Bachmann warns of threats to liberty ...

Bachmann warns of threats to liberty in Iowa speech

There are 215 comments on the TwinCities.com story from Jan 21, 2011, titled Bachmann warns of threats to liberty in Iowa speech. In it, TwinCities.com reports that:

U.S. Rep. Michele Bachmann made her first big appearance as a potential presidential candidate here Friday night with what she described as a "somber, serious speech" warning of the dangers of the expanding federal government and growing national debt.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at TwinCities.com.

cjrian

United States

#197 Jan 22, 2011
the ignorance is scary wrote:
...
Dummy! Nazi's were right-wing fascist whack-o's, not leftist.
...
The ignorance of voters like "whatever" is the most frightening thing wrong in this country today.
"The Nazi credo that the individual belongs to the state also applies to business. Some businesses have been confiscated outright, on other what amounts to a capital tax has been levied. Profits have been strictly controlled. Some idea of the increasing Governmental control and interference in business could be deduced from the fact that 80% of all building and 50% of all industrial orders in Germany originated last year with the Government. Hard-pressed for food- stuffs as well as funds, the Nazi regime has taken over large estates and in many instances collectivized agriculture, a procedure fundamentally similar to Russian Communism." - Time Magazine, 1939

"We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions." - Adolph Hitler

Early in the 20th Century the Left gained control of the storyline and have propagandized that Fascists are of the Right. In truth, there is little difference between rightwing Fascists and leftwing. But most Dictators/Fascists have, since the beginning of the 20th Century come from the Left.

Walter Duranty was an early example of controlling the message. Duranty, a die-hard pro-Soviet Communist wrote outright fabrications - and was awarded a Pulitzer. He wrote "There is no famine or actual starvation nor is there likely to be" (New York Times, Nov. 15, 1931) even after he'd seen people dying in the streets duriung the Ukranian Holomodor (holocaust). And again - "Any report of a famine in Russia is today an exaggeration or malignant propaganda" (New York Times, August 23, 1933). When the real story started to emerge, Duranty CYA'd, writing "There is no actual starvation or deaths from starvation but there is widespread mortality from diseases due to malnutrition" (New York Times, March 31, 1933, page 13)

Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, Pol Pot, Musolini, Kim Jung Il, Castro, Chavez, Morales - all Fascistic Dictators. And all Leftists.
cjrian

United States

#198 Jan 22, 2011
a teaching moment wrote:
I just have to say that fascists are NOT "leftists," whatever you say. There are definitions of political and social movements, and those definitions and delineations have meaning. If you took a Poly Sci course, your professor would put red marks and low grades all over your exams. Same is true for dozens of other conservative responders on "topix." They have no idea of the correct use of political terms. Its painful to read. Its a sorry dumbing down of political discourse.
Actually, I HAVE taken Poli Sci (Poli, not Poly) with Leftist instructors in college. Refute them sufficiently, and they cannot deny evidence. They most certainly don't like being shown wrong, but the evidence speaks for itself. Research, m'boy, research! And get past the false front to the truth.
agreed

Minneapolis, MN

#199 Jan 22, 2011
Hillary Clinton 2012 wrote:
<quoted text>sorry dumdum, lefty fascist believe in a authoritarian govt as did the Hitler regime. Both commanded control of healthcare and all major private industries. Hitler controlling healthcare did not work out soooooo well for the Jews.
Hitlers right wing fascist agenda did not work out for the jews.
Just as Bachmann's right wing agenda fascist will not work out for any non white christian citizen.
Please learn your history. Fascism is not liberal by any stretch of the imagination. It is a right wing corporate merger.
"Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power." Benito Mussolini
a teaching moment

Saint Paul, MN

#200 Jan 22, 2011
cjrian wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, I HAVE taken Poli Sci (Poli, not Poly) with Leftist instructors in college. Refute them sufficiently, and they cannot deny evidence. They most certainly don't like being shown wrong, but the evidence speaks for itself. Research, m'boy, research! And get past the false front to the truth.
The reason that the fascist movements were not leftist (all leftists are socialists, liberals & progressives are not leftists) is that they attacked the labor movement and exploited the working class. The German Nazis, & they called their party the NSDAP, National Socialist German Workers' Party, nonetheless were not socialists and very largely not working class. They were a lower middle class movement (petit bourgeois) and by no means opposed to capitalism. They were what the left would call "state capitalists."

Hitler himself, & many other key Nazis, were "declasse" elements, drop outs from the lower middle class. Hitler's father was a customs agent, a middle class position in Austria. Hitler was an aspiring artist who wound up homeless, doing watercolor postcards. He wasn't a worker, as leftists would define such.

No actual socialist would call the NSDAP or Mussolini's lot "socialists." They represented the lower middle class opposition to the workers' movements and they locked up or shot all real socialists that they could catch.

All that said, yes, the Nazis, and the Leninists & Maoists etc. are totalitarians and quite bloody- handed.

