Who Is Allah?

Who Is Allah?

There are 256357 comments on the The Brussels Journal story from Aug 24, 2007, titled Who Is Allah?. In it, The Brussels Journal reports that:

“Allah is a very beautiful word for God. Shouldn't we all say that from now on we will name God Allah? [...] What does God care what we call him?”

From the desk of Soeren Kern on Fri, 2007-08-24 11:56 Europeans love to mock the salience of religion in American society. via The Brussels Journal

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Brussels Journal.

susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#182687 Jul 12, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
So let me see if I can guess what is going on. What you write here is an extension to the Torah? Or is it a correction of the Torah and everybody but you has the wrong version? Should we all throw out the Torah that we have and listen to your version instead?
Deuteronomy 13:1-5 tells us not to listen to a prophet or spiritual person who advocates going after other gods. Verse 4 "Ye shall walk after the Lord your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him" The rebbee is a false prophet and he's trying to lead you all astray.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#182688 Jul 12, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing funny at all, Seeker.
Muhammad recited what ever was revealed and people recorded it.
Peter did not recite anything as he was revealed nothing. Even Jesus was not recorded as he spoke.
That is why the gospels are named as "Gospel, according to......."
But you are saying that it is impossible for Peter to have created any book since he was illiterate. But clearly, he could merely say things to someone else and have them transcribe it. But that's irrelevant anyway because you failed miserable at proving he was illiterate anyway. In that verse you used, nobody asked Peter to read or write anything, so how could the Rabbi authorities know whether he was illiterate or not? They didn't, they were commenting about his speaking style and the content of what he said and saying that he never attended any formal Rabbinical school and therefore wondered where he thought he had the authority to speak as he did in front of people. That was what was meant by unschooled or unlearned. Nobody said, hey Peter, read this.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#182689 Jul 12, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
You are very well-read, Susan.
Malachi 2:1-10 was a prophesy about the Church and her priests.
Absolutely bmz, and it's been fulfilled.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#182690 Jul 12, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
obviously not, you retard

The more I follow your line of questioning, I think you are the one with the less marbles than Mr yehoshua
lol!

That was a great tip.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#182691 Jul 12, 2013
Rabbeen Al Jihad wrote:
<quoted text>SalaamZ SneeKr. I disagree whole heartedly! Terrorism is not sanction'd by the holy-Qur'An. Where as some fly by night Imams interpretation of it might very well be misunderstood as service to ALLAHs cause. CheerZ
Do I have to actually get the verses? Maybe you would like the ones about striking terror into their hearts? Or maybe the ones about smiting their necks like they tried to do to Rigby? Or maybe the one they quoted about fight them as they fight you? Wasn't Rigby a former soldier in Afghanistan? So what was the meat clever guy doing wrong? What part of the Quran did he violate? He didn't kill any women, right? As Choudary would say, "this is Islam". Face it. Your denial reminds me of this verse.

2:216
Fighting is ordained for you, even though it be hateful to you; but it may well be that you hate a thing the while it is good for you, and it may well be that you love a thing the while it is bad for you: and God knows, whereas you do not know.

So while you may not like it, it is ordained for you as a Muslim, and if you don't like it, then you are not being a real Muslim and this verse is talking about people like you. Allah does not like the pacifist who does not want to fight.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#182692 Jul 12, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
But you are saying that it is impossible for Peter to have created any book since he was illiterate. But clearly, he could merely say things to someone else and have them transcribe it. But that's irrelevant anyway because you failed miserable at proving he was illiterate anyway. In that verse you used, nobody asked Peter to read or write anything, so how could the Rabbi authorities know whether he was illiterate or not? They didn't, they were commenting about his speaking style and the content of what he said and saying that he never attended any formal Rabbinical school and therefore wondered where he thought he had the authority to speak as he did in front of people. That was what was meant by unschooled or unlearned. Nobody said, hey Peter, read this.
Acts describes Peter and john as unschooled or uneducated or unlearned men, Seeker.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#182693 Jul 12, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
Acts describes Peter and john as unschooled or uneducated or unlearned men, Seeker.
Look, that's fine, just ignore the entire rational and logical explanation I gave. No surprise.
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#182694 Jul 12, 2013
Seeker wrote:
How accurate they are, and out of all of them, the most specific and accurate would appear to me to be the one's from Mother Shipton. She was supposedly an old woman who lived as a recluse in a cave in the 12th century, but some people claim that a guy in the 1600's added to her prophecies. But even if someone in the 17th century created this, they are strikingly specific and accurate.

