Debate: Was the Apollo moon landing real or a hoax?

[Miguel]

FossilBob wrote:

<quoted text>
No racist joke was made... You are very confused, and your view of the world appears to be quite twisted.

Perhaps I was too sensitive about the joke, let's say it was a political one. As far as my view of the world being twisted and confused, I think you should address the twisted problems affecting your economy over there in your country, unemployment will reach 10 % shortly, that is just unbelievable ! In 25 years or so, the USA will be like what Mexico is today, a second-rate country. You can then forget about building REAL rockets to go to Mars !

[FossilBob]

Miguel wrote:

<quoted text>
I believe there is no smoke without fire ; plus, my instinct tells me that the moon landings are fake. I could be wrong here, I am a human being, I made plenty of mistakes in my life and I will continue to do lots of mistakes until I die... but hopefully, the frequency of those mistakes will diminish as I gain experience, knowledge and wisdom !
You referred to the spacecrafts sent to Mars. Correct me if I'm wrong, but in the last 10-15 years or so, about 50 % of the probes sent to Mars ended up in failure. I saw that many times on the news, very embarrassing for NASA. And obviously, the technology from 10-15 years ago is better than the one in the 1960s... so what's up with that ? There seems to be a regression there. Isn't that strange ? With better tools, we do a poorer job ? Isn't that fishy ? Could it be that the supposed success of the 1960s were just fabrications and pure lies ?
You put silly words in my mouth to try to justify your claims. Of course I do not believe Elvis is still alive and working as a pump attendant in New Jersey ; I believe Elvis Presley died as announced that night in August 1977, because he took way too many medication. I also think Lady Die also died in that car crash and I do not believe President Kennedy lives in a far away island with his brother Robert.
It's very easy for you to call me out with bravado and challenge me to produce proofs that would prove NASA and the American government lied to the public, when you know full well the required proofs are unaccesible to an ordinary citizen like me. But I am hopeful that one day, the truth will come out.

WHAT smoke??? There is none!!! A few phonies with absurd websites making GRADE SCHOOL ERRORS about science and technology... That's what I was talking about.

Your "instinct"... Well... we'll just throw out all scientific data since you "feel" that the Moon landings were a hoax.

Mars Missions?

Mariner 3- failed ‘64
Mariner 4- Mars ‘64
Mariner 6- Mars ‘69
Mariner 7- Mars ‘69
Mariner 8 failed ‘71
Mariner 9-Mars ‘71

Viking 1-Mars ‘76
Viking 2-Mars ‘76

Mars Observer- failed ‘92
Mars Global Surveyor ‘96
Pathfinder ‘96
Mars Climate Orbiter-failed ‘98
Mars Polar Lander-failed ‘99
Mars Odyssey ‘01
Mars Express ‘03
Spirit ‘03
Opportunity ‘03
Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter ‘05
Phoenix ‘07

We are 14 for 19 attempts, and 3 failures for the last 11 missions. That's a great success rate for the difficulty of the missions!

The statistics you quoted (it's SO easy to twist statistics!) were probably for Soviet and USA missions... Virtually every early Soviet planetary mission failed; even now, the Russians have conducted very few planetary missions, successful or otherwise.

Of course, we have launched a whole bunch of other probes to Venus, Mercury, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto...virtually every one has been successful (we're still waiting for the Pluto mission to get there). We have visited several comets and asteroids! We have orbited Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn!

You need to revisit your "instincts"; you have been deliberately misled by people making money from all the folks who buy their nonsense!

[FossilBob]

Miguel wrote:

<quoted text>
Perhaps I was too sensitive about the joke, let's say it was a political one. As far as my view of the world being twisted and confused, I think you should address the twisted problems affecting your economy over there in your country, unemployment will reach 10 % shortly, that is just unbelievable ! In 25 years or so, the USA will be like what Mexico is today, a second-rate country. You can then forget about building REAL rockets to go to Mars !

Actually, my big concern, along with economy and healthcare, is the environment... too many people ignoring science there, too!

And yes... when we get our act back together, heading for Mars sounds great; but...we can't let the organization and infrastructure disappear during our "slow periods".

It will be rough on you "moon hoax" people when we (or someone... the Chinese?) returns to the Moon, and finds all of those landing stages and equipment! You will have to formulate whole new conspiracies about the Chinese sneaking old USA equipment up there to help us fake the old Moon landings!:)

[Miguel]

FossilBob wrote:

<quoted text>
Actually, my big concern, along with economy and healthcare, is the environment... too many people ignoring science there, too!
And yes... when we get our act back together, heading for Mars sounds great; but...we can't let the organization and infrastructure disappear during our "slow periods".
It will be rough on you "moon hoax" people when we (or someone... the Chinese?) returns to the Moon, and finds all of those landing stages and equipment! You will have to formulate whole new conspiracies about the Chinese sneaking old USA equipment up there to help us fake the old Moon landings!:)

Like I have said before, I have made mistakes in my life and if I am proven wrong about the fake American moon landings, I will be the first to admit it. But to say a joke here, I wouldn't be surprised if the Americans would pay the Chinese some bribes so they would secretly put old USA equipment on the moon to corroborate the 1969-1972 moon landings ! ;-)
On the news today, I was astonished to learn that they have found water on the moon ! And it was discovered by, get this, an Hindu probe ! What in the world...? With all the probes and scientific survey satellites sent to the moon and the SUPPOSEDLY six moon missions and bringing back moon material, I find it hard to believe that we can establish only now that water exists on the moon. And didn't we officially established that there was some water on Mars, which is located far mor away than the moon ?
Can you tell me how much weight in lunar rocks and dust has been brought back by each of the six Apollo missions on the moon ?

