Third husband is no charmer when he puts down his wife

DEAR ABBY: I was divorced twice before I met my present husband, "Lou." We have been married seven years.

[American worker]

If LW3 thinks that he works for "the man", then he clearly has an attitude. No wonder why nobody takes him seriously. My prediction is that he will go nowhere with that kind of problem.

[not a girl anymore]

LW1, the third time is the charm -- the third divorce, that is. This husband has no respect for you: "She's got you fooled." What the HELL is that? A husband should be proud of his wife. Or maybe he thinks he's humorous -- but didn't you see his loutish ways before you married him?(This type of loudmouth is usually pretty obvious.) Dump him. I don't think you're meant for marriage -- sorry about that. Lots of people aren't.

LW2, "cougar" is an insult. It implies you're an over the hill, desperate feline on the hunt for a young guy to make you feel young again. You and your friends might want to check the mirror and see if you are trying too hard by half to look like young girls with your hair, makeup and dress choices.(It never works, by the way. Just kind of makes the boys laugh.)

[Daria]

LW3 may have that youthful enthusiasm that leads him to believe he has all the answers. Or he might really have all the answers. Either way, welcome to the real world! If you are looking for a job in which you are appreciated and warmly welcomed, try working with the elderly or abused animals. Otherwise, sit down, shut up, do what they tell you, and learn as much as you can instead of trying to "teach".

[****]

Daria wrote:

LW3 may have that youthful enthusiasm that leads him to believe he has all the answers. Or he might really have all the answers. Either way, welcome to the real world! If you are looking for a job in which you are appreciated and warmly welcomed, try working with the elderly or abused animals. Otherwise, sit down, shut up, do what they tell you, and learn as much as you can instead of trying to "teach".

Daria, I was all geared up trying to think about how I was going to word my response to LW3 and now I find you did it for me!!!!

Thanks!

Seriously, there's nothing more obnoxious than a youngling who comes in full of "ideas" without first learning the "facts"

That said, I do think that existing staff can learn from the fresh ideas of new employees.

Anyone who thinks they have nothing to learn is severely limiting himself.

[Ann]

Regarding the "cougar" comments; I've heard 'em all. I'm mid-40s with a fiance 16 years my junior. I believe the comments are simply a sad reflection of the utter sexism that still permeates our society. Any older man with a much younger wife/girlfriend is high-fived and considered a "stud" (while his wife/gf isn't even considered a person; she's a "trophy"). The older woman with a young guy, however, is "desperate"; just plain horny or a "cougar" on the prowl. With my fiance I was none of those things; I certainly wasn't skulking about, trolling for a younger man. He just happened...we met, we clicked and he just happens to be younger. I'd advise other 30-/40-something women to do what i do: just ignore the comments. Don't give the twits that utter them the satisfaction of thinking they matter. There's always gonna be someone out there saying dumb things so just focus on yourself and what makes YOU happy.

[well]

LW3-Ignore these people who are rudely telling you that you are obnoxious, because you aren't. You are working in the corporate world where following long established protocols is expected, not thinking and suggesting new ideas.

However, that is not to say that there isn't a place in this world where your ideas will be appreciated and expected, and not just low paying jobs with elderly and abused animals-that has to be the silliest advice I've read in a long time. You just need to find a job somewhere that some new product, Web site or whatever is being developed. In an environment like that, ideas are what counts, as the facts have not yet been established. You will have a chance to have input into what the facts will be at the ground floor. It can be exciting and rewarding as in a few months or years you will see your ideas bear fruits and make impact on others lives. Good luck!

[Matilda]

LW1--Probably should have nipped that behavior in the bud more than 7 years ago. My normally sweet boyfriend wasn't feeling great one weekend when we visited my sister. He proceeded to put me down in front of her and her friends several times. I don't mind the occasional good-humored jab, and can dish it out when needed, too. But I called him out on it, and he hasn't done it since. When one partner is contstantly putting down another, it makes the other people uncomfortable and makes both partners look bad.

