Who Is Allah?

Who Is Allah?

There are 256020 comments on the The Brussels Journal story from Aug 24, 2007, titled Who Is Allah?. In it, The Brussels Journal reports that:

“Allah is a very beautiful word for God. Shouldn't we all say that from now on we will name God Allah? [...] What does God care what we call him?”

From the desk of Soeren Kern on Fri, 2007-08-24 11:56 Europeans love to mock the salience of religion in American society. via The Brussels Journal

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Brussels Journal.

Mengal

Quetta, Pakistan

#165552 Feb 28, 2013
The Christians of the seventh century had insensibly relapsed into a semblance of paganism: their public and private vows were addressed to the relics and images that disgraced the temples of the East: the throne of the Almighty was darkened by the clouds of martyrs, and saints, and angels, the objects of popular veneration; and the Collyridian heretics, who flourished in the fruitful soil of Arabia, invested the Virgin Mary with the name and honours of a goddess.[5]
So, there existed a sect in Arabia which exalted Mary(P) to goddess and included her in the godhead along with the Father and Jesus(P).
St. Epiphanius, Bishop of Constantia, in Cyprus, writing in the fourth century against the Collyridians, says:
"After this a heresy appeared, which we have already mentioned slightly by means of the letter written in Arabia about Mary. And this heresy was again made public in Arabia from Thrace and the upper parts of Scythia, and was brought to our ears, which to men of understanding will be found ridiculous and laughable. We will begin to trace it out, and to relate concerning it. It will be judged (to partake of) silliness rather than of sense, as is the case with other like it. For, as formerly, out of insolence towards Mary, those whose opinions were such sowed hurtful ideas in the reflexions of men, so otherwise these, leaning to the other side, fall into the utmost harm...... For the harm is equal in both these heresies, the one belittling the holy Virgin, the other again glorifying her over-much. For who should it be that teach thus but women? for the race of women is slippery, fallible, and humble-minded...... For some women deck out a koutrkon that is to say, a square stool, spreading upon it a linen cloth, on some solemn day of the year, for some days they lay out bread, and offer it in the name of Mary. All the women partake of the bread, as we related in the letter to Arabia, writing partly about that...... Yea, verily, the body of Mary was holy, but was surely not God. Verily, the Virgin was a virgin, and was honoured, but was not given to us to worship; but she worships Him who was born from her according to the flesh, having come from heaven out of the Father's bosom......" This offering and eating of cakes was probably derived from the worship of Artemis.[6]
Apart from the misogynist comments, St. Epiphanius makes quite clear basics of the Collyridian heresy. It is worthwhile adding that even to this day, the Catholic Christians consider Mary(P) as the Mother of God and prayers are sent to her.
Recently, it was heard from the Christian missionaries that the Qur'an does not condemn the 'true' Trinity, i.e., which says the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit constitute the godhead. In fact, the Qur'an itself condemns all sorts of shirk, i.e., associating partners with Allah. It would not matter if the Trinity was composed of any permutations and combinations of the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit or the Mary or even Martin Luther King or Calvin or Pope. It would still be considered as associating partners with Allah. The above verse of the Qur'an 4:171, For Allah is One God, is enough to refute any such bizarre argument. It is equally clear even in the Old Testament & The New Testament that the God is one God without any partners.
Ye [are] my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I [am] he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I,[even] I,[am] the LORD; and beside me [there is] no savior." [Isaiah 43:10-11]
"Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God [is] one LORD" [Deuteronomy 6:4]
"And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment." [Mark 12:29-30]
The above verses speak of themselves.

bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#165553 Feb 28, 2013
John wrote:
Hey bmz, do you ever feel ashamed for serving the murdering rapist paedophile false prophet mad mo???
Who is that? Are you talking about the pedophile Jesus and his pedophile plus homo gang?

I wish to clarify that Jesus was a Bi.

bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#165554 Feb 28, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>I don't know the answer.
Good.

So, let me tell you that nobody was calling God as the Father in the Tanakh. If you see that, inform me quickly.

This Father fills the pages in the New Testament but has not been mentioned in the Jewish Holy Scriptures.

