Who Is Allah?

Aug 24, 2007 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Brussels Journal

“Allah is a very beautiful word for God. Shouldn't we all say that from now on we will name God Allah? [...] What does God care what we call him?”

From the desk of Soeren Kern on Fri, 2007-08-24 11:56 Europeans love to mock the salience of religion in American society. via The Brussels Journal

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bmz

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#158396
Jan 11, 2013
 
STEFANO COLONNA wrote:
<quoted text>
Where does the Quran say explicitly that?

I've found this verse on Quran 7:11

And We have certainly created you,[O Mankind], and given you [human] form. Then We said to the angels, "Prostrate to Adam"; so they prostrated, except for Iblees. He was not of those who prostrated.

It implies Iblis was an angel, being the order given to angels.

Less matter if it was angel or a devil, the fact that such beings disobey to their god is silly and should be put together with tales since there is no difference between tales and those stories.
How come you could not find the verse, which says that Iblis was of the Jinns or from the Jinns?

Try again and keep reading.!

““You must not lose faith ”

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#158397
Jan 11, 2013
 
rabbee yehoshooah adam wrote:
<quoted text>
rabbee: the letter j, did not even exist. untill after, the 10th century. kinda sounds like your, research material is in error.
otherwise is must write it as: diiux or dzux, which would both not represent the sound.
Romans (thanks Buford) would make -ii sound like | j|.
It's nothing to do with how jews named or precieved themselves.
(has anything ever since christianity became the vogue)

““You must not lose faith ”

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#158398
Jan 11, 2013
 
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>The Wise Guys.
Whot? The mob came into town?
or is this another band i should know?
bmz

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#158399
Jan 11, 2013
 
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>Braindead Muslim Zealot,
It wasn't Jesus who threatened anyone with eternal damnation. He rather warned of possible nasty outcomes for certain behaviors that persisted till death, but drawing a careful distinction like this doesn't serve your thoughtless agenda.
My point was that Jesus acknowledged eternal damnation and introduced it. He acknowledged because he believed in HELL!
bmz

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#158400
Jan 11, 2013
 
SamBee wrote:
<quoted text>
The Quran, in many citations, portrays Satan or Iblis as an angel:
And (remember) when We said to the angels: "Prostrate yourselves before Adam." And they prostrated except Iblis (Satan), he refused and was proud and was one of the disbelievers (disobedient to Allah). S. 2:34
And (remember) when your Lord said to the angels: "I am going to create a man (Adam) from sounding clay of altered black smooth mud. So, when I have fashioned him completely and breathed into him (Adam) the soul which I created for him, then fall (you) down prostrating yourselves unto him." So, the angels prostrated themselves, all of them together. Except Iblis (Satan),- he refused to be among the prostrators. S. 15:28-31
And (remember) when We said to the angels: "Prostrate yourselves to Adam." They prostrated (all) except Iblis (Satan), who refused. S. 20:116
(Remember) when your Lord said to the angels: "Truly, I am going to create man from clay". So when I have fashioned him and breathed into him (his) soul created by Me, then you fall down prostrate to him." So the angels prostrated themselves, all of them: Except Iblis (Satan) he was proud and was one of the disbelievers. S. 38:71-74
The natural reading of the above texts is to see Satan as an angel who refused to obey Allahs order to worship Adam. The following passage brings out this point even more clearly:
And surely, We created you (your father Adam) and then gave you shape (the noble shape of a human being), then We told the angels, "Prostrate to Adam", and they prostrated, except Iblis (Satan), he refused to be of those who prostrate.(Allah) said: "What prevented you (O Iblis) that you did not prostrate, when I commanded you?" Iblis said: "I am better than him (Adam), You created me from fire, and him You created from clay." S. 7:11-12
Allah asks Iblis why he didnt obey his instruction to the angels to prostrate to Adam, which presupposes that he was one of the angels. The text does not say that Allah commanded some other group along with the angels to worship Adam, and therefore makes no sense for Allah to hold Iblis accountable for not obeying a command that was given to them if he wasnt an angel.
No, SamBee.

I beg to disagree. Look for another verse, please. That verse clearly says shows that he was from the Jinns.

I will not cite the verse now, as I have asked Colonna to study the Qur'aan more to find out the verse.

Satan was NOT an angel.

