Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470823 Dec 15, 2012
Roberta G wrote:
<quoted text>Boy, this Cindy sounds like one heck of a piece of work :/
Hey Roberta

Let me first say I was deciding when to pick my spot to say I was sorry things had gotten contentious between us as unfortunately political discussions can often go that way. I have always had the utmost respect for you.

As to this just trust me when I say the things I mentioned are by in the column of the more sane things she has done comparatively speaking both on Topix and definitely in real life. I am not going to get into detail as I feel in this context it would be more spiteful than preventative since it is improbable you will have any sustained contact with her. But even after being desensitized somewhat after 3 years of one insane thing topping the last it still boggles the mind.

Anyway, same as with Chris as I may not see you before but hope I do, Marry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and yours

(T) Peace

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470824 Dec 15, 2012
Sheesh

MERRY Christmas not mArry

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470825 Dec 15, 2012
Simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL Exactly what was thinking reading those posts. It is really something to be able to work the minds of these people, to watch for her/he in disguise, when they cannot see the person behind the name on topix. It seems to bother a lot on here.
I don't think it bothers anyone. I think they just judicially exercise common sense when they think someone is not being honest. For example we had a poster by the name of BBB who used many aliases whose main identity I don't anybody is confused to that keeps showing up here from Aurora, Co

Is it possible that two posters are from the same place? Sure. But it rarely happens. So when someone shows up out of nowhere from that location and follows a pattern like involving themselves in everything that happens such as claiming your family almost went to the same movie theater that night or taking the position it seems to really bother people when people come in and lie and deceive others as if the fault lies with those against the deception it makes one wonder. Or to think these posters are working the minds of anyone. While I am sure proud of their attempted manipulations, very few are actually fooled nor does it have any impact other than perhaps a shake of the head at how pathetic an adult's life must be to stoop to such things

JMO

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#470826 Dec 15, 2012
If we can lose our salvation because of our sinful works and must do good works to get that salvation back (which is what those that believe one can lose their salvation are claiming) than there would be no need for a Saviour.

According to those that believe that, it's their good works that redeems them after they've lost their salvation due to sinful works. And that belief is in direct contradiction of what God's Holy Word says and is nothing but a false man made doctrine.

Salvation can only come from the Saviour. Our works can't save us. And to preach that they can is preaching nothing but a lie and is exactly what satan wants to be preached.

Nothing more and nothing less.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#470827 Dec 15, 2012
lil whispers wrote:
<quoted text>
Daniel 9:26&27
Prdiction on sacrifices
Colossians 2:14
Ephesians 2:15&16
Colossians 2:16&17
See Leviticus 23:4-44
Hebrews 10:1
Matthew 27:51
Hebrews 10:8&9
John 4:21
What really ended at the cross
Acts 15:1&24
Act 15:28&29
Acts 6:13:14
Acts 18:13
Acts 24:14
Testing the issue.
Romans 3:20
See Romans 3:31 and 8:1-3
Romans 10:4
See Romans 7:7
1 Peter 1:9
See 1 Timothy 1:5
See James 5:11
Matthew 5:17
Jesus and the law
Roman 3:20
James 2:10
Purpose for law

Romans 1:16
1 Corinthians 1:23&24
Psalms 40:7&8
Hebrews 8:6&10
Romans 10:10
Philippians 3:8&9
Romans 3:21
Romans 3:31
See Romans 3:19-22 & 4:4 & 5:20&21 &7:13
See 2 Corinthians 3:7-9
See Galatians 3:21-24
See Timothy 1:8-11
See Romans 7:5&11 & 6:1-15
See 2 Corthinians 5:14&15 & 5:21
John 1:29
2 Timothy 1:10
2 Corthinians 3:18&27&28
Matthew 5:21&22
Isaiah 42:21
Magnifies law

Galatians 3:8
Romans 4:3
Romans 3:20
Romans 3:24
Romans 6:1&2
Matthew 5:17
John 15:10
Revelation 14:12
Grace & the law

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#470828 Dec 15, 2012
Skombolis wrote:
Truthtruthtruthtruthtruth...
Wow. You said a lot. So much that I decided to answer you this way instead of my usual format. Anyway...

