Who Is Allah?

There are 220278 comments on the The Brussels Journal story from Aug 24, 2007, titled Who Is Allah?. In it, The Brussels Journal reports that:

“Allah is a very beautiful word for God. Shouldn't we all say that from now on we will name God Allah? [...] What does God care what we call him?”

From the desk of Soeren Kern on Fri, 2007-08-24 11:56 Europeans love to mock the salience of religion in American society. via The Brussels Journal

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Brussels Journal.

Alex123 WM

London, UK

#180100 Jun 16, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Then drop the issue and shut up. I raised the verse that I know and talked about it. If you think it's wrong, don't just say it's wrong, give the right verse. Otherwise you statement is pointless.
Hey sicko, please shut up PDQ.
I refuse to give you free tuition because you are a clueless nutter.
You can do the leg work and get back to me.
If you refuse to go back and do some research, then you can drop the subject and remain clueless.
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Not according to BMZ, so maybe you two should talk it out and come back when you agree on an answer.
Hey sicko, you refuse to understand anything!
BMZ and I have similar views on this and many other issues.
I am not here to prove that BJ is God or if BJ was “physically” present before Abraham, which is a biological impossibility.
Don’t you even understand that?
BJ appeared from the loins of the woman about 2000 years ago and therefore, BJ the earthling was not around before Abraham the earthling!
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you seriously going to attempt this comparison and explanation?
I repeat...BJ the human came out of the female organ of Mary about 2000 years ago and long after Abraham.

Why don’t you use your head instead of your ass…

- Want you to work on this possibility...
Jesus claimed he was the latest prophet of Jews form the line of abraham.
A bit like Leon Spinks' claim after beating the greatest Ali, "He may be the greatest, but I am the latest" or something like that. Any Ali fan who saw the fight would have "stoned" spinks if they could have got away with it.
Alex123 WM

London, UK

#180101 Jun 16, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
First of all, you weren't there, so stop inventing things as though you were.
Second of all, this is from the same book that we are discussing.
John 10:33 “We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied,“but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.”
Hey sicko..
You were not there and the johnnies who cooked up gospel of Johnny were not there either!
So stop inventing things as though you were.
We know how the book was cooked up and you are still clueless about Blasphemy!!

I maintain that BJ could have intimated to the bigoted folks "hey boys! I know you hate me and love Abraham, but I am here as the latest to replace Abraham. Follow me and get educated"

The blood shot eyes of the bigots immediately could have started to look for stones, may be?
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Because Jesus didn't speak the same way that modern people speak. But again, the Jews knew what he was saying, at least according to the story, and the story is what we are talking about as you attempt to say that Jesus never said this and that in the scriptures. You can call the scriptures false or forgeries all you want, but don't claim that these things are not in them.
You talk a load of bullsh*t!
Why are you hell bent on creating a babbling BJ?

Seems nobody understood the idiot, except YOU! LOL…
Why did he bother in the first place!

The point here is…you are quick to jump down the throats of people who experiment with English.

Why then do you accept this grammatical tsunami?
"Before Abraham was born, I am".

WHAT DO YOU THINK IT IS? EXPLAIN MAN.
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Not if I lived back then, and according to the reaction of the Jews, they knew what he was saying.
The Jews knew what he was saying and they rejected him as their prophet. They needed to get rid of BJ who was a nuisance.

If you were among the crowd...won't you point out the GRAMMATICAL error to BJ?
The liars who wrote John have twisted the whole thing.
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
As far as I know, the translation that I gave for Exodus 3:14 is correct and there was a whole tradition of referring to God as "I Am" among the Jews, but since they found it odd or awkward, they sometimes later started to refer to God as "the Lord". But according to the story, which is what we are discussing, they recognized what he was trying to say. And Jesus never once denied it or corrected anybody who attributed divinity to him. That's the part that you don't want to consider.
BMZ has already helped you with Ex 3:14.
But I want you to do more work because you have displayed your ignorance several times already.

