Third 'positive loitering' event in Santa Cruz stirs debate

Nutcases suck wrote:

<quoted text>
Becky, no you DON'T know TBSC members. You don't know them at all or anything about their intentions and goals. You have been banned from their website remember? All the "opposition" does not know anything about them. This is why they made up the story TBSC was promoting cameras and more police activity in NOLO. Both have always been supported by NOLO, but not TBSC. As I understood, they are "loitering" where there has been murder, drug dealing, high crime areas in general. Stuff it Becky and go make up stuff about someone else. TBSC has 3000 members and growing, and you do NOT know them.

Beautifully said!! As a member of TBSC, I applaud you.

Soilie Watch wrote:

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Thanks for the info, I couldn't have said it better myself. I started this blog a while back, but simply don't have time to update it. But it is dedicated to monitoring the local radical anarchist fringe.
And I'm a liberal, leftie myself! These guys just give activism a terrible image...

Are you real? Are you my new best friend? Hummm I donno. Suspect. Give me something I can sink my teeth into. I have pictures. I have documents. I have names. These people are not activist they are terrorist.

SC doesn't seem to see it. What will it take? They already attacked professors. Look how Johnson jumps in for them. I agree that HUFF is only just hanging on slightly. It's the free coffee I think. They might regret it when it all comes down and they are standing there with a COP WATCH sign.

Wes Modes who works at UCSC in the library IT department is a problem. Mainly because he has access to all the professors information and students. Why the university would allow this is beyond me. There are ties to Freeskool which teach classes like resisting police and DIY "fireworks"...right. Of course we have the drum circle incident in Sept. 08. He was found guilty of assaulting a police officer. Co-Founder of Sub Rosa cafe located near the corner of Pacific and Laurel. There is a sign when you go in that states "NO POLICE OR FBI BEYOND THIS POINT." This sort of intimidation like wearing masks and beating on large drums to harass people. No surprise that he was the creator of the facebook event for the demonstrators last night. He always adds a few UCSC students on there to deflect attention.

Edgar De La Cruz wrote:

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I have actually lived in "lower Ocean" since I was a kid. I don't know what the answer to all these problems are, but I'm pretty sure making people feel like criminals is not a step in the right direction. A police officer flashing his brights in my eyes and demanding to see my identification is the only incident of harassment I have ever faced on this street. I'm sure I am not the only young Latino male this has happened to. There are obviously racial undertones in this situation, and we need to realize this and talk about why that is, and how we can break that barrier down. The people of this neighborhood are already stigmatized and criminalized, and I think that is the first thing that must be addressed.

Edgar thinks there are "racial undertones" and we need to "realize this" and "break that barrier down" Edgar sounds like an "anti-racist".

Anti-racists like Edgar say there is a "race problem", and that the only way to solve this "race problem" is to flood white countries and ONLY white countries with immigrants from the third world and force ONLY whites to "assimilate" to the third world immigrants.

To solve the "race problem", white people, and ONLY white people, are supposed to assimilate themselves out of existence. This is genocide.

Edgar probably thinks he's an "anti-racist", but that's just another codeword for Anti White.

Becky Johnson wrote:

LOCAL WRITES: "The truth is that the Latino culture embraces violence & spreads it wherever they go. Look at Tijuana or East LA. Just like the Asian culture values education, Latino culture values stabbing. It takes thousands of years to build this paradigm, & the only way we can fight it is with law enforcement."
BECKY: See? For many TBSC members and supporters, this IS about race. This post is exhibit "A"

This post was written by Bobby Kahn(Robert Norse), so that you can cleverly use it to promote your contention that TBSC is racist organization. We are not racist. I know. I am a member, who has attended all of TBSC's events. We have OVER the above average cross section of minorities, which for Santa Cruz is about 22% NON white. We are a diverse group of families looking to promote safety. What's wrong with that. Stop it with the racist propaganda. Its not working. HUFF is 100% white. I know I attended some of your gatherings, too.

victor wrote:

<quoted text>make shure when they put camaras in your naborhood they put a gun right next to it because if the low life shoot u firt u want d police to be able to shoot back at him when he runs away. more camaras less patroling we need this cops walkin the streets not watching u get shoot in a video.