You're absolutely right.

Obviously, we're being misunderstood in our stance. I think I can speak for all of us when I say that, in no way, shape, or form, are any of us even implying that any righteousness on our part is an intricate part of "God's" salvation. As John declared, "We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham." Salvation has been offered long, long before any of us were born! And whether we accept what's been offered, or not, what we do, personally or as a whole, has no bearing on salvation, whatsoever. Salvation is "God's" promise, period.

To the Romans, Paul wrote, "I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness? For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office: If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them. For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?" Then, in the same chapter, we read, "And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off."

Faith and obedience to the law was a requirement toward the nation of Israel. But, we have many, today, that believe that the requirements for us differ from that of the chosen nation. Many, today, believe that all that's necessary is faith, but obedience not, or not so much. Isn't this boasting against the branches? Have I not quoted, repeatedly, that our anointed Savior hasn't changed, nor will he? Why do some of us believe that the rules have changed? I said it before and I'll say it again. Yes, certain laws have been fulfilled to where, we don't have to perform these tasks any longer. But, were they removed, entirely? NO! They exist as long as our anointed Savior exists, and that's forever. The works are no longer necessary, because of him, but the purpose of them remain in him.

Do we have to be circumcised in order to enter into a covenant with "God?" NO! Our anointed Savior IS circumcision.

Do we have to sacrifice in order to be forgiven and reconciled to "God?" NO! Our anointed Savior IS our sacrifice.

Do we have to put one another to death because we sinned and broke the covenant? NO! Our anointed Savior died for us.

Do we have to adhere to every precept of every separated Day? NO! Our anointed Savior IS these precepts.

It was these things that Israel took for granted, thinking that obedience to these were enough to appease "God." But, as Samuel said, "Hath YHWH as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of YHWH? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams." Why anyone would think that less is required of us troubles me. Even today, the nation of Israel is still the chosen people. And none should boast against them by even thinking that less is required of us.

Until next time...

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#470829 Dec 15, 2012
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't think it bothers anyone. I think they just judicially exercise common sense when they think someone is not being honest. For example we had a poster by the name of BBB who used many aliases whose main identity I don't anybody is confused to that keeps showing up here from Aurora, Co
Is it possible that two posters are from the same place? Sure. But it rarely happens. So when someone shows up out of nowhere from that location and follows a pattern like involving themselves in everything that happens such as claiming your family almost went to the same movie theater that night or taking the position it seems to really bother people when people come in and lie and deceive others as if the fault lies with those against the deception it makes one wonder. Or to think these posters are working the minds of anyone. While I am sure proud of their attempted manipulations, very few are actually fooled nor does it have any impact other than perhaps a shake of the head at how pathetic an adult's life must be to stoop to such things
JMO
Skom you're right in what you said. But in the case of Grace (as you even commented on yourself) it was clear by what she wrote that she sure wasn't Cindy. But did that stop Quin from accusing her of being Cindy?

Nope, not at all.

Just look at all the "new posters" that have come in here that have fit the "Cindy MO" far more than Grace did. And not once did Quin question if any of them may be Cindy. But that wasn't the case with Grace now was it?

Nope, he jumped all over her.

And we all know why don't we?

It's because Grace opposed Quin's belief that a person can lose their salvation after they've attained it. And because of that Quin decided to attack her. And even though it was clear that she wasn't Cindy Quin decided to accuse her of being Cindy and use that as a spring board to launch his attack.

So lets get real honest here. Quin set out to try to discredit Grace by attacking her and who she was. He tried to get people to turn on her by trying to get people to believe she was Cindy back in here trying to pull her deceptive tricks again.

Did it work?

