Is Religious Right Conceding on Gay R...

Is Religious Right Conceding on Gay Rights Issues?

There are 228 comments on the EDGEptown.com News Feed v1.0 story from Mar 27, 2011, titled Is Religious Right Conceding on Gay Rights Issues?. In it, EDGEptown.com News Feed v1.0 reports that:

The head of the Southern Baptists is among a growing number of conservative & evangelical Christians who's conceded that gay marriage is inevitable.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at EDGEptown.com News Feed v1.0.

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Since: Jan 08

Ban Bueng, Thailand

#1 Mar 27, 2011
Those that oppose gay equal rights including SSM are putting their names with those that have opposed abolition of slavery, voting rights for women, and labor laws that removed children from dangerous work. They truly are neanderthal in nature, and history will remember them for that.

“A Militant Homosexual”

Since: Jan 07

West Hollywood, California

#2 Mar 27, 2011
Interesting article. Not sure if I accept all of the conclusions presented, but interesting non the less...

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

Location hidden

#3 Mar 28, 2011
I agree that it is interesting, but one quote jumped off the page at me. "It’s time for Christians to start thinking about how we’re going to deal with that."

I couldn't help thinking that some of these folks are only really thinking, "How do we get them to join our church, and give us lots of money".

Maybe I am getting just to cynical in my old age. I just cannot believe that they are willing to accommodate us, and fold on the issue. Whatever we do, we cannot be lulled into a false sense that they are giving up the fight so readily. We cannot afford to let down our guard until the fight is finished. And even then, we have to watch for people who wish to errode what we have gained.

“IBM had it right: "Think"”

Since: Mar 07

SF Bay Area Suburbs

#4 Mar 28, 2011
When will Gay Christians finally come out as Christian to the Gay community, and the Gay culture elites accept that we live in a predominantly Gay culture.

The bigger hostile crowd is the anti-religious in the mainly secularist , urban Gay weltanschauung crowd, than the christianistas in the AFA.

I will grant that the anti-religious types are less dangerous to the individual, but it is generally easier to come out as Gay in a church than to come out as Christian in the Gay community.
duped since birth

Vero Beach, FL

#5 Mar 28, 2011
RalphB wrote:
I agree that it is interesting, but one quote jumped off the page at me. "It’s time for Christians to start thinking about how we’re going to deal with that."...
That quote struck me, too. Then I thought that perhaps, rather than re-inventing the wheel, they should study a little of their history. How did they deal with abolition? How did they deal with rights for women? They've had to adapt from their stances on these issues in the past, maybe they can get some help from their forefathers...

“Son of Abraham”

Since: Aug 07

Natural Deviant

#6 Mar 28, 2011
This has nothing to do with acceptance and everything to do with the fact it's getting harder for them to make money off of us.

“Created Equal”

Since: Feb 08

USA

#7 Mar 28, 2011
From the quotes in the article, it would seem not so much that formerly anti-gay christians are changing their minds about LGBT marriage rights, but are beginning to make the same distinction we've been making all along: the distinction between a civil marriage and a religious one.

I am an unwavering supporter of LGBT equality, but at the same time, my political philosophy is pragmatically Libertarian. I think that the government had no business insinuating itself so deeply (or at all) into people's personal and familial relationships. The government should not be subsidizing couples at all, much less applying discrimination in determining which couples to subsidize.

However, what is done is done. Marriage equality is about two main things: challenging the social stigmatiztion of LGBT people, and aquiring the same protections and access that heterosexual couples enjoy. It has been possible for LGBT people to find open-minded religious clergy to perform their wedding ceremonies for several decades. That has not been at issue. A marriage is a marriage, whether or not the state recognizes it. But as long as the government is going to give special treatment and protection to heterosexual married couples, it also must extend those same rights and entitlements to LGBT married couples.

Homophobia, like racism, is not likely to go away any time soon, no matter what the government does. But regardless of how the religious right feels about LGBT marriage, we might be seeing the moment when they begin to realize what this fight is really about, and choose to limit their condemnations to the insides of their own churches.

After all, it isn't easy to be on the wrong side of such an important social issue, even if your Bible tells you so.(Which it doesn't, but that's the topic for another rant.)
Snickers

Grove City, PA

#8 Mar 28, 2011
Quite bizarre: That article takes one quote that truly could be interpreted more than one way and turns it into an article of very little substance. It has some vague statements about "young evangelicals" that are not backed up with anything (which I believe is an attempt to change the meaning of "evangelical" just as gays have attempted to change the meaning of "Christian.") And then it throws in some stuff about denominations that have long been liberal and "gay-friendly." There is absolutely nothing that truly answers the question in the headline.