I say, you better do more research on exodus 3:14 from Christian and non christian (particularly Jewish) perspectives.
Good mental health.
Alex123 WM

London, UK

#180102 Jun 16, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>Muhammad was an schizo.
He imagined things in his mind and believed their appearance in his mind were real before him face to face.
But no one but Muhammad saw them.
Have you read the Gospels lately?
How many people thought BJ was a nutcase?
Even his family thought that, right?
No run along Shamma.
Alex123 WM

London, UK

#180103 Jun 16, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
How about if you just answer one question that is asked the same way your questions are asked. I think that the Quran should have said these words, if it was the word for word dictation of Allah. "The words of this Quran are my words", or "this Quran is my word for word guidance to you". Like I said, we can certainly piece together that the Quran does represent itself as the word for word dictation of Allah, but where does it say these exact words that I think or demand that it should say? There is no difference in my one question than there is in your sixteen. I can just make up words and demand that a scripture say those exact words just like you are doing.
So your whole attempt is nonsense. All you are doing to to arrange things and questions to your particular liking so that you can prove yourself right. It couldn't be more obvious what you are attempting to do. Hey, if you can demand things to be just the way you want or think they should be, then you will be right every time. I can do that as well, although I don't because it's stupid.
Hey mentally deranged MPD sicko...
Do you refuse to accept that you lack insight?

I have asked you 16 DIRECT simple questions.
Answer them, you twisted fool...
WE NEED DIRECT FACTUAL ANSWERS, instead of giving us 10 page responses.

Just a YES or NO will do, as that is the only acceptable answer.

Also prove your claim by giving us the appropriate Chapter and Verse from the Gospels,(NOT OT or other books):

Did JESUS HIMSELF say any of the following in the Gospels? If so please give chapter and verse from Gospels:

1. "I am God in flesh"…………………………Yes/No

2. "I am God!"…………………………Yes/No
3. "I am THE only begotten son of God"..........Yes/No
4. "I am God in person"..........Yes/No
5. "I am God Incarnate"..........Yes/N o
6. "I am THE Father and Father and I are one and the same person"..........Yes/No
7. "I am made of sin"..........Yes/No
8. "God is a trinity and I am part of that trinity or triune"..........Yes/No
9. "I am your God who came to earth in human form as my own son to die on a Roman cross for the sins of Gentiles or the world or the entire humanity/"..........Yes/N o
10. "Through belief in my unconditional/loving/willing sacrifice as your God in human form as my own son, you can have eternal life"..........Yes/No
11. "Therefore, Worship me and the cross"...Yes/No
12. "Father, ghost and I are co equal, co eternal and consubstantial gods forming a godhead".....Yes/No
13.“I, Jesus, existed before God as Word and I, Jesus, became God”.........Yes/No
14.“Hey Philip! I am THE Father..........Yes/No

Bonus points:
15. "Worship and kiss the cross and get your pope to kiss it, carry it with him and raise it like Moses' serpent".......Yes/No

16.“My mission is not to bring a book, but to die for sins of GENTILES and JEWS”.........Yes/No.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#180104 Jun 16, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing to do with reincarnation. According to the reincarnation belief, only those, who have lived and died on the planet, come back as animals and humans, depending on their past behavior.
I do not accept that hadith. I just quoted it to make a point. If Jesus could have been there, so could have others.
But if you don't accept it, you shouldn't have raised it as answer in the first place. Why would you raise something that you don't even accept yourself? I honestly just don't understand the logic you use sometimes. It's beyond me. It makes no sense.
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
If that hadith says that the sun goes round the earth, please feel free to reject that. Qur'aan does not say that but the Bible does. Right?
I think the Quran DOES say that as well, if you piece together what it is saying, and the Quran asks that you piece it together and even repeats the same things over and over again so that you will. You know that I can provide all of the verses to piece it together, and it becomes pretty obvious when one does.
But the Bible is an inspiration where the inspired wrote their own limited understanding of what was inspired. Most of it says "and then God did or God said", as if an inspired narrator is retelling what happened. But the Quran is supposed to be the literal, word for word dictation of Allah himself and it is written as if there is no narrator and it is Allah speaking himself directly to you. So there is no room for excuses at all. Don't blame me, I didn't decide to set the Quran up this way. And this is the main reason that I simply could not accept the Quran when I read it, because I couldn't even make any excuses or allowances for it like one could make for the Bible, assuming that one even chooses to do so. This is not an unreasonable or hateful response against the Quran, it is all very well explained, logical reasons. If the Quran did not set itself up this way, I could take it a lot more seriously. But it did. Not even in claims that people make about it, but in it's very scripture itself. I was not actually not anti Quran, until I actually read the Quran itself, and while other religious scriptures might be problematic in some ways, I have never seen a scripture that is so easily and clearly provable to be a fraud, simply because of the way it chose to set it self up as.
Alex123 WM