So, next question: How many times the word Father appears in your OT.
MUQ

Qatif, Saudi Arabia

#165555 Feb 28, 2013
Paul WV wrote:
<quoted text>
By Jesus' death and resurrection He reconciled us to God, opened the gates of heaven, made it possible for us to become adopted children of God and heirs to the Kingdom of Heaven. How does bowing down to mecca, kissing a stone or worshiping mohammad save you? How does flying to mecca and walking around a giant cube save you?
I do not know, how death of one person can achieve this?

So many people die every day and so many innocent people are killed. Even prophets of God have been killed and hanged on false charges.

Why you have made the death of Jesus so mysterious? All this is false teachings of Paul, which have mesmerized most of Christians.

Get out of it and talk with reason and logic.

bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#165556 Feb 28, 2013
John wrote:
Hey bmz, do you ever feel ashamed for serving the murdering rapist paedophile false prophet mad mo???
Hey, John

Who took the dominant role, when Jesus was with boys? Do you think it was Jesus?

bmz

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#165557 Feb 28, 2013
Mengal wrote:
Usmankhanb4u
Karachi, Pakist
Mary & Tri Unity
Christian missionaries for quite sometime have been saying that Muhammad(P)'misunderstood' the true concept of Trinity, i.e, which says the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit constitute the trinitarian godhead.
Rev. W. St. Clair Tisdall in his book The Original Sources Of The Qur'an says under Muhammad's Misconception Of The Doctrine Of The Trinity.

...Muhammad heard certain Christians make that there are three Gods, that is to say God the Father, Mary, and Jesus. It is perfectly plain from these verses that Muhammad really did believe that the Christian doctrine inculcated belief in three separate Divine persons, Jesus and Mary being two of them. But our third quotation implies that Muhammad - probably from what he had seen of "Christian" worship - thought that the order was Jesus, Mary, God, or Mary, Jesus, God. No reasonable man will wonder at the indignation with which Muhammad in God's name abjures such blasphemy. We must all feel regret that the idolatrous worship offered to Mary led Muhammad to believe that people who called her "Queen of Heaven" and "Mother of God" really attributed to her Divine attributes.[1]

After a bit of Catholic-bashing, Tisdall laments:
Had he been taught that the doctrine of the Unity of God is the very foundation of the Christian faith, he might have become a Christian reformer. He can never have heard the true explanation of the doctrine of Trinity in Unity, otherwise he would have learnt that Christian theologians spoke of the Father not as "the Third of Three" but as the very "Fount of Deity".[2]
It is quite clear that Tisdall is pretty much aware of the famous heresies in Arabia during the advent of Islam. George Sale in the preliminary discourse to his translation of The Koran writes:
But, to be more particular as to the nation we are now writing of, Arabia was of old famous for heresies; which might be in some measure attributed to the liberty and independency of the tribes. Some of the Christians of that nation believed the soul died with the body, and was to be raised again with it at the last day: these Origen is said to have convinced. Among the Arabs it was that the heresies of Ebion, Beryllus, and the Nazareans, and also that of the Collyridians, were broached, or at least propagated; the latter introduced the Virgin Mary for God, or worshipped her as such offering her a sort of twisted cake called collyris, whence the sect had its name.
This notion of the divinity of the Virgin Mary was also believed by some at the Council of Nice, who said there were two gods besides the Father viz. Christ and the virgin Mary, and were thence named Mariamites. Others imagined her to be exempt from humanity, and deified; which goes but little beyond the popish superstition in calling her the complement of the Trinity, as if it were imperfect without her. This foolish imagination is justly condemned in the Koran as idolatrous, and gave a handle to Mohammed to attack the Trinity itself.[3]
That was brilliant, Mengal.

Thanks and salaams
BMZ

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165558 Mar 1, 2013
The ancient religion of Islam.
http://answering-islam.org/Silas/pagansources...

Muslim claim this ancient pagan religion of Muhammad is the religion of Abraham and Moses.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165559 Mar 1, 2013
THE PAGAN SOURCES OF ISLAM
by Silas

GENERAL
As Muhammad developed Islam he borrowed from the other regional religions present in the Mideast. These religions include Judaism, Christianity, Sabeanism, Zoroastrianism, and forms of paganism. Judaism is the largest contributor to Islam, followed by Christianity, then followed by the various pagan religions, and Muhammad’s mind. These pagan borrowings constitute significant facets of Islam and this article details some of these pagan contributions.