““You must not lose faith ”

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#158401
Jan 11, 2013
 
SamBee wrote:
<quoted text>
Edom is Rome Esau's grandsons Teman became the Germans and Zepho became the Greeks.
Esau was of the Adamic race, he committed genocide against his posterity by marrying into the Canaanite bloodline. Genesis 36:8 says, "Esau is Edom" and the Jewish Encyclopedia acknowledges that "Edom is in Modern Jewry". Their 1905 edition thus describes the connection between modern day Jews and the race of Edom:
"Some anthropologists are inclined to associate the racial origins of the Jews, not with the Semites, whose language they adopted, but with the Armenians and Hittites of Mesopotamia, whose broad skulls and curved noses they appear to have inherited" (Vol. X, p. 284).
I noticed i'm not the only one that's a bit fed up with this treife.
Geneticists no longer think in trees, but allready find connections that criss-cross everywhere. The genetic bush so to say. Which shows far better how people traveled and what their connection was.
But here i always come upon Sambee and this continous speculation that no rational study could ever endorse.(Not even an explanation. I'll bet that the old book did print a by your leave and stated that this was speculation.)
Though some really old links and plays on words that are not processed.
Seir as in mount seir was not a giant but could mean song or mountain-man. Or the queen of one of the tribes that once moved to the region of mnt. Seir.
Obed-destruction. Jesse-Isai with the connotation Esau.
a.s.o.

““You must not lose faith ”

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#158402
Jan 11, 2013
 
MAAT wrote:
<quoted text>
otherwise is must write it as: diiux or dzux, which would both not represent the sound.
Romans (thanks Buford) would make -ii sound like | j|.
It's nothing to do with how jews named or precieved themselves.
(has anything ever since christianity became the vogue)
dijux does remind one of the french dieu.
So now i wonder where dios, dieu and so on found their origin.

If the myth went theat the jews, particularly 'jesus'was the god man, or god people, we could see this etymology making sense.
hmm i foresee another long study as in the first mention of the french dieu and it's context.

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#158406
Jan 11, 2013
 

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bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
How come you could not find the verse, which says that Iblis was of the Jinns or from the Jinns?
Try again and keep reading.!
I was trying to not humiliate you by exposing another contradiction and absurdity from Quran, but if you insist...

Quran 7:11

And We have certainly created you,[O Mankind], and given you [human] form. Then We said to the angels, "Prostrate to Adam"; so they prostrated, except for Iblees. He was not of those who prostrated.

It implies Iblis was an angel, being the order given to angels.

Quran 18:50 says Iblis is a jinn, which automatically contradict Quran 7:11

And [mention] when We said to the angels, "Prostrate to Adam," and they prostrated, except for Iblees. He was of the jinn and departed from the command of his Lord. Then will you take him and his descendants as allies other than Me while they are enemies to you? Wretched it is for the wrongdoers as an exchange.

We have some problems now:

1)Satan is an angel and therefore not a jinn

2) Or he is a jinn and therefore not an angel, which makes Allah unjust for blaming him for not obeying a command given to the angels and not to the jinn.

Let us see how you will come out from this mess
MUQ

Jubail, Saudi Arabia

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#158407
Jan 11, 2013
 
STEFANO COLONNA wrote:
<quoted text>
Quran was originally written in a Arabic dialect, and in modern time it was translated into many languages by many muslim scholars.
When one comes to see how a specific verse is translated in a specific English, say English, one can note sometimes that certain words are translated with a word and in another translation made by another scholar are translated with different words.
How does one know that that specific word should be understood with a word rather than another of different meaning? It's all arbitrary.
I guess you can add Arabic as one of those languages UNFIT and POOR for a scripture.
What is the criterion for a certain language to be FIT for scripture?

And which is the language, which can be translated by a SINGLE word into another language?

Have you opened ANY English dictionary? Did you not find one word having So Many Different meanings? Is there a SINGLE English word that has only ONE meaning?

So why only Arabic should be exempt from this?

Arabic is a fully developed language and was when the Quran was being revealed. I doubt if the lofty thoughts of Quran could be expressed in any other language of the world than Arabic!!

There are many Arabic words that CANNOT be translated by a single English word. Like the word TAHARA? There is no single English word to translate it!!

Now coming to translation of Quran into English or any other language, when Translators do their job, THEY pick up the most relevant word from the foreign language , which in THEIR mind is closest to the revealed Arabic word.

So it is the act of Translators and not from God, and depending on the knowledge and understanding of the translator, it could be correct or faulty.