http://www.pyramidtlc.org/mother.htm
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
I need not have to know the names of these "Prophesy makers", because our discussion is in a particular direction.
MUQ, have you ever heard of the concept of "leading questions"? It is what a lawyer does where he controls the whole conversation and only asks certain questions and demands that the witness only be able to give certain limited answers so that the questions lead to the conclusions that he wants. Sometimes this is also done by Salesmen. It really isn't seen as very honest and is usually not even allowed in any debate. But this is precisely what you are attempting to do whether you realize it or not, and it is in no shape or form a proper method of debate. First you want to shape the rules, then you want to shape the order of the questions, then you want to shape the only allowable answers. I'm not stupid at all. I probably am far more educated than you are which is why I recognize exactly what you are attempting, when you might not even be educated enough to realize what you are attempting. And again, this is never considered an acceptable or proper form of debate.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
PS:
I have left out all personal remarks and want to focus on topic.
So I repeat my Question:
What is the difference between Prophesies made by prophets of God and those who are in the "prophesy business"
None of the people I referenced considered themselves to be in the "prophecy business" and all claimed that their prophecies came from visions.

I'm sorry that you didn't get the answer you expected so that it fits into your "road map", but if you were more educated, you wouldn't have even attempted your road map and would have known better.
Ans.

01. I think both of us know what is aim of our discussion. But if we jump straight into that topic without laying some foundation and knowing about each other’s views, it would be a fruitless discussion.

02. That is the reason I want to sort out some important issues, the purpose is not to “cross examine you by asking leading questions”.

03. We agreed that Prophesies are for telling about some future event.

04. Then I asked you who make these prophesies, you said Prophets and some other people.

05. I then asked you, what is difference between prophesies made by prophets and other people. This is a very logical question but your answer is not very clear.

06. Can I say that Prophets get the information direct from God and these other persons from some sort of vision, will you agree with that?

07. And can I say prophesies made by Prophets of God are always true and shall come to pass, but those made by other people, might come to pass, or might not come to pass.

Please provide your comments or agreement on this, before we come to the next step.

PS:

a. I did not mean any disrespect by calling other people in “prophesy business”. I just wanted to separate them from Prophets of God. It does not necessarily mean that they had a “business”

b. You have to be patient with me, because I said earlier that I want this to be a slow step by step discussion.
Fateh

Toronto, Canada

#182695 Jul 12, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
No one really knows, Fateh but I was trying to show what Shamma may think.
I was trying to elaborate on your point that know one really knows.
Seeker

