JFK assassination: The man behind the film

Photo: Hundreds gathered Saturday at Dealey Plaza in Dallas to commemorate the 45th anniversary of the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. Full Story
First Prev
of 4
Next Last

Since: Sep 08

Santa Fe

#1 Nov 23, 2008
Once again the Feds lied to you. Pres Johnson, with help from the evil CIA, and the mob killed Kennedy, thus creating the second Amerikan Coup.
The Real America is so dead, and has been for many decades.
chatterbox87501

Bernalillo, NM

#2 Nov 23, 2008
'Bro, I have a picture of Kennedy riding in a motorcade, the flags on his car are those gold fringed ones, from the 1947 coup.

Besides, it was Marilyn Monroe who had him killed. He dissed her after she sang Happy Birthday to him.
lac

United States

#3 Nov 23, 2008
What is more strange ? Idiotic conspiracy theories with no basis of truth, derived by anti-Americans OR idiot whack jobs that actually create profiles on TOPIX ?
or lacs

Bernalillo, NM

#4 Nov 23, 2008
lac wrote:
What is more strange ? Idiotic conspiracy theories with no basis of truth, derived by anti-Americans OR idiot whack jobs that actually create profiles on TOPIX ?
who comment on these commenters?
lac

United States

#5 Nov 23, 2008
or lacs wrote:
<quoted text>
who comment on these commenters?
OR people who log out to make a comment as someone else.
Yawwwwn

Albuquerque, NM

#6 Nov 23, 2008
Another forum for the Santa Fe Conspiracy Theory Crybabies: whenever they lack an actual fact to support their POV they say "ohhhhhh, but there was a conspriacyyyyy".

Don't you wack jobs have enough to do chasing chem trails (we are so important the government wants to poison us from 40,000') and UFO's?

Or maybe if your self esteem was actually good, you wouldn't need to waste your time with government conspiracies.

These are the guys who can't keep their adventures in the Mens Room secret, and you think they swept all this JFK stuff under the rug successfully?

Brain transplant, anyone? I mean, trade that empty space for a brain!
lac

United States

#7 Nov 23, 2008
Yawwwwn wrote:
Brain transplant, anyone? I mean, trade that empty space for a brain!
Yea if they would put all this clouded intelligent thought into thing's like "legal ways to reduce your property tax" or "brew your own beer...explained" or "I can get laid on a Saturday Night AND so can you" this would be a much more pleasant place to live. The government is crooked as a 3 dollar bill, yea we know. They didn't blow up the world trade center or have Kennedy killed. Move on
Peter Droege

Denver, CO

#8 Nov 24, 2008
There are many levels from which one may approach Mr. Stolley's article, but my first reaction was that it is a beautiful piece of writing. Someone should write an article on Mr. Stolley, he sounds like a really interesting guy.
Retired Teacher

Albuquerque, NM

#9 Nov 24, 2008
Wouldn't it be refreshing if this paper practiced basic journalism techniques like proof reading their articles rather than relying on a spell checker? The subtitle should refer to "home movie", not "home move.

Since: Nov 08

Pojoaque, New Mexico

#10 Nov 24, 2008
lac wrote:
What is more strange ? Idiotic conspiracy theories with no basis of truth, derived by anti-Americans OR idiot whack jobs that actually create profiles on TOPIX ?
Just using basic logic (Occam's razor)and the evidence available to the public, the concocted Warren Commission "magic bullet" theory is the real wackjob "anti-conspiracy" theory. Follow the money. War is big business, and continuing and escalating the Vietnam conflict made BILLIONS of dollars for a relatively small group of Americans and others.
chatterbox87501

Bernalillo, NM

#11 Nov 24, 2008
I think it's amazing to have a Santa Fe resident who is so close to the film.

If you google frame 313, you find all sorts of sites that have all sorts of ways to call this film a fake. One I thought interesting was one that went through the film and noticed that the color red spiked and then dropped off. The site suggested that once the President's head was hit, the color red would rise and stay risen, instead of spiking back down.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#13 Nov 24, 2008
It takes an exceptional amount of training and discipline to be shooting at an American President in a moving vehicle. Nerves of steel and a lot of experience shooting, with the requisite knowledge of ballistics. Just to hit that small moving target at 100 yards is quite a feat. Doing so knowing that every law enforcement agency will be after you after the first shot is superhuman. Doing so with an Italian Carcano, which has about the worst reputation of any military rifle in the world goes beyond even superhuman.