1) PAGANISM IN ISLAM
Islamic theology has some of its roots in various pagan beliefs. Primary to Islam is it's most holiest shrine: the Kaba.

THE KABA
The Kaba is now the most revered sanctuary of Islam. It is located in Mecca. Muslims throughout the world direct their prayers toward the Kaba.

PHYSICAL SHAPE
The Kaba's shape is somewhat cubical. Of note in the Kaba's structure is a black rock built into the wall in its eastern corner. The black rock's diameter is about 12 inches. It is reddish black in color, and has red and yellow particles. The black rock is kissed during the perambulation,(the circulation of the Muslims around the Kaba). The Kaba is about 50 feet high, and the walls are about 40 feet long. The facade contains the door, which starts at 7 feet off the ground, and faces N.E.. To enter the Kaba, a ladder must be used. Also built in the eastern corner, is another stone called "lucky". This stone is only touched, not kissed.

KNOWN PAGAN HISTORY
Apart from Muslim myths, little is really known about the history of the Kaba. About 60 years before Christ, the Roman historian Diodorus Siculus commented that there was in Arabia a temple greatly revered by the Arabs. It is probable that he had the Kaba in mind. It was later mentioned to have existed in the 2nd century; Ptolemy, the geographer mentions it in his work, calling it the 'macoraba'. The Kaba was a sanctuary dedicated to one or more pagan deities. The accounts of the campaigns of Abraha note that it was a place of pagan worship in the 6th century. Information on the distribution of the offices among the sons of Kusayy show that the worship of the sanctuary had developed into a regulated cult several generations before Muhammad.
One historian (Hurgronjes) said that sacred worship may have developed around the area because the Zamzam spring was found in this waterless place.
Pre-Islamic history tells us that many Arabian tribes were stone worshippers. This is also mentioned in Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol 5,#661. The Old Testament even talks about Mideast pagan groups that worshipped stones. Muhammad incorporated the Kaba's paganistic roots into Islam to give the Muslims a sense of identity, legitimacy, and uniqueness. He also wanted to ease the Arab's strain of moving from paganism to Islam, by continuing the practices of their fathers.

PAGAN GODS AND RITUALS
There were 360 idols around the Kaba. The pilgrimages to the Kaba were all pagan pilgrimages, the ritual processions around the Kaba were part of pagan beliefs and custom, the white robes worn by the pilgrims were from pagan faiths, the veneration of the Kaba and black stone are derived from pagan rituals and beliefs. Pagans called out the names of their pagan gods as they circled the Kaba, today, Muslims call out Allah's name. Pagans ran between the nearby hills, Muhammad authorized Muslims to do that in the Quran, and probably ran between the hills himself.

The chief pagan god worshipped there was Hubal, who could be called the god of Mecca and of the Kaba. Hubal is not mentioned in the Quran. The goddesses al-Lat, al-Uzza, and Manat were also worshipped there and are mentioned in the Quran.

It is thought that the Kaba was originally set up for astral worship. Golden suns and moons are repeatedly mentioned as the votive gifts. Some pagans regarded the Kaba as a temple devoted to the sun, moon, and 5 planets.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165560 Mar 1, 2013
Muslims and the Black Stone.
Muslims pagan worship.
THE BLACK STONE
The black stone played a prominent role in pagan worship. The pagans offered animal sacrifices there. But the idol of the black stone replaced the alter; on the black stone they smeared the blood of the sacrificed animals.

QURANIC MYTHS
Muhammad made up historical references for the Kaba. Muhammad claimed that Abraham and Ishmael laid the foundations of the Kaba (Q. 2:127). Muhammad claimed that God ordained the Kaba as a sacred house (Q. 5:97). Muhammad also claimed that it was the first temple ever built for mankind (Q. 3:97).
Only Muhammad claimed that it was a place built by Abraham. In looking in the O.T., we find no mention of Abraham traveling to Mecca to build a house of worship.
Further, the late Taha Hussein, one of the most famous Egyptian professors of Arabic literature said that the Islamic myth of Abraham building the Kaba came into vogue just before the rise of Islam. He comments:
"The case of this episode is very obvious because it is of recent date, and came into vogue just before the rise of Islam. Islam exploited it for religious reasons". Quoted in 'Mizar al-Islam' by Anwar al-Jundi.