And the Nazi use of the word "socialist" and "workers" in their party name has confused people for a very long time.
cjrian

United States

#201 Jan 22, 2011
agreed wrote:
Hitlers right wing fascist agenda did not work out for the jews.
Just as Bachmann's right wing agenda fascist will not work out for any non white christian citizen.
Please learn your history. Fascism is not liberal by any stretch of the imagination. It is a right wing corporate merger.
"Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power." Benito Mussolini
Fascism = State control of the Media
Leftism = State control of the Media

Fascism = State control of Transportation
Leftism = State control of Transportation

Fascism = State control of Industry
Leftism = State control of Industry

Fascism = State control of people
Leftism = State control of people

Fascism = State control of property
Leftism = State control of property

Fascism = State control/ownership of all else
Leftism = State control/ownership of all else

Fascism = Suppression of dissent
Leftism = Suppression of dissent

Fascism = Violent enforcement
Leftism = Violent enforcement

And yet, somehow, Fascism is a rightwing thing?
cjrian

United States

#202 Jan 22, 2011
a teaching moment wrote:
...
And the Nazi use of the word "socialist" and "workers" in their party name has confused people for a very long time.
It's not their name that "confused"
It's that their policies and actions (Nazi's, Fascists, Communists, Maoists, etc) are identical. They are one and the same.

Everything and everyone is effectively property of the State.
Dissent is eradicated, permanently.

No, they are the same.
Bruin

Surprise, AZ

#203 Jan 22, 2011
a teaching moment wrote:
<quoted text>
I just have to say that fascists are NOT "leftists," whatever you say. There are definitions of political and social movements, and those definitions and delineations have meaning. If you took a Poly Sci course, your professor would put red marks and low grades all over your exams. Same is true for dozens of other conservative responders on "topix." They have no idea of the correct use of political terms. Its painful to read. Its a sorry dumbing down of political discourse.
As someone else said about art,"I may not know what it is, but I know it when I see it." Political discourse does not get any dumber than when liberals engage in it.
Rob

Minneapolis, MN

#204 Jan 22, 2011
cjrian wrote:
<quoted text>
Fascism = State control of the Media
Leftism = State control of the Media
Fascism = State control of Transportation
Leftism = State control of Transportation
Fascism = State control of Industry
Leftism = State control of Industry
Fascism = State control of people
Leftism = State control of people
Fascism = State control of property
Leftism = State control of property
Fascism = State control/ownership of all else
Leftism = State control/ownership of all else
Fascism = Suppression of dissent
Leftism = Suppression of dissent
Fascism = Violent enforcement
Leftism = Violent enforcement
And yet, somehow, Fascism is a rightwing thing?
Well, there is the unfortunate fact that right wingers always seem to want the military to be outrageously huge, thus huge government. And that military thing makes them get into bed with industry, thus a rather scary military-industrial thing. And I've noticed a disturbing trend that anyone not fer the right wing agenda is agin''Merica, thus suppression of dissent in many ways through the patriot act, etc. And right wingers are ALWAYS for more law and order, thus their disgusting trend toward violent enforcement and the death penalty. And there wasn't a time I remember a more censoring government than in the Bush year, thus control of the media.
Fart

Minneapolis, MN

#205 Jan 22, 2011
Not Your Way wrote:
I was never hugged as a child and have been super P.O.'d ever since.
I dont blame your mother. She knew what she was doing in staying as far away from you as possible.
Sly Fox News

New York, NY

#206 Jan 22, 2011
Michele Bachmann: Welfare Queen
Dec 22, 2009 / http://tinyurl.com/ydrlen7
Michele Bachmann has become well known for her anti-government tea-bagger antics, protesting health care reform and every other government “handout” as socialism. What her followers probably don’t know is that Rep. Bachmann is, to use that anti-government slur, something of a welfare queen. That’s right, the anti-government insurrectionist has taken more than a quarter-million dollars in government handouts thanks to corrupt farming subsidies she has been collecting for at least a decade.
And she’s not the only one who has been padding her bank account with taxpayer money.
Bachmann, of Minnesota, has spent much of this year agitating against health care reform, whipping up the so-called tea-baggers with stories of death panels and rationed health care. She has called for a revolution against what she sees as Barack Obama’s attempted socialist takeover of America, saying presidential policy is “reaching down the throat and ripping the guts out of freedom.”
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/michelle_...
Bruin

Surprise, AZ

#207 Jan 22, 2011
Sly Fox News wrote:
Michele Bachmann: Welfare Queen
Dec 22, 2009 / http://tinyurl.com/ydrlen7
Michele Bachmann has become well known for her anti-government tea-bagger antics, protesting health care reform and every other government “handout” as socialism. What her followers probably don’t know is that Rep. Bachmann is, to use that anti-government slur, something of a welfare queen. That’s right, the anti-government insurrectionist has taken more than a quarter-million dollars in government handouts thanks to corrupt farming subsidies she has been collecting for at least a decade.
And she’s not the only one who has been padding her bank account with taxpayer money.
Bachmann, of Minnesota, has spent much of this year agitating against health care reform, whipping up the so-called tea-baggers with stories of death panels and rationed health care. She has called for a revolution against what she sees as Barack Obama’s attempted socialist takeover of America, saying presidential policy is “reaching down the throat and ripping the guts out of freedom.”
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/michelle_...
Back with the cut and paste,eh, Sly?, Get a brain, useless.
Sly Fox News

New York, NY

#208 Jan 22, 2011
Bruin wrote:
<quoted text>Back with the cut and paste,eh, Sly?, Get a brain, useless.
Everything I post is factual and nobody can disprove me.

