Who Is Allah?

Who Is Allah?

There are 254116 comments on the The Brussels Journal story from Aug 24, 2007, titled Who Is Allah?. In it, The Brussels Journal reports that:

“Allah is a very beautiful word for God. Shouldn't we all say that from now on we will name God Allah? [...] What does God care what we call him?”

From the desk of Soeren Kern on Fri, 2007-08-24 11:56 Europeans love to mock the salience of religion in American society. via The Brussels Journal

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Brussels Journal.

MUQ

Delhi, India

#190628 Sep 29, 2013
Mr. Seeker

So we have covered "Prophet and Like Moses" part of Deut. 18:18.

Now let us see "Amongst their Brethren"...

If any one from open mind reads this phrase, the inclination would be "That the intended person would be not from Jews but some one very closely related to Jews".

Otherwise the straightforward writing should be "From themselves"...

You go all the way to Deut. 17:15 to "prove" that "Their brethren Must mean from Jews"... This is taking extreme views.

Even if you say that "Most direct" meaning of brethren is from Jews, our prophet being from Prophet Ishmael was indeed "from brethren of Jews".

You cannot disqualify him from this prophesy on this ground.

Shall we move on to next phrase of the prophesy?
Eric

Roselle, IL

#190629 Sep 29, 2013
MUQ wrote:
Mr. Seeker
So we have covered "Prophet and Like Moses" part of Deut. 18:18.
Now let us see "Amongst their Brethren"...
If any one from open mind reads this phrase, the inclination would be "That the intended person would be not from Jews but some one very closely related to Jews".
Otherwise the straightforward writing should be "From themselves"...
You go all the way to Deut. 17:15 to "prove" that "Their brethren Must mean from Jews"... This is taking extreme views.
Even if you say that "Most direct" meaning of brethren is from Jews, our prophet being from Prophet Ishmael was indeed "from brethren of Jews".
You cannot disqualify him from this prophesy on this ground.
Shall we move on to next phrase of the prophesy?
How many TRIBES were with Moses in the desert? The answer is 12. Each TRIBE reflected one of the BROTHERS; i.e., sons of Jacob. Since there are 12 Tribes, the prophet will come from one of the brethren; i.e., TRIBES. S/he can't come from all 12 tribes. No where in the Chapter does it refer to Jews. Moses was not technically a Jew. Moses was a Levite. We later find out that the prophet will be of the Tribe of Judah, seed of Jesse. Isaiah 9. Is Muhammad of the seed of Jesse?

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#190630 Sep 29, 2013
MUQ wrote:
Mr. Seeker
So we have covered "Prophet and Like Moses" part of Deut. 18:18.
Now let us see "Amongst their Brethren"...
If any one from open mind reads this phrase, the inclination would be "That the intended person would be not from Jews but some one very closely related to Jews".
Otherwise the straightforward writing should be "From themselves"...
You go all the way to Deut. 17:15 to "prove" that "Their brethren Must mean from Jews"... This is taking extreme views.
Even if you say that "Most direct" meaning of brethren is from Jews, our prophet being from Prophet Ishmael was indeed "from brethren of Jews".
You cannot disqualify him from this prophesy on this ground.
Shall we move on to next phrase of the prophesy?
The question is MUQ why did the Jews reject Muhammad?

JOEL THUMBS UP

Since: May 13

Location hidden

#190631 Sep 29, 2013
Jews reject Jesus and Muhammad as false prophets fit to be stoned to death. LOL.

JOEL THUMBS UP

Since: May 13

Location hidden

#190632 Sep 29, 2013
Nondualism is the exclusive preserve of the highest intellectuals in a mental way and the rarest of individuals experience some degree or the fullest nondualism via the union in conscious-energy of the subject with the object.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#190634 Sep 29, 2013
MUQ wrote:
Mr. Seeker
It does not matter what you care or what I care, our personal choices do not matter.
What scripture says, according to that, the title of Prophet is much more befitting on our prophet and Moses than it is for Jesus.
The title of "Prophet" is vague, and there was not even any mention of the title "Messiah" in the Jewish scriptures yet, so it is easy to see how and why the very vague term of "Prophet" was used, but this could mean anybody, even a Messiah. And all prophets in the Jewish religion have all been Jews. It is highly unlikely that suddenly there would be one and only one Arab prophet when there are no scriptures whatsoever from the descendants of Ishmael until the Quran, assuming we even consider the Quran a scripture, and instead Muhammad had to use scriptures from the Jews. One would think that he could have scriptures from the descendants of Ishmael to use as well, but there were none. That should tell you something right there. Nothing conclusive has been established in this area whatsoever.
MUQ wrote:
For him this is not his main title and only an additional tile.
So that part of Deut. 18:18 is over.
There are no specific titles or names when one uses the very generic term of "prophet" like we find in Isaiah 9:6 or Isaiah 7:14. Prophet can mean any number of things and is a very unspecific title. It's just you making things into the way you need them to be. You pick the criteria and the rules that you think will make it work. That is all that is going on.
MUQ wrote:
Now let us come to the second part of the prophesy, that "He will be like Moses"?
The personalities and actions and achievement of Our prophet and Moses are of same kind than between Moses and Jesus.
Both Moses and our prophet were "Out door" persons and Jesus was an "Insider".
Outdoor person? Insider? Where the heck do you get these arbitrary ideas from?
MUQ wrote:
He sacrificed himself for mankind(according to Christians and as per their scriptures ), than go out and change the world.
Our prophet also showed Miracles,
Not according to the Quran. The Quran says Jesus performed miracles, but Muhammad did not, and this is why many Muslims try to say that the Quran itself is Muhammad's miracle, because they have nothing else to refer to.

