When Sundance says locals only, it me...

When Sundance says locals only, it means locals only - The Park Record

There are 28 comments on the Park Record story from Sep 24, 2010, titled When Sundance says locals only, it means locals only - The Park Record. In it, Park Record reports that:

Sundance Film Festival organizers have tightened the requirements for people to obtain the popular festival passes and ticket packages designed for Utahns, an effort, they say, will ensure they go to people who live in the state instead of outsiders.

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Part-time resident

Miami, FL

#1 Sep 24, 2010
This is pretty outrageous. We have owned a home there for many years and spend three months a year in PC. I pay significant real estate taxes and we donate to local charities. We are lucky enough to have more than one home but we certainly contribute to the community. We hire local contractors and furnished our home using only local businesses.

I certainly understand the need to confirm that someone owns real property in town. That is fine with me. However, to make me change my permanent address in order to buy tickets is unfair.

I think that this decision is a poor one. Many of the largest supporters of the festival have second homes there. Now we are not "locals" anymore? The festival has had no issue taking our contributions. I think that this decision will cause such contributions to decrease.

Interestingly, when I called to complain about this new rule, I was offered the opportunity to donate several thousand dollars and get premium treatment. My wife and I had planned on making a much more significant contribution next fiscal year. Now, I am reconsidering.

Park City is a tourist town. The second homeowners are an important part of the community, even if we only visit there a few months of the year. We pay significantly higher taxes (our millage rate is much higher) and support local businesses. We deserve to be treated the same as the "locals." I don't complain about the taxes and we love it there. However, treating us differently sends a very unfriendly message to us.

I believe that if you truly own a home there and can prove it, you should be treated the same as everyone else.

We are so disappointed that we may not attend the festival this year. Maybe no-one cares but the point is that no property owner should be penalized for living in more than one state. I wish we could live there, but my business is out of state and I need to pay bills like everyone else.

My two cents.
mimiPC

Park City, UT

#2 Sep 24, 2010
Living here 3 months out of the year does not make you a local. It means that 9 months each year you are a "local" somewhere else (the majority of the year). Owning property does not make a local, paying taxes does not make you a local. Living in PC the majority of the time, if not all, makes you a local. You were willing to "donate" much more, but now won't because you don't get the same perks as someone who actually lives here? Yes, you pay more taxes, do you think that "buys" you local status? You said it yourself, PC is a tourist town and the short time of the year you are here, you are a tourist, supporting local businesses the same as any tourist. Just owning a home does not earn you the right to be the "same as everyone else". Those of us who live here everyday, support businesses everyday, are true locals. I do think it is too bad that you are considering boycotting Sundance. You are not being penalized for living in more than one state. You are just being acknowledged as a "part timer", not as a real local. If you have the funds to donate more (as you stated) and won't because of this, then I must doubt your committment to our town and community as a "local".
mimiPC

Park City, UT

#3 Sep 24, 2010
I have no idea why it comes up as Yuma, AZ. I have lived fulltime in PC for over 15 years. Must figure that out.
dink sweeny

Salt Lake City, UT

#4 Sep 24, 2010
well stated mimiPC, esp about the level of committment as community member. PTPC take your two cents, pay your taxes, or move to Aspen, see what their tax rate is like, theres plenty more of you. your 3 months wether you use/need it or not you're serviced by water power police snow removal trash removal transportation, you're just more tourist thanks leave your money than just plain leave
Another Second home owner

United States

#5 Sep 24, 2010
My family also has a second home there. I read these posts. We don't come to PC during Sundance as our kids are in school. There are many families that have homes there that live in Florida. I think you are being unfair to the other poster.

He/she did not say they would not donate to other local causes, only that this action made them feel unwelcome as to the Festival. There seems to be a backlash against any second homeowner that complains about anything. The response is always "move to Aspen".

Seems disrespectful to me. You know nothing about this family but want to run them out of town. They may bring needed tourist dollars to PC, bring more families there and help employ your neighbors. They may spend more there in three months on the local economy than many spend in a year. I only know that this world would be a better place if we were all more neighborly.

They appear to be charitable. Don't run them out of town. Treat them like any other family that helps the community by spending time here. If they are homeowners, they pay taxes and help everyone.

They are your neighbors, whether they stay a month or a year. We live in Boca Raton. We have many friends that own homes but stay only during the winter. We call them neighbors, not strangers. Anyone that owns property is your neighbor. Don't be so quick to treat them as if they are second class citizens.

Skeeter

South Jordan, UT

#6 Sep 24, 2010
Part time res....Sure you have to pay bills like everyone else. Except not everyone else has two or more homes that we have to deal with.

