Evolution vs. Creation

Full story: Best of New Orleans

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.
Comments
69,361 - 69,380 of 114,621 Comments Last updated 3 hrs ago

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73740
Feb 4, 2013
 
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text>This is a deformed explanation. Why are they no longer changing to human forms?
Why are WHO not changing into human forms? other proto-humans? your question shows you don't even understand the way evolution works....

there have been several hominid species. you actually have the DNA of Neandertals, another species, in you.

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73741
Feb 4, 2013
 
woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>Thanx...still pretty much the same ol same ol on this page, huh?
Yup.

You remember the sheepdog and coyote cartoons with the time clock?

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73742
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text>This is a deformed explanation. Why are they no longer changing to human forms?
For one, because the term "human" already applies to a specific species.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73743
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you ever heard of google?
Don't worry.
It only hurts for a lifetime.
Ofcourse. And many other sites including Wikipedia and others.
Show me your evidence.

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73744
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Yup.
You remember the sheepdog and coyote cartoons with the time clock?
"Mornin' Fred."

'Mornin' Ralph"

favorite of mine....

You are correct, the religious believers are continually failing in hairbrained attempts to prove thier beliefs...they are much like the wolf/coyote in that cartoon.

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73745
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

2

2

2

woodtick57 wrote:
<quoted text>"Mornin' Fred."

'Mornin' Ralph"

favorite of mine....

You are correct, the religious believers are continually failing in hairbrained attempts to prove thier beliefs...they are much like the wolf/coyote in that cartoon.
Yup.

Morning Woodtick. Lol
Wonderingme

Apopka, FL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73746
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
OMG. My missing car!
What 24 year old can afford a 2008 Lambo! Non profit? I think not!!!

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73747
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Wonderingme wrote:
<quoted text>What 24 year old can afford a 2008 Lambo! Non profit? I think not!!!
My mom thinks I drink too much beer. i like to go to the pub and have a few pints and she added up the total cost of that. "If you had put all that money in a decent investment, you'd have been able to buy a Lamborghini by now." she scolded me...

"Ma, do you drink beer?" i asked.

"Certainly not." she replied.

"Where the f*ck is your Lamborghini?"...

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73748
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

2

2

2

Wikipedia:

There are generally considered to be three outstanding problems with the Big Bang theory: the horizon problem, the flatness problem, and the magnetic monopole problem.

Horizon problem
The horizon problem results from the premise that information cannot travel faster than light. In a Universe of finite age, this sets a limit—the particle horizon—on the separation of any two regions of space that are in causal contact. The observed isotropy of the CMB is problematic in this regard: if the Universe had been dominated by radiation or matter at all times up to the epoch of last scattering, the particle horizon at that time would correspond to about 2 degrees on the sky. There would then be no mechanism to cause wider regions to have the same temperature.

A resolution to this apparent inconsistency is offered by inflationary theory in which a homogeneous and isotropic scalar energy field dominates the Universe at some very early period. During inflation, the Universe undergoes exponential expansion, and the particle horizon expands much more rapidly than previously assumed. The observed isotropy of the CMB then follows from the fact that this larger region was in causal contact before the beginning of inflation.

Heisenberg's uncertainty principle predicts that during the inflationary phase there would be quantum thermal fluctuations, which would be magnified to cosmic scale. These fluctuations serve as the seeds of all current structure in the Universe. Inflation predicts that the primordial fluctuations are nearly scale invariant and Gaussian, which has been accurately confirmed by measurements of the CMB. If inflation occurred, exponential expansion would push large regions of space well beyond our observable horizon.

Flatness problem
The overall geometry of the Universe is determined by whether the Omega cosmological parameter is less than, equal to or greater than 1. Shown from top to bottom are a closed Universe with positive curvature, a hyperbolic Universe with negative curvature and aflat Universe with zero curvature.
The flatness problem is an observational problem associated with a Friedmann–Lemaître–Robert son–Walker metric. The Universe may have positive, negative, or zero spatial curvature depending on its total energy density. Curvature is negative if its density is less than the critical density, positive if greater, and zero at the critical density, in which case space is said to beflat. The problem is that any small departure from the critical density grows with time, and yet the Universe today remains very close to flat. Given that a natural timescale for departure from flatness might be the Planck time, 10^43 seconds the fact that the Universe has reached neither a heat death nor a Big Crunch after billions of years requires some explanation. For instance, even at the relatively late age of a few minutes (the time of nucleosynthesis), the Universe density must have been within one part in 10^14 of its critical value, or it would not exist as it does today.