That was NOT Lee Harvey Oswald.
chatterbox87501

Bernalillo, NM

#16 Nov 24, 2008
The last 5-6 paragraphs of this article are worth a read:

http://minnieapolis.newsvine.com/_news/2007/1...

Shot by the Secret Service, by accident?
GS Hartman

Rio Rancho, NM

#17 Nov 24, 2008
Dave Nelson wrote:
It takes an exceptional amount of training and discipline to be shooting at an American President in a moving vehicle. Nerves of steel and a lot of experience shooting, with the requisite knowledge of ballistics. Just to hit that small moving target at 100 yards is quite a feat. Doing so knowing that every law enforcement agency will be after you after the first shot is superhuman. Doing so with an Italian Carcano, which has about the worst reputation of any military rifle in the world goes beyond even superhuman.
That was NOT Lee Harvey Oswald.
The fatal shot was fired at a distance of about 200 feet, not a difficult shot for any decent marksman. As Nick mentioned, some myths have arisen over the years which wrongly imply that Oswald couldn't have done this by himself. One was that he was a bad shot, although his Marine Corps records clearly prove otherwise. The other was that the shot itself was very difficult, due to the distance, movement of the car, etc. In fact, it has been replicated by a number of marksmen over the years, all using the same poor-quality Italian carbine that Oswald used. If you ever have a chance to go to the Sixth Floor museum, it is definitely worth your time. You'll probably be amazed at how close the "X" in the street is to the window Oswald fired from. I couldn't get over how Dealey Plaza looks considerably smaller in person that it appears to me in any of the pictures.

The psychological stress for Oswald must have been tremendous, but whatever your theories are about the JFK assassination, other world leaders have been killed by single gunmen. So while it must be nerve-wracking for the guy actually pulling the trigger, it obviously is not something that humans are incapable of handling. And while Oswald's rifle was a piece of junk, it was fitted with a scope. To hit a man-sized target at less than 200 feet with a scoped rifle does not require a skilled sharpshooter, although nerves of steel would definitely be an asset.
Zorkon756

Honolulu, HI

#18 Nov 24, 2008
How do we know JFK is dead? Has he signed a death certificate saying so? Was it notorized?
GS Hartman

Rio Rancho, NM

#19 Nov 24, 2008
chatterbox87501 wrote:
The last 5-6 paragraphs of this article are worth a read:
http://minnieapolis.newsvine.com/_news/2007/1...
Shot by the Secret Service, by accident?
Impossible to believe! For this to have even a ghost of chance of being true, that meant that after hearing at least one shot, an agent unstrapped the rifle from the door rack, threw off the safety, and fired a round during the 5-second or so window of time that Oswald himself was firing? And no one else in that third car (the presidential car was the second in the motorcade) knew this, and no one else in the car behind them, or anyone lining the parade route saw such a bizarre thing? Keep in mind that those vehicles had bulletproof windshields, so to have any chance of hitting the car in front of you, you would have to be holding the rifle above or to the side of the windshield - in other words, in plain view of everyone!

Seems like this article was written by a guy with too much time on his hands, and no access to books.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#20 Nov 24, 2008
GS Hartman wrote:
<quoted text>
The fatal shot was fired at a distance of about 200 feet, not a difficult shot for any decent marksman. As Nick mentioned, some myths have arisen over the years which wrongly imply that Oswald couldn't have done this by himself. One was that he was a bad shot, although his Marine Corps records clearly prove otherwise. The other was that the shot itself was very difficult, due to the distance, movement of the car, etc. In fact, it has been replicated by a number of marksmen over the years, all using the same poor-quality Italian carbine that Oswald used. If you ever have a chance to go to the Sixth Floor museum, it is definitely worth your time. You'll probably be amazed at how close the "X" in the street is to the window Oswald fired from. I couldn't get over how Dealey Plaza looks considerably smaller in person that it appears to me in any of the pictures.
The psychological stress for Oswald must have been tremendous, but whatever your theories are about the JFK assassination, other world leaders have been killed by single gunmen. So while it must be nerve-wracking for the guy actually pulling the trigger, it obviously is not something that humans are incapable of handling. And while Oswald's rifle was a piece of junk, it was fitted with a scope. To hit a man-sized target at less than 200 feet with a scoped rifle does not require a skilled sharpshooter, although nerves of steel would definitely be an asset.
"To hit a man-sized target at less than 200 feet with a scoped rifle does not require a skilled sharpshooter, although nerves of steel would definitely be an asset."

