More women cite economy as reason for their abortions

[Kacy]

Several pages back I posted a comment about both sides meeting somewhere in the middle, finding common ground, so to speak. So far, I've had absolutely zero responses from any of the fools who have been attacking me and others for everything else I/we have said. That leads me to believe they are on here simply to take out the aggression they can't use elsewhere, and nothing more. I'm sorry you boys can't beat your wives, that it's not legal anymore. Stupid women that we are, we had a problem with that. Anyhoo, this whole thing has made me very bored and I'm going to call it a day.... carry on with your hatred.

[Consistent]

Kacy wrote:

Several pages back I posted a comment about both sides meeting somewhere in the middle, finding common ground, so to speak. So far, I've had absolutely zero responses from any of the fools who have been attacking me and others for everything else I/we have said. That leads me to believe they are on here simply to take out the aggression they can't use elsewhere, and nothing more. I'm sorry you boys can't beat your wives, that it's not legal anymore. Stupid women that we are, we had a problem with that. Anyhoo, this whole thing has made me very bored and I'm going to call it a day.... carry on with your hatred.

Right back to "if you dont agree with me you must be a Dinosaur that wants to subjegate womyn like I believe they were at one time".

Spare me the Sexist Anti-male rants masked as Enlightened Progressive Thought. You are an ignorant child devoid of any but "canned" beliefs fed to you by a corrupt education system....You havent had a valid, original rant yet.

You "Silver Spoon Fed", never suffered, Daddy sacrificed for, little children have no clue about life or reality. Your view of history is distorted from the lack of any substance in your lives. You spew out the same old talking points on this issue, as though they are commonly held indisputable "truths", unaware that your "education" is/was actualy indoctrination provided by other humans as naive as you.

Post after post from those that recognize the shame that it is to end the lives of babies for a Choice....because you equate "Choice" with freedom, shows how corrupt your values are. Real freedom involves responsibility!
I cannot disregard another to "Force" my will because it is what will make me happy, but that is exactly what Abortion does.
Just because the "Other", you advocate forcing, as an act of Freedom of Choice, is a defenseless child that you do not see as a Blessing from God, doesnt mean that your power makes the killing with force, an acceptable consequence of your "Choice" to practice the acts of reproduction.
You narsisstic, destructive act is in no way noble, and neither is your ignorant avocacy of "choice" an act of compassion.

I believe in your right to kill your babies....I also believe in society's right to force you to face the consequences of your choice!
One of the consequences that society needs to impose, through proper education, is that you have sure and certain knowledge that you just killed a child that is/was a gift from God!

[Bitner]

Consistent wrote:

<quoted text>
Right back to "if you dont agree with me you must be a Dinosaur that wants to subjegate womyn like I believe they were at one time".
Spare me the Sexist Anti-male rants masked as Enlightened Progressive Thought. You are an ignorant child devoid of any but "canned" beliefs fed to you by a corrupt education system....You havent had a valid, original rant yet.
You "Silver Spoon Fed", never suffered, Daddy sacrificed for, little children have no clue about life or reality. Your view of history is distorted from the lack of any substance in your lives. You spew out the same old talking points on this issue, as though they are commonly held indisputable "truths", unaware that your "education" is/was actualy indoctrination provided by other humans as naive as you.
Post after post from those that recognize the shame that it is to end the lives of babies for a Choice....because you equate "Choice" with freedom, shows how corrupt your values are. Real freedom involves responsibility!
I cannot disregard another to "Force" my will because it is what will make me happy, but that is exactly what Abortion does.
Just because the "Other", you advocate forcing, as an act of Freedom of Choice, is a defenseless child that you do not see as a Blessing from God, doesnt mean that your power makes the killing with force, an acceptable consequence of your "Choice" to practice the acts of reproduction.
You narsisstic, destructive act is in no way noble, and neither is your ignorant avocacy of "choice" an act of compassion.
I believe in your right to kill your babies....I also believe in society's right to force you to face the consequences of your choice!
One of the consequences that society needs to impose, through proper education, is that you have sure and certain knowledge that you just killed a child that is/was a gift from God!