Lowell, MA

#182696 Jul 12, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
01. I think both of us know what is aim of our discussion. But if we jump straight into that topic without laying some foundation and knowing about each other’s views, it would be a fruitless discussion.
Why is that? I think it would save a lot of time.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
02. That is the reason I want to sort out some important issues, the purpose is not to “cross examine you by asking leading questions”.
Well then just say what you want to say, otherwise there is no reason for what you are doing. I'm not being dishonest at all, in fact, I am being completely fair and honest and straightforward and upfront. I have no ulterior motives that will be revealed later. I say it all upfront openly and honestly.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
03. We agreed that Prophesies are for telling about some future event.
Sure, that's what the word means.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
04. Then I asked you who make these prophesies, you said Prophets and some other people.
Actually, I said anybody who thinks that they have received actual visions.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
05. I then asked you, what is difference between prophesies made by prophets and other people. This is a very logical question but your answer is not very clear.
One claims they are part of actual scriptures, or is claimed to be such, in the other case they claim they are not part of any religious scriptures but have received visions anyway. Anybody can claim they are the real thing either way.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
06. Can I say that Prophets get the information direct from God and these other persons from some sort of vision, will you agree with that?
No, not necessarily. For example, Muhammad claimed he received everything from the God, but I do not believe that. In fact, he never even claimed that God talked to him directly, but only the "Angel" Gabriel, and the person who identified it as Gabriel was actually someone from a very wayward or even heretical sect of Christianity.
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
07. And can I say prophesies made by Prophets of God are always true and shall come to pass, but those made by other people, might come to pass, or might not come to pass.
Well, if they are REALLY guided by God, then SOME day they will ultimately come to pass, but that's about all that I can say. How could I say anymore? How would I know? How could you?

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#182697 Jul 12, 2013
yehoshooah adam wrote:
<quoted text>
rabbee: your way to close to being true to the more subtle, than any other beast of the fields to be true to G-D here in TheTorah Happening. your so far from the real truth of G-D, it is apathetically pathetic. you hypocrite, your doing the same thing with the muslems. i am just telling you all, that your all full of hogwash.
You need to ask God to enlighten your mind rabbee as to what TheTorah is all about.
You are preaching the Adam that is in the Muslim Koran.
Allah had all the angels bow to Adam, and you are claiming to be that Adam in the Muslim Koran rabbee.
Are you the Muslim Adam in the Koran rabbee?
Faith

New Baltimore, MI

#182698 Jul 12, 2013
Allah was a w'hore and Muhammad was his ass-pimp.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#182699 Jul 12, 2013
@seeker I had a vision of my own death almost 30 years ago where I went to Heaven. It was just like near death experience with the tunnels and the light. That is why I am so brazen in my beliefs, I know I am going to Heaven no matter what. I have no fear of death but I do fear Gods punishment in this life. That is why I am perfectly holy but I still fast on Yom Kippur anyway. "Whom the Lord loves, he corrects even as a father the son in whom he delights".
MUQ

Qatif, Saudi Arabia

#182700 Jul 12, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Why is that? I think it would save a lot of time.
<quoted text>
Well then just say what you want to say, otherwise there is no reason for what you are doing. I'm not being dishonest at all, in fact, I am being completely fair and honest and straightforward and upfront. I have no ulterior motives that will be revealed later. I say it all upfront openly and honestly.
<quoted text>
Sure, that's what the word means.
<quoted text>
Actually, I said anybody who thinks that they have received actual visions.
<quoted text>
One claims they are part of actual scriptures, or is claimed to be such, in the other case they claim they are not part of any religious scriptures but have received visions anyway. Anybody can claim they are the real thing either way.
<quoted text>
No, not necessarily. For example, Muhammad claimed he received everything from the God, but I do not believe that. In fact, he never even claimed that God talked to him directly, but only the "Angel" Gabriel, and the person who identified it as Gabriel was actually someone from a very wayward or even heretical sect of Christianity.
<quoted text>
Well, if they are REALLY guided by God, then SOME day they will ultimately come to pass, but that's about all that I can say. How could I say anymore? How would I know? How could you?
How can we discuss about prophesies in scripture, unless I know what is their position in your eyes?

If you have no belief in these prophesies and consider them "at par or even lower" than those by some cave dwellers, then what is the worth of our discussion?

