Gurkha Pathan Rajput Jat : Who is the...

Gurkha Pathan Rajput Jat : Who is the hardest?

Created by Harry Potter on Jun 22, 2010

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Gurkha

Pathan

Rajput

Jat

They are all Rajputs

Pat

Fremont, CA

#218 Apr 28, 2011
abhi wrote:
wars are won by intelligence. Martial race theory had just one purpose..instil arrogance among some tribes, insult the rest and DIVIDE AND RULE THOSE INDIAN FOOLS. I guess the englishman proved himself the best fighter of all.
You are sopt on. Its funny that folks here are mentally gulam and they still rate their bravery by the standards or requirements set by Brtishers. At any time if this is the base then Brits will be bravest!! Funny ! The whole thing of gore chale gye and left some gadhe here.
Deepesh shah

Europe

#219 Apr 28, 2011
We thakuri r the real gurkha...gurung,magar,rai,limb u bri bol chas....aile tero bao ko biyah herai dinchu bujis....
We r the son of pirtvi narayan shah bujis
Raman Singh Heer

Beverly Hills, CA

#220 Apr 28, 2011
The Jatt Sikhs were at the time of Ranjeet Singh a very potent force. Even today their fighting techniques in particular Ancient arts like "Shastar Vidaya" which is a evolved form of Martial art that shares the Origins of Kalapatiryu and Kung Fu.

If anyone has had the pleasure of seeing live "Gatka" demonstrations one can appreciate the skill that goes into the Jatt Sikh Martial arts. All that fancy stick and sword twirling might look dramatic but it has origins of brutal effectiveness in single combat. In India the Mughals of the later period that clashed with the Jatts were outclassed in CQC, despite superior numbers, superior Armour and more firearms the Mughal forces were still held in check by primitive and poorly armed Khalsa Jatt Warriors.

Ideological commitment can go a long way to deciding the outcome of a confrontation. Some would call such men Fanatics but nobody can deny they are very formidable...

This is very relevant to modern times as well though, much as I abhor the terrible Taliban for thier harsh treatment of fellow humans one cannot deny thier formidable zeal.

Zealots can be a problem but in the end the real battle really is inside hearts and minds, when you get down to it even the most fearsome fighters and even outright Homicidal maniacs can be talked out of thier aggresive patterns.

The Chakram (sharpened throwing disc) is a brilliant weapon that resembles a Frisbee or more correctly an Aerobee. It has much greater range than throwing knives or Shuriken (Ninja stars) and while it lacks the return capability of Boomerangs it can be used to take down bigger targets and has more stopping power when it impacts. I love the Chakram but only came to know of it's great power after seeing one slice Watermelons in half from over 50 feet away! I could not do that with a throwing knife and even a Ballistic knife would be lucky to travel that far.

The Sikhs also have a great twist on the Knucle duster it's called a Wagh Nakah and resembes a Knucle brace with razor sharp claw like protrusions which can rend flesh just like a real leopards claw and can also be used for climbing as well as close quarters combat.

The other most famous weapon that is carried by almost all baptised Sikhs is the Kirpan, which is traditionally a short stout sword like weapon though these days it would be described as a large knife. The Kirpan comes in many forms and along with the Yemini Jambiya, Khyber Chora, Ghurkha Khukri and other ethnic and cultural knives it is not only a great all round weapon but also a very symbolic one that is like a cultural trademark and a favourite of mine.

Ranjeet Singhs army the Khalsa and the Nihangs would have been fammiliar with all the above weapons and continued to use them effectively long after the advent of modern firearms. In fact the Chakram disc was flung in battalion style volleys and had devastating impact against troops in formation, many annecdotes from the Sikh War refer to this fearsome weapon as being capable of decapitating a man from a hundred paces.