London, UK

#180105 Jun 16, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
But if you don't accept it, you shouldn't have raised it as answer in the first place. Why would you raise something that you don't even accept yourself? I honestly just don't understand the logic you use sometimes. It's beyond me. It makes no sense.
<quoted text>
I think the Quran DOES say that as well, if you piece together what it is saying, and the Quran asks that you piece it together and even repeats the same things over and over again so that you will. You know that I can provide all of the verses to piece it together, and it becomes pretty obvious when one does.
But the Bible is an inspiration where the inspired wrote their own limited understanding of what was inspired. Most of it says "and then God did or God said", as if an inspired narrator is retelling what happened. But the Quran is supposed to be the literal, word for word dictation of Allah himself and it is written as if there is no narrator and it is Allah speaking himself directly to you. So there is no room for excuses at all. Don't blame me, I didn't decide to set the Quran up this way. And this is the main reason that I simply could not accept the Quran when I read it, because I couldn't even make any excuses or allowances for it like one could make for the Bible, assuming that one even chooses to do so. This is not an unreasonable or hateful response against the Quran, it is all very well explained, logical reasons. If the Quran did not set itself up this way, I could take it a lot more seriously. But it did. Not even in claims that people make about it, but in it's very scripture itself. I was not actually not anti Quran, until I actually read the Quran itself, and while other religious scriptures might be problematic in some ways, I have never seen a scripture that is so easily and clearly provable to be a fraud, simply because of the way it chose to set it self up as.
This idiot simply doesn't get it, does he?
and yet he persists on beating his head against brick walls!

I particularly like his last few lines where he says:
"I have never seen a scripture that is so easily and clearly provable to be a fraud,"

- Gospel of John, written by many johnnies who never met Jesus, long after Jesus left?

- The Gospels that have no originals, errrr...all of them?

- Even the copies are not in Aramaic or Hebrew!

I suspect some kinda fraud here...duh!
lol.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#180106 Jun 16, 2013
Alex123 WM wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you read the Gospels lately?
How many people thought BJ was a nutcase?
Even his family thought that, right?
No run along Shamma.
WHAT THE TERM "SON OF GOD" SIGNIFIES

The expression "Son of God", is an analogical term. It indicates origin, a close association, or identification. In Christian theology it describes the relationship of two persons of the triune God.
It expresses an intimate relationship between two persons: God the Father, and God the Son - Jesus the Messiah.

Here are several scriptures illustrating this facet of their relationship:
John 17:5 - "And now Father, glorify me in Your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began."

Here Jesus stated that He was with the Father before the world began.

Colossians 1:13-20 "For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities all things were created by him and for him. He is before all things and in him all things hold together. And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead so that in everything He might have the supremacy. For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him and through him to reconcile to himself all things whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross."

Here, we see the term "Son of God", brought to light: "the image of the invisible God".

Hebrews 1:1-3 "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son whom He appointed heir of all things and through whom He made the universe. The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of His being, sustaining all things by His powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven."

Again, we see the relationship between the Father and the Son disclosed, "the exact representation of His being".

John 1:1-3, 10, 14, 18 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through Him all things were made; without Him, nothing was made that has been made......(10) He was in the world and though the world was made through Him, the world did not recognize Him....(14) The Word became flesh and made His dwelling among us. We have seen His glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father full of grace and truth......(18) No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father's side has made Him known."

John 14:8, 10 "Don't you know me Phillip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, "Show us the Father"? Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me?"

Jesus plainly told Phillip, "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father".
From these verses we see that in Christ, the invisible God is revealed. Jesus was with the Father before the world began. Christ, as God the Son, is the Creator of all things.

God in all His fullness, dwelt in Christ, reconciling the world. We see that Christ, as the Son of God - God's representation, is God manifest and revealed to the world. Angels, prophets, and things can reveal to us something about God.

But God alone can reveal God. It takes God to reveal Himself to mankind. What better way for the eternal revealer to be revealed to mankind on earth than by clothing His self-expresion in human form?