Nope. Because people called him out on it because they knew better.

And what did Quin do (and he continues to do)?

He acted like it's no big deal and just tried to shove it under that table and change the subject, just like he always does when his dishonesty is exposed.

Only time will tell if he'll be man enough to step up and apologize and admit his deceit and dishonesty. I rather doubt it will happen. He'll more likely avoid it or try to change the subject and use it to launch another attack like he did twice yesterday when he was confronted about lies he got caught in.

“squuuze me”

Since: Feb 09

Florida, USA

#470830 Dec 15, 2012
Is it possible for a believer to lose their mind?

Is it possible for one whose name "is" written in the Lambs Book of Life to lose their mind?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470831 Dec 15, 2012
Red Apples wrote:
If we can lose our salvation because of our sinful works and must do good works to get that salvation back (which is what those that believe one can lose their salvation are claiming) than there would be no need for a Saviour.
According to those that believe that, it's their good works that redeems them after they've lost their salvation due to sinful works. And that belief is in direct contradiction of what God's Holy Word says and is nothing but a false man made doctrine.
Salvation can only come from the Saviour. Our works can't save us. And to preach that they can is preaching nothing but a lie and is exactly what satan wants to be preached.
Nothing more and nothing less.
I do agree salvation can not be lost. I personally believe however like it says in Romans (Romans 2:5-8) that there will be a day (Judgement Day) when "God's righteous judgement will be revealed" and "God will give to each person according to what he has done.". Good works mean nothing without faith. Works are simply a manifestation of obedience and faith. Those that have endured and finished the race will receive their reward and be spared judgement. Will God save someone who doesn't remain faithful and obedient? That to me sounds like someone who believed for a while and even received the Word with joy but fell away in times of temptation as we are told in Luke.

Jesus tells us in

John 15
10If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love.

He also says in Matthew and Luke that believers who are obedient will receive eternal life

To me it isn't can someone lose their salvation but rather can someone lose their faith. If a believer can receive the word with joy and still fall away or not remain in Christ's love by failing to be obedient then to me it can only be one of two things. Either the person never was a believer in the first place or believers can lose faith and fall away.

But if a person never was really a believer to begin with how would they ever have been in Christ's love as surely God can not be fooled? And why would Luke say specifically some will believe for a while and receive the Word with joy?

However I do agree that salvation can not be lost and that works do not redeem us. If someone hates their brother, refuses to forgive others, forsakes assembly, does not repent when they sin, etc then no amount of good works makes any difference. Obedience to me in fact really is not even a separate category from faithfulness as one who is faithful will be obedient out of love.

I think you and I can agree that regardless of what it means as far as was someone truly a believer or not, that someone that does not remain faithful is not going to be saved. If their faith was on the rock, if their seed did not take root, if they give into temptation and fall away..for whatever reason or whatever that implies about their original faith and whether they were a believer, one does need to keep their faith to be saved.

Perhaps that is why Paul says to examine ourselves daily and why both Paul and James say don't just listen to the word and deceive ourselves but those that follow the Word will be saved.

So maybe that would be the better message to get across to people. Not that salvation can be lost or that salvation can be earned but rather make sure we test ourselves daily to make sure we are not simply Christian in name but Christian in deed. If when we examine ourselves daily and we can see our faith is strong and that we continue to strive to please God out of love then we know what we have heard has taken root. To me that is the real warning, to make sure we are not simply paying lip-service but that we have committed to the faith. Those that have will most certainly be saved and any transgressions of the faithful who will naturally be sorry when they stumble will be forgiven.