And you did continue to spout your hatred of anyone who disagrees with you. I love the charges of being spoonfed and indoctrinated, because it's really you who has been.

What you are vomitting up here is merely your own opinion, relevant only to you. No one is required to live their lives according your your opinion, or your religious beliefs. I, personally, am unimpressed. My own religion leaves such a decison up to the only one who should be making it; the woman who is pregnant. That law agrees as well that up to a certain point, it is up to the woman.

Your rants are proof of the rage you feel that your religion cannot control the masses anymore. Too bad, put on your Big Girl Panties, and deal with it.

[KPB]

I'm a guy and most people here are women it seems. I'm not right or left. I try to go with common sense on issues. I could never condone abortions. If you can convince yourself that it's ok, you have a completely different way of thinking than I. The baby - whenever it becomes a baby - will certainly turn out to be born a baby. I've talked to several women who had abortions and every one of them went through a grieving/depression/guilt phase that was still with them years after the abortion. In my opinion, there are other options available. I know my opinion doesn't count for much, but it seems that the people that fight hardest for the right of women to have abortions are women that have never had one. Maybe they'd think differently if they had. Just a thought.

[Sarah D]

AndrewEss wrote:

<quoted text>
So has cannabilsm, so what! Just because you place a white coat on and have a sophisticated coathanger, makes it alright. You run with that concept, it works.

I am simply disagreeing with your opinion that abortion is a relatively new development. It is as old as humanity.

[Sarah D]

KPB wrote:

I'm a guy and most people here are women it seems. I'm not right or left. I try to go with common sense on issues. I could never condone abortions. If you can convince yourself that it's ok, you have a completely different way of thinking than I. The baby - whenever it becomes a baby - will certainly turn out to be born a baby. I've talked to several women who had abortions and every one of them went through a grieving/depression/guilt phase that was still with them years after the abortion. In my opinion, there are other options available. I know my opinion doesn't count for much, but it seems that the people that fight hardest for the right of women to have abortions are women that have never had one. Maybe they'd think differently if they had. Just a thought.

I have already stated that I personally would probably have never have had an abortion because I WOULD feel guilty about it. But that is me and my personal feelings should not be used to dictate to other women and force them to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term.

I know women who have had an abortion and they state that they feel no guilt about it. Now maybe they're lying to me or lying to themselves but there are women who don't feel guilty about it, who feel that it was the proper decision to make at that time. And then there are women who do feel terribly guilty about it.

But the point is that women should be allowed to make the decision for themselves and not have it forced on them. They should not be pressured to HAVE an abortion and they should not be pressured to NOT have an abortion.

[Lover]

Abortion is just another pi$$-poor excuse for irresponsibility. Personal responsibility is GONE in this world. You made the decision to possibly have a child the second you made the decision to perform the acts that everyone in the WORLD knows creates them. What GARBAGE.

[Sarah D]

Super Wayne wrote:

<quoted text>
"IF" you are making such an assumption about my statements and setiments as being lasking in relation to the male side of this equation then I am worse of a writer then I thought. I feel no such way and have said nothing to prove otherwise. Your assumption comes in only the lack of myself having specifically making a point to inclde the word "male". I am sorry for the omission of the word itself but that is hardly my intent as I would imagine you probably know.
But thats not in keeping with your need to demonize my own simple position. Its far easier to attack my "honor" and "manly-hood" then it is to give weight to my own position.
You dislike me because I wont relent. I wont say that its "OK" for anyone to take the life of an unborn child simply due to the most common reasons given. Inconvienence.
You state that a woman should be allowed to abort a baby because it just doesnt suit them. Because they cant afford "it" or have too many or havent done something yet. Like finish school or their career.... What nobel reasons for denying life. And this should be legal? I am suppose to say thats ok?
I wont. But keep coming at me with attacks on myself personally. Say how I am "only" talking about the responsibilities of the female. Knock yourself out.