El Cid

Saint Albans, WV

#180107 Jun 16, 2013
Alex123 WM wrote:
<quoted text>
So....worship the spirit and not a naked pagan satan who is oozing off a phallus begging women to bite his raw meat and suck off his fresh bodily juices/blood.
Al-EX the Phallocentric,

Have you ejaculated at the thought, yet?
El Cid

Saint Albans, WV

#180108 Jun 16, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
I gave my reasons for rejecting that God is spirit.
Which proves that you are incapable of deep thought.
yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

#180109 Jun 16, 2013
Alex123 WM wrote:
<quoted text>
This idiot simply doesn't get it, does he?
and yet he persists on beating his head against brick walls!
I particularly like his last few lines where he says:
"I have never seen a scripture that is so easily and clearly provable to be a fraud,"
- Gospel of John, written by many johnnies who never met Jesus, long after Jesus left?
- The Gospels that have no originals, errrr...all of them?
- Even the copies are not in Aramaic or Hebrew!
I suspect some kinda fraud here...duh!
lol.
rabbee: does it really matter what the synagogues of the talking vipers and scorpions, accuses the church of the talking primates, or the church of the talking otter day saints of?

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#180110 Jun 16, 2013
Alex123 WM wrote:
<quoted text>
This idiot simply doesn't get it, does he?
and yet he persists on beating his head against brick walls!
I particularly like his last few lines where he says:
"I have never seen a scripture that is so easily and clearly provable to be a fraud,"
- Gospel of John, written by many johnnies who never met Jesus, long after Jesus left?
- The Gospels that have no originals, errrr...all of them?
- Even the copies are not in Aramaic or Hebrew!
I suspect some kinda fraud here...duh!
lol.
Jesus called Himself the "Son of God" throughout the Gospels,(John 3:16-18), and the disciples also identified Him as the Son of God in their writings,(Rom 1:3).

Further, Jesus identified Himself as God revealed in the flesh,(John 8:58), and His disciples identified Him as God,(John 1:1, Phil 2:5-11). How could Jesus be The Son of God, and God at the same time? What does this term - "Son of God" mean? And if Jesus is the Son, in what way is Jesus God's Son? Did God have physical relations with Mary and get her pregnant?

Many Muslims do not understand what this term, according to Christian theology, actually means. They have asked me these or similar questions. This paper focuses on what the term "Son of God" signifies in Christian theology with respect to Muslim understanding.

MUSLIMS AND THE SON OF GOD
Muhammad, the founder of Islam, misunderstood what the term "Son of God" meant with respect to Christianity. He thought of it only in terms of sexual reproduction, i.e. that God fathered a child through sexual intercourse with Mary. Therefore he spoke out against it.

Christians also reject that God had physical intercourse with Mary, but we understand Christ being God's Son as an analogical term. We believe that the eternal Son of God, one with the Father from all eternity, united to Him in one Spirit, "became flesh and dwelt among us" (John 1:14), and took "the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men" (Philippians 2:7).
We believe in the incarnation of the Son of God.

Muhammad did hear the Christians proclaim Jesus the Messiah as God's Son, but understanding or not, he specifically denied that Jesus was the Son of God.
He said in the Quran,
Sura 2:116 - "They say: "God has begotten a son". Glory be to Him. No, to Him belongs all that is in the heavens and on earth: everything renders worship to Him."

and, Sura 9:30 - "The Christians say the Messiah is the Son of God, that is a saying from their mouths."

Muhammad was unable to distinguish between the Christian belief in Jesus as the Son of God and the Arab Pagan belief in idols as offspring of God, i.e., Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat,(these were idols worshipped around Mecca as daughters of the supreme God - or Allah).

Muhammad misunderstood that Christians in no way consider Jesus - the Son of God, in the same way the Arab Pagans understood their idols.

Muhammad's misconception of the Sonship of Christ is another proof that the Quran was not revealed to him by God, but rather it was built upon Muhammad's own concepts and ideology.

Because of Muhammad's misunderstanding, Islam places limits on God's power.
In view of this, a Christian writer commented that "to assert that God has no Son because He has no wife is like saying that God is not living because He does not draw breath." Daniel, "Islam and the West, p.182.

