Spinosaurus vs. t-rex
Anonymous Proxy

Manchester, UK

#4323 Dec 18, 2012
6 tonne Sue is comparable to 12 tonne Spinosaurus. 9 tonne Sue is comparable to 18 tonne Spinosaurus (Therrien and Henderson estimated it nearly 21 tonnes).
UCMP 118 742 being huge is based on old growth curves. Two most recent ones state 16 years old is likely 'adult', though it would still have some growing to do, so MOR 008 sized is reasonable.

Choosing between higher estimates for all or the lower ones is subjective, we dont know which is more accurate. I dont like sum-saurs, so I go for the lower ones.

“DoubleTheClaw, DoubleThePain”

Since: Aug 11

Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

#4324 Dec 18, 2012
Anonymous Proxy wrote:
6 tonne Sue is comparable to 12 tonne Spinosaurus. 9 tonne Sue is comparable to 18 tonne Spinosaurus (Therrien and Henderson estimated it nearly 21 tonnes).
UCMP 118 742 being huge is based on old growth curves. Two most recent ones state 16 years old is likely 'adult', though it would still have some growing to do, so MOR 008 sized is reasonable.
Choosing between higher estimates for all or the lower ones is subjective, we dont know which is more accurate. I dont like sum-saurs, so I go for the lower ones.
How could average Spinosaurus weigh twice as much as Sue, T.rex is more robust and probably more muscular and Sue is 12.8 m long, Spinosaurus 13-18m long estimate suggest a 15-16 m estimate would be conservative it's about a 2-3 m difference in length and Tyrannosaurus is proportionately heavier, I don't think an average Spinosaurus weighs twice as much as Sue.
I see a lot of debate in UCMP 118742, it's pretty incomplete I understand, This is the most recent study done on T.rex growth rate that I know: http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/conten...
According to this study T.rex would reach adult hood in between 15-18 years old, UCMP 118742 may have 2 more years to grow or imaybe it's already an adult when it died. Nevertheless UCMP 137538 is still huge and according to the study above MOR 009 has 4-7 more years to grow and it's already 11 m long we all know T.rex gains weight very fast.
Kinky Bulbasaur

Fremont, CA

#4325 Dec 19, 2012
Scale Hartman's Baryonyx or Cristatusaurus (Suchomimus) up to Spinosaurus skull length and they are 16m long ish.
9m Baryonyx = 2t (ignore the fact Baryonyx was longer than this for now), 16m Spinosaurus ~ 11t.
11m Cristatusaurus = 3.5t, 16m Spinosaurus ~ 11t.

So its more like
6 vs 11
9 vs 16.5
But still.
A 12m spinosaurid would have a longer body than Tyrannosaurus (it would have a short tail). A 12m Spinosaurus (based on MSNM V4047) would have a huge body, but very short tail.
Not as robust (although that is based on often gracile sub-adults for Spinosaurus, nothing better we can do though) yes, but bigger overall.
Denser bones too, as Mortimer pointed out sometime ago.

“DoubleTheClaw, DoubleThePain”

Since: Aug 11

Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

#4326 Dec 19, 2012
Baryonyx and Spinosaurus may have different body proportions, the estimate varies depends on the bone used as the cornerstone to scale up.
Person 1

Tallmadge, OH

#4327 Dec 20, 2012
The T. rex was more eguiped for fighting. The T. rex was much moe hevily biult and could get up to 9 tones. The Spinosaurus was lightly built and it was probably unusual to see one over 5 or 6 tones although in some instinces it might have grown larger. The only thing that I could think the spino has that would help him in this situation is it's cerved teeth made for snagging fish and if it would have bit T. rex in the neck it would have been difficult to escape it's grasp and would probably slice important neck muscles in the prosses.

“FAECVS TAVRI”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#4328 Dec 20, 2012
Don't forget that it also had well-equipped claws.

“DoubleTheClaw, DoubleThePain”

Since: Aug 11

Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

#4329 Dec 20, 2012
JMD577 wrote:
Don't forget that it also had well-equipped claws.
which are slung below the body and have a limited range of movement, they couldn't reach the face of T.rex.
tyrannosaurus rex

Chennai, India

#4330 Dec 21, 2012
trex wins 65/35.
Spino Guy

South Africa

#4331 Dec 21, 2012
Carchorodontosaurus would crush both dino's
Spino Guy

South Africa

#4332 Dec 21, 2012
Balaur wrote:
<quoted text>
which are slung below the body and have a limited range of movement, they couldn't reach the face of T.rex.
The arms were high up and if Spinosaurus could force t-rex's head low enough(no time to explain) those claws could take the eye out or if those jaws got locked around the neck of rexy,spino would be able to rap those claws around and twist and break the neck but t-rex would win more likely

“DoubleTheClaw, DoubleThePain”