You would be surprised how many couldn't hit the torso at that range, much less the back of a head.

Your point of impact is also different when you are shooting up or down. He would have had to sight in from an elevated platform or really knew the ballistics of the cartridge and picked a good average point of impact when sighting in on a flat range. He would also have known exactly how the car would approach and when to shoot.

Don't forget this is the guy that blew it trying to kill Gen. Edwin Walker.

That assassination required lots of planning and organization, and knowledge of the itinerary.

There have also been many skilled shooters that couldn't do what was done simulating the same layout.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#21 Nov 24, 2008
A really GOOD rifle is one that can put 3 rounds within an inch of each other. Fairly rare. You can shoot one brand of ammo and do that and shoot another brand and be way off. Has to do with the internal ballistics of the ammo and the precision of the rifle. Handloading your own ammo is the way to get the most accuracy out of your rifle. Takes lots of trial and error. I haven't tested a Carcano, but you can probably find what the average groups are in the hands of a benchrest shooter using manufactured ammo. My guess is it will be 3 shots within 3 inches at the very best. You can hold your sight dead on, but that bullet can wander inches away from where you ained. How big is the back of a head?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy_...

Some ballistic tests on that rifle.
GS Hartman

Rio Rancho, NM

#22 Nov 24, 2008
"You would be surprised how many couldn't hit the torso at that range, much less the back of a head."

I get your point about that. Of course, if the Warren Commission is correct, one bullet missed the car and all its occupants entirely - so everything didn't go strictly according to plan, even if the end result was a "success".(And if the WC is wrong, and multiple gunmen were involved, then even MORE than one bullet apparently missed the car completely!) Still, remember that Oswald only had to do this once - maybe if he had to do it ten times, only three attempts would have worked. All assassination attempts obviously do not succeed.

I think it has been convincingly demonstrated over the years that a single, well-trained shooter, even with a poor quality rifle, could pull this off. Of course, that isn't conclusive proof that he DIDN'T have help, but people who insist that a single rifleman could not have done this have been proven wrong many times over.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#23 Nov 24, 2008
GS Hartman wrote:
"You would be surprised how many couldn't hit the torso at that range, much less the back of a head."
I get your point about that. Of course, if the Warren Commission is correct, one bullet missed the car and all its occupants entirely - so everything didn't go strictly according to plan, even if the end result was a "success".(And if the WC is wrong, and multiple gunmen were involved, then even MORE than one bullet apparently missed the car completely!) Still, remember that Oswald only had to do this once - maybe if he had to do it ten times, only three attempts would have worked. All assassination attempts obviously do not succeed.
I think it has been convincingly demonstrated over the years that a single, well-trained shooter, even with a poor quality rifle, could pull this off. Of course, that isn't conclusive proof that he DIDN'T have help, but people who insist that a single rifleman could not have done this have been proven wrong many times over.
A single rifleman could pull it off, with a lot of help and a detailed plan. That was not Lee Harvey Oswald.

Remember seeing his expression after being arrested? That was not the expression of a man that just shot a President, it was the expression of a man that realizes he was set up. Therefore he was killed before he could say his piece.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker
First Prev
of 4
Next Last

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

The Santa Fe New Mexican Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Rodella eyes Rio Arriba sheriff's job (Apr '09) Sep 22 Darian Valdevia 30
Deadly exposure: Plutonium-related cancers plag... (Apr '09) Aug '14 Lynne Loss 10
Memory Lane - only for Real Santa Feans (Oct '08) Aug '14 Suz Santa Fe 2,201
Lawyers slam police in Valdez trial (Nov '08) Jul '14 MzRoze 46
Echoes of the past still haunt Pojoaque's Line ... (Jun '09) Jun '14 cwatson 41
Is it safe to make yourself faint? (May '09) Jun '14 Just A random guy 5
Paulson: crisis happens once or twice in 100 years (Nov '08) May '14 swedenforever 11

People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE