Who Is Allah?

Who Is Allah?

There are 256489 comments on the The Brussels Journal story from Aug 24, 2007, titled Who Is Allah?. In it, The Brussels Journal reports that:

“Allah is a very beautiful word for God. Shouldn't we all say that from now on we will name God Allah? [...] What does God care what we call him?”

From the desk of Soeren Kern on Fri, 2007-08-24 11:56 Europeans love to mock the salience of religion in American society. via The Brussels Journal

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Brussels Journal.

HughBe

Kingston, Jamaica

#158819 Jan 16, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
"many of my rabbis"?
do you realize what a frothing at the mouth lunatic you sound?
HughBe --I regard your habits and that of many of your rabbis as nastiness and not sex.

Frijoles--"many of my rabbis"?

HughBe--- YES. It is my understanding that homosexuality is generally supported by Judaism and that speaks to the rabbis, and their teachings.
Why would they teach and support a behaviour that they deem wrong?

They see nothing wrong with it and so why would they not indulge?

Who teaches the flock of Judahites that the bible does not speak against women eating and SERVICING each other? RABBIS? why?

Frijoles--do you realize what a frothing at the mouth lunatic you sound?

HughBe--- No. Explain it to me and integrate it with your answers to my previous comments and questions.
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158820 Jan 16, 2013
bmz wrote:
Jesus wanted to make a man out of Mary. That was not reported by the four but others did.
You refer to the gnostic Gospel of Thomas that was REJECTED by the Church as unworthy of inclusion in the Canon for obvious reasons that somehow escape you...

See: http://gnosis.org/naghamm/gthlamb.html
Also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_Thomas

It begins: "These are the secret sayings which the living Jesus spoke and which Didymos Judas Thomas wrote down."

Yeah, right.

Verse 114 in this compilation of gnostic rubbish (and probably your favorite) reads as follows:

Simon Peter said to him, "Let Mary leave us, for women are not worthy of life."
Jesus said, "I myself shall lead her in order to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman who will make herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven."

Other ridiculous verses of special note:

(105) Jesus said, "He who knows the father and the mother will be called the son of a harlot."

(100) They showed Jesus a gold coin and said to him, "Caesar's men demand taxes from us."
He said to them, "Give Caesar what belongs to Caesar, give God what belongs to God, and give me what is mine."
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158821 Jan 16, 2013
(67) Jesus said, "If one who knows the all still feels a personal deficiency, he is completely deficient."

(60) <They saw> a Samaritan carrying a lamb on his way to Judea. He said to his disciples, "That man is round about the lamb."
They said to him, "So that he may kill it and eat it."
He said to them, "While it is alive, he will not eat it, but only when he has killed it and it has become a corpse."
They said to him, "He cannot do so otherwise."
He said to them, "You too, look for a place for yourself within repose, lest you become a corpse and be eaten."

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158822 Jan 16, 2013
SamBee wrote:
<quoted text>
Where in the Scriptures is it evil to know them? If your saying know them was not sexual.
The account — told in Genesis 19.4-11, and repeated in Judges 19.22 — in a nutshell goes thus: Lot decided to settle in Sodom, a city reputed to be as wicked as its neighbour, Gomorrah. In order to determine the truth of this reputation, God sent two angels to investigate. These two foreign travellers were met at the gate of the city by Lot, and they accepted his hospitable invitation to sojourn at his home. That night the inhabitants of Sodom clamoured round Lot's house, pounding on his door and demanding: "Bring the visitors out unto us, that we may know them." Lot refused to comply with this "evil" request, and instead offered them his two daughters.
never said know wasnt sexual, hence my funny business remark

the question I posed wayback is what was the sin of sodom?
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158823 Jan 16, 2013
(50) Jesus said, "If they say to you,'Where did you come from?', say to them,'We came from the light, the place where the light came into being on its own accord and established itself and became manifest through their image.' If they say to you,'Is it you?', say,'We are its children, we are the elect of the living father.' If they ask you,'What is the sign of your father in you?', say to them,'It is movement and repose.'"