Nobody however can deny the effectiveness of Jatt Sikh arms and battles such as Mudki and ChilianWalla will vouch for this fact.
rajputana

Mumbai, India

#221 Apr 29, 2011
ranjit singh army was not a foolish jatt gatka and pattebaj army, it was a well equip army on the contemporary europian patterns,matching the fire power and muskets brought by swede,check ,italian merchants.moreover this army was commanded and trained by french generals allards,ventura , and others who were famous fighters of napoleonik army ,most of the army was kept under strict discipline by these general,this army was composed of gurkha,muslims , purbia rajput and brahmins , mostly infantry , pathan and sikh formed the cavalry, so gatka and acrobatics was only for show and sports , not used in modern battles. sikh empire came crumbling down because of idiot jatts unruly and arrogant behaviour with the royal officers and generals , which finally resulted in a disaster in last anglow sikh war.
Raman Singh Heer

Beverly Hills, CA

#222 Apr 29, 2011
rajputana, 9 of the 12 Sikh misals were of pure Jatt stock. Bhim Singh founded the Bhangi Misal and he was a Dhillon Jatt, Kanhya Misal was founded by Jai Singh who was a Sandhu Jatt, Nakia Misal was founded by Hira Singh who was a Sandhu Jatt, Singhpuria Misal was founded by a Jatt landlord named Kapur Singh, Karora Singhia Misal was founded by Karaora Singh, etc.

To say that Jatts aren't warriors, or the ruling class, or zamindars is false.



"Bahman dey nal, nahi Jatt di yariah." - There is no friendship between a Jatt and a Brahmin.

Jatts are a very powerful and significant tribe. Might I remind you that it was the Jatts of Sindh who revolted and overthrew the despot and cruel king of Sindh "Raja Dahir."

Jatts have never bowed to Brahmins. Rajputs are great fighter as well and I send my warmest sentiments to you and your family. My best friend is a Ponwar Rajput.
yaudheya

Gwalior, India

#223 Apr 30, 2011
Raman Singh Heer wrote:
Might I remind you that it was the Jatts of Sindh who revolted and overthrew the despot and cruel king of Sindh "Raja Dahir."
Jatts have never bowed to Brahmins. Rajputs are great fighter as well and I send my warmest sentiments to you and your family. My best friend is a Ponwar Rajput.
Dahir may be a good or bed king , but Don't forget , he gave his life but neither he surrender nor gave his religion and culture like Jaats . If you feel pride on traitorous work of jaat of Sindh then you are not real jaat . A true jaat never think against his country , his religion and culture even whole country becomes against him . It became good that all those bastards converted in Islam and if you have pride and sympathy with their trait you should also convert and go to Pakistan , " Tum jaise logon ke bina bhi yahan kaafi badboo hai "

Rajputs are also against the Brahminvaad but not against Brahmins . A bed to bed Brahmin becomes good then a Paki or Arab for us . What the guarantee that you will not be betrayal against your Rajput friend while you have pride and justification for your traitor ancestors .
palwan khan

Shipley, UK

#224 May 2, 2011
rajputs and pathaans ang ghukhans are very brave and strong these three races are neck to neck,,jats come after these tribes
Pat

San Leandro, CA

#225 May 2, 2011
seema like pathans are tribes and others are not tribals any more..

pahtna ka paan and naan.
rajput gandu hain

Rawalpindi, Pakistan

#226 May 2, 2011
rajput aik gandu nasal hai jis ki puri nasal ney pathano sey gand marwaye hai sub sey bahudur pathan hain jao apni maa sey pocho rajputu behnchodo key tumhey sub sey ziyada kis sey marwaney mai maza ata hai wo boley gi pathano sey tum log rajput pathano key shokrey ho tum rajput aik neech qom ho
yaudheya