I think you have been out too long in the Arizona Sun.

==========

Report: Health Industry Employing Hundreds of Ex-Gov. Officials
July 06, 2009 / http://tinyurl.com/nyx3t6
Here in the United States, the Washington Post is reporting the nation’s heath care industry has hired more than 350 former government officials and members of Congress to sway health care reform efforts on Capital Hill. According to lobbying records, three out of every four major health care companies have at least one former government insider on the payroll. Nearly half held positions under key committees and lawmakers including Senators Max Baucus and Charles Grassley. Bacaus is chair of the Senate Finance Committee which is largely steering health care reform efforts. Baucus’s aides recently held a meeting with a group of lobbyists that included two of his former chiefs of staff. The Washington Post says the health care industry is now spending $1.4 million dollars a day on lobbying, totaling $126 million dollars in the first fiscal quarter.
http://www.democracynow.org/2009/7/6/headline...
apostman

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#209 Jan 22, 2011
a teaching moment wrote:
<quoted text>
The Nazi use of the word "socialist" and "workers" in their party name has confused people for a very long time.
You got YOUR monies worth out of your tuition!

I would ask you if you consider the "conservatives" akin to laissez-faire capitalism? Further what would you define as Neo Conservatism?
whatever

Saint Paul, MN

#210 Jan 22, 2011
skipped scholl alot huh wrote:
<quoted text>
Sleep through history and civics class a lot?
"scholl"

LOL!!!!!!!!!!
apostman

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#211 Jan 22, 2011
laissez-faire capitalism

def. basically "HANDS OFF BUSINESS"

Problem is that would include abatements and exemptions.
Hillary Clinton 2012

United States

#212 Jan 22, 2011
agreed wrote:
<quoted text>
Hitlers right wing fascist agenda did not work out for the jews.
Just as Bachmann's right wing agenda fascist will not work out for any non white christian citizen.
Please learn your history. Fascism is not liberal by any stretch of the imagination. It is a right wing corporate merger.
"Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power." Benito Mussolini
BP, Goldman Sachs and GE all gave obama record campaign donations in 2008. Sorry but even George Soros is an admitted lefty fascist, he is a close Obama associate. Obama controls all major corporations.
whatever

Saint Paul, MN

#213 Jan 22, 2011
ZenBirdist wrote:
<quoted text>
NYW, we're obviously not going to get back on topic in this thread, so I'll just end our dialogue here with a some words of compassion for you. Even though you've been rude and insulting to me, I would defend you against another's rudeness as I've defended others against yours. Even though you've been disrespectful to me for as long as I remember interacting with you, I hope others will interact more respectfully with you than you do with them. I no longer am annoyed by your barrage of insults at myself and others for disagreeing with you. Instead I'm hopeful that you'll learn the value of a civil disagreement without personal verbal attacks. I know things haven't gone your way, and I pray that sooner or later they will, and when they do I hope you'll show some compassion to others who are mad because they didn't get their way.
Zen
Zen
you are worthless zen for brains

“Liberal Teachers ruin Kids”

Since: Mar 09

Paradise Valley Arizona

#214 Jan 22, 2011
Mr Mellow wrote:
<quoted text>
Dummy! Nazi's were right-wing fascist whack-o's, not leftist.
another one who has it all wrong.

The Nazi's learned from the American Progressives please do , do your home work.
a teaching moment

Saint Paul, MN

#215 Jan 22, 2011
cjrian wrote:
<quoted text>
It's not their name that "confused"
It's that their policies and actions (Nazi's, Fascists, Communists, Maoists, etc) are identical. They are one and the same.
Everything and everyone is effectively property of the State.
Dissent is eradicated, permanently.
No, they are the same.
One more thing, then I have go out with friends. Saturday night, good times!

Nazis, colored- shirt fascists, ratfink Maoists, Leninists, Trotskyites etc. ARE the same in many of their actions. Lead- fisted police states, state control of everything, etc. However, many leftists would categorize Marxist- Leninists/Maoists/etc. and Nazis/Fascists as "state capitalists," not as socialists. Really confusing, because several of these nasty movements use terms like "socialist" & "communist" to label themselves.

The key is to look at how they relate to the workers, the working class. The Nazis suppressed the German working class, Maoists are exploiting Chinese workers right now in grim ways that even Charles Dickens never imagined or saw. All the above movements are totalitarians, but they weren't and aren't socialists. Not by a long shot. Socialism is all about whether the working class is running society, or not.

And by that test, Obama & his supporters sure as H*** aren't leftists or socialists either. They are corporate capitalists.

“El Bobo's is this big.”

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#216 Jan 22, 2011
Tea Party bowel movement Michele Bachmann has less of a chance being President than Palin. If a number that remote is even possible.

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