[FossilBob]

Miguel wrote:

<quoted text>
Like I have said before, I have made mistakes in my life and if I am proven wrong about the fake American moon landings, I will be the first to admit it. But to say a joke here, I wouldn't be surprised if the Americans would pay the Chinese some bribes so they would secretly put old USA equipment on the moon to corroborate the 1969-1972 moon landings ! ;-)
On the news today, I was astonished to learn that they have found water on the moon ! And it was discovered by, get this, an Hindu probe ! What in the world...? With all the probes and scientific survey satellites sent to the moon and the SUPPOSEDLY six moon missions and bringing back moon material, I find it hard to believe that we can establish only now that water exists on the moon. And didn't we officially established that there was some water on Mars, which is located far mor away than the moon ?
Can you tell me how much weight in lunar rocks and dust has been brought back by each of the six Apollo missions on the moon ?

843 pounds of rocks...

You DO realize that we are talking about a very small percentage of water molecules bound with the Lunar rocks, right? The Indian probe had sensitive NASA instruments that detected the molecules.

There is water ice on Mars; we've known that for some time... Mars has an atmosphere with clouds (possibly even snow); QUITE a bit different than the Moon.

In neither case has anyone found any pools, streams, etc... Some Martian features were clearly carved by water a long time ago...the question is whether any of these features are more recent.

[Gao Xinjian]

We will go to the moon and prove that you Americans have never been there, you cheating and lying bastards ! Lying like all your Presidents do, from Nixon to Bush Jr. and soon Obama too will be proven to be a lier !

It is the 60th anniversary of our Great Revolution and we will so be number one in the whole world ! Americans, beware the wrath of China !!!

[FossilBob]

Gao Xinjian wrote:

We will go to the moon and prove that you Americans have never been there, you cheating and lying bastards ! Lying like all your Presidents do, from Nixon to Bush Jr. and soon Obama too will be proven to be a lier !
It is the 60th anniversary of our Great Revolution and we will so be number one in the whole world ! Americans, beware the wrath of China !!!

You MIGHT want to talk to your own leaders about "lying"; the folks in Tibet would certainly have some enlightening comments.

As for the Moon...don't be silly. If and when you can get a ship there, you'll find those flags (and the lunar lander stages) waiting there for you.

[Daughterof the60s]

The same president who couldn't cover-up a simple burgary a mile from the White House, was able to cover-up a moon landing hoax for 50 years that would have to have included thousands of people and unfriendly foreign goverments? Also if the first landing was a hoax why would we have continued to produce other hoax landings and fake the non-landing that was Apollo 13. Are these hoax people so jaded that they can't believe that there was a time when the goverment working with contractors in the private sector were able to produce these very great explorations, or are they just stupid.

[Slimey]

FossilBob wrote:

<quoted text>
You MIGHT want to talk to your own leaders about "lying"; the folks in Tibet would certainly have some enlightening comments.
As for the Moon...don't be silly. If and when you can get a ship there, you'll find those flags (and the lunar lander stages) waiting there for you.

How long after they land will they start making bootleg copies of the equipment?

[FossilBob]

Slimey wrote:

<quoted text>
How long after they land will they start making bootleg copies of the equipment?

At a fraction of our cost!:)

[caroline and annie]

hey guys
just checking in in case you missed us :)
so
just a quick update
is the moon still made of cheese?
ok
so
yeh
get back to us
kind regards
anola and carola

[Ellie Mooneer Expert]

Caroline and annie:
whoever you are you are either durnk or completely stupid. Who else agrees with me on this? Its a disgrace that you can ridicule us enthusiasts who are regular debaters on this site.
Please have some respect
and stop watchign wallace and grommit
as NO the moon is not made of cheese and NO you cannot eat it!

[Chimney]

Gao Xinjian wrote:

We will go to the moon and prove that you Americans have never been there, you cheating and lying bastards ! Lying like all your Presidents do, from Nixon to Bush Jr. and soon Obama too will be proven to be a lier !
It is the 60th anniversary of our Great Revolution and we will so be number one in the whole world ! Americans, beware the wrath of China !!!

This has to be a fraud post.

Nobody in China is really this stupid.

[d-man]

hill billy wrote:

<quoted text>i agree even today with our equ...it would not be easy..hell the space shutall blowed up...we got a space station..just a litte bit higher than a plane flys..if we could land on the moon...would it not make sense to put the station there..at least before we walked on the moon ..3 years i belive,,when we sent the rocket up...they admitted that the rocket missed by over 200.000 thousand miles..then 3 year latter we walked on the moon.useing the same computer data..that was proved wrong...by better computers..that found the mistake in older computers...what the hell..certain men made millions off the tax payer sucker..