(37) His disciples said, "When will you become revealed to us and when shall we see you?"
Jesus said, "When you disrobe without being ashamed and take up your garments and place them under your feet like little children and tread on them, then will you see the son of the living one, and you will not be afraid"

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158824 Jan 16, 2013
HughBe wrote:
<quoted text>
HughBe --I regard your habits and that of many of your rabbis as nastiness and not sex.
Frijoles--"many of my rabbis"?
HughBe--- YES. It is my understanding that homosexuality is generally supported by Judaism and that speaks to the rabbis, and their teachings.
Why would they teach and support a behaviour that they deem wrong?
They see nothing wrong with it and so why would they not indulge?
Who teaches the flock of Judahites that the bible does not speak against women eating and SERVICING each other? RABBIS? why?
Frijoles--do you realize what a frothing at the mouth lunatic you sound?
HughBe--- No. Explain it to me and integrate it with your answers to my previous comments and questions.
If I understand you correctly, you are mad at some rabbis because they are not as homophobic as you.

that is really sad - why not live and let be.
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158825 Jan 16, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
never said know wasnt sexual, hence my funny business remark
the question I posed wayback is what was the sin of sodom?
What was the Sin of Sodom and Gomorrah?
http://www.str.org/site/News2...

In short, homosexual conduct.

Excerpt: The Mosaic Law has two explicit citations on homosexuality. Leviticus 18:22 says, "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female. It is an abomination [toebah]." Leviticus 20:13 says, "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act [toebah]. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood guiltiness is upon them."
HughBe

Kingston, Jamaica

#158826 Jan 16, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
If I understand you correctly, you are mad at some rabbis because they are not as homophobic as you.
that is really sad - why not live and let be.
You have understood nothing, as usual.

Try again.

Why would they/rabbis teach and support a behaviour that they deem wrong?

They see nothing wrong with it and so why would they not indulge?

Who teaches the flock of Judahites that the bible does not speak against women eating and SERVICING each other? RABBIS. why?

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158827 Jan 16, 2013
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>What was the Sin of Sodom and Gomorrah?
http://www.str.org/site/News2...
In short, homosexual conduct.
Excerpt: The Mosaic Law has two explicit citations on homosexuality. Leviticus 18:22 says, "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female. It is an abomination [toebah]." Leviticus 20:13 says, "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act [toebah]. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood guiltiness is upon them."
Thats one interpretation - and from Christian tradition

One of the common Jewish interpretations notes thematic continuity of an earlier theme - that of hospitality, as represented by Abraham and the three angels.

What I was calling attention to was that nowhere in the primary text of that series of passages does it call homosexuality as an abomination, or even a sin. And as we know, the term sodomite (meaning one who does anal intercourse), isnt even in the narrative.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158828 Jan 16, 2013
HughBe wrote:
<quoted text>
You have understood nothing, as usual.
Try again.
Why would they/rabbis teach and support a behaviour that they deem wrong?
They see nothing wrong with it and so why would they not indulge?
Who teaches the flock of Judahites that the bible does not speak against women eating and SERVICING each other? RABBIS. why?
Straw argument. I never said what behavior the rabbis supported - what I was asking was what the sin of sodomy was. I.E. what is the lesson of the passage.

You are getting confused, partly because, within these posts, I am also straying into the issue of homophobia.
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158829 Jan 16, 2013
Meanwhile, in "There is no compulsion in religion" Egypt,

Egyptian court sentences Christian family to 15 years for converting from Islam
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/01/16/egypt...

The 15-year prison sentence given to a woman and her seven children by an Egyptian court for converting to Christianity is a sign of things to come, according to alarmed human rights advocates who say the nation's Islamist government is bad news for Christians in the North African country.

A criminal court in the central Egyptian city of Beni Suef meted out the shocking sentence last week, according to the Arabic-language Egyptian paper Al-Masry Al-Youm. Nadia Mohamed Ali, who was raised a Christian, converted to Islam when she married Mohamed Abdel-Wahhab Mustafa, a Muslim, 23 years ago. He later died, and his widow planned to convert her family back to Christianity in order to obtain an inheritance from her family. She sought the help of others in the registration office to process new identity cards between 2004 and 2006. When the conversion came to light under the new regime, Nadia, her children and even the clerks who processed the identity cards were all sentenced to prison.

Samuel Tadros, a research fellow at Hudson Institute's Center for Religious Freedom, said conversions like Nadia's have been common in the past, but said Egypt's new Sharia-based constitution "is a real disaster in terms of religion freedom.”
...
said Jordan Sekulow, executive director of the American Center for Law and Justice. "This is another tragic case that underscores the growing problem of religious intolerance in the Muslim world. To impose a prison sentence for a family because of their Christian faith sadly reveals the true agenda of this new government: Egypt has no respect for international law or religious liberty.”
__________
Qur'an:9:29 "Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission."

Qur'an:8:39 "Fight them until all opposition ends and all submit to Allah."

Qur'an 5:10 "Those who reject, disbelieve and deny Our signs, proofs and verses will be companions of Hell-Fire."

Qur'an 5:51 "Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends."