They (also) said: "Allah took our promise not to believe in an messenger unless He showed us a sacrifice consumed by Fire (From heaven)." Say: "There came to you messengers before me, with clear Signs and even with what ye ask for: why then did ye slay them, if ye speak the truth?" if you are truthful?

Also 17:90-96, 15:06-8, 13:7. See? I actually use scriptures themselves rather than making up whatever I feel like
MUQ wrote:
but we Muslims do not make so much hue and cry about it like Christians do,
Cry about it? You simply don't mention it because according to the Quran, he did no miracles.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#190635 Sep 29, 2013
MUQ wrote:
and miracles are not the true test for genuinity of a prophet.
Of course not because even the Quran tells us that they asked for signs or miracles from them and Muhammad made excuses instead. And this is why Muslims try to make the Quran itself a miracle, and it is no miracle at all. Maybe if the whole thing was recited in a week or a month, that would be impressive, but the fact that it had to be recited over 23 years, and even sometimes abrogated what it said in the past as circumstances changed, is highly suspicious of Muhammad making whatever Sura was needed as his circumstances unfolded. A perfect example is the changing of the Qibla. That could have and should have been mentioned right up front, but it was not mentioned until Muhammad was finished trying to court the Jews and realized that they had rejected him. And then the very poor excuse of Allah testing them was used to explain this bizarre and abrupt change.
MUQ wrote:
But certainly our prophet showed many miracles and they are recorded in books of Hadith and transmitted in much better form.
Then you are putting the Hadiths before the Quran as the Quran clearly tells us that they wanted miracles from Muhammad before they could believe him, and he could not do that and even clearly said he is merely a messenger.
MUQ wrote:
Perhaps the Best and unique quality of Moses and which distinguished him from all other Jewish prophets is that he was a LAWGIVER.
You can pick whatever qualities you feel like, but it is only your own arbitrary choice to MAKE it work for you. I use the scriptures, and 34 mentioned nothing about that when describing what it is to be like Moses.
MUQ wrote:
No other Jewish prophet was a lawgiver and our prophet was also a lawgiver.
In that way also our prophet is like Moses.
Sure, let's just use whatever qualities suit your argument and ignore that fact that Deuteronomy 34, from the same exact book, did not mention that when describing what is like to be like Moses. And as far as Prophets being law givers, there were many.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/oah/oah/oah05.htm