I don't demand that you think it ok. But when you are advocating that the law be changed and women forced back into the back alleys where they can suffer horrible deaths as they did before then I'm going to fight you on the issue.

Outlawing abortion won't make it go away. It didn't before. If women are desperate they will use coat hangers and knitting needles AS THEY DID BEFORE.

Remember, it could be your own daughter that you're condemning to this.

[Sarah D]

Lover wrote:

Abortion is just another pi$$-poor excuse for irresponsibility. Personal responsibility is GONE in this world. You made the decision to possibly have a child the second you made the decision to perform the acts that everyone in the WORLD knows creates them. What GARBAGE.

Is that directed at the woman who became pregnant or the man who impregnated her?

[Kacy]

Consistent wrote:

<quoted text>
Right back to "if you dont agree with me you must be a Dinosaur that wants to subjegate womyn like I believe they were at one time".
Spare me the Sexist Anti-male rants masked as Enlightened Progressive Thought. You are an ignorant child devoid of any but "canned" beliefs fed to you by a corrupt education system....You havent had a valid, original rant yet.
You "Silver Spoon Fed", never suffered, Daddy sacrificed for, little children have no clue about life or reality. Your view of history is distorted from the lack of any substance in your lives. You spew out the same old talking points on this issue, as though they are commonly held indisputable "truths", unaware that your "education" is/was actualy indoctrination provided by other humans as naive as you.
Post after post from those that recognize the shame that it is to end the lives of babies for a Choice....because you equate "Choice" with freedom, shows how corrupt your values are. Real freedom involves responsibility!
I cannot disregard another to "Force" my will because it is what will make me happy, but that is exactly what Abortion does.
Just because the "Other", you advocate forcing, as an act of Freedom of Choice, is a defenseless child that you do not see as a Blessing from God, doesnt mean that your power makes the killing with force, an acceptable consequence of your "Choice" to practice the acts of reproduction.
You narsisstic, destructive act is in no way noble, and neither is your ignorant avocacy of "choice" an act of compassion.
I believe in your right to kill your babies....I also believe in society's right to force you to face the consequences of your choice!
One of the consequences that society needs to impose, through proper education, is that you have sure and certain knowledge that you just killed a child that is/was a gift from God!

Umm, I am in no way "spoiled." My parents were dirt poor growing up and worked very hard to make ends meet. You assumed by "education" I meant college, probably a liberal arts college where you imagine ultra-liberal professors teaching snooty rich kids (???), and that isn't the case for me either. Any formal education I've received I paid for myself, and the rest I've just learned on the job. I work very hard, always have, have never taken a handout from anybody.

Point number 2: I've never had an abortion, so as you say I have a need to justify killing my babies, or something to that effect.... I have never killed a baby, nor had an abortion, so I don't think I need to say any more on that.

There is no silver spoon for me, sorry. My husband and I have both worked hard, own a very modest home, raise our children to be open-minded and to think for themselves. If one of them someday turns out to think just like you, I guess I will have to accept that and embrace them with open arms. Somehow I doubt they will though. I think regardless of where their beliefs end up falling on the political spectrum, they will at least have the decency to not insult or hate people. I hope I have taught them that much.

[Kacy]

KPB wrote:

I'm a guy and most people here are women it seems. I'm not right or left. I try to go with common sense on issues. I could never condone abortions. If you can convince yourself that it's ok, you have a completely different way of thinking than I. The baby - whenever it becomes a baby - will certainly turn out to be born a baby. I've talked to several women who had abortions and every one of them went through a grieving/depression/guilt phase that was still with them years after the abortion. In my opinion, there are other options available. I know my opinion doesn't count for much, but it seems that the people that fight hardest for the right of women to have abortions are women that have never had one. Maybe they'd think differently if they had. Just a thought.

