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“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#129 Jan 28, 2013
Pinch- Wicca is not and never had been a sex cult; this has already been addressed and answered in my last post; I don't care what your personal veiws about religions are, you are still spreading lies and propaganda as you just did in your post above; if you are so concerned about factuality then stop inventing, twisting, fear-mongering, and perjuring Wicca.
pinch111

Plymouth, UK

#130 Jan 29, 2013
CShine wrote:
Pinch- Wicca is not and never had been a sex cult; this has already been addressed and answered in my last post; I don't care what your personal veiws about religions are, you are still spreading lies and propaganda as you just did in your post above; if you are so concerned about factuality then stop inventing, twisting, fear-mongering, and perjuring Wicca.
No,i've read up on Wicca,tell me about sex magic? tell me about Beltane? tell me about skyclad? tell me about gardnerian and alexandrian initiations?

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#131 Jan 29, 2013
Oh wow, jeez, this is starting to make more sense now. So according to pinchy- consenting adults who enjoy sex and find pleasure in it are likely to molest underage kids? Just because sex is part of the world and not constricted to only between married couples for the purpose of procreation doesn't mean it is the only thing that happens or the only way to do ritual, isn't compulsory or expected, or otherwise carried out unethically.

If you have issues with the sex-positive nature of Wicca, you might want to get yourself a time machine, because the rest of the world is headed that way, too. Women dressing scantily are not 'asking for it'; it is the rapist fault for raping, not the fault of the victim for whatever assinine excuses the apologists come up with; sex outside marriage is OK; it's OK to have boundaries and expect them to be respected; consent is a must; self-pleasure is OK and healthy in moderation; sex with a partner is healthy; BDSM, kink, and fetish are fine- have boundaries and a clear understanding first; ANDDDD- woman can and should have orgasms, even if it means using something besides straight intercourse to achieve them!

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#133 Jan 29, 2013
We've aleady been over this re: initiations do not contain sex, etc. Feel free to reread the posts in the other thread you started your prejudice agenda in- which you never replied to except to start on a different tactic or to rehash a new one.

These are the sexual principals that are encouraged and upheld in Pagan religions including Wicca. Yet you keep saying that is 'perverse' and alluding that Pagans deserve/attract criminals because of these sex-positive principals. So if it is not the principals that bother you, than it's the fact that people who already are having sex anyway may do so ritually?(and yes, privately)
pinch111

Plymouth, UK

#134 Jan 29, 2013
CShine wrote:
We've aleady been over this re: initiations do not contain sex, etc. Feel free to reread the posts in the other thread you started your prejudice agenda in- which you never replied to except to start on a different tactic or to rehash a new one.
These are the sexual principals that are encouraged and upheld in Pagan religions including Wicca. Yet you keep saying that is 'perverse' and alluding that Pagans deserve/attract criminals because of these sex-positive principals. So if it is not the principals that bother you, than it's the fact that people who already are having sex anyway may do so ritually?(and yes, privately)
Your reply is economical with the truth.Let me make it easier for you,do Gardnerian Wiccan covens and Alexandrian Wiccan covens exist?the answer to that is yes,there does that help?Now can you answer this,do Gardenerian wicca coven initiations and Alexandrian wiccan coven initiations involve bondage,domination,sado- masochism including whipping and sexual intercourse?Do these initiations take place in front of other naked coven members?at what age can these initiations take place?You keep avoiding the question,answer please????A neophyte may or may not be having sex already as you say,indeed a neophyte initiate may even be a virgin.What did you mean in your previous post"ANDDD women can and should have orgasms even if it means using something besides straight intercourse to achieve them"explain please?
pinch111

Plymouth, UK

#135 Jan 30, 2013
CShine wrote:
We've aleady been over this re: initiations do not contain sex, etc. Feel free to reread the posts in the other thread you started your prejudice agenda in- which you never replied to except to start on a different tactic or to rehash a new one.
These are the sexual principals that are encouraged and upheld in Pagan religions including Wicca. Yet you keep saying that is 'perverse' and alluding that Pagans deserve/attract criminals because of these sex-positive principals. So if it is not the principals that bother you, than it's the fact that people who already are having sex anyway may do so ritually?(and yes, privately)
"Alex Sanders initiates a novice into the sacred mysteries"youtube,and you say there is no sex??????????
pinch111

Plymouth, UK

#136 Jan 30, 2013
avangaline wrote:
are there any books anyone would recomend to learn more about wicca?
Yes,'THE BOOK OF SHADOWS'by Gerald Gardner,available through wikipedia online,click on the link at the bottom of the page and go straight to first,second and third degree initiation,to get a flavour of Wicca.

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#137 Jan 30, 2013
It has been discussed at length when you bought up all those red herrings last time, but since you are polluting a new thread and harassing folks who are probably teenagers- let me go through this again.

