MANY SDA's believe WEDNESDAY Crucifix...
Gerhard Ebersoehn

South Africa

#4153 Nov 25, 2014
One must take into account the disciples’ utter confusion and the chaos caused by the natural disasters of the “darkness”[1],“earthquak e”[2],“rent veil”[2],“opened graves”[3], and fallen-in door-lintel of the portal into the sanctuary[4]. So the disciples could impossible have had their passover meal “the first night”[5]“on the fifteenth”[6], after “when it had become evening already”[7] three to four hours after Jesus had given his life “the ninth hour”[8] before sunset[9]:“on the 14 Nisan” the day before.
So the disciples rather even before Jesus had died, would have gone into hiding in the very room where two days after “when being evening regarding the First Day of the week, thronged-in-together-still behind closed doors for fear of the Jews”[10], Jesus found his disciples confused and in consternation,“disheartened with the death of their Messiah”.

Therefore instead of Jesus’ disciples should have buried Him, God designed Joseph and Nicodemus would come forward and without the help of his disciples and in their absence, would bury Him in faith and obedience to God’s Laws of the Passover of Yahweh.[11]
[1] Mark 15:33 Matthew 27:45 Luke 23:44
[2] Matthew 27:51
[3] Matthew 27:52
[4]…
[5] John 19:39
[6] Leviticus 23:6
[7] Mark 15:42 Matthew 27:57 John 19:31,38
[8] Mark 15:33,34 Matthew 27:45,46 Luke 23:44
[9] John 11:9
[10] John 20:19
[11] John 19:40 Exodus 12:10 Genesis 50:26 et al

It was ONLY Joseph—who is the only one MENTIONED—, who dared to ask Pilate for Jesus’ body.

And it was ONLY Nicodemus—who is the only one MENTIONED, who later on in “the first night” of ULB,“also came to him (Joseph) there”, where the two of them “treated the body of Jesus” and “prepared” it for the grave.

Not one of the twelve disciples came to or were present “where” Pilate “had delivered” the body to and Joseph “then treated” it. Joseph and Nicodemus undertook alone; they were only the two of them—these two members of the Sanhedrin. Of all Jesus’ followers they were the only who were members of the Sanhedrin; perhaps that was why John could record,
“There came also Nicodemus to him (Joseph) who having met at the first night (of ulb)”–‘ehlthen de kai Nikodehmos ho elthohn pros auton nuktos to prohton’.

Under normal circumstances as members of the Sanhedrin, Joseph and Nicodemus most likely would have met for their passover meal-together, and there and then must between the two of them have decided to ask Pilate for Jesus’ body as well as for permission to bury him according to the Jews’ Ethics to Bury their Passover.

In fact, that is what the Text states,“There came also Nicodemus to him (Joseph) who HAVING MET AT THE FIRST NIGHT (of ULB)”–‘ehlthen de kai Nikodehmos ho ELTHOHN pros auton NUKTOS TO PROHTON’. And that may explain the relevance of the Preposition ‘pros’ and its syntactical accompanying Accusative in both the Pronoun ‘auton’ and the nomenclature ‘nuktos to prohton’—“for the First Night” or “at the First Night” or “on account of” or “pertaining to” or,“for the First Night”. As follows,
“Nicodemus also came there ON ACCOUNT OF Joseph and they HAVING MET AT THE FIRST NIGHT”—of unleavened bread!

Thank God and praise His Name for the wonderful TRUTH in His Word!
Gerhard Ebersoehn