Gwalior, India

#227 May 3, 2011
rajput gandu hain wrote:
rajput aik gandu nasal hai jis ki puri nasal ney pathano sey gand marwaye hai sub sey bahudur pathan hain jao apni maa sey pocho rajputu behnchodo key tumhey sub sey ziyada kis sey marwaney mai maza ata hai wo boley gi pathano sey tum log rajput pathano key shokrey ho tum rajput aik neech qom ho
Tumhar ye dava bilkul galat aur Pathani fitarat ke ulat hai kyon ki Pathan naturally GAY kaum hai . Half Pathan get enjoy towards front side and remained half get towards back side . So your claim about Rajput women is totally wrong , actually you should ask this question from Pathan women that how do they birth next generations .
rajput gandu hain

Karachi, Pakistan

#228 May 4, 2011
tum ney yai sahi kaha pathan londeybaz hotey hai per tum jaisey gandu rajput jin key pass paisa hota nahi hai tum log 10 10 rupey mai apni gand marwatey ho pathano sey jub tuk tum yai apna dhunda bund nahi karogey tum tuk yai pathano ki adat kaisey chutay gi or maderchod sun tu jo itni bat ker raha hai na tum rajput pathano key lund sey nikley ho tum aik pathano ki najayiz aulad ho aur yahan pey apney bap pathan sey bat ker rahey ho
yaudheya

Gwalior, India

#229 May 4, 2011
rajput gandu hain wrote:
tum ney yai sahi kaha pathan londeybaz hotey hai per tum jaisey gandu rajput jin key pass paisa hota nahi hai tum log 10 10 rupey mai apni gand marwatey ho pathano sey jub tuk tum yai apna dhunda bund nahi karogey tum tuk yai pathano ki adat kaisey chutay gi or maderchod sun tu jo itni bat ker raha hai na tum rajput pathano key lund sey nikley ho tum aik pathano ki najayiz aulad ho aur yahan pey apney bap pathan sey bat ker rahey ho
You didn't read my post carefully that what i said . I repeat again ,' Half Patthan get enjoy towards front side and remained half Pathan from back side , so Pathans are busy with each other and their is no need of women .
yaudheya

Gwalior, India

#230 May 4, 2011
rajput gandu hain wrote:
tum ney yai sahi kaha pathan londeybaz hotey hai per tum jaisey gandu rajput jin key pass paisa hota nahi hai tum log 10 10 rupey mai apni gand marwatey ho pathano sey jub tuk tum yai apna dhunda bund nahi karogey tum tuk yai pathano ki adat kaisey chutay gi or maderchod sun tu jo itni bat ker raha hai na tum rajput pathano key lund sey nikley ho tum aik pathano ki najayiz aulad ho aur yahan pey apney bap pathan sey bat ker rahey ho
What i said which made you so disturb . I told about the historical habit and tradition of sexual behavior of Pathans which was started among them with Arabians when they successfully invaded Afghanistan and imposed these abnormal Arabian sexual traditions on the name of Islam . Is there no verse in quaran where ' NAKED BOYS ' are reserved for good [?]Muhammadans .
Sikh Sword

Honolulu, HI

#231 May 4, 2011
It's official. Americans are the hardest. They caught bin laden in another sovereign nation called Pakistan and now Pakistani people are upset that America broke their sovereign rights. Bin laden was so close to islamabad and Pakistan's "West Point". No American soldier died. Now Pakistan looks bad internationally and have shown their true colors to the world. India and few other nations knew Pakistan is a bad nation that supports terrorism and it is great Americans caught the SOB. Indians need to be more like Americans and FUK up Muslims like bin laden, so India can be at peace.