Now you will say, the only JEWISH Prophet law giver on that list was Moses, and as far as I can tell, that would be correct because Muhammad was not Jewish, just like all of the other prophets listed on that page.
MUQ wrote:
Coming to "minor points"
Who are you to decide what is a minor point and what is not? More manipulation where you dictate what is important and what is not so that it can suit your argument.
MUQ wrote:
also, our prophet matches much more with Moses than Jesus.
You want to pick whatever qualities you feel like to use for the comparison, but if we actually use the scriptures, your arbitrary choice fails.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#190636 Sep 29, 2013
MUQ wrote:
Mr. Seeker
So we have covered "Prophet and Like Moses" part of Deut. 18:18.
Now let us see "Amongst their Brethren"...
If any one from open mind reads this phrase, the inclination would be "That the intended person would be not from Jews but some one very closely related to Jews".
Otherwise the straightforward writing should be "From themselves"...
Then why wasn't "from yourselves" used in 17:15? Notice how you don't ask that question and don't apply your arbitrary rules consistently? You apply them only when you think it suits your argument. Very bad, very subjective, and therefore very illogical. And this is what I have consistently told you that you do, and you still don;'t even realize any problem with doing this.
MUQ wrote:
You go all the way to Deut. 17:15 to "prove" that "Their brethren Must mean from Jews"...
All the way? It's only about 23 verses away.
MUQ wrote:
This is taking extreme views.
No, taking an extreme view is to arbitrarily make up an entirely different meaning for the same exact phrase only a mere 23 or so verses later when the author gives zero indication whatsoever that it means something radically different. Again, you just make up whatever you think will suit your argument, but there is no basis for it. When reading any book or scripture, if the same exact phrase is used in the same exact book, and only a mere 23 or so verses away, then the default conclusion is that the phrase means the same thing both times unless the author indicates otherwise. And this is why the Jews themselves understood it to mean fellow Jews. I am just using Jews as a generic term, but what El Cid mentioned is actually even more accurate.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#190637 Sep 29, 2013
Eric wrote:
<quoted text>
How many TRIBES were with Moses in the desert? The answer is 12. Each TRIBE reflected one of the BROTHERS; i.e., sons of Jacob. Since there are 12 Tribes, the prophet will come from one of the brethren; i.e., TRIBES. S/he can't come from all 12 tribes. No where in the Chapter does it refer to Jews. Moses was not technically a Jew. Moses was a Levite. We later find out that the prophet will be of the Tribe of Judah, seed of Jesse. Isaiah 9. Is Muhammad of the seed of Jesse?
I am just using Jews as a generic term for the sake of argument, but what you mentioned is actually even more accurate. It's still the same point though. Brethren did not mean from the descendants of Ishmael or Arabs or anything like that, and if they thought it meant that, there would have been a great deal of questions from them as all prophets were supposed to come from the "chosen people" and not from a people who were pagans at that time. This is part of what made them the chosen people.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#190638 Sep 29, 2013
JOEL THUMBS UP wrote:
Nondualism is the exclusive preserve of the highest intellectuals in a mental way and the rarest of individuals experience some degree or the fullest nondualism via the union in conscious-energy of the subject with the object.
Thanks for your contribution Joel. I don't know what it is doing on a forum and thread about Islam, rather than a Deepak Chopra forum, but thanks anyway.

Since: May 12

Location hidden

#190639 Sep 29, 2013
JOEL THUMBS UP wrote:
Abraham originated in Kashmir or Ur but later lived in Judah.
Psst at the time of Abraham there was no Judah.

JOEL THUMBS UP

Since: May 13

Location hidden

#190640 Sep 30, 2013
STEFANO COLONNA wrote:
<quoted text>

Psst at the time of Abraham there was no Judah.
LOL.

Somewhere in the region - Canaan...?
El Cid

Saint Albans, WV

#190642 Sep 30, 2013
Is Mohammad a descendant of Ishmael?

http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/ishmae...

Short answer: No.
El Cid

Saint Albans, WV

#190643 Sep 30, 2013
IS MOHAMMED A DESCENDENT OF ISHMAEL?

http://www.religionresearchinstitute.org/Moha...

Excerpt:

Muslims believe that Mohammed is a descendant of Ishmael. As proof of their position, Muslims refer to genealogies written around 770-775 A.D. by Ibn Ishak.

What he has written is simply not true. Ishmaelite tribes, especially the tribe of Nebaioth from which, according to Ibn Ishak, Mohammed is said to have come, were nomadic tribes who lived in the Sinai and Fertile Crescent deserts. These tribes disappeared after the 7th century B.C.

Mohammed's family was a Sabaean Yemeni family, while the Ishmaelites, who lived in the deserts of the Fertile Crescent, became extinct many centuries before Mohammed's family left Yemen.

Historians say that the family of Mohammed was a family which lived in Saba-Yemen. In the 5th century A.D., Qusayy Bin Kilab, the 8th ancestor of Mohammed, gathered an alliance of many Yemeni families forming Quraish, the tribe from which Mohammed later came. These families only came to occupy Mecca in the 5th century A.D. The city of Mecca was built by the tribe of Khuzaa'h in the 4th century A.D.

Mohammed’s family is not connected to any Ishmaelite tribe because Mohammed’s family didn’t leave Yemen until the 5th century A.D., and that’s about 1,100 years after the Ishmaelites disappeared. Mohammed’s tribe could not have lived in the same locations as the Ishmaelite tribes at any time throughout history.
Alex WM

London, UK

#190644 Sep 30, 2013
STEFANO COLONNA wrote:
<quoted text>
Psst at the time of Abraham there was no Judah.
Good one!
Alex WM