THEOLOGICAL PROBLEMS

Every man living in Mecca before and during Muhammad's life had some relationship with the Kaba. If the Kaba was the house of God, why did Muhammad order his followers to face Jerusalem? Muhammad's 'revelation' in the Quran says that when Allah had Muhammad change prayer directions, it was a test of the Muslims. This sounds like a lame excuse on Muhammad's part. What's the test? Face another direction? That does not appear to be such an incredible challenge!
Probably the real answer is that through his early contacts with Christians and Jews, Muhammad knew that their faiths, centered in Jerusalem, where monotheistic. Muhammad abhorred polytheistic worship, consequently he aligned himself with faiths that he believed were from the true God. He selected Jerusalem as the direction of prayer. He hoped that the Jews would receive him as a prophet.

About a year and a half after the migration to Medina, after the Jews had thoroughly rejected him, he turned the direction of prayer to Mecca - the center of pagan worship in the Arabian peninsula (Q. 2:144). Just as he had compromised with the pagan idol worshippers in Mecca, by sanctioning and worshipping the pagan goddesses Lat, Uzza, and Manat, so now he hoped to gain favor with the pagan Arab tribes that worshipped at the Kaba in Mecca. He authenticated the pagan focus of attention.
After Muhammad took Mecca, he cleansed the Kaba. Inside the Kaba were many representations of the prophets. When his men began to cleanse the Kaba, and wash out the representations, Muhammad placed his hands on the pictures of Jesus and Mary, and said "Wash out all except what is below my hands". Again, Muhammad went against his own principles, and sanctioned his definition of idolatry.
Muhammad then sanctioned the pagan rituals concerning the Kaba, i.e. kissing the black stone, touching the Kaba, circling the structure, running between the two hills, etc. Later, Umar said to the black stone "I know that you are a stone, that neither helps nor hurts, and if the messenger of god had not kissed you, I would not kiss you".(Sahih al-Bukhari, volume 2,#667). But then he kissed the stone. Like Umar, many other Muslims follow the prophet in their practice of veneration of a pagan idol.
Before Muhammad, there was a group of people in Arabia who also abhorred idolatry. They were known as the Hanifites. Even the Hanifites saw that kissing the black stone was pagan idolatry. During one of the pre-Islamic Eids, the Qurayshi were worshipping their idols, slaying sacrifices, praying, and making circuits around the Kaba. Just as they did each year for this festival. Some Hanifites saw them, and stood apart from them, and said:

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#165561 Mar 1, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>I don't know the number.
There is much you dont know.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165562 Mar 1, 2013
Muslims Pagan worship.
"By the Lord!, our people have nothing left of the faith of Abraham. What is this stone that we should encircle it? It can neither hear nor speak, neither hurt nor help. O our people, look out for your souls, for by the Lord are you altogether wanting."

One of the Hanifites was Obeidallah... later he embraced Islam. He immigrated to Abyssinia with other Muslims. Later he became a Christian. After his conversion, he said to his Muslim friends 'We (Christians) see, but you are only blinking'- that is, cannot see plainly.
So, why then does Muhammad kiss the black stone? Why did he incorporate paganism into his faith. There is even the Quranic story of Abraham - how he chided those who worshipped idols sura 6, 21, etc., and said it was sinful in God's sight. Yet here we have Muhammad walking around the Kaba, just like the pagans, kissing the stone, just like the pagans. Even Umar knew it was empty and false, yet he followed Muhammad in kissing the stone.
It cannot be denied that an entire pagan theology and ritual, was adopted by Islam, after Muhammad had one of his convenient 'revelations' and made it 'religiously' correct.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165563 Mar 1, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
There is much you dont know.
But I keep learning something new each day.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#165564 Mar 1, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>
But I keep learning something new each day.
I dont doubt that.