It is not that Muhammad didn't understand how Jesus is Gods Son, Its that Muhammad was a power seeker.
He wanted his own kingdom and sought an empire of his own.

To the ignorant pagan Arabs that followed Muhammad money and wealth meant more to them then God could visibly offer to them by prayer and worship.



bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#180111 Jun 16, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>Muhammad was an schizo.
He imagined things in his mind and believed their appearance in his mind were real before him face to face.
But no one but Muhammad saw them.
The sense of the text "Before Abraham was I am", which is to be understood of the deity, eternity, and immutability of Christ, and refers to the passage in Exodus 3:14. "I am that I-am--I am hath sent me unto you", the true Jehovah;
and so Christ was before Abraham was in being, the everlasting I am, the eternal God, which is, and was, and is to come: he appeared in an human form to our first parents before Abraham was, and was manifested as the Mediator, Saviour, and living Redeemer, to whom all the patriarchs before Abraham looked,
and by whom they were saved:
He was concerned in the creation of all things out of nothing, as the efficient cause thereof; he was set up from everlasting as Mediator; and the covenant of grace was made with him, and the blessings and promises of it were put into his hands before the world began;
The eternal election of men to everlasting life was made in him before the foundation of the world; and he had a glory with his Father before the world was; yea, from all eternity he was the Son of God, of the same nature with him, and equal to him; and his being of the same nature proves his eternity, as well as deity, that he is from everlasting to everlasting God; and is what he ever was, and will be what he now is: he is immutable, the same today, yesterday, and for ever; in his nature, love, grace, and fulness, he is the invariable and unchangeable I am.[God]
Shamma,

This is nothing but a pile of loose horse shit. Insane and deranged men came up with all that nonsense and incoherence.

Look at the bullshit you wrote: "and so Christ was before Abraham was in being, the everlasting I am, the eternal God,"

If Jesus were the everlasting God, then there was no need for a stupid Son. I can't accept the above hocus pocus. It is bull shit.

Tell me how any sensible person can accept all the rubbish and garbage written about Jesus?
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#180112 Jun 16, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus called Himself the "Son of God" throughout the Gospels,(John 3:16-18), and the disciples also identified Him as the Son of God in their writings,(Rom 1:3).
Further, Jesus identified Himself as God revealed in the flesh,(John 8:58), and His disciples identified Him as God,(John 1:1, Phil 2:5-11). How could Jesus be The Son of God, and God at the same time? What does this term - "Son of God" mean? And if Jesus is the Son, in what way is Jesus God's Son? Did God have physical relations with Mary and get her pregnant?
Many Muslims do not understand what this term, according to Christian theology, actually means. They have asked me these or similar questions. This paper focuses on what the term "Son of God" signifies in Christian theology with respect to Muslim understanding.
MUSLIMS AND THE SON OF GOD
Muhammad, the founder of Islam, misunderstood what the term "Son of God" meant with respect to Christianity. He thought of it only in terms of sexual reproduction, i.e. that God fathered a child through sexual intercourse with Mary. Therefore he spoke out against it.
Christians also reject that God had physical intercourse with Mary, but we understand Christ being God's Son as an analogical term. We believe that the eternal Son of God, one with the Father from all eternity, united to Him in one Spirit, "became flesh and dwelt among us" (John 1:14), and took "the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men" (Philippians 2:7).
We believe in the incarnation of the Son of God.
Muhammad did hear the Christians proclaim Jesus the Messiah as God's Son, but understanding or not, he specifically denied that Jesus was the Son of God.
He said in the Quran,
Sura 2:116 - "They say: "God has begotten a son". Glory be to Him. No, to Him belongs all that is in the heavens and on earth: everything renders worship to Him."
and, Sura 9:30 - "The Christians say the Messiah is the Son of God, that is a saying from their mouths."
Muhammad was unable to distinguish between the Christian belief in Jesus as the Son of God and the Arab Pagan belief in idols as offspring of God, i.e., Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat,(these were idols worshipped around Mecca as daughters of the supreme God - or Allah).
Muhammad misunderstood that Christians in no way consider Jesus - the Son of God, in the same way the Arab Pagans understood their idols.
Muhammad's misconception of the Sonship of Christ is another proof that the Quran was not revealed to him by God, but rather it was built upon Muhammad's own concepts and ideology.
Because of Muhammad's misunderstanding, Islam places limits on God's power.
In view of this, a Christian writer commented that "to assert that God has no Son because He has no wife is like saying that God is not living because He does not draw breath." Daniel, "Islam and the West, p.182.
It is not that Muhammad didn't understand how Jesus is Gods Son, Its that Muhammad was a power seeker.
Another pile of Horse Shit covered with Bull Shit!