Since: Aug 11

Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

#4333 Dec 22, 2012
Spino Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
The arms were high up and if Spinosaurus could force t-rex's head low enough(no time to explain) those claws could take the eye out or if those jaws got locked around the neck of rexy,spino would be able to rap those claws around and twist and break the neck but t-rex would win more likely
No theropod had their arms high up except for maybe the Therizinosaur family, Spinosaurus's claws were probably 3-4 feet off the ground based on Baryonyx (well if you don't want to based on Baryonyx Spinosaurus would have no size estimates at all) T.rex were 14-15 ft tall at the hips and 18 ft tall at the top head, Theropod's arms joints aren't flexible so Spinosaurus couldn't raise it's arms up, I don't see how Spinosaurus could force T.rex's head down while the vital target which is the neck and the skull is above T.rex's heigh.
Spino Guy

South Africa

#4334 Dec 22, 2012
Balaur wrote:
<quoted text>
No theropod had their arms high up except for maybe the Therizinosaur family, Spinosaurus's claws were probably 3-4 feet off the ground based on Baryonyx (well if you don't want to based on Baryonyx Spinosaurus would have no size estimates at all) T.rex were 14-15 ft tall at the hips and 18 ft tall at the top head, Theropod's arms joints aren't flexible so Spinosaurus couldn't raise it's arms up, I don't see how Spinosaurus could force T.rex's head down while the vital target which is the neck and the skull is above T.rex's heigh.
Spinosaurus might not have a chance to rexy but put Carchorodontosaurus to the test
Dino-expert2000

Antalya, Turkey

#4335 Dec 24, 2012
Spino guy wrote:
You people speak nonsense.A T-rex only had bacteria in it's mouth when it is a child not adult.
Recent studies have proven that even adult Tyrannosaurus Rex have tons and TONS of bacteria in their mouth. For example, if a Tyrannosaurus Rex bites an Edmontosaurus but it gets away, the Edmonstosaurus would die later because of the bacteria in the infected wound. The same would probably go for Spinosaurus expect if he swam in saltwater. It's a great help against infection.
Dino-expert2000

Antalya, Turkey

#4336 Dec 24, 2012
Recent studies have shown that the sail of Spinosaurus does NOT reduce it's agility or movement, giving it a higher chance of winning. Also, the jaws and teeth of Spinosaurus are designed like a crocodile's meaning that it's jaws are stronger than we think they are. I'm not saying that Spino will win, I'm just trying to make things even!
Crazy Fish

Bournemouth, UK

#4337 Dec 24, 2012
There is nothing special about the teeth of Tyrannosaurus. Not like that anyway.

The modern analogue for the improbable bacteria bite was the VENEMOUS Komodo Dragon. Key words being 'was' and 'VENEMOUS'.

An animal with a multi tonne bite simply does not need dangerous bacteria that takes days to kill. What if the interior of its own jaws were injured? Killed by its own weapon... SOme bacteria would be preent inevitably; we have bacteria in our mouths after all. But as an actual weapon, exclusive to Tyrannosaurus? unlikely.48
TyrantLizardKing

Rotherham, UK

#4338 Dec 28, 2012
If we look at it in a fair prespective, it wouldn't be fair to use the upper bounds of T-rex against the only known estimates of Spino. In all fairness we should assume that the estimates of Spino are liberal and therefore use the liberal T-rex estimates.

Many people are saying that Spino was only a few tonnes heavier than T-rex, however if we actually scale it with it's closest relative Suchomimus we get: 17/11 = 1.54 ^ 3 = 3.69 x 4 tonnes (Suchomimus Holotype)= 14.76 tonnes. This gives Spino a large size advantage.

Spino's bite force is underestimated too. Firstly conical teeth are quite good at withstanding bite force, and Spino would need atleast 1 ton of bite force to pick up Onchopristis. Secondly Spino's mandible is deeper than it's relatives and this would mean a stronger bite force. Dr Sakamoto estimated a 8.5 metre Baryonyx's bite force as 386 kg. Assuming that muscle strength increases as we scale up that would give a 17 metre Baryonyx a bite force of 2025 kg. Accounting Spino's deeper mandible would increase that to about 2.5 tons. Less powerful than the T-rex's but still very capable of killing.

I hope this doesn't sound like a ramble, I am just trying to disprove some false assumptions and trying to balance it out. I think each creature has a chance to kill the other. Around 60/40 to the Spino.If new specimens of Spino are found we could use them to find better liberal estimates but right now all we can do is extrapolate.

Since: Dec 12

New York

#4339 Dec 29, 2012
I forgot to mention that 14 tonne Spino estimate is achieved without using the new method. So if the new method is the correct one it would mean that Spino would be quite a bit heavier, due to the square-cube law
Velcroraptor

Netherlands

#4340 Dec 29, 2012
t-rex is much stronger he wil win all the time becuz he is the king and will always win

also i changed my name from De Man to velcroraptor just so u guys know i dont want u guys to get confused me and de man r de same persn ok

“FAECVS TAVRI”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#4341 Dec 29, 2012
Do you even know the facts about Spinosaurus? And it sickens me when people claim there's a "king" of the dinosaurs. They had no government, they didn't exist all at the same time and place, I don't think any dinosaur saw themselves as rulers or kings. Heck, I'll bet you can find any dinosaur and there'll always be another dinosaur to be a good match for them.

“FAECVS TAVRI”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#4342 Dec 29, 2012
I was talking to Velcroraptor, just to let everybody know.

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