JMO

(T) Peace

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#470832 Dec 15, 2012
hick-up wrote:
Is it possible for a believer to lose their mind?
Is it possible for one whose name "is" written in the Lambs Book of Life to lose their mind?
I do not know.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470833 Dec 15, 2012
Red Apples wrote:
<quoted text>
Skom you're right in what you said. But in the case of Grace (as you even commented on yourself) it was clear by what she wrote that she sure wasn't Cindy. But did that stop Quin from accusing her of being Cindy?
Nope, not at all.
Just look at all the "new posters" that have come in here that have fit the "Cindy MO" far more than Grace did. And not once did Quin question if any of them may be Cindy. But that wasn't the case with Grace now was it?
Nope, he jumped all over her.
And we all know why don't we?
It's because Grace opposed Quin's belief that a person can lose their salvation after they've attained it. And because of that Quin decided to attack her. And even though it was clear that she wasn't Cindy Quin decided to accuse her of being Cindy and use that as a spring board to launch his attack.
So lets get real honest here. Quin set out to try to discredit Grace by attacking her and who she was. He tried to get people to turn on her by trying to get people to believe she was Cindy back in here trying to pull her deceptive tricks again.
Did it work?
Nope. Because people called him out on it because they knew better.
And what did Quin do (and he continues to do)?
He acted like it's no big deal and just tried to shove it under that table and change the subject, just like he always does when his dishonesty is exposed.
Only time will tell if he'll be man enough to step up and apologize and admit his deceit and dishonesty. I rather doubt it will happen. He'll more likely avoid it or try to change the subject and use it to launch another attack like he did twice yesterday when he was confronted about lies he got caught in.
Honestly I only came in like a day ago and on the tail-end of the conversations so I didn't see anything that might have led up to it.

I can say for me personally I spoke with her over on WIANLAC and felt quite comfortable she was who she said or at least as comfortable as someone can be with a new poster as it is always possible but I certainly haven't seen anything to make me think so.

I can't speak for Quin's true motivation as only he knows if his suspicions were legitimate and without knowing what led up to it I don't have an opinion of my own. However obviously on general principle I would agree that it would be wrong to call someone's identity into question simply as a debate tactic.

I hope you understand why I can't commit to much more than that and that I am not being evasive but I simply don't have the necessary information. I understand why it can be very difficult to take a new poster at face value but I don't deny that can be exploited as well. Obviously I would hope that wasn't the case but can't weigh in one way or the other since i wasn't here for the lead-up

(T) Peace
simplyput

Aurora, CO

#470834 Dec 15, 2012
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't think it bothers anyone. I think they just judicially exercise common sense when they think someone is not being honest. For example we had a poster by the name of BBB who used many aliases whose main identity I don't anybody is confused to that keeps showing up here from Aurora, Co
Is it possible that two posters are from the same place? Sure. But it rarely happens. So when someone shows up out of nowhere from that location and follows a pattern like involving themselves in everything that happens such as claiming your family almost went to the same movie theater that night or taking the position it seems to really bother people when people come in and lie and deceive others as if the fault lies with those against the deception it makes one wonder. Or to think these posters are working the minds of anyone. While I am sure proud of their attempted manipulations, very few are actually fooled nor does it have any impact other than perhaps a shake of the head at how pathetic an adult's life must be to stoop to such things
JMO
I think it is very rude for a Christian to attack and disect someone's every statement, that just stops in because they are from the same place. Some in my family almost did go to this theater and we have had the agony of what IFs and still do, now if you think I am lieing then there is not much I can do about this and why would I even want to lie about something like that?. I know the pain of these poor people , I am not this cindy person or anyone else , I just happen to stop into this thread.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470835 Dec 15, 2012
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>
Faith and obedience to the law was a requirement toward the nation of Israel. But, we have many, today, that believe that the requirements for us differ from that of the chosen nation. Many, today, believe that all that's necessary is faith, but obedience not, or not so much..
I hear ya brother. And perhaps there is a better way for us to tailor our message as we are not trying to convey that people need to walk around on eggshells fearful that the slightest misstep will cost them salvation or that they can earn their way back in. But rather what we are saying is that how can someone claim faithfulness when they are not obedient?

They are called the two greatest COMMANDMENTS for a reason and that is they are to be followed

Luke 10
27 He answered,“‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’ and,‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’”28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied.“Do this and you will live.”