Jesus never called himself the Son of God. How dare you lie?

Every time it was suggested to him if he were the Son of God, he did not acknowledge. The best testimony comes from Satan.

Satan asked him twice, "if you are the son of God........." but Jesus never said, "Yes, my dear Satan, I am!"

When the high priest was alleged to have asked, "Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.",
he did not confirm that he was the Son of God. Instead he used the term 'Son of Man", which simply means man. In other words he was telling them that tehy will see the man coming back.

You are the Son of man. I am the Son of Man. Son of Man does NOT mean Son of God.

And that silly question "Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.", is so absurd that no one can believe a high priest to add "the son of God" to the word Messiah.

That is why we keep asking you questions such as "Where and when did Jesus say that he was this and that.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#180113 Jun 16, 2013
@ Shamma

Hello, Son of Man

If you have any further questions, please ask and yours truly, the Son of Man will surely answer.

In the above sentence, I am the Son of Man.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#180114 Jun 16, 2013
El Cid wrote:
<quoted text>Which proves that you are incapable of deep thought.
Please think hard and deep. I gave very good reasons.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Singapore

#180115 Jun 16, 2013
Shamma wrote:
In Christian theology it describes the relationship of two persons of the triune God.
It expresses an intimate relationship between two persons: God the Father, and God the Son - Jesus the Messiah.
Here are several scriptures illustrating this facet of their relationship:
John 17:5 - "And now Father, glorify me in Your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began."
Here Jesus stated that He was with the Father before the world began.
Colossians 1:13-20 "For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins. He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities all things were created by him and for him. He is before all things and in him all things hold together. And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead so that in everything He might have the supremacy. For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him and through him to reconcile to himself all things whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross."
Here, we see the term "Son of God", brought to light: "the image of the invisible God".
Hebrews 1:1-3 "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son whom He appointed heir of all things and through whom He made the universe. The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of His being, sustaining all things by His powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven."
Again, we see the relationship between the Father and the Son disclosed, "the exact representation of His being".
John 1:1-3, 10, 14, 18 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through Him all things were made; without Him, nothing was made that has been made......(10) He was in the world and though the world was made through Him, the world did not recognize Him....(14) The Word became flesh and made His dwelling among us. We have seen His glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father full of grace and truth......(18) No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father's side has made Him known."
John 14:8, 10 "Don't you know me Phillip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, "Show us the Father"? Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me?"
Jesus plainly told Phillip, "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father".
From these verses we see that in Christ, the invisible God is revealed. Jesus was with the Father before the world began. Christ, as God the Son, is the Creator of all things.
Edited your useless junk and stuff a little for brevity.

We have already dismissed "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God." as a 15th Century forgery, which has now become a fasle truth in Christendom.

And we have also quoted from John Wycliffe's first translation in English in the later part of the 14th Century, which can be read here:

"CAP 1

1 In the bigynnyng was the word, and the word was at God, and God was the word.

2 This was in the bigynnyng at God.

3 Alle thingis weren maad bi hym, and withouten hym was maad no thing, that thing that was maad.

4 In hym was lijf, and the lijf was the liyt of men; and the liyt schyneth in derknessis,

5 and derknessis comprehendiden not it. "

It is all about God. No Jesus and no Word in there.
MUQ

Jubail, Saudi Arabia

#180116 Jun 16, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>You are dumb like your prophet Muhammad.
All Beings have the Spirit substance of God in them.
It is the Spirit of God that gives life to the spirit and soul of man.
We are made in the Spirit image of God by the Spirit of God.
We all have the spirit substance of God in us that sustains our human life.
You Muslims are dumb bells.
You all deserve to go to hell for being so stupid.
Every human has a soul and no one knows exactly what it is.

In Quran it is said "Soul (or spirit) is a command of God and you have been given little knowledge about it".

Holy Spirit on the other hand is a very specific identity, which has been told in Quran to perform certain commands from God.

