Six teens arrested in graffiti bust

[GrownMan]

Jack Kirkpatrick wrote:

A person or crew (gangs)committing felony murder don't do community service; they get art therapy -- just look at Charlie Manson and the gang members that secreat messages out of prison under the guise of art.
People who mess up private property or public property in the name of art is not always art and the writing has another agenda that create turff wars that are not in the public interest or create a climate of danger to others living in a community or visiting a community; it may be a statement but freedom of speech and expression are not absolute! A community standard is what promulgates many of our laws that all of us are subject to.
Governments sometimes are convinced to set aside a wall but set the rules. Not all art are is for public consumption, but galleries are set aside for those that choose to consume quesstionable works.
Community service and even confinement time may be an appropriate sanction for vadalism or nuisance as well as restitution!

turf war? lol... this isn't some bloods and crip shit...

[Jack Kirkpatrick]

Where have you been "Grown man?" Graffiti or tagging are not always about street gangs -- crips, bloods, notenos, surenos, aryan brotherhood, punks, KKK...!

Who commits graffiti vandalism? "Graffiti damage is inflicted by both juveniles and adults. There are several types of graffiti vandals: taggers who want their handiwork (usually names or initials) to be seen; gang members who are communicating with other gangs; and those who consider their graffiti another art form and do murals." If you want some FAQ:
http://www.mag.maricopa.gov/archive/newpages/...

Graffiti vandalism is wide spread and not an exclusive practice of any individual or group.

Didn't you know that there are some graffiti crews that pit high schools and social groups including competing graffiti crews that are territorial? You may want to check this out -- there are turf issues in many communities or neighboring communities .

Most don't result in shootouts, but are nevertheless, non-gang wars of identity; a type of invasion if you will.

You should read about this in the United States or European and Middle Eastern countries...!

Try on the Great Graffiti Wars of the Late 20th Century or the Brooklyn's Ditmas Graffiti War.... Crews and individuals stake a claim to turf even on the peninsula -- you just have to know where to look and interpret it. Of course all graffiti are vandalism if personal property owners do not want it on their property or on public property! The public is the victim of graffiti and graffiti wars whether is defined by turf or not!

When I received training it was inclusive - crews, gangs and individual offenders and the intelligence used to collect it was used to suppress it deleterious affects on the public.

[Jim the Smart]

You people who say tagging is cool, are ignorant. Whoever said poeple who don't tag are just jealous, could not be further from the truth. Im 18 and go to college, and never tagged anything. I garuntee you would envy my life if you saw it. I don't understand what little bastards think is cool about destroying property that is not theirs. Like someone said earlier they only feel remorse when they get caught. Slap a big fine on their ass, and give them a little time in the slammer to think about why graffiti is cool.

[cadeburton]

These are new jersey rules.

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[cadeburton]

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[cadeburton]

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[RWC Guy]

Explicit wrote:

Wow, most of these people are ignorant. I understand there's alot of posers, or kids trying to make a name, but there's 2 sides of the story.
I think it depends how you do it, those who do it on houses with families, do deserve a penalty.
But put yourself in that position, maybe they don't have a dime to their name, they just want that satisfaction of bringing art to the city. As long as its away from harm, around vacant areas, its alright. Most of you old fogeys wouldnt agree, but i would love for one of your sons or daughters to get caught trying to live their only life to the fullest, and you're coming down so hard on them. Its art for fking sake, not murder.

It is not "art", it's just vandalism. Businesses HAVE to paint over that shit, nobody wants that crap on their buildings. The buildings were already painted the way the people that own them wanted them to be painted. Who are you to tell me or anyone that people like these punks have a right to do this to us ?

And the BS about how there's nowhere for this "art" - you have GOT to be kidding. Space-wise, there is FAR more graffitti/vandalism than there is real "art".

And finally, the people who do tagging ARE stupid. That much exposure to spray paint like that makes them friggin' retarded. Have you ever talked to any of these punks ? What a bunch of freaking retards.

They all get to be locked up and pay HUGE fines for years now, and they deserve it. You don't fuck with people's businesses, their livelihood, what they sweat at every day to earn a living. It's about respect, have a little.

[Dumb street bombin]

I'm street bombin all day i been cought before i was 18 an im glad i did you learn from it an know how too handle shit when it counts aint too much bout too happen too these cats just learn from it and keep it lit now that you over age..
On Mama's!!

[its cool]

respect to saber. your the best man. you have an amazing life and do what you want for a living. thats better than most of these people on here can say.

[New Graffiti Cop]

Everyday I ride this bus to work and watch punk kids scrawl crap all over with markers. SFPD offers $250 for arrest and conviction. Now instead of frustration, I've got a new job. Concerned citizens, 911 is no longer just for emergencies, but two taggers a day and join the affluent.

Do it....

[Jack Kirkpatrick]

Punishment for graffiti:8,100 hours of community service work seems reasonable for graffiti expungement - that is based on a 40 hour work week and 50 weeks. That is a full time job or the offender can do half the number hours with a "B" in each class in school, minimum of 5 classes.

It takes a full time crew to clean up graffiti and police shouldn't have to clean up by enforcing laws to suppress this problem!

I would add, that any juvenile on probation or adult offenders doing work forlough should complete community service work cleaning up behind this mess. DUI and domestic violence or negotiated pleas offenders should be added to the list...

Let's get serious - courts and the DA's office!