Thanks for adding a new perspective to this conversation, which, quite frankly, has grown very dull.

I think the options you talk about are adoption (or not getting pregnant). Assuming the woman is pregnant and trying to decide what to do, I applaud and commend any woman who can carry a pregnancy to term, have the baby, then hand him/her over to someone else. But I imagine women who do that suffer from just as much guilt and remorse and depression as those who have abortions, something many pro-lifers fail to mention.

I think women fight hardest for the right to an abortion because we obviously are the ones who might someday face a situation where we have to make that decision. I faced it once years ago, and decided I would have the baby. Then I miscarried. So be it. It was sad, for sure. Now I'm married and have two beautiful children, and don't plan to ever find myself in a situation where I would need to consider abortion. However, you or I can't predict the future, and if I were be raped or if a health crisis prevented me from continuing a pregnancy early on, well, then it would be something I would want to have as an option available to me. It's pretty scary for any woman to think she may have to give birth to her rapist's child, or that she may die as a result of not being able to terminate her pregnancy. In my case, I'd be leaving the two young children I have now without a Mommy. What good does that do? Anyone who suggests that would be "God's will" is, in my mind, demented. I would like to be able to make that decision with my physician and my husband... and no one else.

[Consistent]

Wow...original thinking...how refreshing!

The .0000000000000001% of females that may get Pregnant from a Rape, or the .00000000000003% of woman that MUST abort the baby in order to survive, are just as stupid as talking points today, as theywere 40 years ago!
It is insulting to those with any intellegence to read a posting, and discover the recitation of the same stupid points.

......."However, you or I can't predict the future, and if I were be raped or if a health crisis prevented me from continuing a pregnancy early on, well, then it would be something I would want to have as an option available to me. It's pretty scary for any woman to think she may have to give birth to her rapist's child, or that she may die as a result of not being able to terminate her pregnancy.".......

[Super Wayne]

Sarah D wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't demand that you think it ok. But when you are advocating that the law be changed and women forced back into the back alleys where they can suffer horrible deaths as they did before then I'm going to fight you on the issue.
Outlawing abortion won't make it go away. It didn't before. If women are desperate they will use coat hangers and knitting needles AS THEY DID BEFORE.
Remember, it could be your own daughter that you're condemning to this.

And we come full circle. Ive answered this in one of my firsts posts in this thread. Its about responsibility. I cannot stop a woman from shoving in a coathanger any more then I can stop someone from jumping off a bridge. No more then I can stop a robbery or even a murder in a dark ally. Yet ALL these things still happen. And they are still illegal (with the exception of the first, for now)

Point is, the fact that it will or may still happen does not justify allowing the act in general. So now we should provide the rope to the suicidal person? Make robbery legal for people who might not be so well off or who dont want to bother working for a living? We should support legal abortions simply because they will do it anyway?

Do you see why that arguement doesnt hold water?

[Kacy]

Consistent wrote:

Wow...original thinking...how refreshing!
The .0000000000000001% of females that may get Pregnant from a Rape, or the .00000000000003% of woman that MUST abort the baby in order to survive, are just as stupid as talking points today, as theywere 40 years ago!
It is insulting to those with any intellegence to read a posting, and discover the recitation of the same stupid points.
......."However, you or I can't predict the future, and if I were be raped or if a health crisis prevented me from continuing a pregnancy early on, well, then it would be something I would want to have as an option available to me. It's pretty scary for any woman to think she may have to give birth to her rapist's child, or that she may die as a result of not being able to terminate her pregnancy.".......

1. You spelled intelligence wrong. How ironic.

2. I've worked in health law for years and have worked on multiple cases involving both situations, so yes it absolutely does happen. Your percentages are completely wrong. 1 in 5 women will be raped in her lifetime, I think is the current stat on that, and a number of those result in pregnancy.