Just because a document claiming to be a Gard BOS is on the 'Net doesnít mean squat. It's not published by him; the one on sacrad-tests.com is a document someone claimed to have received second hand. If they or someone else made changes to it, it is unknown and undocumented. Every Wiccan and coven and tradition has its own BOS- which means a Gard will have a book that includes material from the line of Gardnerians they came from, plus coven additions, plus their own. There are several variations even within the Gard trad due to his own work in editing and adding to his BOS before his death, not to mention additions from folks like Ray Buckland and Doreen Valiente. If you had done any nth of the amount of study and research you claim to have done, you would know all this already. In fact your whole post smacks of Dan Brown fiction. The jesus fertility cult thingy in his book is not Wicca.

What I do know is that sex is not used as an initiation in any tradition and regardless, minors are not initiated.

An edited youtube video is not evidence of anything. There is one titled something like Ďrare footage of Wiccan in forestí and itís just some white kid stacking wood backwards or something. Meaningless, or abstract perhaps, but not factual evidence of anything. Unless you believe everything on there, then I guess you have to believe that the US Gov is hiding secret detention camps and that Bigfoot exists. Also, since when did youtube allow footage of sex occurring? IT doesnít and thatís why youíve never seen it happening in any video there. Furthermore the footage is no more a real initiation than reading a recipe backwards is a real Wiccan ritual (another well-known stunt that Alex Sanders pulled for the sake of camera footage.)

Even though both the sources you cite as your evidence are unsubstantiated, neither of them include sex as an initiation, or at all.

Furthermore, once again for the four hundtreth time, just because an ALREADY INVOLVED couple decide to have sex ritually and make it something special for them and their jointly held spiritual beliefs does not mean the ritual is not private, impelled upon another person outside an already existing relationship, or used as an initiation. It is not. Again, we are not part of a fictional novel. Once again, it would just be two people who are already having sex with each other simply making it more ceremonial when they do.

Some covens practice skyclad and some donít. It has nothing to do with sex if they do or do not. The fact that you think that simply being unclothed is naughty and perverse is your own issue. Any that do, do not include anyone underage at all, or during those times.

Some covens include a scourge, some do not. Whether they do or not has nothing to do with sex or BDSM or pain or injury. It is used to stimulate the blood vessels and skin- no different (once again) then the spa practices of the Russian Banyans which includes a birch switch to do essentially the same thing. If you think skin exfoliation applications at your local spa are scary and painful, then yeah, this optional Wiccan practice should be avoided. Really, demonizing the scourge is the silliest of tactics, not to mention the absurd idea that people into BDSM would join a religion they donít believe in for the hope of the rare occurance of a ritual practice that will not meet their expectations in the least.

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#138 Jan 30, 2013
As for your last question, I can only imagine that you randomly stuck that in there in hopes of confusing any other readers that it has to with these imaginary Dan Brown initiations of yours. It was simply referring to modern sex between modern people, nothing specific to Wicca, only to point out that the sex-positive principals upheld by most Pagans are in accordance with this as well as respecting boundaries and consent. If you donít know what the clitoris is, you are on your own. I dunno, maybe watch the South Park movie.

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#139 Jan 30, 2013
That should be sacred-texts.com - autocorrect changed the reference.
joX

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#140 Jan 31, 2013
pinch111 wrote:
<quoted text>Yes,'THE BOOK OF SHADOWS'by Gerald Gardner,available through wikipedia online,click on the link at the bottom of the page and go straight to first,second and third degree initiation,to get a flavour of Wicca.
Wikipedia? HaHa. If wikipedia is your academic source then, it shows your age. Come back to this forum in a few years when you grow up a bit.
DaBroad

United States

#141 Jan 31, 2013
I refuse to go to Wikipedia for anything, but I certainly hope this creep didn't send some underage kid to porn with the recommendation to go clicking. Pinch needs to be a bit more responsible. And find SCOLARLY sources. Anyone can post anything to Wikipedia. I would no more trust it for real information than I would trust anything written in Topix. Verify and reverify.
Really, if there are any children here, you shouldn't be on Topix in the first place. There are more reputable sites.
primrose

Tavistock, UK

#142 Feb 1, 2013
Clover wrote:
You study for a year and a day that's usually how it happens. That's what my coven believes anyway. That's not what you have to do, though. It can be just once you know enough to say "Wow,I think I believe this." Christians are born christian, so why can't we decide to be wiccan when you want?
Does your coven have an initiation ritual and how does it go?

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#144 Feb 1, 2013
Haha, nice try pinch, go ahead and have fun holding your breath for an answer from an unregistered poster from 4-5 years ago!
katie kiger

Crawfordsville, IN

#148 Nov 20, 2013
I claim to be wiccan how can i truely be wiccan with out fear of rejection cause my mom is a bible church worship god kind of person i believe their is a higher power but i want to truely serve my goddess and priest can you help me

“Dance with Fire- Boycott BS”

Since: Apr 07

Moon

#149 Nov 21, 2013
No one can control what is in your heart and mind. If certain actions or discussions are not allowed in your household, then your best of course of action is to wait until you move out on your own, college, whatever.

This is a good article that addresses some issues you may have. She also lists things you can do besides practice rituals.

http://paganwiccan.about.com/od/faq/f/parents...

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