Police walking the street! Yes, so many have asked for that, but the powers that be just refuse. It makes such sense! Walkin the Beat, like the old days

Edgar De La Cruz wrote:

<quoted text>
I have actually lived in "lower Ocean" since I was a kid. I don't know what the answer to all these problems are, but I'm pretty sure making people feel like criminals is not a step in the right direction. A police officer flashing his brights in my eyes and demanding to see my identification is the only incident of harassment I have ever faced on this street. I'm sure I am not the only young Latino male this has happened to. There are obviously racial undertones in this situation, and we need to realize this and talk about why that is, and how we can break that barrier down. The people of this neighborhood are already stigmatized and criminalized, and I think that is the first thing that must be addressed.

Really? A police officer shined a light in your eyes ONCE and asked you for ID and now the whole world is racist? Are you FKM?

Well, what are your solutions? We are still waiting for you to address what you think must first be addressed. Please, use your brain for a few minutes and offer us some concrete ideas.

Mi Orgullo wrote:

<quoted text>

Becky Johnson wrote:
LOCAL WRITES: "The truth is that the Latino culture embraces violence & spreads it wherever they go. Look at Tijuana or East LA. Just like the Asian culture values education, Latino culture values stabbing. It takes thousands of years to build this paradigm, & the only way we can fight it is with law enforcement."
BECKY: See? For many TBSC members and supporters, this IS about race. This post is exhibit "A"

This post was written by Bobby Kahn(Robert Norse), so that you can cleverly use it to promote your contention that TBSC is racist organization. We are not racist. I know. I am a member, who has attended all of TBSC's events. We have OVER the above average cross section of minorities, which for Santa Cruz is about 22% NON white. We are a diverse group of families looking to promote safety. What's wrong with that. Stop it with the racist propaganda. Its not working. HUFF is 100% white. I know I attended some of your gatherings, too.

BJ has long exploited racism to get attention and has been criticized by NorseKahn, a sampling of her endeavors:

BJ WRITES:
"So dey wuz content with their confinement? Bein' as dey wuz singing and wid smilin' faces?"

AND BJ WRITES:
"...it reminded me of po white folk in the South who observed how happy the "[OFFENSIVE RACIAL SLUR REMOVED]" were with the institution of slavery, by always laughing and singing..."

And just in case anyone missed it, here's a sideways shot of the man who wants to make public policy around here:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_LAsPUjrm_Ko/Sl4hTx3...

Pray for the Teddy Bear :-)

Sum Dim wrote:

And just in case anyone missed it, here's a sideways shot of the man who wants to make public policy around here:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_LAsPUjrm_Ko/Sl4hTx3...

Pray for the Teddy Bear :-)

and pray that the belt stays in place

Aptos Resident II wrote:

from the article........
"There are other ways to go about fighting crime," Edgar de La Cruz said..........
Excellent, Edgar. What are your alternate suggestions??

lets try not to put down someone who is actually trying to get involved in his community's issues. Sounds like something TBSC would say don't it!
Lets get down to the root of what many people feel about TBSC's goals and presence. Until member of TBSC acknowledge their stance as being principle informed by their limited experiences as privileged white tax payers and allow citizens of the neighborhoods they loiter in to actually participate alongside members and aid in their own "empowerment"... we'll have the persisting problem of white Santa Cruz residents organizing and rallying around their privilege as white home owners, white mothers, white grandparents... concerned and respectable white citizens. Unfortunately, taking back santa cruz and restoring things to the way they used to be would mean ethnically cleansing the "Lower Ocean" neighborhood and restoring segregated work and housing practices in our beautiful beach town. Sorry, no poor people, students, blacks or Mexicans allowed in this city! Lets not forget that we're all santa cruz residents and that further stigmatizing a neighborhood where men, women, and children of all ages and races live and work is as unneighborly as it gets.

jarbee wrote:

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Really? A police officer shined a light in your eyes ONCE and asked you for ID and now the whole world is racist? Are you FKM?
Well, what are your solutions? We are still waiting for you to address what you think must first be addressed. Please, use your brain for a few minutes and offer us some concrete ideas.