But I do doubt that you share any of that in this forum. In this forum you preach non evidence based ideology.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#165565 Mar 1, 2013
Shamma wrote:
Muslims Pagan worship.
"By the Lord!, our people have nothing left of the faith of Abraham. What is this stone that we should encircle it? It can neither hear nor speak, neither hurt nor help. O our people, look out for your souls, for by the Lord are you altogether wanting."
One of the Hanifites was Obeidallah... later he embraced Islam. He immigrated to Abyssinia with other Muslims. Later he became a Christian. After his conversion, he said to his Muslim friends 'We (Christians) see, but you are only blinking'- that is, cannot see plainly.
So, why then does Muhammad kiss the black stone? Why did he incorporate paganism into his faith. There is even the Quranic story of Abraham - how he chided those who worshipped idols sura 6, 21, etc., and said it was sinful in God's sight. Yet here we have Muhammad walking around the Kaba, just like the pagans, kissing the stone, just like the pagans. Even Umar knew it was empty and false, yet he followed Muhammad in kissing the stone.
It cannot be denied that an entire pagan theology and ritual, was adopted by Islam, after Muhammad had one of his convenient 'revelations' and made it 'religiously' correct.
Ever look at Christianity?

Sheez, Some forms of Catholicism are more pagan than those natives with the bones through their nose. And then there is that "small" matter of the trinity and all the tortured verbal gymnastics I hear you guys go through to explain yourself out of that.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165566 Mar 1, 2013
More of Muslims pagan worship.
Another Muslim myth, concerning the Kaba, is that 'anyone who prays under the Kaba's water-pipe becomes as pure as on the day when his mother bore him'. Muslims have a hard time accepting Christ's atonement, but will allow for total forgiveness of sins by uttering a prayer under a spout!
The spout became an pagan idol that forgave sins


POST MUHAMMAD HISTORY

In one of the early Muslim civil wars (a.d. 683), al-Zubayr in Mecca was besieged by al-Husayn. Husayn's men used catapults and damaged the Kaba. It looked like 'the torn bosoms of mourning women'. Zubayr and his men pitched their tents next to the Kaba, and a conflagration caught the Kaba on fire. The Kaba was severely damaged, and the black stone was split into three pieces.



A short time later, al-Hadjdjadj conquered Mecca and killed Zubayr. He modified the Kaba's structure.



In 929, the Karmatians invaded Mecca and carried off the black stone! 20 years later it was returned.



Other natural events (bad weather) have also caused the Kaba to need repair.



Muslims erroneously claim that God has protected the Quran from corruption, yet their god was not able to protect his sacred house!







POST MUHAMMAD ISLAMIC MYTHOLOGY

Later Muslim theologians invented a number of myths about Mecca and the Kaba.



One Islamic tradition is - according to Ibn Abbas: Muhammad said,'The black stone came from Paradise and at the time of its descent it was whiter than milk, but that the sins of the children of Adam have caused it to be black, by their touching it. That on the Day of Resurrection, when it will have two eyes, by which it will see and know all those who touched it and kissed it, and when it will have a tongue to speak, it will give evidence in favor of those who touched and kissed it'!



Muslim writers also said that the Kaba was first constructed in heaven, 2000 years before the creation of the world, where a model of it still remains. Adam erected the first Kaba on earth exactly below the spot its perfect model occupies in heaven! 10,000 angels were appointed to guard Adam's Kaba, but obviously they didn't do a good job! God then instructed Abraham to rebuild it.



There are a number of other myths about the Kaba. Among them are that Mecca is the navel of the world, that the Kaba was established at the creation of the world, destroyed during the flood, re-built by Abraham, that Gabriel provided the black stone. There are also legends about the Zamzam water from the nearby well.



Some Muslims say that there are references to the Kaba in the O.T. Here are a few mistaken claims:



1) Muslims hope that Gen 35:4, 14, 15 refer to the Kaba. Since "Beth-El" = House of God, and that the Jewish temple wasn't built until much later. But as the Bible shows, Bethel is a town, in Palestine - Genesis chapter 12. Also, Jacob built an altar, not a temple to God. Abraham also built an altar to the Lord in Gen 12:7.