[Go DFL]

The only reason the conservatives want to ban Abortion is to control the poor even more than they are. We need to provide more resources to these poor women that get abortions. Maybe even raise taxes to provide for these women.

[Super Wayne]

Kacy wrote:

<quoted text>
1. You spelled intelligence wrong. How ironic.
2. I've worked in health law for years and have worked on multiple cases involving both situations, so yes it absolutely does happen. Your percentages are completely wrong. 1 in 5 women will be raped in her lifetime, I think is the current stat on that, and a number of those result in pregnancy.

It does happen. And in terms of a percentage of all abortions. The over 1 million abortions a year.... Its less then 1% Yet its used in these arguements as a supporting fact about what?, 90% of the time?

http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/aborti...

http://www.abortiontv.com/Misc/AbortionStatis...

http://www.abort73.com/HTML/II-A-abortion_sta...

http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/stati...

And yes, even as stated in the original story of this thread...

[Kacy]

Super Wayne wrote:

<quoted text>
And we come full circle. Ive answered this in one of my firsts posts in this thread. Its about responsibility. I cannot stop a woman from shoving in a coathanger any more then I can stop someone from jumping off a bridge. No more then I can stop a robbery or even a murder in a dark ally. Yet ALL these things still happen. And they are still illegal (with the exception of the first, for now)
Point is, the fact that it will or may still happen does not justify allowing the act in general. So now we should provide the rope to the suicidal person? Make robbery legal for people who might not be so well off or who dont want to bother working for a living? We should support legal abortions simply because they will do it anyway?
Do you see why that arguement doesnt hold water?

1. You can't spell worth sh*t.

2. You are on the smoking ban topic complaining about the government daring to interfere with business owners' rights to do whatever they want in their own establishments. How truly ironic.

[Consistent]

Kacy wrote:

<quoted text>
1. You spelled intelligence wrong. How ironic.
2. I've worked in health law for years and have worked on multiple cases involving both situations, so yes it absolutely does happen. Your percentages are completely wrong. 1 in 5 women will be raped in her lifetime, I think is the current stat on that, and a number of those result in pregnancy.

LOLOLOLOLOL...
A "number", as I said .000000000001%.

The point is that dupes like you still try to use it as a justification for keeping the wholesale slaughter, as a right....to Protect the .000000000001% Number.

And geeee....1 in 5....another canard I have never heard repeated by those that feed thier belly at the expense of others, and need to justify their useless jobs.

You are all full of "Creative Facts", produced by people with an agenda.

[Super Wayne]

Kacy wrote:

<quoted text>
1. You can't spell worth sh*t.
2. You are on the smoking ban topic complaining about the government daring to interfere with business owners' rights to do whatever they want in their own establishments. How truly ironic.

Cute.... Cant argue so personally attack. That serves you well? And I feel even attempting to have any discussion with you would be like talking to, well a child. Good luck Kacy!

[C Hamilton]

Super Wayne wrote:

<quoted text>
It does happen. And in terms of a percentage of all abortions. The over 1 million abortions a year.... Its less then 1% Yet its used in these arguements as a supporting fact about what?, 90% of the time?
http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/aborti...
http://www.abortiontv.com/Misc/AbortionStatis...
http://www.abort73.com/HTML/II-A-abortion_sta...
http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/stati...
And yes, even as stated in the original story of this thread...

The study I read revealed "333,000 sexual assaults and rapes reported in 1998, along with many more unreported, were responsible for 25,000 pregnancies." (Source: Prevention of pregnancy resulting from rape A neglected preventive health measure . American Journal of Preventive Medicine, Volume 19 , Issue 4 , Pages 228 - 229, F . Stewart)

I grant you, the number of abortions performed because of a rape are statistically small. However, are you opposed to a rape victim receiving the morning after pill at a hospital immediately following the incident? I know many PL are. Where do you stand on the issue?