AMERICA RULES
rajput gandu hain

Rawalpindi, Pakistan

#232 May 5, 2011
tum log aik gandu qom ho tum log pehley apni history perho tumhari aurtain bhi randi thi pathano sey chudwati thi tum logon ki nasal hi pathano key shoq ki waja say buni aur yaudheya tu to gandu hai pata nahi kis kis pathan sey tuney gand marwaye hai aur bat sun behnchod america ney hi hath jor liye afghanistan mai jung ker key tum bhainchod india waley kiya ho maderchod jitna tumharey foji mai zor hai utna to humarey 15 sal key larkey mai us sey ziyada zor hai qasam sey ager maa ka doodh piya hai to aao laro ager baap ka doodh piya hai to tum log ho hi gandu qom tum rajput aik neech qom ho............
Enigma

UK

#233 May 5, 2011
yaudheya wrote:
<quoted text>
1-- Lt. Gen. Kaul himself described ' Chindit ' as a pure secrete Gurkha army trend by Brigadier Vinget . Bri. Vinget denied B.M.Caul to include him in this army because according to Vinget , it was a Gurkha army and Gurkhas can't be commended by Indian officers [ While there was no such written rule in British army manuals ]. Would you like to explain this for me [ Because you have declared me a furious . Lol ]
2-- No brother , How can i expect it with you or with anyone . I gave my thought only and every one has a right to agree or disagree on it and i also have same right . Yes i agree with you that medals are not ' earn ' only by loyalty but it is also true that medals are not earn only by bravery . Loyalty and bravery both are essential criteria for military honor , from ancient empires to modern British empire .
3-- Here , is your argument not full with emotion instead logic

You come across as quite an intelligent guy but you need to stop jumping into conclusions without seeing the bigger picture. The wars India fought against Pakistan and China was only border skirmishes. It was never a full blown out wars. And the Gurkhas were used very sporadically. Out of 7 Gurkha regiments in India today, only 1 or 2 regiments were used at a time. And when they were used, they impressed everyone from the Indians, Chinese to the Pakistanis. The only full blown out war after the 2nd world war has been The Korean War, The Vietnam war and the Russo- Afghan war. If the Indian wars had been a full blown out wars and if India used all the 7 regiment at once, then I guarantee you that Gurkhas would have won a lot more medals.
Sorry for the late reply brother, I was on spring holiday. Just to clarify some of the points you raised.
1-- The only reason I can think what he meant was that the Gurkhas were the only ones used from the Indian army for the expedition. One battalion of about 350 men from 2nd Gurkha riffles (my dad/granddad’s old regiment) were used along with British soldiers/Burmans/West Africans and there were also support from the Americans and Chinese who wanted the Japs out of China. Since this was a special expedition, all the men were given special training in India. Maybe this is where you got the notion that the Gurkhas got better training. I think it would be an insult to the other brave men who fought and died in this expedition if only the Gurkhas were given credit for it. It’s also true that before partition only Gurkhas and British were allowed to command the Gurkhas. Gurkhas could obtain ranks as high as Captain and Gurkha Major and any higher were British (discrimination). Obviously the rules changed in the Indian army after partition.
2 -- After reviewing what you have written, I am gonna have to agree with you on this one. There is no point having courage and not showing loyalty and vice versa. So you are 100% correct.
3 -- Let us determine if this was based on emotion or logic. I will break down my analysis.
a. The only full blown out war after the 2nd world war has been The Korean War, The Vietnam war and the Russo- Afghan war. FACT.
b. The wars India fought against Pakistan and China were only border skirmishes and It was never a full blown out wars. FACT.
c. The Gurkhas were used very sporadically. Out of 7 Gurkha regiments in India today, only 1 or 2 regiments were used at a time. FACT.
After putting my analysis together, I think it’s pretty fair to say that if a full blown out war had taken place and all 7 regiments were used all at once, then Gurkhas would have won many more Medals. I think the Gurkha history itself proves this to be a fair logical analysis and anyone who knows about the Gurkhas would probably make the same logical analysis. Take it easy my brother.
Enigma