And in case of any error or mistake it is the mistake of Translator and not Arabic language.

And Muslims always print Arabic original Quran side by side with the English Translation, so any one can cross check.

And Arabic is a Living language of the world, not a Dead language or a language which very few people speak, like Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic, or Sanskrit!!

Allah Knows Best.
MUQ

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#158408
Jan 11, 2013
 
Excerpts from the Gospel of Barnabas, Part-30

Chapter 63 : Vengeance

After certain days Jesus passed near to a city of the Samaritans; and they would not let him enter the city, nor would they sell bread to his disciples. Wherefore said James and John: "Master, may it please you that we pray God that he send down fire from heaven upon these people?"

Jesus answered: "You know not by what spirit you are led, that you so speak.*Remember that God determined to destroy Nineveh because he did not find one who feared God in that city; the which was so wicked that God, having called Jonah ;the prophet to send him to that city, he would fain for fear of the people have fled to Tarsus;, wherefore God caused him to be cast into the sea, and received by a fish and cast up near to Nineveh. And he preaching there, that people was converted to repentance, so that God had mercy on them.

Chapter 64 : Who is your enemy?

"Tell me, O man, who is your enemy? Assuredly your body, and every one who praises you. Wherefore if you were of sane mind you would kiss the hand of those who revile you, and present gifts to those who persecute you and strike you much; because, O man because the more that for your sins you are reviled and persecuted in this life the less shall you be in the day of judgment.

But tell me, O man, if the saints and prophets of God have been persecuted and defamed by the world even though they were innocent, what shall be da one to you, O sinner? and if they endured all with patience, praying for their persecutors, what shouldst you do, O man, who are worthy of hell?

Assuredly not a leaf stirs without the will of God. Wherefore, when you are in tribulation do not think of how much you have borne, nor of him who afflicts you; but consider how much for your sins you are worthy to receive at the hand of the devils of hell. You are angry with this city because it would not receive us, nor sell bread to us. Tell me, are these people your slaves?

have you given them this city? have you given them their corn? or have you helped them to reap it? Assuredly no; for you are strangers in this land, and poor men. What thing is this then that you say?" The two disciples answered: "Lord, we have sinned; may God have mercy on us." And Jesus answered: "So be it."
Note: Beautiful Preaching indeed (MUQ)

(Abridged)
bmz

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#158409
Jan 11, 2013
 
STEFANO COLONNA wrote:
<quoted text>
I was trying to not humiliate you by exposing another contradiction and absurdity from Quran, but if you insist...
Quran 7:11
And We have certainly created you,[O Mankind], and given you [human] form. Then We said to the angels, "Prostrate to Adam"; so they prostrated, except for Iblees. He was not of those who prostrated.
It implies Iblis was an angel, being the order given to angels.
Quran 18:50 says Iblis is a jinn, which automatically contradict Quran 7:11
And [mention] when We said to the angels, "Prostrate to Adam," and they prostrated, except for Iblees. He was of the jinn and departed from the command of his Lord. Then will you take him and his descendants as allies other than Me while they are enemies to you? Wretched it is for the wrongdoers as an exchange.
We have some problems now:
1)Satan is an angel and therefore not a jinn
2) Or he is a jinn and therefore not an angel, which makes Allah unjust for blaming him for not obeying a command given to the angels and not to the jinn.
Let us see how you will come out from this mess
Read the whole Qur'aan, ignorant fool. Satan was also there besides the angels.

18:50 DOES NOT imply. Only ignorant fools imply.

Cheers
Buford

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#158410
Jan 11, 2013
 
bmz wrote:
My point was that Jesus acknowledged eternal damnation and introduced it. He acknowledged because he believed in HELL!
Braindead Muslim Zealot,

The point is that you are a liar.

You wrote, "Didn't Jesus talk about eternal damnation? The man always threatened everyone with that. Even if one called his brother fool, he threatened with eternal damnation."
Buford

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#158411
Jan 11, 2013
 
MUQ wrote:
Arabic is a fully developed language and was when the Quran was being revealed. I doubt if the lofty thoughts of Quran could be expressed in any other language of the world than Arabic!!
Which must be why when Mohammad's scribes were recording his dictations "from Allah." the words were missing diacritical marks that needed to be added later so as to "fix" the meaning of the words.

Umm...what exactly are the "lofty thoughts of Quran" that could NOT be expressed in any other language of the world than Arabic?