London, UK

#190645 Sep 30, 2013
El Cid wrote:
IS MOHAMMED A DESCENDENT OF ISHMAEL?
http://www.religionresearchinstitute.org/Moha...
Excerpt:
Muslims believe that Mohammed is a descendant of Ishmael. As proof of their position, Muslims refer to genealogies written around 770-775 A.D. by Ibn Ishak.
What he has written is simply not true. Ishmaelite tribes, especially the tribe of Nebaioth from which, according to Ibn Ishak, Mohammed is said to have come, were nomadic tribes who lived in the Sinai and Fertile Crescent deserts. These tribes disappeared after the 7th century B.C.
Mohammed's family was a Sabaean Yemeni family, while the Ishmaelites, who lived in the deserts of the Fertile Crescent, became extinct many centuries before Mohammed's family left Yemen.
Historians say that the family of Mohammed was a family which lived in Saba-Yemen. In the 5th century A.D., Qusayy Bin Kilab, the 8th ancestor of Mohammed, gathered an alliance of many Yemeni families forming Quraish, the tribe from which Mohammed later came. These families only came to occupy Mecca in the 5th century A.D. The city of Mecca was built by the tribe of Khuzaa'h in the 4th century A.D.
Mohammed’s family is not connected to any Ishmaelite tribe because Mohammed’s family didn’t leave Yemen until the 5th century A.D., and that’s about 1,100 years after the Ishmaelites disappeared. Mohammed’s tribe could not have lived in the same locations as the Ishmaelite tribes at any time throughout history.
Hey woodworking woodworm of a moron....
Did Abraham suddenly appear out of thin air?
Who were his ancestors?
Here is a clue...
He had Arab relatives....or even better....ANCESTORS!!
Go back to your wood-hole.
Alex WM

London, UK

#190646 Sep 30, 2013
El Cid wrote:
IS MOHAMMED A DESCENDENT OF ISHMAEL?
http://www.religionresearchinstitute.org/Moha...
Excerpt:
Muslims believe that Mohammed is a descendant of Ishmael. As proof of their position, Muslims refer to genealogies written around 770-775 A.D. by Ibn Ishak.
What he has written is simply not true. Ishmaelite tribes, especially the tribe of Nebaioth from which, according to Ibn Ishak, Mohammed is said to have come, were nomadic tribes who lived in the Sinai and Fertile Crescent deserts. These tribes disappeared after the 7th century B.C.
Mohammed's family was a Sabaean Yemeni family, while the Ishmaelites, who lived in the deserts of the Fertile Crescent, became extinct many centuries before Mohammed's family left Yemen.
Historians say that the family of Mohammed was a family which lived in Saba-Yemen. In the 5th century A.D., Qusayy Bin Kilab, the 8th ancestor of Mohammed, gathered an alliance of many Yemeni families forming Quraish, the tribe from which Mohammed later came. These families only came to occupy Mecca in the 5th century A.D. The city of Mecca was built by the tribe of Khuzaa'h in the 4th century A.D.
Mohammed’s family is not connected to any Ishmaelite tribe because Mohammed’s family didn’t leave Yemen until the 5th century A.D., and that’s about 1,100 years after the Ishmaelites disappeared. Mohammed’s tribe could not have lived in the same locations as the Ishmaelite tribes at any time throughout history.
No matter what you do..
You are NOT related to Abraham or Isaac unless you can prove that you are a Semite.
Muhammed PBUH was a Semitic Arab.
You are the outsider and it is quite funny when you defend one semitic family against another while having no claim over either!!
Go back to your hole...gate crasher.
Alex WM

London, UK

#190647 Sep 30, 2013
JOEL THUMBS UP wrote:
Jews reject Jesus and Muhammad as false prophets fit to be stoned to death. LOL.
lol..
If they reject their own brother, what chance has the cousin got?
Alex WM

London, UK

#190648 Sep 30, 2013
Eric wrote:
Alex, help me out on the prophecies of Muhammad. The ones I have heard were all fulfilled in his life time by Muhammad himself. It is not a prophecy in my mind to say you are going to do something and then do it. Can you offer prophecies of Muhammad that were not fulfilled during his life time or soon thereafter by his lifetime acquaintances.
The definition of "prophet" is quite wide.
Holy Prophet Muhammed PBUH is firstly a messenger of God.
I do not subscribe to the idea that God chose only one lot of prophets/messengers from one part of the world to convey the message to the rest of the world forever.
That will be seen as arrogance and elitism!

The ability to perform miracles and to dish out prophecies needs closer scrutiny.
Many conjurers and fake healers do a better job than the so called ancient Prophets.
In the case of "accepted" prophets, there is NO WAY you can prove who said what and if what they said did really happen or when.
I don't see any Prophet saying that something would happen and exactly when and how that something would happen!
Without wishing to challenge the authenticity of many religious books, you will find that most were written after the event claiming to predict the future.

There are claims that Prophet Muhammed prophesied many things but I am no expert in that field.
Quran is a great miracle and many things mentioned there are better than what many prophets have ever said.

Since: May 12

Location hidden

#190649 Sep 30, 2013
JOEL THUMBS UP wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL.
Somewhere in the region - Canaan...?
Psst the biblical Abraham existed before any place was called Judah.

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