UK

#234 May 5, 2011
Deepesh shah wrote:
We thakuri r the real gurkha...gurung,magar,rai,limb u bri bol chas....aile tero bao ko biyah herai dinchu bujis....
We r the son of pirtvi narayan shah bujis
“aile tero bao ko biyah herai dinchu bujis”. Right on CHIEF!! Is this some kind of Thakuri war cry? You have seriously got me shaking in my boots with terror!! Anyway you are too late. Mero bao ko biyah bahi sakiyo bujis!
Thakuris are the real Gurkhas?!! Really? Only Thakuris and no one else?!! Are you gonna give us any intellectual input to support your argument or are you just gonna rant and rave like a juvenile lunatic? But then again, judging by the use of your vocabulary, I don’t think you are capable of it. Anyhow, lets get back to the subject.
The Gurkhas we are discussing here are the Gurkhas who earned the fearsome fighting reputation, fought all over the world against great opposition and known around the world as “bravest of the brave”. These men were recruited by the British from Nepal since 1816 to form parts of the Indian army. These Gurkhas from the Indian army and the 4 regiments the British took with them from India have fought during the British Raj, 1st and 2nd World Wars, India’s war with Pakistan/China, Malayan insurgencies, Falklands, Iraq/Afghanistan war and has taken them almost 200 years to earn the Gurkha reputation. Gurkha/Goorkha itself is an anglicized name given by the British and it’s these Gurkhas from the Indian and British Armies that are the REAL GURKHAS!!
Now according to you, the real Gurkhas are sons of Prithivi Narayan Shah and are Thakuris. But last time I checked, Prithivi Shah died in 1775. That leaves a 41 year gap because the British only started recruiting Gurkhas from 1816. The Gorkhali army led by Prithivi Narayan Shah only fought to unite the mountain Kingdoms around Nepal. If you think it was because of this that the Gurkhas became world famous, then you better go see a doctor. You are delusional. No one had heard of Gorkhali army back then apart from Nepal and the surrounding area and no one knows who Prithivi Shah is outside Nepal today. It’s the Gurkhas from the Indian armies after 1816 that became world famous and like I said it has taken 200 years to achieve this. It was not the Gorkhali army under Prithivi Shah. So the only thing I presume you are trying to imply is that the Thakuris are the ORIGINAL GURKHAS. Since you touched on the subject, lets determine who the ORIGINAL GURKHAS were and if Thakuris were the only ORIGINAL GURKHAS.
Enigma

UK

#235 May 5, 2011
Deepesh shah wrote:
We thakuri r the real gurkha...gurung,magar,rai,limb u bri bol chas....aile tero bao ko biyah herai dinchu bujis....
We r the son of pirtvi narayan shah bujis
ORIGINAL GURKHAS formed under Prithivi Narayan Shah.
Prithivi Narayan Shah (Thakuri King) from the House of Gorkha, raised an army from Gorkha and the surrounding area to conquer Kathmandu and unite the whole of Nepal. He succeeded on conquering Kathmandu valley but died before he could conquer the whole of what we know today as Nepal. But his sons and followers achieved his dreams. Now let us look in dept who his followers were and who were in his Gorkhali army.
Gorkha is in west central Nepal and is the Heartland of Gurungs and Magars. Gorkha used to be a Magar Kingdom before the Shah Dynasty took over and Prithivi Narayan Shah only trusted 4 tribes Thakuri/Chettri/Gurungs and Magars in his army. No other Tribes were allowed to enlist apart from these 4 tribes. The bulk and Majority of the army were Magars, followed by Gurungs (who were not allowed to be commanders), than Chettris and the tribe with the smallest representative were Thakuris who were mainly commanders.
Prithivi Narayan Shah made Biraj Thapa (Magar) his first ever Kaji (Chief) and Biraj Thapa is the first ever chief of the Nepalese army. Shah said in his Dibya Updesh “In giving the Kazi’s post to the Pandes, Basnyets, Panths and Magars, give it to them each in turn.” Isn’t it funny how your Thakuri King made a Magar Kaji and trusted Chettris and Magars before any Thakuris? It was the blood of Thakuris/Chettris/Magars and Gurngs from west central Nepal that were spilt in the expansion of Nepal. Without the help of Chettris and especially Gurungs/Magars who made the bulk of the army, Prithivi Shah would not have an army and would have never fulfilled his dreams. Now do you think Prihivi Narayan Shah would have also considered Chettris/Gurungs and Magars as his sons or was Thakuris his only sons and Gorkhalis like you mentioned?
This was the ORIGINAL GURKHA army that united Nepal, now lets talk about the GURKHAS that went on to become World famous.
Enigma