I believe this whole article is calculated to mislead the Christian masses into thinking their leaders are capitulating. If they are, then we need some new leaders with a stronger Biblical foundation and a whole lot more faith.

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

Location hidden

#9 Mar 28, 2011
Snickers wrote:
"just as gays have attempted to change the meaning of "Christian.").
Interesting comment. You don't say "some gays" or "a few gays" or "many gays". Just "gays". Are we to assume that you do, indeed, mean "all gays", as it implies?

And in what way are we attempting to change the meaning of "Christian"? What is the only true meaning of "Christian" that we are attempting to change, and what is the one meaning of "Christian" that we are attempting to substitute instead?

When even "Christians" cannot agree on a single meaning of the term, what amazing power is it that we have to change it?

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#10 Mar 28, 2011
Can't say I have a lot of contact with the christian community-actually none whatsoever. But in some of the articles I have been reading it seems that this is just a tip of the iceburg when it comes to the paradigm shift, the new awakening of modern christians. I think, especially the young people that are looking at all this from more expanded viewpoint being more connected with the larger world, that more christians are coming realized that their religion has been hijacked and they've been taken on a money-grubbing, power grabbing joy ride instead of that transforming spriritual journey for which it was intended and which they expected. And the institution of the church is going to have the rude awakening of finding it either starts caretaking the soul and the humanitarian needs of the world instead of the interests of right-wing politicians or find itself dumped on the curb like a two dollar hooker. It's really a win-win situation and has been a long time in coming. Glad to see the time when I might actually feel comfortable sitting in the same room with a cristian.

“Son of Abraham”

Since: Aug 07

Natural Deviant

#11 Mar 28, 2011
Snickers wrote:
Quite bizarre: That article takes one quote that truly could be interpreted more than one way and turns it into an article of very little substance. It has some vague statements about "young evangelicals" that are not backed up with anything (which I believe is an attempt to change the meaning of "evangelical" just as gays have attempted to change the meaning of "Christian.") And then it throws in some stuff about denominations that have long been liberal and "gay-friendly." There is absolutely nothing that truly answers the question in the headline.
I believe this whole article is calculated to mislead the Christian masses into thinking their leaders are capitulating. If they are, then we need some new leaders with a stronger Biblical foundation and a whole lot more faith.
Why are you on this board??? You are one here 24/7.

Is it making you feel any less gay??????

“Marriage Equality”

Since: Dec 07

Lakeland, MI

#12 Mar 28, 2011
from the article, "'We have to prepare our children to be in a context in which they’re going to be in a playground with children who have two dads or two moms,' Mohler emphasized."

This just blows my mind. They flatly refuse to acknowledge the fact that virtually NONE of the children on that playground have just one mother and one father already!

And I'm not talking about families headed by same-sex couples. I'm talking about the *millions* of children who's *heterosexual* parents have divorced and remarried and divorced and remarried and divorced and remarried again, bringing in a "new mommy" or a "new daddy" with each and every new marriage. That's been commonplace among straight-headed families for decades now!

I realize that one has to suspend a huge amount of reality and common sense to believe in most religions, but do they have to ignore it ALL???

“Marriage Equality”

Since: Dec 07

Lakeland, MI

#13 Mar 28, 2011
McMike wrote:
This has nothing to do with acceptance and everything to do with the fact it's getting harder for them to make money off of us.
I agree. I think they're starting to realize that people *will* accept same-sex couples just like they've accepted inter-racial couples, divorce, etc.

As that happens, there will be an inverse relationship to that and their ability to rake in millions by panicking the stupid people over the issue.(Then Maggie the Hut will have to get a real job!)

Then they'll just fall back on abortion. I think that's their never-ending meal ticket anyway and I think they know it.