Matthew 19:16-17
Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, "Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?" Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments."

It isn't so much about making a mistake and it isn't about losing salvation or earning it but rather it is a reminder to test ourselves daily to make sure we are on the narrow path. Of course we will stumble from time to time but when we do we get up, dust ourselves off, and get back to living our faith.

If someone claims belief yet that belief does not prompt them to be obedient then something went wrong. When it went wrong or why can be debated but in the end doesn't really matter. If a believer that will be saved is obedient, either because he chooses to be or as some feel because he will automatically be, then it only makes sense that one who is not has an issue with their faith. And they need to address it because if they don't get right with God, as some never do but think they have, they will hear:

Matthew 7:21
"Not everyone who says to Me,'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

(T) Peace
Here For Now

Lenoir City, TN

#470836 Dec 15, 2012
LAWEST100 wrote:
<quoted text> Yes we are reygulars, and are here far more often then you are, and of course like many people, conveying God's truth through the pureness of his Word always skake up the fragile "christian" beliefs of those like yourself, but you've just said the magic words yourself..........you can't see.
Peace.
I’m still not feeling myself so was just going to read some till I read this.

With all due respect Lawest, Le Le and Roberta have been posting with us for years. And with all due respect you have not shaken me with your words. You are free to believe what you want and so am I. I am not fragile and I believe once saved always saved. Neither are Le Le and Roberta fragile.

I’m not saying you are not wanted here but Le Le and Roberta are wanted here too.
HFN

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#470837 Dec 15, 2012
simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>
I think it is very rude for a Christian to attack and disect someone's every statement, that just stops in because they are from the same place. Some in my family almost did go to this theater and we have had the agony of what IFs and still do, now if you think I am lieing then there is not much I can do about this and why would I even want to lie about something like that?. I know the pain of these poor people , I am not this cindy person or anyone else , I just happen to stop into this thread.
Perhaps you aren't the same poster who has spammed this room for years from Aurora, Co. Perhaps you are not an attention seeker and your family really did almost go to the same theater the same night their was a mass shooting. And perhaps you really do believe the devil is trying to get to us through tv and video games and that isn't a tactic looking to appeal to emotion. I don't deny all those things are possible. Although I have my doubts when coupled with what you said here:

"LOL Exactly what was thinking reading those posts. It is really something to be able to work the minds of these people, to watch for her/he in disguise, when they cannot see the person behind the name on topix. It seems to bother a lot on here."

Perhaps you are who you say. I gave my honest assessment, I could be wrong. But someone who seems to find humor and even admiration in the fact that they believe others can come in here and manipulate people by being deceitful is not someone's whose opinion of me is going to matter much. And I don't expect mine to matter to you as you confirmed. Yet we both have the right to our opinions.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#470838 Dec 15, 2012
Cast all your care upon him;for He careth for you.
1 Peter 5:7

Genesis 8:22
Philippians 4:11
Luke 12:24-28
1 Timothy 6:9&10
Matthew 6:31&32
1 Timothy 6:6&7&8
Contentment

“squuuze me”

Since: Feb 09

Florida, USA

#470839 Dec 15, 2012
Mental Illness ...

I'll leave it to you to Google it for yourselves and settle on a definition that best suits your point of view.

The story must have some significance as it has been told and retold for over two thousand years. I'm talking about the Apostle Peter and the attempted murder of a Roman soldier. When the soldiers came to arrest Jesus, Peter tried to murder one of the soldiers with a sword. As it were the soldier flinched, Peter missed, and the rest is history.

In attempting to murder a Roman soldier; had Peter lost his mind? Or was it just a momentary lapse in judgement?

Peter witnessed miracles firsthand. Peter witnessed Jesus walking on water and attempted to do the same, where he was successful for a short distance ...until he sank, but was rescued, as the story is told.