Your so wrong on everything you stated. Ignorance causes you to say thing only YOUR mind can understand. For every thing you say we couldn't have done, I can tell you how it was done.
Your first incorrect assumption is, you think the Apollo computer was a more primitive version of the comp we use today. The Apollo comp is nothing like what we have to day. And, that the shuttle blew up, so we could never have flow to the moon. Pure ignorance, The Apollo moon ship is not the shuttle. The shuttle is a piece of junk compared to the Saturn / Apollo moon ship. The shuttle used solid fuel rocket boosters that are very dangerous. Wernher von Braun [our rocket genius at the time] warned against using solid boosters for manned space flight.Once you light that thing, you can't turn it off.
Apollo on the other hand had a Launch Escape tower with 64,000lb of thrust to pull the command module away from the decaying rocket if something went wrong. The computer would detect a major malfunction & then "vote" on what to do. If 2 out of 3 commands said "no" the escape tower would automatically fire & pull the CM out of harms way for a nice splash down in the Atlantic. If the ground crew noted a major problem the computer did not, then the commander would turn the "abort handle to the left & the escape tower would fire as well.
No disrespect, but you have no idea what your talking about.

[d-man]

FossilBob wrote:

<quoted text>
843 pounds of rocks...
You DO realize that we are talking about a very small percentage of water molecules bound with the Lunar rocks, right? The Indian probe had sensitive NASA instruments that detected the molecules.
There is water ice on Mars; we've known that for some time... Mars has an atmosphere with clouds (possibly even snow); QUITE a bit different than the Moon.
In neither case has anyone found any pools, streams, etc... Some Martian features were clearly carved by water a long time ago...the question is whether any of these features are more recent.

Also there is no water molecules on the sun lit areas, as it evaporated billions of years ago. They found water in a crater that is in permanent darkness -240 degrees.

[d-man]

FossilBob wrote:

<quoted text>
You are ABSOLUTELY clueless; We did, of course launch a number of unmanned missions: Ranger, Surveyor, Lunar Orbiter...about 20 in all.
Round trip was 6 days...
The technology has nothing to do with it; we haven't built big enough rockets in 40 years; they ARE expensive.

Fossil Bob, these people are ignorant. They think because the Apollo comp was primitive, NASA could never get to the moon, because the shuttle has a great computer & can only orbit the Earth.
By that logic, how did sailors navigate the oceans with nothing more that a sextant? They navigated to specific locations with no computer...MUST HAVE BEEN FAKED. Magellan, Columbus, the Vikings, all of them faked it. They just sailed out of sight a few miles off shore, waited 3 years then came back & lied about it all. The first thing that indicates you are debating an idiot is comparing the shuttle to the Saturn V. It's like comparing a dirt bike to a Honda Goldwing.
One is designed for a long trip, the other is not. That's how ignorant they are. I can only laugh.

[d-man]

Trevor Swistchew wrote:

<quoted text>Let room know radiation level you think is on moon.then question the fact of men on the moon.www.whythemoon landing never happened.com

It's pretty easy to block radiation, that's why their space suits were white, not to mention the many layers of protection they had. The space suit is quite a piece of engineering. The whole radiation argument is for the ignorant who don't no any better because they have no concept of physics & engineering. I don't either, but a lot more that any hoaxer.

[JourneyJerker]

Who doesn't love a conspiracy theory?? They sent a rocket to the moon, supposedly looking for water, but they probably deposited a flag and some other stuff to make it look like we were there. NASA figured they better do it before India or China figures it out...

It's SOOO obvious.

[FossilBob]

d-man wrote:

<quoted text>
Fossil Bob, these people are ignorant. They think because the Apollo comp was primitive, NASA could never get to the moon, because the shuttle has a great computer & can only orbit the Earth.
By that logic, how did sailors navigate the oceans with nothing more that a sextant? They navigated to specific locations with no computer...MUST HAVE BEEN FAKED. Magellan, Columbus, the Vikings, all of them faked it. They just sailed out of sight a few miles off shore, waited 3 years then came back & lied about it all. The first thing that indicates you are debating an idiot is comparing the shuttle to the Saturn V. It's like comparing a dirt bike to a Honda Goldwing.
One is designed for a long trip, the other is not. That's how ignorant they are. I can only laugh.

The first manned orbital flight was based on calculations of a whole roomful of folks with mechanical calculators...folks today are spoiled (and misled) by today's modern electronics!

[FossilBob]

JourneyJerker wrote:

Who doesn't love a conspiracy theory?? They sent a rocket to the moon, supposedly looking for water, but they probably deposited a flag and some other stuff to make it look like we were there. NASA figured they better do it before India or China figures it out...
It's SOOO obvious.

We long ago left a bunch of flags, rocket stages, etc... on the Moon.

It's SOOO obvious.