South Africa

#4154 Nov 25, 2014
Which makes me think of yet another wonderful reality that struck me the other day while I was thinking about Jesus Crucifixion and Burial, that it is the SCRIPTURES that demand that it should happen over “two days”—“after two days the LORD will revive us; in the third day He will raise us up”—speaking of our God just like it is written of Him in Royal Plural at the creation already!
Anyway, here is what struck me about the shear stupidity of the same-day crucifixion and burial heresy for making use of Deuteronomy 21:22,23—FALSELY of course.‘They say’, Jesus HAD to be buried (“in haste” they always have to add FALSELY) on the same day He was crucified and died,“before sunset” because Deuteronomy 21 assumedly demanded it.
Now IF that were so, then what about the Jews’ concern over the Law which prohibited them to partake in the passover meal in the night after the sacrifice of the lamb if they had touched the body of a dead human?
These before sunset buried daft have no answer. But if after their passover meal ---or after their would-be passover meal at this the last of all passovers a Jew might have touched a dead, then there is no fear for getting unclean after, and Joseph and Nicodemus could at their own time, peacefully and meticulously, proceed “to the Ethics of the Jews” to “handle”,“prepare” and “treat” the body of “Our Passover” and “Lamb of God”“to…” in the end,“lay Him in the tomb”— the tomb itself even, as “in the Prophets concerning the Christ how He ought to have suffered” according to God’s fore-knowledge and predestination,“prepared and ready at hand”.
birdman

Mattoon, IL

#4155 Nov 26, 2014
Wednesday Crucifixion is a False belief that Satan has deceived people to believe.
STEENBERG

Santa Monica, CA

#4156 Nov 26, 2014
birdman wrote:
Wednesday Crucifixion is a False belief that Satan has deceived people to believe.
Satan worked through the Catholics, not only to teach you about a false TRINITY, but also to convince you that the resurrection occurred on Sunday morning so you can celebrate :the Lord's day" and forget about the Sabbath! Catch? Google Fred Coulter for the most accurate, moment by moment countdown to the WEDNESDAY late afternoon crucifixion and get the settled in you mind once for all! Do that even before you attack the turkey. Happy Thanksgiving!
Gerhard Ebersoehn

Johannesburg, South Africa

#4157 Nov 26, 2014
STEENBERG wrote:
<quoted text>Satan worked through the Catholics, not only to teach you about a false TRINITY, but also to convince you that the resurrection occurred on Sunday morning so you can celebrate :the Lord's day" and forget about the Sabbath! Catch? Google Fred Coulter for the most accurate, moment by moment countdown to the WEDNESDAY late afternoon crucifixion and get the settled in you mind once for all! Do that even before you attack the turkey. Happy Thanksgiving!
Please say something out of your own?!
Gerhard Ebersoehn

Johannesburg, South Africa

#4158 Nov 26, 2014
Something other than about turkeys.
Gerhard Ebersoehn

Johannesburg, South Africa

#4159 Nov 26, 2014
birdman wrote:
Wednesday Crucifixion is a False belief that Satan has deceived people to believe.
You have never read anything. Yet it is true what you say. Nevertheless you just refer to the rear end of the porcupine on the attack. On the attack the porcupine's front end is its sharp end. And the first Christian politician knew that very well. So he let slip the loop of his lasso pole from the rear end to the sharp end over the porcupine 's spines and strangled him at the throat. You know what I mean? No?

Well Justin Martyr started the present universally accepted corruption in Matthew 28:1---the sharp end of our present thorny issue. Said he before anybody else, Jesus was Crucified the day before the day of Saturn and was Raised on the Day after the day of Saturn on the day of the Sun.
Gerhard Ebersoehn

Johannesburg, South Africa

#4161 Dec 5, 2014
Where have all the enemies of their only enemy gone?!

Bunnies hiding in sand bunkers ....
Rubies

Hobart, Australia

#4162 Dec 9, 2014
Gerhard Ebersoehn wrote:
Where have all the enemies of their only enemy gone?!
Bunnies hiding in sand bunkers ....
You still mashing your gums to yourself Gerhard? Nobody's interested any more.
Gerhard Ebersoehn

South Africa

#4163 Dec 12, 2014
... says she who does not know a thing ...

It is not for a lack of interest or disinterest; it is a matter of lack of knowledge and humbleness to admit the substance of the Day-of-Substance in Jesus’ Last Passover. It is a matter with people like you, Rubies, of pride hurt and disdain for purity and simplicity of Biblical truth. Because it touches upon your Holy Sunday.

