find something more constructive to do with your time rather than wasting other people's time.

Shalom.

CS.

“Quo Vadis”

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Dr Shrink wrote:
<quoted text>
READ all my posts directed to you previouss 10 days
your asking and demands hang on my tail,
you are nobody to questions others,not any court persecutor or lawyer to sentence or defend anyone
next of all
I am excluded from any false group of modern pharisee acussing each other, sending false peace(there is not peace) love(there is not sincere love)or without of sense religious discussions
you also don't havet to send me in advance your thanks?
undestood poor rabbee?
have good night,
You display nothing that resembles love. All I did was ask the name of your God and the name of your Lord. It didn't require you writing me an epistle or a sermon because my questions were simple. Now it really matters very little if any what you think of me; your true Christian behavior is a witness unto itself. Now it's either you answer the questions, or you won't or you can't, it's not quantum physics. My questions only require simple answers, they were not designed with the purpose of being difficult, but you are proving my theory correct nonetheless.

Shalom.

CS.

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