So do not be confused and put your own logic into it.

That is where you bring Paul's logic into Quran.

You are confused as usual and try to muddle the clear Quranic message also.

No creation of God has any "part" of God into them. Creator and Creations are separate from each other.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#180117 Jun 16, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
Shamma,
This is nothing but a pile of loose horse shit. Insane and deranged men came up with all that nonsense and incoherence.
Look at the bullshit you wrote: "and so Christ was before Abraham was in being, the everlasting I am, the eternal God,"
If Jesus were the everlasting God, then there was no need for a stupid Son. I can't accept the above hocus pocus. It is bull shit.
Tell me how any sensible person can accept all the rubbish and garbage written about Jesus?
You need to wake up Muslim!
Your pagan jinn devil moon god is not a real God.
Jesus before the world existed was concerned in the creation of the world and knew you even before Adam was created out of the dust of the earth.

God the Father choose to reveal him self to us through His eternal Spirit Son Jesus Christ.

You are without reason of the mind.
If God only wanted worship of Him He would have just continued to create angels,
But God wanted to have a relationship with man along with worship of Him by out of mans own love for God.

You are an Muslim intellectual moron.
You keep trying to shove Muhammad's non-existence pagan moon god bull-shit.

You have the mind Muslim of a wolf savage dog.

God never said to anyone not to not take Jews and Christians as friends.
yehoshooah adam

Denver, CO

#180118 Jun 16, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Every human has a soul and no one knows exactly what it is.
In Quran it is said "Soul (or spirit) is a command of God and you have been given little knowledge about it".
Holy Spirit on the other hand is a very specific identity, which has been told in Quran to perform certain commands from God.
So do not be confused and put your own logic into it.
That is where you bring Paul's logic into Quran.
You are confused as usual and try to muddle the clear Quranic message also.
No creation of God has any "part" of God into them. Creator and Creations are separate from each other.
rabbee: well the quran is not, the word of G-D. only TheTorah, is TheWord of G-D. everything else is the words of fallible men, or from subtle talking critters of the fields. and i do not trust Paools editor, any more than i don't trust yours.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#180119 Jun 16, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
Another pile of Horse Shit covered with Bull Shit!
Jesus never called himself the Son of God. How dare you lie?
Every time it was suggested to him if he were the Son of God, he did not acknowledge. The best testimony comes from Satan.
Satan asked him twice, "if you are the son of God........." but Jesus never said, "Yes, my dear Satan, I am!"
When the high priest was alleged to have asked, "Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.",
he did not confirm that he was the Son of God. Instead he used the term 'Son of Man", which simply means man. In other words he was telling them that tehy will see the man coming back.
You are the Son of man. I am the Son of Man. Son of Man does NOT mean Son of God.
And that silly question "Tell us if you are the Messiah, the Son of God.", is so absurd that no one can believe a high priest to add "the son of God" to the word Messiah.
That is why we keep asking you questions such as "Where and when did Jesus say that he was this and that.
You have the mind set Muslim of a wild savage dog.
You are blind to the teachings of Jesus Christ.

John 10:30-33, What made the Jews want to kill Jesus?

"I and the Father are one." 31The Jews took up stones again to stone Him.
32Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?"
33The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God," (John 10:30-33)

What was it that Jesus had said or done that caused the Jews to say that He was claiming to be God? Was it "I and the Father are one"?

If so, why would that cause the Jews to want to kill Jesus? Perhaps it was something else. Maybe it was something Jesus said elsewhere that made them so angry.

There are only two places in John where the Jews wanted to kill Jesus with stones. Both of these occur after Jesus spoke and made a claim about Himself. The first was in John 8:58-59 and the second was in John 10:30-33.

Here is the context of both verses:
1.John 8:56-59 "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad." 57The Jews therefore said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?" 58Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." 59Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself, and went out of the temple."

2.John 10:27-36, "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; 28and I give eternal life to them, and they shall never perish; and no one shall snatch them out of My hand.

29"My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. 30"I and the Father are one." 31The Jews took up stones again to stone Him.

32Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?" 33The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God." 34Jesus answered them, "Has it not been written in your Law,'I said, you are gods'?

35"If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), 36do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world,'You are blaspheming,' because I said,'I am the Son of God'?"

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