Because is the prophesies in scriptures which is our main topic of discussion and we have to concentrate on that.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#182701 Jul 12, 2013
Most prophecies especially those made by people claiming to be religious men or divine messengers are mere day dreams that never get fulfilled.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#182702 Jul 12, 2013
REASON BEHIND FAILED PROPHECIES:

Visions can be seen from any plane of consciousness - gross physical, subtle physical,lower vital, higher vital, mental, higher mind, illumined mind, intuitive mind, overmind, supermind and so on. A vision need not fulfill itself since often there comes about a fresh infusion of external forces into the force formation (event) "seen" by the seer and this fresh invasion of forces into the existing force formation alters the causation with the result that the old force formation gets disturbed and it may also get dissolved and the event associated with it that was foreseen never fulfills itself or the outcome is quite different from the original. This is why most visions fail.
JOEL

India

#182703 Jul 12, 2013
A cause (or a variety of causes) begins transforming itself into the effect. The tranced seer perceives this activated causal mechanism and reports that so and so event will transpire in future. The effect materializes at a given date in the future and the prophecy is fulfilled provided nothing like say an invasion of external forces interferes with the causal mechanism of the said event. If an intervention takes place, the causal mechanism is disturbed, modified or dissolved and the prophecy fails. This is the reason most prophecies fail.
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#182704 Jul 12, 2013
Seeker wrote:
<quoted text>
Do I have to actually get the verses? Maybe you would like the ones about striking terror into their hearts? Or maybe the ones about smiting their necks like they tried to do to Rigby? Or maybe the one they quoted about fight them as they fight you? Wasn't Rigby a former soldier in Afghanistan? So what was the meat clever guy doing wrong? What part of the Quran did he violate? He didn't kill any women, right? As Choudary would say, "this is Islam". Face it. Your denial reminds me of this verse.

2:216
Fighting is ordained for you, even though it be hateful to you; but it may well be that you hate a thing the while it is good for you, and it may well be that you love a thing the while it is bad for you: and God knows, whereas you do not know.
So while you may not like it, it is ordained for you as a Muslim, and if you don't like it, then you are not being a real Muslim and this verse is talking about people like you. Allah does not like the pacifist who does not want to fight.
And your omission of 2:217 reminds me of your vicious cherry-picking. Why did you not quote 2:217, which is a continuation of 2:216?

Here it is:

"2:217They ask you about fighting in the sacred month. Tell them,“Fighting in a sacred month is a grave sin and forcing people to turn away from the Lord’s way, denying Him, turning them away from House of Allah and expelling people, is a transgression in the sight of Allah. Persecution is worse than slaughter. They will not stop fighting until they have turned you away from your faith, if they can. If anyone of you turns away from his religion, dies as a disbeliever, all his good works will go to waste in this world and the Hereafter and such will abide forever in hell."

Read this part of 2:217 with the help of a magnifying glass:

"They will not stop fighting until they have turned you away from your faith, if they can"

And who is 'you' in 2:216? Answer: The people with whom the pagans were fighting. Were we the Muslims of this age there?

When you are done with this, go back to discover the "you":

2:190 Fight, in the way of Allah, against those who wage war upon you, but do not commit aggression by attacking first. Allah does not like aggressors, 2:191 and slay them wherever you come upon them. Oppression is worse than slaughter. But do not fight in the vicinity of the Sacred House of Worship unless they attack you there first, but if they fight against you, you may slay them. This shall be the just retribution, such disbelievers deserve. 2:192 But if they desist, then Allah is much-forgiving and the Most Merciful.

2:193 Fight until there is no more oppression, and worship of Allah is established. If the oppressors desist, then there shall be no more hostility, except against oppressors, if any.

2:194 The Sacred months should be kept sacred but you are allowed to retaliate during the sacred months, only if you are attacked. If anyone commits aggression against you, then retaliate likewise and remain conscious of Allah. Know that Allah is with those who are conscious of Him.

Part of the verses to be read with the help of the biggest magnifying glass available in your city:

"Fight, in the way of Allah, against those who wage war upon you, but do not commit aggression by attacking first. Allah does not like aggressors,"

"Oppression is worse than slaughter."

"But do not fight in the vicinity of the Sacred House of Worship unless they attack you there first"

Note the part "unless they attack you there first"

"but if they fight against you, you may slay them." (If they fight)

"If the oppressors desist, then there shall be no more hostility, except against oppressors, if any."