If you weren't aware, a person who is interviewed does not participate in the drafting up of an article which is why there's just a snippet of what he said and an entire article dedicated to TBSC. If I can recall correctly, He stated that the racial undertones of TBSC prevent many residents from participating with them and accepting their backassward approach at making Lower Ocean resident's lives that much more difficult and policed. I live on West Cliff Dr. and I can tell you now that my neighbors would have a fit if TBSC had the gall to hold a demonstration like this and make any suggestions that would alter our way of life.

vince wrote:

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As a Hispanic member of TBSC, I find your comments racist. This group's sole goal is to make Santa Cruz a place free from drugs, gangs and bad behavior!!! I am a proud member and applaud their actions. I wish I could have attended last night, but worked too late to attend.
You, on the other hand, are obviously a sad woman with no life.

you feel it's necessary to wave your hands and call attention to yourself as one of the lone non white members. I'm sorry, Madrigal was there last night so... there are TWO whole non white members. You get a thumbs up and TBSC gets a gold star for their commitment to diversity

Amy R Whitmore wrote:

What Edgar de La Cruz, from the Sentinel article, who does not live in our neighborhood, fails to realize, is that if you live in Lower Ocean, and are a law abiding citizen, then you welcome the cameras and increased police presence. Wake up Edgar we just had 2 innocent people murdered in our neighborhood. What kind of solution do you suggest? I live in lower Ocean and have to call the police about 3 times a week on some sort of criminal activity. Whether it is drug dealing, prostitution, or gang fights, I am scared for me and my family's safety.

I attended the event last night and the young man, Edgar, mentioned to reporters that he is a lifelong resident of the Lower Ocean neighborhood. I think that you need to get to know your neighbors maam

desperatelyseekingsusan wrote:

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Frankie, I'm sure theslavemaster back at the plantation will be happy to know their their good old boy has done the family proud. They'll probably applaud you for your efforts at driving the Injuns out of our god give land.

The usual ad hominem tripe .... you picked your pseudonym well "Desperately"

Now you're not only slurring White people, you're also creating hate caricatures out of White people from the American South, and White people who settled the western states.

Anti-White hate caricatures are all you can come up with? Show some class and present some real ideas.

As for "Injuns" (your word, not mine), check out what a real "Injun" has to say about this topic: http://www.badeagle.com/

(PS: your anti-white bigotry is showing too much. Might want to ask your handlers for better talking points.)

rebekkahsc wrote:

<quoted text>
you feel it's necessary to wave your hands and call attention to yourself as one of the lone non white members. I'm sorry, Madrigal was there last night so... there are TWO whole non white members. You get a thumbs up and TBSC gets a gold star for their commitment to diversity

Yes, I did feel it necessary. Especially since that woman (becky johnson) claims TBSC is anti-latino. Just for the record, there are many non-white members of TBSC. We all have the same goal, a safe Santa Cruz. What are you doing to help in this cause?

Edgar De La Cruz wrote:

<quoted text>
I have actually lived in "lower Ocean" since I was a kid. I don't know what the answer to all these problems are, but I'm pretty sure making people feel like criminals is not a step in the right direction. A police officer flashing his brights in my eyes and demanding to see my identification is the only incident of harassment I have ever faced on this street. I'm sure I am not the only young Latino male this has happened to. There are obviously racial undertones in this situation, and we need to realize this and talk about why that is, and how we can break that barrier down. The people of this neighborhood are already stigmatized and criminalized, and I think that is the first thing that must be addressed.

You are welcome to attend NOLO meetings. They are mostly all white because they can't get their Latino neighbors to join them to help resolve crime. They put out all their invitations in Spanish and canvass the neighborhood pretty well. They put notices in the Sentinel of their meetings. Get on it so you can help resolve instead of complain.

leotolstoy wrote:

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I know the members of Taking Back Santa Cruz wish someone as ridiculous as you weren't defending their camp. Cube would probably agree though. She is as reckless as you appear to be. She will probably end up being the group's undoing.

Leo Tolstoy wasn't as delusional as you! What makes you think I'm "defending TBSC camp"? I have nothing to do with them.

I'm responding to the reckless anti-White bigotry that pops up often here.

Whenever a "person of color" speaks out about their ethnic interests, it's called "Pride".

Whenever a White person speaks out about their ethnic interests, it's called "Hate", or "Racism".

Why the double standard? This is the very definition of bigotry, to show two standards for different groups.

If you think it's "ridiculous" to point out the obvious double standard, one can only wonder what YOUR standards are based upon.