A resolution to this problem is offered by inflationary theory. During the inflationary period, spacetime expanded to such an extent that its curvature would have been smoothed out. Thus, it is theorized that inflation drove the Universe to a very nearly spatially flat state, with almost exactly the critical density.

Magnetic monopoles
The magnetic monopole objection was raised in the late 1970s. Grand unification theories predicted topological defects in space that would manifest as magnetic monopoles. These objects would be produced efficiently in the hot early Universe, resulting in a density much higher than is consistent with observations, given that searches have never found any monopoles. This problem is also resolved by cosmic inflation, which removes all point defects from the observable Universe in the same way that it drives the geometry to flatness.

“what we think we become”

Since: Aug 11

above and beyond

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73749
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

01Justsayin wrote:
Crap! The Avatar was one of the few people in here I actually enjoy talking to. Oh well. Back to trash talking the atheists.
lol. they would like that.

“what we think we become”

Since: Aug 11

above and beyond

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73750
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you come to the conclusion that someone who doesn't see things your way finds everything vile and evil?
They know who they are. Don't need to pinpoint anyone.
ztormbringer

North Richland Hills, TX

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73751
Feb 4, 2013
 
Kong_ wrote:
A bit off-topic, but something's fishy with this:

"Lamborghini crash kills Kissimmee woman, Winter Haven man.

Tiffany Beene was treasurer of a Christian non-profit."

(Yes...Tiffany owned the Lamborghini)

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/bre...

Apparently there's good money in Christian non-profits.
There is, the mafia and drug cartels recognized this about 20-25 years ago and jumped on the gravy train. Dig deep enough into non-profit structures and you'll run across their spore. From no-bid purchasing for building materials , to funny bookkeeping it's all there if anyone want's to look. Often the excuse given when caught is they were doing "good" with "dirty" money. Um, that's money laundering.

“what we think we become”

Since: Aug 11

above and beyond

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73752
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
That's nice. Now explain how that helps in predicting the positions of astronomical phenomena.
Why don't you ask a Scientist who might have the answers.

After sleeping through a hundred million centuries we have finally opened our eyes on a sumptuous planet, sparkling with color, bountiful with life. Within decades we must close our eyes again. Isnt it a noble, an enlightened way of spending our brief time in the sun, to work at understanding the universe and how we have come to wake up in it? This is how I answer when I am askedas I am surprisingly oftenwhy I bother to get up in the mornings.

-Richard Dawkins

There are experts out there who know the answers but they don't know that it's only here and now. There will be no other time, not in the next lifetimes, it's now and never. To requote Einstein, "God doesn't play nice."

Since: Apr 12

Taizhou, China

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73753
Feb 4, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

Other respondents have spoken about the scientific signs of evolution.
I would like to speak about the psychological signs:

&#9632; When we stroke a dog or a cat, our inner brains tell us that we are inspecting a juvenile for lice. Likewise, when we stroke another human being, our inner brains tell us the same thing. Of course, we lost most of our fur long ago, but our inner brains don't know that.

&#9632; Hometown loyalty is an example. My mother grew up in Woodville, Mississippi, hometown of composer William Grant Still. My father grew up in New Albany, Mississippi, hometown of writer William Faulkner. I grew up in Anderson, Indiana, hometown of Carl Erskine, pitcher for the Dodgers.

You may say, "So what? Those are other people's accomplishments, not yours." But my inner brain tells me that we are still living in villages which declare war on each other. So I want the population of each village to be as stong as possible.

&#9632; Reaction to screen images is another example. Why do you feel afraid when a monster appears in a movie? That monster can't hurt you any more than this message on the screen can. But your inner brain tells you to react with fear to anything that looks like a wild animal.

&#9632; Hostility toward people of differing opinion is still another example. Case in point: look at how much hatred there is right here in this thread. We attack each other because our inner brains tell us that we are confronting enemies and predators.

&#9632; You want to know why people, especially men and boys, play fight so much?
And you want to know why friends tease each other?
And why do we express affection by lightly punching each other.

It's because they are rehearsing in case of an actual attack by enemies or predators.
Of course, physical fitness will be of little help to us if an enemy nation drops a bomb on us. Also, modern civilization has eliminated the danger of predators.
But our inner brains don't know that.