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#14 Mar 28, 2011
Snickers wrote:
Quite bizarre: That article takes one quote that truly could be interpreted more than one way and turns it into an article of very little substance. It has some vague statements about "young evangelicals" that are not backed up with anything (which I believe is an attempt to change the meaning of "evangelical" just as gays have attempted to change the meaning of "Christian.") And then it throws in some stuff about denominations that have long been liberal and "gay-friendly." There is absolutely nothing that truly answers the question in the headline.
I believe this whole article is calculated to mislead the Christian masses into thinking their leaders are capitulating. If they are, then we need some new leaders with a stronger Biblical foundation and a whole lot more faith.
No, christians are figuring out their priorities have been totally screwed up through right-wing special interests who have been teaching christians en mass that their mission on earth is to judge people instead of ministering to them. What would have happened if the church, instead of spending its formidable capital trying to prevent Adam and Steve from getting married, had instead worked to see the Adam and Stve had living wage jobs, affordable health insurance? What if the evangelical community had stood foresquare against NAFTA, all the other pro-corporation, anti-family legislation that has ruined the lives of the very families they claim to be protecting from Adam and Steve? What do you think our economic landscape would look like if the chruch had used its clout in towards humanitarian legislation instead of getting their ego rocks off trying to pass or uphold "I"m better than you" law? No one is changing the definition of "christian", it's christians themselves that are now struggling to define themselves in the way that Jesus intended.

“Take Topix Back From Trolls”

Since: Dec 08

Seminole, FL

#15 Mar 28, 2011
RalphB wrote:
Maybe I am getting just to cynical in my old age. I just cannot believe that they are willing to accommodate us, and fold on the issue. Whatever we do, we cannot be lulled into a false sense that they are giving up the fight so readily. We cannot afford to let down our guard until the fight is finished. And even then, we have to watch for people who wish to errode what we have gained.
It just may be that we will be the ones doing the accommodating. They're either going to change or drift off into total irrelevancy. They really can't afford to preach to empty pews every Sunday and I don't know many folks who enjoy sitting and listening to hate being spewed week in and week out.

Since: Mar 07

Washington DC

#16 Mar 28, 2011
RalphB wrote:
I couldn't help thinking that some of these folks are only really thinking, "How do we get them to join our church, and give us lots of money".
I don't think you're cynical at all. Many churches have been using the anti-gay issue as a money maker for decades. Even in the article about the pastor that's changed his view mentioned this as an issue. He wasn't worried that half his congregation would walk out the door, he was worried the MONEY would:

"If they bolted, half our budget would go out the door. I knew the issue could tear the church apart."

It's not about the Bible, morality, or anything else. It's about the dollar signs.

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#17 Mar 28, 2011
aRodeojock wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't think you're cynical at all. Many churches have been using the anti-gay issue as a money maker for decades. Even in the article about the pastor that's changed his view mentioned this as an issue. He wasn't worried that half his congregation would walk out the door, he was worried the MONEY would:
"If they bolted, half our budget would go out the door. I knew the issue could tear the church apart."
It's not about the Bible, morality, or anything else. It's about the dollar signs.
Babydoll, I think you might be a little "glass half empty" in the way you're looking at this. I agree with the poster you responded to, you never turn your back on an enemy, but the fact in and of itself that they recognize people are abandoning hate evangelism in droves is more important than them fearing the consequences of it. If they are forced to abandon their hate rhetoric to keep those dollars flowing, who cares?

“Take Topix Back From Trolls”

Since: Dec 08

Seminole, FL

#18 Mar 28, 2011
Snickers wrote:
Quite bizarre: That article takes one quote that truly could be interpreted more than one way and turns it into an article of very little substance. It has some vague statements about "young evangelicals" that are not backed up with anything
You just go on believing that nothings changed and all is well in Churchland. When you wake from your fanciful daydreaming you're going to discover that you've obviously not attended church for a few years and that you know absolutely nothing about young evangelicals.

End of story. You lost.

Hint: there have been dozens of articles about diminished church attendance and just as many about dozens of new, young evangelicals in recent months. But please continue deluding yourself.

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#19 Mar 28, 2011
Learning how to deal with the reality of married same-sex couples doesn't mean they will suddenly start accepting us. It just means they have to get more creative in finding ways to demonize us.

Since: Mar 07

Washington DC

#20 Mar 28, 2011
RubyTheDyke wrote:
<quoted text>
Babydoll, I think you might be a little "glass half empty" in the way you're looking at this. I agree with the poster you responded to, you never turn your back on an enemy, but the fact in and of itself that they recognize people are abandoning hate evangelism in droves is more important than them fearing the consequences of it. If they are forced to abandon their hate rhetoric to keep those dollars flowing, who cares?
Well, sweetcheeks, everyone should care. As long as these "churches" are using their tax-exempt status to take away our rights and influence politics in other manners, they're breaking the law.

I'm not looking at it as a "half empty" scenario. It is what it is. The young evangelicals are leaving for less rhetoric and the "high and mighty" are worried for their bottom line.

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