Frankie wrote:

<quoted text>
Whenever a White person speaks out about their ethnic interests, it's called "Hate", or "Racism".
Why the double standard? This is the very definition of bigotry, to show two standards for different groups.
If you think it's "ridiculous" to point out the obvious double standard, one can only wonder what YOUR standards are based upon.

A few reasons for this "double standard":
-Slavery
-Internment Camps
-The genocide of the Native "Americans"
-Discrimination
-Jim Crow
-Denial of fair home loans
-Lynchings
-Land Theft
-Police Brutality
-Unfair sentencing

I mean, a lot of people relatives where screwed over by all those things. It's like a fresh scar, it's not like it happened thousands of years ago. This is recent. And it's not about 'ethnic interests', it's about white people still trying to control others minds and actions.

I'm sure a lot of people will be angry at this post, but whatever, you know you've thought about it yourself. Don't expect everything to be cool just because someone (some rich white dude) signed some piece of paper that said "racism is over yay!"

localresident wrote:

...if you don't want people messing with your business, go live in North San Juan or something...

Yum...breakfast at Toki's...

ItsOK2feelGuiltyHomie wrote:

<quoted text>
A few reasons for this "double standard":

OK, it's OK ... let's look at your list of reasons.

[STRONG]-Slavery[/STRONG]

Slavery was an institution worldwide. Who owned the African slaves in the Colonies/America? All owned by White people? Not hardly. All white people "owned" them? Not hardly. Which ethnic group was the MOST LIKELY to own them? Hint: it wasn't whites. Who financed the slave trade? Who owned and ran many (most?) of the ships? Again, it wasn't the colonists from Britain. Once you find the answer, you'll be shocked. And finally: so what? Blacks and other ethnicities provided the slaves to be shipped, so why is it all "White Peoples' Fault" ???

[STRONG]-Internment Camps[/STRONG]

Let's see, I think that was during FDR's reign, right? You're talking about the Japanese, right? Once again, look behind the curtain and you'll see that the "Americans" of that era were rather "diverse", not all white. But of course, it's ALL WHITEY's FAULT. That makes a whole lot of sense. If "America" did this to the Japanese, why aren't the Blacks, Mexicans, Chinese, etc living here given part of the blame? Of course, people don't often mention those ethnic German and Italians who were also interned. Wonder why the Japanese are "special".... Hint: it's easier to smear "whitey" if we don't mention the other people of European background who were interned.

This post will be too long with the above format, so I'll shorten it ...

-The genocide of the Native "Americans" (of course, ALL Whites living today are supposed to bear this burden forever, and of course the Amerindians NEVER EVER committed crimes/genocide against each other! Of COURSE NOT. LOL)

-Discrimination (Discrimination is a normal human proclivity. People generally prefer their "own" over others. Blacks do it, Mexicans do it, Chinese do it, and Whites do it. Funny how the only one's smeared for it are Whites)

-Jim Crow (This is way too complex to address here.)

-Denial of fair home loans (Ditto)

-Lynchings (Lynchings were frontier justice when the "law" was either non-existent or had failed. Many, many "victims" were whites. Not just Blacks. This is an anti-white canard based on propaganda, not historical fact.)

-Land Theft (by who?)

-Police Brutality (Are you going to tell me Rodney King was a paragon of virtue? LOL)

-Unfair sentencing (Why is this cause to justify hate caricatures of White People? I'm sure it's happened to Whites as well.)

I mean, a lot of people relatives where screwed over by all those things. It's like a fresh scar, it's not like it happened thousands of years ago. This is recent. And it's not about 'ethnic interests', it's about white people still trying to control others minds and actions.
I'm sure a lot of people will be angry at this post, but whatever, you know you've thought about it yourself. Don't expect everything to be cool just because someone (some rich white dude) signed some piece of paper that said "racism is over yay!"

Oh yeah, lots of people have been "screwed over" ... but your sense of history is missing a lot.

Let's talk about the Genocidal attacks on Europeans by the Huns, the Mongols, the Turks, and the Arabs (Spain). Your "history lesson" never seems to mention those things, and how they affected the European peoples during a couple of thousand years of history. You think "History" only started when your ox got gored? Sorry, it's a bit bigger than that.

And none of it is any living White person's "fault". It's just what happened.