UK

#236 May 5, 2011
Deepesh shah wrote:
We thakuri r the real gurkha...gurung,magar,rai,limb u bri bol chas....aile tero bao ko biyah herai dinchu bujis....
We r the son of pirtvi narayan shah bujis
GURKHAS in the Indian and British Army.
The Anglo-Nepalese war took place between 1814-1816. The British were so impressed by the bravery shown by the Gorkhali army that they wanted to recruit Gurkhas into their Indian armies. I think even you know this. The Gorkhali regiment led by Bal Bhadra Kunwar (Chettri) was Shree Purano Gorakh. Shree Purano Gorakh was the 2nd regiment raised by Prithivi Narayan Shah himself in 1763 and consisted entirely of Magars (again isn’t it funny how a Thakuri King raised a pure Magar regiment but never a pure Thakuri regiment). Shree Purano Gorakh is still in existence today in the Nepalese Army and still consists entirely of Magars.
Initially Thakuris/Chettris and Gurungs/Magars were the only ones recruited by the British. But through time and experience the British regarded Gurungs and Magars to be the idle Gurkha soldiers and started recruiting exclusively from these 2 tribes. From 1816 till the end of the century, 7 Gurung/Magar regiments were raised. Thakuris /Chettris were still recruited but in very limited numbers and they never raised more than 1 Thakuri/Chettri regiment. The Nepalese government had to beg the British not to recruit only from Gurung/Magars because central Nepal (Gurung/Magar heartland) had no one but old men/children and women left to attend their fields. The British then stared to recruit Rai/Limbu from east of Nepal and were also very impressed by them. They raised 2 Rai/Limbu regiments.
After partition from India, the British wanted to keep their Gurkha tradition going and took 4 regiments from the Indian army to form part of the British Army. And guess what? 2 were Gurung /Magars and 2 were Rai/Limbus. Many Tamangs and Sunwars also made big contribution to the Gurkhas. I think I covered just about everything.
Now if you had said that the King who led the original Gorkahli army was Thakuri or Thakuris played a prominent part in uniting Nepal then I would have no problem accepting this because this is facts of history. But if you are gonna rant and rave in an uncivilized manner, at least make sure you know what you are talking about because I know my history inside out. The original Gorkhali army was a multicultural army and the Gurkhas who went on to become world famous has always been a multicultural army. I will expose you and anyone who tries to hijack the Gurkha name for themselves. Bujis!!
And finally your comment “gurung,magar,rai,limb u bri bol chas”. Now do you realise what a stupid comment this was? You take Chettri/Thakuri Regiment (9th Gurkha Riffles) out of Gurkhas, then it doesn’t make any difference. You Take Gurung/Magar/Rai/Limbus out of Gurkhas, then there is no Gurkhas. This is facts of history and it’s in black and white. BUJIS!!!

yaudheya

Gwalior, India

#238 May 8, 2011
Dear [ Enigma ] Ajay , we have reached on that level of debate from where any one of us can't interpret his view because we have decided different criteria of ' hardness ' as you didn't accept the Gen. Kaul's refrence ,So leave it .
You looks a noble person and have a good knowledge of military history and i want to get some knowledge about the history of Gurkhas , especially about the beginning of ' True Gorkhas '. I also want to know , what was the position of Gorkhas in Nepal during 327 b.c. to 900 ad .

If you have any site address , please tell me .

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