What could Peter have possibly been thinking in his attempt to murder a Roman soldier? Did he feel that Jesus was incompetent in matters pertaining to His own life? Or was Peter just a hothead? Perhaps a loner, introverted, misunderstood, contemptible, hard to get along with?

Attempted murder ...already murder in his heart. Of a Roman soldier no less, with many witnesses ...a certain death sentence.

Is Peter in heaven today? Or, when judged; will Peter be shown mercy?

Is it possible for a "saved" person to contract Mental Illness?

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#470840 Dec 15, 2012
Red Apples wrote:
If we can lose our salvation because of our sinful works and must do good works to get that salvation back (which is what those that believe one can lose their salvation are claiming) than there would be no need for a Saviour.

According to those that believe that, it's their good works that redeems them after they've lost their salvation due to sinful works. And that belief is in direct contradiction of what God's Holy Word says and is nothing but a false man made doctrine.

Salvation can only come from the Saviour. Our works can't save us. And to preach that they can is preaching nothing but a lie and is exactly what satan wants to be preached.

Nothing more and nothing less.
Greetings, salutations, and shalowm, my Brother.

Be not misled, Brother. Salvation has been offered long before our anointed Savior was crucified. Our anointed Savior only altered, for us, the means to salvation. The law, prophecies, and psalms, prove as much.

Salvation has been, is, and will be, whether any individual accepts it, or not. Even a majority rejection won't eradicate salvation. Our righteousness is required for several reasons, though. If you oppose my assertions, you could always address the scriptures I quote, to show my errors. Anyway...

REASON #1 - Our righteousness proves that we truly believe in "God's" will and promises, without doubt.

James wrote how that the devils also believe "God" exists. But, the devils tremble, too, according to James. I've asked, numerous times, what it was that differentiates us from these trembling, believing devils?

REASON #2 - Our righteousness benefits all those we encounter.

Faith and love are one and the same, if we allow them to be. Without love, our faith is useless, as the prophets proved. What, to you, is love? What laws, or works, do you think we're referring to? Our anointed Savior defined love as one dying for their friends, if need be. The apostles encouraged us to be willing to die for one another, if need be. John wrote that love is keeping the commandments. So, do you reject my assertions, or what's written? More times than not, I quote scriptures without interpretation and commentary. Which do you reject?

I must say, that much of what Paul writes are misunderstood. In addition, the translators translated as best they could. The italicized words and sentences in our verses shows where the translators couldn't find a reasonable, agreeable translation for the original text. But, this is what we were given to work with, until a concordance and lexicon were produced. Were the translators inspired by "God," but not those that gave us these most excellent tools to examine what's written more thoroughly?

Apparently, you misunderstand the reason and purpose of a savior, which is "God's" only-begotten Son. Salvation is in him, and I doubt that not. But, do you understand what it was that he saved us from? Did he save us from sin, even though we, all, are still susceptible to sin, whether we desire to sin, or not? Are we saved from death, which is the penalty for sin? Do we not, still, die? Can we not sin? Consider the following, dedicator of faith.
__________

Our anointed Savior, many times, rebuked people for having "little faith."

Matthew 17:20
And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

Do you have faith equivalent to the size of a mustard seed, "Which indeed is the least of all seeds: but when it is grown, it is the greatest among herbs, and becometh a tree, so that the birds of the air come and lodge in the branches thereof"?

I'm just asking.
__________

Paul wrote, "And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity."

Shalowm.