Perhaps you mean Qur'an 33:60 "Truly, if the Hypocrites stir up sedition, if the agitators in the City do not desist, We shall urge you to go against them and set you over them. Then they will not be able to stay as your neighbors for any length of time. They shall have a curse on them. Whenever they are found, they shall be seized and slain without mercy - a fierce slaughter - murdered, a horrible murdering."
rabbee yehoshooah adam

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#158412
Jan 11, 2013
 
MAAT wrote:
<quoted text>
otherwise is must write it as: diiux or dzux, which would both not represent the sound.
Romans (thanks Buford) would make -ii sound like | j|.
It's nothing to do with how jews named or precieved themselves.
(has anything ever since christianity became the vogue)
rabbee: well the letter j was concieved, by seperating the letter i into it's vowell and consonant forms. the j became the consonat, and the i remained as the vowel. so therefore it, would only be diux origionally. and there was quite a bit, of confusion over this at first.
MUQ

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#158416
Jan 11, 2013
 

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Buford wrote:
<quoted text>
Which must be why when Mohammad's scribes were recording his dictations "from Allah." the words were missing diacritical marks that needed to be added later so as to "fix" the meaning of the words.
Umm...what exactly are the "lofty thoughts of Quran" that could NOT be expressed in any other language of the world than Arabic?
Perhaps you mean Qur'an 33:60 "Truly, if the Hypocrites stir up sedition, if the agitators in the City do not desist, We shall urge you to go against them and set you over them. Then they will not be able to stay as your neighbors for any length of time. They shall have a curse on them. Whenever they are found, they shall be seized and slain without mercy - a fierce slaughter - murdered, a horrible murdering."

Have you ever read or seen any URDU book?

Do you find ANY PUNCTUATION marks in any URDU Book?

Can any one else but a man who know URDU can read these words without punctuation marks?

But if we want people who do not understand URDU to read URDU book, we should put punctuation marks and vowels so that they can read it.

The same is the case for Quran, to Original Arabs, no punctuation marks were needed, they could read it without these.

But when Non Arab people started accepting Islam and THEY tried to read Quran, they faced problems. That is WHY punctuation marks and dots were "invented" so that they find it "easy" to read.

And since people could still make mistakes by using punctuation marks by themselves, that is why only "Authentic Reciters" who had learned Quran from companions of prophet, were allowed to teach people as to where to place which punctuation mark.

Can any one show any other book in the world, which was preserved in so elaborate a fashion?

there is no way in which one can satisfy the "disease" in the hearts of people, but to a logical and reasonable mind, any amount of fair investigations, would make him realize that Quran is preserved in its pristine condition, like no other book on the face of earth.

But I do not understand, when you do not believe in any religion, why you keep on asking these questions? Why you pretend sometime that you are Christian and some time as you are an atheist and some time as a Buddhist?

Why you waste your time and others in these useless and purposeless discussions?

What I told you about URDU, you will forget and keep on repeating the same objection to some one else!
bmz

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#158417
Jan 12, 2013
 
Buford wrote:
<quoted text>
Which must be why when Mohammad's scribes were recording his dictations "from Allah." the words were missing diacritical marks that needed to be added later so as to "fix" the meaning of the words.
Umm...what exactly are the "lofty thoughts of Quran" that could NOT be expressed in any other language of the world than Arabic?
Perhaps you mean Qur'an 33:60 "Truly, if the Hypocrites stir up sedition, if the agitators in the City do not desist, We shall urge you to go against them and set you over them. Then they will not be able to stay as your neighbors for any length of time. They shall have a curse on them. Whenever they are found, they shall be seized and slain without mercy - a fierce slaughter - murdered, a horrible murdering."
When you speak English, do you mention commas colon and full stops, you ignorant fool?

A sample to show how you talk. Jesus said (Comma)(Inverted Comma)I am going where you cannot come(Stop) The people said (Comma)(Inverted Comma)We don't know where is he going(Question Mark)

And by the way, if commas, colons, semi-colons and inverted commas, etc., are not inserted in the English text, would you be able to understand?