[TTFN]

LW1's husband is exhibiting classic passive-aggressive behavior. When you call him on it, he'll say something like, "I don't know what you are talking about. It was just done to be funny." But it isn't funny. Here's what I did to my p.a. husband many years ago:

I said, "Call it what you want. The behavior is mean. I don't care whether you agree with me or not; I won't tolerate it. So, the next time you do it, I will give you one warning. If you do it again, I will stand up and tell our guests that I'm sorry; you and I have an ongoing disagreement over your rude comments; you knew that if you did it again it would be necessary for me to leave to make a point that the mean and rude comments were unacceptable; so, I need to leave; very sorry for you having to be a part of this, but he was warned. Then, do it. If you're at someone else's house, leave.

At first my husband didn't believe me and he said, "I'll just hide the car keys." I said, I'll take a cab. "I'll take all the money." I'll walk. I don't care what the circumstances are, honey, I...will...walk...out.

Guess what? I had to "warn" him a few times, but never had to walk out. But believe me; I would have. We've been happily married ever since.

[Dienne]

TTFN wrote:

LW1's husband is exhibiting classic passive-aggressive behavior. When you call him on it, he'll say something like, "I don't know what you are talking about. It was just done to be funny." But it isn't funny. Here's what I did to my p.a. husband many years ago:
I said, "Call it what you want. The behavior is mean. I don't care whether you agree with me or not; I won't tolerate it. So, the next time you do it, I will give you one warning. If you do it again, I will stand up and tell our guests that I'm sorry; you and I have an ongoing disagreement over your rude comments; you knew that if you did it again it would be necessary for me to leave to make a point that the mean and rude comments were unacceptable; so, I need to leave; very sorry for you having to be a part of this, but he was warned. Then, do it. If you're at someone else's house, leave.
At first my husband didn't believe me and he said, "I'll just hide the car keys." I said, I'll take a cab. "I'll take all the money." I'll walk. I don't care what the circumstances are, honey, I...will...walk...out.
Guess what? I had to "warn" him a few times, but never had to walk out. But believe me; I would have. We've been happily married ever since.

Congratulations on being "happily married ever since", I guess, but I'm really wondering why you had to go through all that rigamarole and what that really says of your relationship. Seems to me that once you told your husband that his rude comments bother you, he should have stopped immediately - at least, if he actually has any respect for you. The fact that you had to explain yourself, threaten him, and then remind him a few times tells me that maybe he doesn't really take your needs and wishes seriously.

[Rational]

not a girl anymore wrote:

LW1, the third time is the charm -- the third divorce, that is. This husband has no respect for you: "She's got you fooled." What the HELL is that? A husband should be proud of his wife. Or maybe he thinks he's humorous -- but didn't you see his loutish ways before you married him?(This type of loudmouth is usually pretty obvious.) Dump him. I don't think you're meant for marriage -- sorry about that. Lots of people aren't.
LW2, "cougar" is an insult. It implies you're an over the hill, desperate feline on the hunt for a young guy to make you feel young again. You and your friends might want to check the mirror and see if you are trying too hard by half to look like young girls with your hair, makeup and dress choices.(It never works, by the way. Just kind of makes the boys laugh.)

I never thought "cougar" was an insult. Lots of younger men like cougars! I know I did/do. When I was 27 I met a really nice, very beautiful, intelligent Polish girl working out at the small fitness center where I worked (it was a shared fitness center). She and I got to talking and I eventually asked her out. I didn't know she was 37 going on 38! I knew she was older than me but she took care of herself and looked only to be around 33-34. She never got those looks from people. Actually the looks she usually got were dagger stares from much younger women who when they saw her saw how much more beautiful and toned she was and looked better than they in a dress at 37 and 38 then they did at 21, 22. Had a few guys pretty much run into doors looking at her and then grinning at me when we would be dressed up to go out!

[marie s]

lw1 + her hubby are both messes. he clearly is an abuser (emotional) and she needs to DTMFA.

lw2: 38 is hardly a cougar. she passed a group of mo-rons.

lw3: quit corporate america, and do something you really love.

peace.

[marie s]

you and the first commenter are HARSH, and you've got some attitude. this kind of thinking is backwards, and exactly what's wrong w/ corporate america. SO glad I don't work for (or with) you. yecch.