2) Muslims claim that David mentions the Kaba in Psalm 84:6. If 'Baca' was a location, it was not known where it existed in the Bible. But a more correct interpretation, taken in context of the whole Psalm, is that since 'baca' means weeping, it means 'valley of tears'. David could be saying that he longs for the presence of God, and that even through difficult times (baca) God will be with him, and will turn his tears to joy.



3) Muslims also think that Isaiah 60:7 "All the flocks of Kedar" refers to Arabian people worshipping at the Kaba. Reading thru Isa 60:7, it shows that Kedar's flocks are going to be sacrificed on the alter. Are Muslims saying that Arabs were going to be human sacrifices?

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165567 Mar 1, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Ever look at Christianity?
Sheez, Some forms of Catholicism are more pagan than those natives with the bones through their nose. And then there is that "small" matter of the trinity and all the tortured verbal gymnastics I hear you guys go through to explain yourself out of that.
God shares His love with mankind through the Holy Trinity.
Warren

Adelaide, Australia

#165568 Mar 1, 2013
Allah does not exist

There is no evidence that islam existed before 600AD

Muhammed was a thief murderer and cheat
i am al mahdy

Saudi Arabia

#165569 Mar 1, 2013
hi..to make a long story short .iam al mahdy.the chosen one..any way..am in jeddah..obhur...and now for somthing compleatly different...lets all watch the sky ..because its time to expose the truth.......roaaaaaaaaar.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165570 Mar 1, 2013
More of Muslim pagan wordhip.

4) Some Muslims think that since the New Jerusalem in the book of Revelation is cubic, it also resembles the Kaba and thus is a prophecy of the Kaba! But the Kaba is not a perfect cube, not even close. The structure is 50 ft high, with a sloping roof, the shorter walls are 35 feet long, and the facade is 40 ft. long.

SUMMARY FOR THE ISLAMIC RITES CENTERED ON THE KABA
Every Muslim that makes the Hajj, every Muslim that runs between the hills, every Muslim that bestows a kiss on the black stone, is performing pagan rituals, founded on pagan superstitions, sanctioned by Muhammad himself.

Muslims have accused Christianity of incorporating paganism, and to an extent, some exterior cultural aspects have been. But paganism is an integral root of Islam; paganism is part of it's theology, history, ceremony, and veneration.

My references for this section are from the original Hughes Dictionary of Islam (not the recent one that has been sanitized by a Muslim publisher), the Shorter Ency. of Islam, and the Ency. of Islam, pub. by E. J. Brill, and 'The Sources of Islam' by Tisdall.

MORE ISLAMIC PAGANISM
THE NIGHT JOURNEY
The Night Journey describes Muhammad's ascent into heaven. It is briefly mentioned in sura 17:1, and described in Sahih al-Bukhari, in several of his volumes, notably in vol 1,#345.

Muhammad's story parallels a Zoroastrian story. It is found in an old Pahlavi book known as "The Book of Arta Viraf". The Zoroastrian story describes the journey of a saintly priest (Arta Viraf), who went into a trance and his spirit went up to the heavens under the guidance of an angel named Sarosh. He passed from one utopia (7 heavens?) to another until he reached the presence of Ormazd, the great deity of the whole universe. When Arta saw everything in heaven and that the inhabitants were very happy, Ormazd commanded him to return to earth as his 'messenger' and to tell the people all that he saw and heard.
Also, the Zoroastrians taught, long before Islam, there was a marvelous tree in Paradise called 'humaya', which corresponds very closely to the 'sidrah', the lote tree of Islam.

Finally, there is another Zoroastrian work the 'Zerdashtnama', which has a story of how Zoroaster himself ascended into the heavens and obtained permission to visit hell, where he found Ahriman, the Devil.
All of these stories are paralleled in the Quran. No doubt Muhammad heard these stories and decided to put himself on a level with Zoroaster and others. So, now we have Muhammad copying the Zoroastrian stories and claiming to have these experiences.

Again, while Muslims claim that paganism influenced Christianity, we see that paganism is part of the core of Islamic faith and theology.

AZAZIL - THE DEVIL
In the Muslim Hadith, the Devil has a certain name - Azazil.

The name does not occur in the Quran. The name may come from Leviticus 16:8, 10, 26 - the scapegoat in Hebrew is Azazil. From another source it means 'the demon of the desert'.