"The Sacred months should be kept sacred but you are allowed to retaliate during the sacred months, only if you are attacked." (Allowed to retaliate only if attacked)

"If anyone commits aggression against you, then retaliate likewise"
bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#182705 Jul 13, 2013
susanblange wrote:
@seeker I had a vision of my own death almost 30 years ago where I went to Heaven. It was just like near death experience with the tunnels and the light. That is why I am so brazen in my beliefs, I know I am going to Heaven no matter what. I have no fear of death but I do fear Gods punishment in this life. That is why I am perfectly holy but I still fast on Yom Kippur anyway. "Whom the Lord loves, he corrects even as a father the son in whom he delights".
Dear Woman,

One can see your unshakeable faith in the LORD Almighty only. And that is what the Trinitarians need to learn.

Also, I did not find you self-loathing at all. This is something great and shows your full trust and faith in the LORD Almighty.

Dear woman, your faith in the LORD Almighty God, has already saved you. You will always remain in peace.

So nice to see that you are not a Mushrik (one who ascribes partners to God Almighty)

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#182706 Jul 13, 2013
bmz wrote:
<quoted text>
And your omission of 2:217 reminds me of your vicious cherry-picking. Why did you not quote 2:217, which is a continuation of 2:216?
Here it is:
"2:217They ask you about fighting in the sacred month. Tell them,“Fighting in a sacred month is a grave sin and forcing people to turn away from the Lord’s way, denying Him, turning them away from House of Allah and expelling people, is a transgression in the sight of Allah. Persecution is worse than slaughter. They will not stop fighting until they have turned you away from your faith, if they can. If anyone of you turns away from his religion, dies as a disbeliever, all his good works will go to waste in this world and the Hereafter and such will abide forever in hell."
Read this part of 2:217 with the help of a magnifying glass:
"They will not stop fighting until they have turned you away from your faith, if they can"
And who is 'you' in 2:216? Answer: The people with whom the pagans were fighting. Were we the Muslims of this age there?
When you are done with this, go back to discover the "you":
2:190 Fight, in the way of Allah, against those who wage war upon you, but do not commit aggression by attacking first. Allah does not like aggressors, 2:191 and slay them wherever you come upon them. Oppression is worse than slaughter. But do not fight in the vicinity of the Sacred House of Worship unless they attack you there first, but if they fight against you, you may slay them. This shall be the just retribution, such disbelievers deserve. 2:192 But if they desist, then Allah is much-forgiving and the Most Merciful.
2:193 Fight until there is no more oppression, and worship of Allah is established. If the oppressors desist, then there shall be no more hostility, except against oppressors, if any.
2:194 The Sacred months should be kept sacred but you are allowed to retaliate during the sacred months, only if you are attacked. If anyone commits aggression against you, then retaliate likewise and remain conscious of Allah. Know that Allah is with those who are conscious of Him.
Part of the verses to be read with the help of the biggest magnifying glass available in your city:
"Fight, in the way of Allah, against those who wage war upon you, but do not commit aggression by attacking first. Allah does not like aggressors,"
"Oppression is worse than slaughter."
"But do not fight in the vicinity of the Sacred House of Worship unless they attack you there first"
Note the part "unless they attack you there first"
"but if they fight against you, you may slay them." (If they fight)
"If the oppressors desist, then there shall be no more hostility, except against oppressors, if any."
"The Sacred months should be kept sacred but you are allowed to retaliate during the sacred months, only if you are attacked." (Allowed to retaliate only if attacked)
"If anyone commits aggression against you, then retaliate likewise"
Every Sura prior to Sura 9:29 is been abrogated.
It is the later Sura's that are the law.
What you quoted are invalid.
Sura 9:29 all Muslims are obligated under to obey.
Sahih International
Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture -[fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.

What you posted is to deceive the non-believer into thinking Islam is a peace full religion.
But Sura 9:29 is the law that turns Muslims into wild savage dogs.

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