[Free Thinker]

Well citizens, as a former writer I ask you, what exactly is so destructive about graffiti? That you have to clean it? I'm sure you would much rather have you city being a gray, megalithic, slab of wretchedness, but if you actually take the time to stop and read the art, you may learn something about the world. When you see graffiti, you see that person, one way or another, they got theirselves to you, and if they hadn't done that, you would never know who they are. All day long you are bombarded by advertisements by the gurus, the big shots. Staring down at you from their towers making you feel small, making your wife feel inadequate, and do they ever ask for YOUR permission to do these things? You see what they do, and they make money off of you for doing it. Now why is it forbidden for us miniscule specks on the ass end of humanity to present ourself before them? You could get their permission, yes, but that's the same as someone throwing a rock at your head and asking if you could throw it back. Graffiti is the city, it mirrors the true colors. Say what you want about it, but it is self expression, and one teenager showing his potential to the counter culture, he has achieved more than you ever will: Fame, even if that isn't to the public. Most of you assholes speak down on graffiti because it's illegal. Who gives a shit? A federal government is unconstitutional, therefore in the eyes of the forefathers, that is also illegal, but you have all been raised to be the all seeing, all dancing, automatons of the planet, and because some man in a suit tells you something is wrong, you listen. Think for yourself for a change, and make a difference like these children have. It should also be noted that most graffiti artists and their crews are not violent or members of gangs, that's a stereotype. Most gang members hate for artists to write on their turf because it maked them look like they're not in control. Now go on, and enjoy your boring, unnoted life.

[Jack Kirkpatrick]

By your line of reasoning, Free Thinker, you say, "graffiti artists and their crews are not violent or members of gangs. Most gang members hate for artists to write on their turf because it maked [sic] them look like they're not in control." Yet, you are asserting that graffiti [sic] artists should be allowed to assert their own control over community rights.

Artistic control belongs to the owner of buildings and many of those buildings belong to the public domain governed by public law and we also have laws govern personal property. The majority of citizens in our Republic delegate to our legislature the right to pass laws for the public good. In some states, the citizens even have a mechanism to pass laws by initiatives and proposition, if the legislature fails to act in the public's interest. As a graffito artist, you have a right to redress if you think the pubic is wrong or that they should offer a public outlet for your artistic outlet.

Advertisement may be controlled, but you can buy space for a billboard to promote your works. Community bulletin boards are also a good outlet and often free.

Regardless of artistic merit, we have artist open studios, galleries, museums and traveling expositions that can be open to artists - even graffito artists. These are places for the public to read and rave and critique their work. Not all graffiti is destructive, but not all art works are for open public consumption either. That is why there are acceptable outlets to present one's works!

You say our towns and cities are "gray, megalithic, slab]s] of wretchedness," but that is for the public to decide in the appropriate forums - you can use your own slabs as a canvas - your rooms or the exterior of your home to promote your art (look up the "purple house" in Oakland). History has shown we are not one dimensional in our architecture or artistic movements. I think there could be a venue for graffiti - street art is common during fairs and festivals...! Most art is short-lived and destroyed before greatness is recognized.

According to the philosophy of social contract, the rise of clans, tribes... and the nation-state is implied in natural law - we are a community harboring self-protection for the greater good. That is why our forefathers organized a representative democracy from organized states and set up the United States of America. Hippies organized communes and the history of "extraordinary groups and unconventional lifestyles" are quite common in this country.

The countercultures have pushed the envelope , but even then there were boundaries and what was left is represented in the present what is often best. Yet the cost of drug experimentation have resulted in serious additions that have not allowed victims to overcome the consequences. They thought of themselves over the pubic right to community.

You can assume that we have a "boring, unnoted life," but I truly don't really know anyone feeling that way who are engaged in their daily activities even if they are poor. Unfettered graffiti for now is not a matter for the public good and even you can make a judgement on what is worthy or gray or wretched.

[graflife]

Anonymous Bosch wrote:

Graffiti is a fun, exciting, dangerous, and quite addicting way of expressing yourself. The "cost" of "cleaning it up" are grossly overstated. The paint is provded free (call DPW) and graffiti is usually done on abandoned or industrial bldgs where the aesthetics are unimportant to begin with. Graffiti cleaning is a small economy unto itself in most cities, resulting in untold city jobs and benefits to product suppliers. I love seeing fresh graffiti and imagining the kid standing there in the middle of the night risking quite a lot to get their piece up. I respect the nerve it takes and the artistry involved. Even "ugly" graffiti is beautiful to me. Carry on kids! There is a silent mass of fans out here - even old married/family geezers like me.
savs up jcats down

i couldnt agree more im only 13 and ive made my state news for graffiti ha its my life its addicting waaay more than any drug and to me its harmless people just over react to it , its the only way i know how to express myself and because its something society looks down upon people just say stupid shit like '' i hope these kids get raped '' its ridiculous to me and since i dont think anyone except for writers and a few other people who respect it i dont think anyone else will understand it so i think ill just keep bombing
STAY UP!

[San Bruno Resident]

At 13 you should not be taking any drugs including sniffing your paint. Do the exterior of you family's home before reaching out into the neighborhoods.

[dont trip]

kjp wrote:

feel sorry for him come on.he did what he did and he knew it was wrong.all of them need to pay and do time. but will they? if we were able to dig back into their backgrounds im sure this would not be the first time any of them have been caught doing something illegal and nothing has happened to them

f-your sh!t