&#9632; R. D. Guthrie, in his book Body Hot Spots, explains smiling as a form of teasing. According to Guthrie, you smile at another person in order to show your sharp fangs, which your inner brain thinks you still have. Since you believe that you can bite the other person to death, but choose not to, the other person can interpret this as a friendship signal.

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73754
Feb 5, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

Cybele wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's more:
"The entirety of atheism is contained in this response. Atheism is not a philosophy; it is not even a view of the world; it is simply a refusal to deny the obvious. Unfortunately, we live in a world in which the obvious is overlooked as a matter of principle. The obvious must be observed and re-observed and argued for. This is a thankless job. It carries with it an aura of petulance and insensitivity. It is, moreover, a job that the atheist does not want."
READ THE LAST LINE. Apparently, he is willing to admit that an atheist does not and would not want to have an explanation for God. By stating something like "deny the obvious" he's acknowledging that perhaps the concept of a God is what many thinks is the 'obvious' and that he evidently states that it should be 'observed' and 're-observed.'
I read his book The End of Faith. And most of his criticisms are against Islam religion. And people say he's a closet Buddhist. Go figure.
Looks to me like you have completely misunderstood Sam Harris. His use of the double negative did not help.

He is saying that to him at least, it is obvious there is no God.

And Buddhism does not require any belief in God or gods either, BTW.

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73755
Feb 5, 2013
 

Judged:

2

1

1

Common Person wrote:
<quoted text>
We are all common people, you're no exception, sorry.
What religion does is give people who choose to believe something they cannot prove (a higher power, etc) is called "faith".
Join the 22nd century already. At least get educated on things you talk about.
Your own assumption that the use of the phrase "common people" is pejorative already labels you.

In any case, yes, in Seneca's time the less educated believed in a huge array of Cults from all over the Empire, while the more educated generally were versed in the philosophy, literature, and mathematics of the Greeks and took a rational approach, looking down their noses on anti-rational cults.

They were also fully aware that invoking religion was a useful tool in ruling...

Fast forward to today, and watch all the overly pious displays from politicians like Gingrich and Obama (why swear on one bible when you can use 10?). And you don't think they are using religion to manipulate "the common people"?

If you want to turn Seneca's statement into class warfare, be my guest, but I think his observation was a clear sighted one.

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73756
Feb 5, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text>This is a deformed explanation. Why are they no longer changing to human forms?
So long as you are making your living running around in trees and collecting fruit, the existing monkey/ape form is superior to any human one, for that lifestyle.

The evolution of the bipedal apes that would become the hominid line started with a specific event, the drying of East Africa and the replacement of thick jungle with Savannah. Bipedalism was a solution at the time. They could no longer survive in the same way as before, and this is what drives either adaptation or extinction.

There is no "natural tendency" for apes to become more human. Every creature adapts to the environment it is in, or dies out.

We adapted to a new environment, and we got lucky. The hand was freed from locomotion and so gradually developed into a more precise instrument (but less powerful), etc. The additional metabolic burden of a larger brain was compensated for by an increase in the protein and fat content in the new diet. Over the next six million years, this fortunate and singular collection of circumstances drove changes to our form. One thing led to another.

Other apes have not been subject to these particular circumstances, and remained confined to the thick jungles that continued to exist in Western and Southern Africa, and South East Asia. Therefore they would have no tendency to "become human".

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73757
Feb 5, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

Langoliers wrote:
Wikipedia:
There are generally considered to be three outstanding problems with the Big Bang theory: the horizon problem, the flatness problem, and the magnetic monopole problem.
Horizon problem
....A resolution to this apparent inconsistency is offered by inflationary theory

Flatness problem
The overall geometry of the Universe is determined by whether the Omega cosmological parameter is less than, equal to or greater than 1.....A resolution to this problem is offered by inflationary theory.

Magnetic monopoles
The magnetic monopole objection was raised in the late 1970s. Grand unification theories predicted topological defects in space that would manifest as magnetic monopoles. These objects would be produced efficiently in the hot early Universe, resulting in a density much higher than is consistent with observations, given that searches have never found any monopoles. This problem is also resolved by cosmic inflation, which removes all point defects from the observable Universe in the same way that it drives the geometry to flatness.
So, three out of three problems already solved by Inflation.

Perhaps the US national debt is next.

