Pope denounces 'powerful' gay marriage lobby in U.S.

There are 1603 comments on the USA Today story from Mar 9, 2012, titled Pope denounces 'powerful' gay marriage lobby in U.S.. In it, USA Today reports that:

Pope Benedict XVI waded deep into U.S. campaign politics Friday, urging visiting U.S. bishops to beef up their teaching about the evils of premarital sex and cohabitation, and denouncing what he called the "powerful" gay marriage lobby in America.

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Since: Nov 09

Seattle, WA

#1779 Aug 3, 2012
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
All opinion. Which you are entitled too. But I have to ask, if getting married is not about having kids and starting a family, then what is the purpose of getting married at all?
Given that the gov't provides over a 1000 rights associated with marriage, I don't think that can be answered with only a single point. There are MANY purposes to marriage, and each couple will have their own focus.

But I never said that marriage wasn't about starting a family. It is. But even just two people can constitute a family.
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
Traditional marriage will be devalued by same sex marriage.
That's an absurd and unsupported statement. How so? Your marriage will be as valuable to you as you want it to be.

This SOUNDS like you are saying that marriage will be "tarnished" somehow, if "filthy" gays are allowed to touch it. I realize that this is not actually what you said, but can you see how someone might see this subtext? If you can't clearly and explicitly explain what you think will happen to marriage if gay couples participate, then it sounds as if you simply don't want to share the thing because you consider gay people to be beneath you.

I would worry less about devaluing marriage, and more about devaluing PEOPLE.
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
Gay couples can already claim their domestic partners on taxes and their HMO's and insurace
Not in every state, and not to any Federal extent.
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
And you are right, no one is asking me to be gay. It is a conscious choice made by humans.
This is another absurd and unsupported statement. Where did you get this nonsense? Is that a "choice" YOU could make? Can you rearrange your sexuality at will? Are you in command of who you find attractive?

No one "chooses" to be gay. Considering what gay people go through, why on Earth WOULD they? Do you think that gay people are HOPING to be denied marriage rights, or to be kicked out of their homes, or to be beaten in the streets? Do you think that gay sex is so much better than straight sex? What would motivate someone to make such a choice?
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
And the last time I checked, we were at the top of the evolutionary ladder and one should be able to reasonably deduct that we are smart enough to know better.
Some of us DO know better. We know that consenting adults should have the freedom to craft the best life for themselves that they can, without the interference of nosy, prudish busy-bodies. No one chooses to be gay, but people who ARE gay should not have to face condemnation simply for being themselves.
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
Not to mention the religious factor for some. While the Bible is not law, it is a pretty good guide for someone to establish a good moral foundation. Which, sad to say, God condemmed homosexuals. God's son said to forgive. Where your comfort lies is within your relationship with God, if you even have one.
I'm not interested in any religious factors, they're irrelevant. Your beliefs don't give you license to control others, or to sculpt social law in such a way that people who don't fit your religious framework are made into outsiders.

Again, no one is asking YOU to be gay, or to enter into a same-sex relationship or marriage. Whatever you think the gods want YOU to do, you're free to do it, but don't expect that non-adherents to your religion will willingly follow your religious rules. I can't imagine why a god would allow people to feel same-sex desires (many exclusively) and then forbid any pursuit of it. That kind of "Catch-22" treatment doesn't sound very moral.

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09


#1780 Aug 3, 2012
Or a far simpler argument: People have committed suicide due to the hatred and oppression they have dealt with for being gay. If it is a choice, then why not "choose" to be straight"? Do these people really think that given suicide or switching over, they would still kill themselves?
Gay And Proud wrote:
<quoted text>
Such a simple question! And it has an absolutely easy answer.
If homosexuality is truly a choice then it can be changed. And if it can be changed you'd think that those who've made a business of it, and been leaders in the attempt to change gay to straight, would be able to provide examples of success.
However, the head of the leading ex-gay group Exodus International, a man by the name of Alan Chambers, has admitted very publicly that you can't make a gay person straight no matter what method they try. And they've tried for years and years!
Here's a link to info on it if you don't believe me: http://www.smh.com.au/world/movement-splits-a...

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#1781 Aug 3, 2012
Silvercoastcorks wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't disproved anything either. Prove that it is not a choice of who you are or are not attracted to.
You've already proven that sexuality is not a choice. You yourself said that you "chose" to be heterosexual because you were attracted to members of the opposite sex. In your bizarro world, you "chose" to be attracted to the sex you were already attracted to (LOL on your sad definition of the word 'choice')

Thus you have already admitted that the gender a person is attracted to is inherent and not a choice.

Thanks for making the argument for us!

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