Haven't you figured it out yet? Instead of moaning about it, play their game. Instead of donating to Sundance....give your property manager a healthy tip to get the tickets for you. I'm sure he (or she) would love the extra bucks in their pockets and would appreciate it more. Because, hey, they're business people too that have bills to pay.

There are a lot of businesses here that give their employees a...uh...bonus...to buy tickets using their local status for their...uh.."LOCAL". ..clients. It's been that way since they started the locals only stuff. The tickets don't look any different and I have yet to see anyone check ID's at the door. Personally, I get the **** out of town during Sundance.

And thank you for paying the higher property taxes, we enjoy the fruits of your successful business in a round about way.
Mature Person

Arlington, VA

#7 Sep 25, 2010
Grose, who backs Sundance's decision to tighten the requirements, said the change could also foil people wanting to sell festival tickets on the secondary market since film-loving Utahns will have a better opportunity to buy directly from Sundance.

Don't think for a moment that true locals aren't selling on the secondary market for they are.
AJC

San Diego, CA

#8 Sep 25, 2010
By paying property tax on 100% of a home valuation and not 55%, part-time residents subsidize Sundance way more than than full-time residents do.
I personally have purchased tickets at inflated prices via Ebay from locals who obtained locals packages
Maynard

Dallas, TX

#9 Sep 25, 2010
I own this, I own that, money, money, money.......shut up!
Coleman

Oakley, UT

#10 Sep 25, 2010
Sundance talks a lot about wanting locals involved - as volunteers maybe. The only locals festival pass is for movies in SLC/Odgen - in other words "stay out of Park City. Oh - there is an option for a $2500 festival pass for us wealthy locals! I have been in the lottery for years and NEVER been selected. I doubt there are very many available for locals...
local

Park City, UT

#11 Sep 25, 2010
: characterized by or relating to position in space : having a definite spatial form or location
2
a : of, relating to, or characteristic of a particular place : not general or widespread b : of, relating to, or applicable to part of a whole
3
a : primarily serving the needs of a particular limited district b of a public conveyance : making all the stops on a route
4
: involving or affecting only a restricted part of the organism : topical <a local anesthetic>
5
: of or relating to telephone communication within a specified area
Examples of LOCAL

1. We had dinner at a local restaurant.
2. The police have arrested a local man for the crime.
3. This is a local shop for local people: we don't get many outsiders here.
4. She took the local bus.
Part-time resident wrote:
This is pretty outrageous. We have owned a home there for many years and spend three months a year in PC. I pay significant real estate taxes and we donate to local charities. We are lucky enough to have more than one home but we certainly contribute to the community. We hire local contractors and furnished our home using only local businesses.
I certainly understand the need to confirm that someone owns real property in town. That is fine with me. However, to make me change my permanent address in order to buy tickets is unfair.
I think that this decision is a poor one. Many of the largest supporters of the festival have second homes there. Now we are not "locals" anymore? The festival has had no issue taking our contributions. I think that this decision will cause such contributions to decrease.
Interestingly, when I called to complain about this new rule, I was offered the opportunity to donate several thousand dollars and get premium treatment. My wife and I had planned on making a much more significant contribution next fiscal year. Now, I am reconsidering.
Park City is a tourist town. The second homeowners are an important part of the community, even if we only visit there a few months of the year. We pay significantly higher taxes (our millage rate is much higher) and support local businesses. We deserve to be treated the same as the "locals." I don't complain about the taxes and we love it there. However, treating us differently sends a very unfriendly message to us.
I believe that if you truly own a home there and can prove it, you should be treated the same as everyone else.
We are so disappointed that we may not attend the festival this year. Maybe no-one cares but the point is that no property owner should be penalized for living in more than one state. I wish we could live there, but my business is out of state and I need to pay bills like everyone else.
My two cents.
Part Time LOCAL

Washington, UT

#12 Sep 25, 2010
mimiPC wrote:
Living here 3 months out of the year does not make you a local. It means that 9 months each year you are a "local" somewhere else (the majority of the year). Owning property does not make a local, paying taxes does not make you a local. Living in PC the majority of the time, if not all, makes you a local. You were willing to "donate" much more, but now won't because you don't get the same perks as someone who actually lives here? Yes, you pay more taxes, do you think that "buys" you local status? You said it yourself, PC is a tourist town and the short time of the year you are here, you are a tourist, supporting local businesses the same as any tourist. Just owning a home does not earn you the right to be the "same as everyone else". Those of us who live here everyday, support businesses everyday, are true locals. I do think it is too bad that you are considering boycotting Sundance. You are not being penalized for living in more than one state. You are just being acknowledged as a "part timer", not as a real local. If you have the funds to donate more (as you stated) and won't because of this, then I must doubt your committment to our town and community as a "local".
Your brainless arrogance is only second to your moronic blather. If it weren't for the second homeowners getting screwed on their property taxes, Park City would not enjoy the inordinate tax base that it does (and your property taxes would be substantially higher). According to your argument, the 15 illegal aliens squatting in a two bedroom apartment who are paid in cash on the side to avoid taxes and sending half of what they make out of the country are "locals", yet the affluent part time resident who pays $100,000/year in property taxes, hires local contractors, and donates to local charities should have no community merit.
Saint George-PC Resident