My book about you is taking on shape. For substance though, I had to bring in others in other places to the discussion.

What stands out so far, is the only defence deniers of Jesus' Burial Day has : their sheer denial of and refusal to declare ignorance in the issue. Seeing they pretend blind --- it is YOUR 'argument', sissie, yours…: <<...it does not exist...">>. Nothing ‘new’ yet because nothing ‘new’ will ever come out of empty denial.
Gerhard Ebersoehn

South Africa

#4164 Dec 12, 2014
.
But the whole world already is TAKING NOTICE already ... you - faked Rubies - just don't know, once again.
.
Gerhard Ebersoehn

Emmarentia, South Africa

#4165 Dec 16, 2014
Rubies:
“Ceremonial sabbath” is a furphy that must be discarded in light of scripture. It is special pleading engaged in by the SDAs for the sole purpose of discrediting this verse :
Col 2:16 Therefore let no one pass judgment on you
in questions of food and drink,
or with regard to FESTIVAL {ANNUAL observation}
or NEW MOON {MONTHLY observation}
or SABBATH.{WEEKLY observation.}
The SDA and COG foundation and very reason for existence crumbles, of course, if this verse refers to the weekly Sabbath. Which it clearly does.
Taking their aversion to extremes, many sabbatarians these days hate the truth of this verse so vehemently, that they pronounce Paul an apostate and delete his all words from their bibles.
Hence the many decades of denial and subterfuge engaged in, creating other “ceremonial sabbaths” which were all supposedly “nailed to the Cross.“
This conspicuous ploy spectacularly fails when SDAs next insist that the “DAY of Atonement” was NOT nailed to the Cross with all the other Appointed Feasts, but began in 1844 and is still continuing today, 170 YEARS later, with no end in sight.
Therefore, PROSABBATON which means “before Sabbath” can only be FRIDAY. And since PARASKEUE = PROSABBATON, then PARASKEUE explicitly, and invariably, means FRIDAY.… All 4 Gospels unequivocally, emphatically and unanimously state that Jesus was crucified, He died and was buried on FRIDAY.

GE:
Even were every word, true, it does not, <state>, nor does it indicate or elude to, nor does it prove,“He died and was buried on FRIDAY”. Your post has been useless ‘information’ of no value even for anything else in life. You have said, nothing in fact. And you need not have mentioned these things, are you trying to show with them that they mean that “He died and was buried on FRIDAY”. Rather keep quiet and save face. Because the day Jesus was BURIED on, started where the Gospels say “the evening had come already” in four ‘parallel Scriptures’—which “evening” in all four ‘parallel Scriptures’,”had already come” AFTER the previous and past day on which Jesus had been Crucified and had Died.
Bring the Manuscript(s) which have Mark 15:42 “The evening had come and because it already was The Preparation which is the Fore-Sabbath Joseph went in before Pilate”, BEFORE 15:24,37 Jesus’ Crucifixion and death! Bring them, quote them! Then you may say what you are trying to say with “evening” in every sense and manner occurring, AFTER 15:24,37 Jesus’ Crucifixion and Death! And bring it in every one of <<all 4 Gospels>>, or admit their truth and your, fraud! Bring the Manuscript(s) which have Matthew 27:57 “When the even was come, there came Joseph”, before 27:35,50 Jesus’ Crucifixion and death! Bring the Manuscript(s) which have Luke 23:50,52 “Behold, Joseph went unto Pilate”, before 23:33,46 Jesus’ Crucifixion and death! Bring the Manuscript(s) which have John 19:31,38 “the Jews because the Preparation had begun, asked Pilate” and “his side (was) pierced” and “after (them) Joseph asked Pilate”, before 19:23,30 Jesus’ Crucifixion and death! Bring, quote, <<all 4 Gospels>>! THEN, Rubies, shall I listen to you; NOT BEFORE!

Rubies:
Hundreds of years of written testimony of Church Fathers corroborates the truth of this. Any other interpretation is unscriptural specious argument from those with a spurious gospel to support. QUOD ERAT DEMONSTRANDUM : All 4 Gospels unequivocally, emphatically and unanimously state that Jesus was crucified, He died and was buried on FRIDAY.