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73758
Feb 5, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Thomas Robertson wrote:
Other respondents have spoken about the scientific signs of evolution.
I would like to speak about the psychological signs:
&#9632; When we stroke a dog or a cat, our inner brains tell us that we are inspecting a juvenile for lice. Likewise, when we stroke another human being, our inner brains tell us the same thing. Of course, we lost most of our fur long ago, but our inner brains don't know that.
&#9632; Hometown loyalty is an example. My mother grew up in Woodville, Mississippi, hometown of composer William Grant Still. My father grew up in New Albany, Mississippi, hometown of writer William Faulkner. I grew up in Anderson, Indiana, hometown of Carl Erskine, pitcher for the Dodgers.
You may say, "So what? Those are other people's accomplishments, not yours." But my inner brain tells me that we are still living in villages which declare war on each other. So I want the population of each village to be as stong as possible.
&#9632; Reaction to screen images is another example. Why do you feel afraid when a monster appears in a movie? That monster can't hurt you any more than this message on the screen can. But your inner brain tells you to react with fear to anything that looks like a wild animal.
&#9632; Hostility toward people of differing opinion is still another example. Case in point: look at how much hatred there is right here in this thread. We attack each other because our inner brains tell us that we are confronting enemies and predators.
&#9632; You want to know why people, especially men and boys, play fight so much?
And you want to know why friends tease each other?
And why do we express affection by lightly punching each other.
It's because they are rehearsing in case of an actual attack by enemies or predators.
Of course, physical fitness will be of little help to us if an enemy nation drops a bomb on us. Also, modern civilization has eliminated the danger of predators.
But our inner brains don't know that.
&#9632; R. D. Guthrie, in his book Body Hot Spots, explains smiling as a form of teasing. According to Guthrie, you smile at another person in order to show your sharp fangs, which your inner brain thinks you still have. Since you believe that you can bite the other person to death, but choose not to, the other person can interpret this as a friendship signal.
Some of this (not all), hate to say, reminds me of why psychology and evolutionary psychology are still wanting as real scientific disciplines.

What you have here are plausible just-so stories, an effort to explain all our behavior within an accepted paradigm. I am not saying its wrong, but its not really science. If instead you started with the premise of "Original Sin" and proceeded to explain all human behavior in these terms, you would be doing the same thing.

A lot of the conjectures above would be very difficult to provide any falsification tests for, and that is the problem.

Still, interesting.

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#73759
Feb 5, 2013
 

Judged:

2

2

1

Cybele wrote:
<quoted text>
So did Newton with his Law of Gravity and his mysticism. So did Galileo who was a devout Catholic and known to be the Father of Science. So did Georges Lemaitre, a Catholic priest who proposed the Big Bang Theory, etc. The point is even Scientists believe in a God.
Some scientists, please be precise when you are making such bold statements, it makes the majority look bad. Certainly most scientists were religious in the repressive past (most people were (or else were punished (often violently))), in the more enlightened present this is not necessarily so.

According to a 1998 report in the journal Nature, a recent survey found that 93% of NAS members are either atheists or agnostics. http://www.stephenjaygould.org/ctrl/news/file...

Using such data (and the 50 state religion in prison survey) then if all atheists and agnostics were removed from the USA, it would lose 93% of the National Academy of Sciences but less than 1% of the prison population. Go figure

Galileos devout faith did not stop him being denounced to the Inquisition in 1615 and being tried and condemned by the Inquisition in 1633, to live the rest of his life under house arrest.

Darwin, in a letter to John Fordyce in 1879 "I have never been an atheist in the sense of denying the existence of a God. I think that an agnostic would be the most correct description of my state of mind. by his own words, agnostic.

Although not a religious man Einsteins Jewish upbringing did not stop him discovering the formula that shows that no omnipotent being (Revelation 19:6 KJV) can exist in this universe at the same time as you (E=MC^2). Nor did it stop him writing, "For me the Jewish religion like all other religions is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions

Edward Teller - agnostic

Robert Oppenheimer never believed in or practiced any religion

James Watson - atheist

Francis Crick - atheist.

Carl Sagan - agnostic

Stephen Hawking - atheist.

Brian Cox - is comfortable with the unknown and does not need answers to everything.As far as I am concerned we are information processing devices, which require energy we convert food for energy we are basically heat engines. This is how steam engines work, and fridges. So if there is an afterlife, I would have to reconsider the engineering design of fridges

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

•••