Try this:

"Jesus said I am going where you cannot come the people said we don't know where is he going they thought he was going to die"

Can you understand this easily? Can you or you cannot?
bmz

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#158418
Jan 12, 2013
 

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MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you ever read or seen any URDU book?
Do you find ANY PUNCTUATION marks in any URDU Book?
Can any one else but a man who know URDU can read these words without punctuation marks?
But if we want people who do not understand URDU to read URDU book, we should put punctuation marks and vowels so that they can read it.
The same is the case for Quran, to Original Arabs, no punctuation marks were needed, they could read it without these.
But when Non Arab people started accepting Islam and THEY tried to read Quran, they faced problems. That is WHY punctuation marks and dots were "invented" so that they find it "easy" to read.
And since people could still make mistakes by using punctuation marks by themselves, that is why only "Authentic Reciters" who had learned Quran from companions of prophet, were allowed to teach people as to where to place which punctuation mark.
Can any one show any other book in the world, which was preserved in so elaborate a fashion?
there is no way in which one can satisfy the "disease" in the hearts of people, but to a logical and reasonable mind, any amount of fair investigations, would make him realize that Quran is preserved in its pristine condition, like no other book on the face of earth.
But I do not understand, when you do not believe in any religion, why you keep on asking these questions? Why you pretend sometime that you are Christian and some time as you are an atheist and some time as a Buddhist?
Why you waste your time and others in these useless and purposeless discussions?
What I told you about URDU, you will forget and keep on repeating the same objection to some one else!
Jesus had the fools Thomas and Philip. We have Buford.

Salaams, MUQ. lol!
MUQ

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#158420
Jan 12, 2013
 
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus had the fools Thomas and Philip. We have Buford.
Salaams, MUQ. lol!
Our Bufford is different from Thomas and Philips. They had genuine doubts and when Jesus cleared it, they believed in it whole hardheartedly.

Our Bufford is only to get mental relaxation on these forums, he is not in the market for any knowledge or to understand some things.

He goes on and one in never ending question and answer session. And after 1000 such posts, goes back to point # 1 to repeat the same cycle.

He wastes his time as well as others and creates doubts in the minds of those people who do not have enough knowledge.

they might be "impressed" by "Authentic looking" quotations from verses of Quran!!

Salaam.

MUQ
Tom

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#158421
Jan 12, 2013
 

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kandoor wrote:
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why did allah ask satan to bown down to adam?
surely only allah is worthy of such devotion?
God ask angels and satan to bow down to Adam is to respect to him (adam) as a perfect creation. But satan disobey Him and said that he's greater than adam because he was created from a smokeless fire while adam is just from dirts. It doesnt mean Allah asked them to worship Adam.

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#158422
Jan 12, 2013
 
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
What is the criterion for a certain language to be FIT for scripture?
And which is the language, which can be translated by a SINGLE word into another language?
Have you opened ANY English dictionary? Did you not find one word having So Many Different meanings? Is there a SINGLE English word that has only ONE meaning?
So why only Arabic should be exempt from this?
Arabic is a fully developed language and was when the Quran was being revealed. I doubt if the lofty thoughts of Quran could be expressed in any other language of the world than Arabic!!
There are many Arabic words that CANNOT be translated by a single English word. Like the word TAHARA? There is no single English word to translate it!!
Now coming to translation of Quran into English or any other language, when Translators do their job, THEY pick up the most relevant word from the foreign language , which in THEIR mind is closest to the revealed Arabic word.
So it is the act of Translators and not from God, and depending on the knowledge and understanding of the translator, it could be correct or faulty.
And in case of any error or mistake it is the mistake of Translator and not Arabic language.
And Muslims always print Arabic original Quran side by side with the English Translation, so any one can cross check.
And Arabic is a Living language of the world, not a Dead language or a language which very few people speak, like Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic, or Sanskrit!!
Allah Knows Best.
You became the lawyer of arabic language, but you missed my point.

Bmz was trying to elevate arabic over any other language, and I told him arabic isn't better or worst than many such Latin and Greek.

Ask to him what is criterion to enstablish which language is better than another.

You're right when you say there are arabic words that cannot be translated into English, and from my personal experience I can say there are English words that cannot be translated into Italian and vice versa and I'm sure there are English words that cannot be translated into arabic.

You touched an issue very important, why certain translators translate a word giving a meaning rather than another. Reading the Quran (English translation) and dealing with Muslims I learnt that Muslims tend to accept the translation that more make sense, rather the one who expose the fraud. One day out of curiosity I wanted to check onto arabic dictionary what was the main meaning for that arabic word and guess what, the meaning was something that the Muslims on net denied its meaning.

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