GE:
Quote? You have <<a spurious gospel to support>>, Rubies; not me. You—ironically or not ironic whatsoever—are the one in collaboration with the Seventh-day Adventists, not me. You are the party here, who acts the Seventh-day Adventist, the Roman Catholic and the sect and the cult; not me.
Kevin McMillen

Morgantown, WV

#4166 Dec 17, 2014
Gerhard Ebersoehn wrote:
<quoted text>
Where does it say that?1
It does not. READ Leviticus 23:16.
Lev 23:16
Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD.

What day is the morrow after the sabbath? Lev. 23 is plain, seven "shabbaths" shall be complete. A "shabbath" can not be from Tuesday to Tuesday, it can only be from Sabbath to Sabbath.

So Lev. 23:16 does indeed say that the fiftieth day is always on the day after the Sabbath. It does not fall on any day of the week as the Jews count.

Kevin McMillen
Kevin McMillen

Morgantown, WV

#4167 Dec 17, 2014
Gerhard Ebersoehn wrote:
<quoted text>
In Leviticus
"seven sabbaths’-weeks" = 7 x 7 days-weeks determined by its first day counted which was the Seventh Day Sabbath for which reason Leviticus uses "Sabbaths" to describe the 7 groups of days each of which BEGAN with a 7th day "Sabbath".
The 7 x “sabbaths'-weeks” must be counted "FROM the day after the sabbath" of the passover, whichever day of the week it might be.
You keep insisting here that the hebrew word "shabbath" means weeks, it does not. A shabbath can not be from Tuesday to Tuesday or from Friday to Friday.

Shabbath either means the Sabbath or theseven day period from one Sabbath to another. It never means Tuesday to Tuesday.

So the seven sabbaths - weeks must be counted from the weekly sabbath for the 50th day to fall after the seventh "shabbath".

Kevin McMillen
Rubies

Hobart, Australia

#4168 Dec 18, 2014
STEENBERG wrote:
<quoted text>Satan worked through the Catholics, not only to teach you about a false TRINITY, but also to convince you that the resurrection occurred on Sunday morning so you can celebrate :the Lord's day" and forget about the Sabbath! Catch? Google Fred Coulter for the most accurate, moment by moment countdown to the WEDNESDAY late afternoon crucifixion and get the settled in you mind once for all! Do that even before you attack the turkey. Happy Thanksgiving!
Have you ever posted any rebuttals to my extremely thorough debunking of Fred Coulter's claptrap? On the Fred Coulter thread?
Rubies

Hobart, Australia

#4169 Dec 18, 2014
DANNO wrote:
Steenberg.
Do you think you can be the FIRST member on here to answer a simple question?
Acts 9:7 (KJV) says:-
And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, HEARING A VOICE but seeing NO man.
>>==>>====>> ==~~~~===~
Acts 22:9 (KJV) says:-
And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; BUT THEY HEARD NOT THE VOICE of him that spake to me.
Question: Did Paul's companions hear the voice ? Yes or no
I really would like to read your answer to this question.
Thanx
No you would not like a response.

Since you don't even believe the Bible, then why do you bother imagining you are a christian?
Rubies

Hobart, Australia

#4170 Dec 18, 2014
Kevin McMillen wrote:
<quoted text>
The prophecy says that he will cause the sacrifice and oblations to cease, which Jesus' death did. That does not mean he can't reinstate them at some point in the future.
So my argument does not collapse.
I have no idea why he would reinstate them, but as you say Ezekiel prophecies seem to say he does.
Well that just makes no sense. It is clear that sacrifices & oblations DID NOT cease until 70 AD.
The apostles and all the church worshipped at the Temple until then, they all observed the Appointed Feasts, they made and fulfilled vows (which required sacrifices), they wrote to teh church to continue observing the feasts.