Washington, UT

#13 Sep 25, 2010
Another Second Home Owner (from Hollywood, FL)-- I totally agree! Not sure why there is so much animosity toward 2nd homeowners in PC -- the huge taxes they pay fund lots of stuff that full-time locals enjoy (skating rinks, baseball fields, renovated racquet club, bike trails, etc.) Why not welcome them as "neighbors" too?
The antagonistic attitude is very unwelcoming and short-sighted. As a full-time UTAH resident, it is embarrassing to me that we come across as so unfriendly.
Response to dink sweeny

Washington, UT

#14 Sep 25, 2010
You're a blockhead -- and you need to learn to spell and punctuate!
lost

United States

#15 Sep 26, 2010
What about me? I live two mile's across the border in Wyoming! Maybe we should start charging more for cigarettes and liquor to out of state people! lol
Part-time resident

Miami, FL

#16 Sep 26, 2010
Saint George-PC Resident wrote:
Another Second Home Owner (from Hollywood, FL)-- I totally agree! Not sure why there is so much animosity toward 2nd homeowners in PC -- the huge taxes they pay fund lots of stuff that full-time locals enjoy (skating rinks, baseball fields, renovated racquet club, bike trails, etc.) Why not welcome them as "neighbors" too?
The antagonistic attitude is very unwelcoming and short-sighted. As a full-time UTAH resident, it is embarrassing to me that we come across as so unfriendly.
I appreciate the positive comments from Saint George, Another Second home Owner and others. I can't seem to understand why second homeowners are treated with such disdain. I don't know if it is a sign of the times. Seems to be that it could be jealousy because the second home is considered a luxury so we must punish those families that can afford a second home. Could be some other reason. Don't know. The national political debate seems to be to tax the families making over 250k because they are such a small segment of the population. They have money and we want it. This disdain reminds me of that.

Funny thing is that we have befriended many full-time families and have never felt unwelcome by any individual residents. However, when it comes time to property taxes or other ways to discriminate, I constantly feel like we are not welcome. And if you don't like it, "Go to Aspen." That is the mantra.

Again, I don't mind the extra tax bill because we don't vote there, but if the Festival rewards locals with better ticket options, we should qulaify like any other homeowner.

We give extensively to charities both throughout the country and locally, but it is our choice to determine which causes deserve our donations. If a non-profit discriminates against our family, it our right to send these funds to another organization. Don't confuse commitment to community to making rational decisions as to what causes in the community we wish to fund with our donations.

I really believe that the Festival's decision will cost it donations from second homeowners. We certainly support its decision to verify home ownership for all individuals buying local tickets. Home ownership, whether you live there for a year or three months, should be enough to qualify. Thanks for the support.
Another Second Home Owner

Roy, WA

#17 Sep 26, 2010
We have to pay 50% more in property taxes than those who live in their houses. Also, like others, I donate to local charities and use local contractors' services and buy local. I may only spend 2 months out of the year in PC. But, I feel like a local and wish to not be treated like an outsider.

I wanted to say that, even though I find that one of the best times to ski is during Sundance. I have never been to a Sundance event.:)
Amen

Salt Lake City, UT

#18 Sep 27, 2010
About time and the way it should be! Even better LOCAL only tickets should be specially marked and locals should be REQUIRED to show ID at the venues. This would prevent people selling them on Ebay or other websites. This is allow no problem to LEGITIMATE second home owners as stipulated:

"Addicott suggested people who own vacation homes in Park City or are students in Utah who come from outside the state obtain a Utah state identification card to meet the eligibility requirement."
Mumbo jumbo

Salt Lake City, UT

#19 Sep 28, 2010
Honestly, who cares about Sundance?

Yawn.
Carlos Gonzalez

West Jordan, UT

#21 Sep 29, 2010
Part-time resident wrote:
This is pretty outrageous. We have owned a home there for many years and spend three months a year in PC. I pay significant real estate taxes and we donate to local charities. We are lucky enough to have more than one home but we certainly
Agree with you 100%. I am a full-time local and think second home owners like yourself deserve all the rights and privileges of full-time locals, but don't let the poor decisions of one venue change your attitude of PC as a whole!:)

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