Daria wrote:

LW3 may have that youthful enthusiasm that leads him to believe he has all the answers. Or he might really have all the answers. Either way, welcome to the real world! If you are looking for a job in which you are appreciated and warmly welcomed, try working with the elderly or abused animals. Otherwise, sit down, shut up, do what they tell you, and learn as much as you can instead of trying to "teach".

[rona]

That husband sounds like a piece of work. Maybe the 4th time will be a charm?

[reader1]

Seven years to stay married to an abuser. Yes, that's what he is an abuser. Verbal abuse is quite damaging and should not be tolerated.
AS for the youthful corporate worker, grow up,..."The Man" is your boss, and no matter what, he deserves respect. Show respect and then maybe he will in turn show you respect.
As for the single lady who likes to party, ignore the insults and party to your hearts content.

[Terri at home]

LW1: I don't like to blame people for their failed/failing marriages b/c you never know what has happened in their married life or how the bad times came to be. However, I have my suspicions b/c it's her 3rd marriage and this guy is so out there.

LW2: Cougar is an insult. Just like golddigger is an insult.

LW3: Youthful enthusiasm with solutions can be based on not knowing all the facts. That said, sometimes someone is brilliant and does have very good solutions to problems at work -- whether young or not -- and cannot get heard. It's usually either they are not going through proper channels or they are not working at a place that is right for them.

[Dienne]

Two thoughts on LW3: First, he says he's been working for large companies all along, but it seems like he only has a problem with this company. Maybe it's not so much "the man" as "this job". Not all jobs are a good fit for all people. Maybe it's a personality clash.

But, on the other hand, he says he's a young man and that he's always worked for large "companIES" (emphasis on the plural). If he's that young and he's had that many different jobs, I have to wonder why. In that case, maybe it's not "the man"; maybe it's just you.

I think we need a lot more information about how many other jobs he's had, why he's changed jobs, what the specific situation is at this job, etc. before we can really determine whether the problem is "the man", this job, or him.

[Daria]

[QUOTE who="this kind of thinking is backwards, and exactly what's wrong w/ corporate america. SO glad I don't work for (or with) you. yecch.
<quoted text>[/QUOTE]

I didn't say Corporate America was the ideal. I understand his frustration. But if he's going to choose to work in that kind of environment, he needs to expect frustration, and learn all he can from it. Harsh to me would be the "yecch" comment!

[Angelique]

Three letters from immature individuals. LW1. This woman is on her third marriage and rather than going to therapy to discover why she is 1) on her third marriage; 2) seems to have chosen someone abusive; 3) figure out if there is a pattern in her choice of men, she writes to an advice columnist to get her to agree that yes indeed husband number 3 is abusive. Abby then suggests that the LW behave in a passive aggressive, immature manner by trading insults with her husband in public. This woman needs to get herself to a mental health professional immediately.

LW2. Thirty eight and still going to places frequented by 18 year olds. Hmmmm.....

LW3. Find a different job.

[Maggie]

JimR wrote:

<quoted text>
Watch out girlfriend, you better not say anything about emotional abusers because there are a few of them who think that they run this board. But you will be interested in my website, www.badparents.org . It deals with the roots of emotional abuse and how it continues to plague millions (or is that billions now?) in our wonderful dysfunctional society.

Jim, I'm sorry you were abused as a child, but it's time to get past it. You are so obsessed and tangled up in your childhood, you see everything through that lens. You are giving your parents total control over your life, which is sad - isn't it enough that they ruined your childhood?

[Maggie]

Dienne wrote:

Two thoughts on LW3: First, he says he's been working for large companies all along, but it seems like he only has a problem with this company. Maybe it's not so much "the man" as "this job". Not all jobs are a good fit for all people. Maybe it's a personality clash.
But, on the other hand, he says he's a young man and that he's always worked for large "companIES" (emphasis on the plural). If he's that young and he's had that many different jobs, I have to wonder why. In that case, maybe it's not "the man"; maybe it's just you.
I think we need a lot more information about how many other jobs he's had, why he's changed jobs, what the specific situation is at this job, etc. before we can really determine whether the problem is "the man", this job, or him.

That struck me too - the "companies" he's worked for. No matter what your age, you cannot just come into a company and start telling them how they are doing things wrong - even if you are right. It takes time to learn how to express yourself and really understand why things are done the way they are.