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158830 Jan 16, 2013
HughBe wrote:
<quoted text>
You have understood nothing, as usual.
Try again.
Why would they/rabbis teach and support a behaviour that they deem wrong?
They see nothing wrong with it and so why would they not indulge?
Who teaches the flock of Judahites that the bible does not speak against women eating and SERVICING each other? RABBIS. why?
Being that you wont admit the apparent,

I am more than willing to move on....

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158831 Jan 16, 2013
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>What was the Sin of Sodom and Gomorrah?
http://www.str.org/site/News2...
In short, homosexual conduct.
Excerpt: The Mosaic Law has two explicit citations on homosexuality. Leviticus 18:22 says, "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female. It is an abomination [toebah]." Leviticus 20:13 says, "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act [toebah]. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood guiltiness is upon them."
In case you missed the nuance, I was referring to genesis, not leviticus.

The after the fact interpretations note the obvious, i.e. those passages from leviticus. But if you go back to the passage in genesis that Huggy is hung up on, there are several negative behaviors by the people of sodom (rape, incest, violence, inhospitality), and someone looking at the passage from a less homophobic lens might just as easily note the other negative behaviors just as well as THE cardinal sin that pushed the community over the edge.

Honestly, I dont know why some of the people on this forum cant get this. I guess homophobia has deep roots.

Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158832 Jan 16, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Thats one interpretation - and from Christian tradition
One of the common Jewish interpretations notes thematic continuity of an earlier theme - that of hospitality, as represented by Abraham and the three angels.
What I was calling attention to was that nowhere in the primary text of that series of passages does it call homosexuality as an abomination, or even a sin. And as we know, the term sodomite (meaning one who does anal intercourse), isnt even in the narrative.
Leviticus 18:22 and Leviticus 20:13 are from Hebrew tradition, and they clearly call homosexuality, as in a man lying with another man as he would with a woman, an abomination that "surely" will be punished with death for the two offenders.

The link that I posted explores the "hospitality" argument, and rejects it as a dodge. To conclude that Sodom and Gomorrah are burned to the ground with all of their resident men, women, and children incinerated because some louts were inhospitable to Lot's angellic visitors, is absurdly insulting to YHWH!

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158833 Jan 16, 2013
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>Leviticus 18:22 and Leviticus 20:13 are from Hebrew tradition, and they clearly call homosexuality, as in a man lying with another man as he would with a woman, an abomination that "surely" will be punished with death for the two offenders.
The link that I posted explores the "hospitality" argument, and rejects it as a dodge. To conclude that Sodom and Gomorrah are burned to the ground with all of their resident men, women, and children incinerated because some louts were inhospitable to Lot's angellic visitors, is absurdly insulting to YHWH!
But, many, if not most Jews, consider that article a dodge. It doesnt add any new evidence to the issue.

Its a matter of interpretation and opinion
HughBe

Kingston, Jamaica

#158834 Jan 16, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Straw argument. I never said what behavior the rabbis supported - what I was asking was what the sin of sodomy was. I.E. what is the lesson of the passage.
You are getting confused, partly because, within these posts, I am also straying into the issue of homophobia.
Rephrased questions for your benefit.

1. Do your rabbis support homosexuality?
2. Do your rabbis think that homosexuality is wrong?
3. Do your rabbis teach that Lesbian sex is not condemned in scriptures?

Original questions below.

Why would they/rabbis teach and support a behaviour that they deem wrong?
They see nothing wrong with it and so why would they not indulge?
Who teaches the flock of Judahites that the bible does not speak against women eating and SERVICING each other? RABBIS. why?

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#158835 Jan 16, 2013
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>Leviticus 18:22 and Leviticus 20:13 are from Hebrew tradition, and they clearly call homosexuality, as in a man lying with another man as he would with a woman, an abomination that "surely" will be punished with death for the two offenders.
!
and there are passages that also call incest, rape, violence, and inhospitality wrong as well.

We are back to the shellfish vs homosexuality issue. Which is a "worse" prohibition to violate? Its a matter of what you want to dwell on.
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158836 Jan 16, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
and there are passages that also call incest, rape, violence, and inhospitality wrong as well.
We are back to the shellfish vs homosexuality issue. Which is a "worse" prohibition to violate? Its a matter of what you want to dwell on.
How about we dwell on what actually necessitated YHWH incinerating Sodom and Gomorrah? My guess is that it wasn't a flagrant and enduring violation of the shellfish prohibition. Umm, is that a capital offense?
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158837 Jan 16, 2013
"Father, forgive me, I ate shellfish."

"Did you enjoy it?"
Buford

Scott Depot, WV

#158838 Jan 16, 2013

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