There are Apocrypha Jewish books - Enoch and Apocalypse of Abraham, that mention Azazil. Islamic traditions - Hadiths develop their story. Muslims associate Azazil with the fallen angels Harut and Marut. Ibn Abbas tradition has the strongest Islamic reference developing it as Satan's name, before the fall of Adam.

Here is Tisdall's view on it (taken from "The Sources of Islam"):
Muslims take the name Azazil from the Jews, but put the Zoroastrian story behind the name. Muslims believe that God created Azazil, who worshipped God for a 1000 years while he was in the 7th hell. Then he ascended a stage at a time, all the while worshipping God. Finally, he reached the earth. Elsewhere, Muslim tradition says he stayed 3000 years by the gate of paradise, with hostile intentions against Adam and Eve. He was very jealous of them.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#165571 Mar 1, 2013
Mote Muslim pagan worship.
Compare the above with the Zoroastrian account:
Ahriman (Azazil) remained in the abyss, there to commit hurt and injury, and mischief and darkness. Ormazd (God) knew of his existence and plans. It went on like this for 3000 years. The evil spirit was ignorant of Ormazd's existence, but eventually rising out of the pit, saw Ormazd's light. Then Ahriman was filled with hostility and envy, he set out to destroy.

THE SABEANS
Who were the Sabeans? Why did Muhammad regard them as believers in the true God? The Sabeans are mentioned at least 3 times in the Quran:
1) 2:62 - "Believers, Jews, Christians, and Sabeans; whoever believes in God and the last day and does what is right, shall be rewarded by their Lord; they have nothing to fear or regret."
2) 5:69 - "Believers, Jews, Sabeans and Christians; whoever believes in God and the last day and does what is right, shall have nothing to fear or to regret."
3) 22:17 - "As for the true believers, the Jews, the Sabeans, the Christians, the Magians, and the pagans, God will judge them on the day of Resurrection. God bears witness to all things."

Although what is known about the Sabeans is not comprehensive, enough has been written about them to determine a basic understanding of their practices and beliefs. Most of the writings are from Islamic sources. Some of the writers are Ibn Hazm in 'Fisal wa-Milal', Ibn al-Nadim in the 'Fihrist', Shahrastani in 'The Treaty on Sects', and Masudi in 'Muruj al-Dhahab.

Ibn Hazm, writing in 'Fisal wa-Milal', identifies the people then known as 'Harranians' as the 'Sabeans' mentioned in the Quran. Hazm writes that they honored the seven planets and the twelve constellations, they have 5 times of prayer,(the same times as the Muslims pray), they fast in Ramadan, they venerate and turn to the Kaba in prayer. Hazm also says they also worshipped the stars and idols. Hazm further claims that Allah sent Abraham to turn them away from pagan worship, but Abraham didn't succeed.

Comparing all the early writings on the Sabeans, we find that they inhabited Syria, and spread from there, they were definitely pagans, having a mixture of Babylonian and Helenic religion. The 'prophets' they professed to follow were Hermes and Agathodaemon, who they identified in Shahrastani's time with Seth and Idris (O.T. Enoch). Gods who were worshipped were the gods of the 7 week-days, the god of the Jinn, the lord of the Hour, the god who makes arrows fly, the god Tammuz (a variation of the one previously mentioned), Hamam the prince, the father of the gods, the god 'North', the lord 'Fortune', etc. They also kept the Eid of their own. Further, the Sabeans made star worship a chief characteristic of their system.

So, did Islam get the 5 times a day prayer?--From the star worshipping Sabeans. What about fasting during Ramadan?- from the Sabeans. The Eid?- from the Sabeans.

It seems very odd to me that Muhammad, the man who's central doctrine was the oneness of God, would include pagan worshippers as those who were believers in the true God. If Muhammad were truly a prophet, how could he have made such a big mistake? How did astral worshippers get included into the Quran as those that worship the true God? How could Muhammad's 'revelation' be in such error?

It is noteworthy that just as Muhammad incorporated the pagan veneration of the Kaba and black stone into Islam, so he incorporated the Sabean times of prayer, Eid, and fasting into Islam.

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