The Gentiles were never required nor permitted to sacrifice at the Temple (nor to observe the Sabbath), but Jesus' death provided for us, the covering blood that was prefigured by the Israelites' Passover sacrifices.
For the Israelites, it was business as usual at the Temple between 30 - 70 AD, whether or not they were born-again Messianic believers.
Rubies

Hobart, Australia

#4171 Dec 18, 2014
Kevin McMillen wrote:
<quoted text>
This is probably one of the most ignorant statements that I've seen on this forum.
So, a shabbathon is not a shabbath huh?
It is correct that only the weekly sabbath and the day of atonement are called "shabbath shabbathon", but to claim that a shabbathon is not a shabbath if the word shabbath is not used is ridiculous.
That's like if someone said "The wind sure is windy today." and someone else said "It sure is windy." That the second person wasn't talking about the wind since the word wind wasn't used.
Rubies, you make no sense.
Maybe you haven't studied the subject of the two sabbaths during the crucifixion week enough.
What does Matt. 28:1 say?
It says, transliterated from the Greek to English:
At the end (or after) the sabbaton, as it began to dawn towards the first sabbaton.
The King James incorrectly says this:
Mat 28:1

In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week,
What it really says is, "after the sabbaths, as it began to dawn towards the first of the sabbaths.
After what Sabbaths? The first day of unleavened bread which fell on a Thursday and the weekly Sabbath. Which would mean Jesus died on a Wednesday, and "three days and three nights" later would bring us to the wave sheaf day which was not Sunday which starts at midnight but just after sunset after the weekly sabbath.
What is the first of the sabbaths?
This was the first day of the seven sabbaths count to Pentecost.
Your convoluted argument about the 15th day of Abib not being a shabbath because it is called a shabbathon is pathetic!1695
Wish I knew how to retract some kind "Judge It" icons I gave you.
There is only ONE SABBATH!
And you, being not of Hebrew lineage, are not included in its covenant!
Kevin McMillen

Morgantown, WV

#4172 Dec 19, 2014
Rubies wrote:
<quoted text>
Well that just makes no sense. It is clear that sacrifices & oblations DID NOT cease until 70 AD.
.
Rubies, this only goes to show that your mind is limited. The Jews may not have ceased to offer the sacrifices until 70ad, but that doesn't mean that God required them after Jesus died.

So, the need for sacrifices and oblations did indeed cease at Jesus' death.

This is why it is so hard to discuss the truth of the bible with people like you, you are either blinded by God or your stubbornness has blinded you.

Kevin McMillen
Kevin McMillen

Morgantown, WV

#4173 Dec 19, 2014
Rubies wrote:
<quoted text>
Wish I knew how to retract some kind "Judge It" icons I gave you.
There is only ONE SABBATH!
And you, being not of Hebrew lineage, are not included in its covenant!
Why do you waste your time with those stupid "judge it" icons? They mean nothing.

Isa 56:6
Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

We can argue whether the covenant spoken of here is the Mt. Sinai covenant or the "Everlasting" covenant, but what's the point.

I personally believe that God has had an "Everlasting" covenant with man from his creation. The Mt. Sinai covenant was merely a sidetrack to that covenant because of transgressions.

The New Covenant in Jesus' blood is continuation and fulfillment of the shed blood required for that "Everlasting" covenant.

The New Covenant which God will make in the future with Israel and Judah Jer. 31 and Heb. 8 are also a continuation of that same "Everlasting" covenant.

Dispensationalism is a crock. God defining sin differently amongst dispensations is a crock.

God's law has always been the same. The only difference is the Mt. Sinai covenant where God had to treat Israel like a bunch of little kids, you can't do this, you can't do that, because they were a stiff necked rebellious people.

God's law has always defines sin, from creation. This is how we know what is transgression, what is a sin.

Gal. 3, because of transgressions, God added the law, as a conditional covenant, to the "Everlasting" covenant.

The "Everlasting" covenant is an unconditional covenant, but God's law still shows us what sin is.

Sinning does not remove us or break our "Everlasting" covenant with God, but it does require repentence.

The truth is really so simple, but stubborn people just want to confuse things.

Kevin McMillen

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