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#470841 Dec 15, 2012
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
I do agree salvation can not be lost. I personally believe however like it says in Romans (Romans 2:5-8) that there will be a day (Judgement Day) when "God's righteous judgement will be revealed" and "God will give to each person according to what he has done.". Good works mean nothing without faith. Works are simply a manifestation of obedience and faith. Those that have endured and finished the race will receive their reward and be spared judgement. Will God save someone who doesn't remain faithful and obedient? That to me sounds like someone who believed for a while and even received the Word with joy but fell away in times of temptation as we are told in Luke.
Jesus tells us in
John 15
10If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love.
He also says in Matthew and Luke that believers who are obedient will receive eternal life
To me it isn't can someone lose their salvation but rather can someone lose their faith. If a believer can receive the word with joy and still fall away or not remain in Christ's love by failing to be obedient then to me it can only be one of two things. Either the person never was a believer in the first place or believers can lose faith and fall away.
But if a person never was really a believer to begin with how would they ever have been in Christ's love as surely God can not be fooled? And why would Luke say specifically some will believe for a while and receive the Word with joy?
However I do agree that salvation can not be lost and that works do not redeem us. If someone hates their brother, refuses to forgive others, forsakes assembly, does not repent when they sin, etc then no amount of good works makes any difference. Obedience to me in fact really is not even a separate category from faithfulness as one who is faithful will be obedient out of love.
I think you and I can agree that regardless of what it means as far as was someone truly a believer or not, that someone that does not remain faithful is not going to be saved. If their faith was on the rock, if their seed did not take root, if they give into temptation and fall away..for whatever reason or whatever that implies about their original faith and whether they were a believer, one does need to keep their faith to be saved.
Perhaps that is why Paul says to examine ourselves daily and why both Paul and James say don't just listen to the word and deceive ourselves but those that follow the Word will be saved.
So maybe that would be the better message to get across to people. Not that salvation can be lost or that salvation can be earned but rather make sure we test ourselves daily to make sure we are not simply Christian in name but Christian in deed. If when we examine ourselves daily and we can see our faith is strong and that we continue to strive to please God out of love then we know what we have heard has taken root. To me that is the real warning, to make sure we are not simply paying lip-service but that we have committed to the faith. Those that have will most certainly be saved and any transgressions of the faithful who will naturally be sorry when they stumble will be forgiven.
JMO
(T) Peace
Hey Skom, I have a response to this post in my next post.

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#470842 Dec 15, 2012
Skom, I agree with what you said here.

Quote: "I personally believe however like it says in Romans (Romans 2:5-8) that there will be a day (Judgement Day) when "God's righteous judgement will be revealed" and "God will give to each person according to what he has done.". "

The saved will stand before God in Judgement at the "Bema Seat".

Romans 14:10-12 says,“For we will all stand before God’s judgment seat…so then, each of us will give an account of himself to God.” Second Corinthians 5:10 tells us,“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.” In the context, it is clear that both scriptures are referring to Christians, not unbelievers.

The judgment seat of Christ, therefore, involves believers giving an account of their lives to Christ. The judgment seat of Christ does not determine salvation; that was determined by Christ’s sacrifice on our behalf (1 John 2:2) and our faith in Him (John 3:16). All of our sins are forgiven, and we will never be condemned for them (Romans 8:1). We should not look at the judgment seat of Christ as God judging our sins, but rather as God rewarding us for our lives. Yes, as the Bible says, we will have to give an account of ourselves. Part of this is surely answering for the sins we committed. However, that is not going to be the primary focus of the judgment seat of Christ.

At the judgment seat of Christ, believers are rewarded based on how faithfully they served Christ (1 Corinthians 9:4-27; 2 Timothy 2:5). Some of the things we might be judged on are how well we obeyed the Great Commission (Matthew 28:18-20), how victorious we were over sin (Romans 6:1-4), and how well we controlled our tongues (James 3:1-9). The Bible speaks of believers receiving crowns for different things based on how faithfully they served Christ (1 Corinthians 9:4-27; 2 Timothy 2:5).

The various crowns are described in 2 Timothy 2:5, 2 Timothy 4:8, James 1:12, 1 Peter 5:4, and Revelation 2:10. James 1:12 is a good summary of how we should think about the judgment seat of Christ:“Blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, because when he has stood the test, he will receive the crown of life that God has promised to those who love him.”

http://www.gotquestions.org/judgment-seat-Chr...
________

Have a great evening. God bless.

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