mountain meadows massacre where is a...

mountain meadows massacre where is apology for church leaders who encouraged?

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there it is

Demotte, IN

#1 Jan 27, 2009
When will the church issue a REAL apology and amends for this outrage?
http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-ORD4bRclc6NriC...

“I Believe in Christ”

Since: Nov 08

Salt Lake City, UT

#2 Jan 27, 2009
there it is wrote:
When will the church issue a REAL apology and amends for this outrage?
http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-ORD4bRclc6NriC...
I see you, GrandpaSmurf!!!*singsong voice*

“"LDS Christian"”

Since: Nov 07

Indianapolis, IN

#3 Jan 27, 2009
Granpasmurf went to college and was living in the dorms with all the other students there.
After he'd been there a month, his mother came to visit him.
"How do you get along with the other students, smurfie?" she asked.
"Mother," he replied, "they're such terribly noisy people. The one on that side keeps banging his head on the wall and won't stop. The one on the other side screams and screams all night."
"Oh Smurfie!" says her mother. "How do you manage to put up with these awful noisy neighbors?"
"Mother, I do nothing. I just ignore them and sit here quietly, playing my bagpipes."

http://www.youtube.com/watch...
there it is

Demotte, IN

#4 Jan 27, 2009
No you don't!( ha ha voice)

“I will not keep calm”

Since: Mar 08

Raise hell...change the world

#5 Jan 27, 2009
This forum doesn't make sense. It says "where is apology for church leaders who encouraged"
The people who commited this horrific act is dead.
They were given the death penalty and rightfully so.
In all reality our church does not need to apologize. These events happened long before any of us were born. We didn't participate in it.
Our church leaders did however offer their regrets as well as build a memorial in honor of those who died.
What more can we do?

“Aurea mediocritas ”

Since: Feb 08

Grand Rapids, MI

#6 Jan 27, 2009
not ashamed wrote:
This forum doesn't make sense. It says "where is apology for church leaders who encouraged"
The people who commited this horrific act is dead.
They were given the death penalty and rightfully so.
In all reality our church does not need to apologize. These events happened long before any of us were born. We didn't participate in it.
Our church leaders did however offer their regrets as well as build a memorial in honor of those who died.
What more can we do?
I've pointed this out before. There appears to some here that wish the Mormon to put on tin foil hats, climb into a spaceship and fly to the other side of the moon. Yet still, they will not be happy because they know the Mormons will prosper, be happy and heathy with the Mormon Tab choir echoing songs thru space to their total dismay.

“"LDS Christian"”

Since: Nov 07

Indianapolis, IN

#7 Jan 27, 2009
there it is wrote:
No you don't!( ha ha voice)
You!... Off my planet!
there it is

Demotte, IN

#8 Jan 29, 2009

“I Believe in Christ”

Since: Nov 08

Salt Lake City, UT

#9 Jan 29, 2009
there it is wrote:
http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog -ORD4bRclc6NriC2eBjavvtc_4pF6A sM-?cq=1
Nope, no offended by any of that, and I've got NA (Native American) ancestors. We often refer to Brigham Young and Joseph Smith by their initials because it is faster than typing it out.

Smurf, why do you always try to make something out of nothing? Just because you have the patience to type out Mountain Meadows Massacre every time doesn't mean everyone does or should. Do I have reverence for what happened there? Yes, in my heart, I do. But, I'm lazy and young, and we lazy young people like to abbreviate things for convenience. Just look at texting shorthand as an example. I mean no disrespect whatsoever when I abbreviate it. What is it that you are always telling us...? "Judge not lest ye be judged...?" By accusing us of not caring, you are totally contradicting yourself (oh shocker). How dare you try and lead people away based on your ignorant opinion of how we feel based on the amount of letters we use to refer to something.

Why are you so offended by this? You act as if it happened yesterday instead of 150 years ago! What happened, HAPPENED! There is no going back! I'm fine with you wanting to keep the victim's names remembered, but keep in mind that the victim's families have put this to rest! If the people who were the actual ones wronged can find solace and peace right now, you sure as heck have no reason to keep dredging this up to push your own agenda. How dare you.
there it is

Demotte, IN

#10 Jan 30, 2009

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#11 Jan 31, 2009
It's 2:30 am as I sit here writing this. I woke up from a deep sleep and the answer is perfectly clear. The Mountain Meadows Massacre occurred over 150 years ago it's true, but the God responsible for this horror is still very much alive in the imaginations of the followers of Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and the rest of the men who set themselves up above the true God of LOVE and created a false god of vengeance and wrath. A god that catered to the baser desires of men, A god who promised sex, money and power to those deemed worthy by the prophets. A god who required blood atonement in direct disagreement with the teachings of Jesus, who pointed at the real God of LOVE. A god worshiped with ceremony and in secret by an elite who seeks to protect this god with lies to the gentiles. To protect the greater truth say the prophets. The True God OF LOVE does not need lies to protect him! Jesus warned of false prophets. This whole Mountain Meadows Massacre and blood atonement connection that the Mormon Church is trying to hide so desperately is very real evidence of this. The mentality that produced the Mountain Meadows Massacre is very much alive today in the Mormon Church and it's offshoots! These teachings are a true danger to the spiritual well being of the whole planet. Their false teachings lead to needless suffering by those whose spirit is crushed by believing in this false information. Their lies and confusion are obvious with an extensive search of all of the information available on the subject. To those who would say PROVE IT, and I'm sure they will! I say , the proof is there. It's all over the internet.Law libraries, the Library of Congress, Museums, memoirs of private citizens, court records,congressio nal records,military records,public libraries...! Read it and then draw your own conclusion! The truth about the matter is totally obvious when you look at the whole picture of this group of people. The very fact that the rest of us are called the gentiles says a lot about these arrogant and false teachings! The only reason the Mormons are attempting to hide the truth about the Mountain Meadows Massacre and it's connection to the dangerous blood atonement doctrine is to protect the false set of prophets that their whole church depends on. This and their desire to establish a theocracy with their Current Prophet in charge (they call it a theodemocracy) makes them a danger to be recognized! With their large numbers of followers this could be a reality if something is not done about the apathy of the majority, which is their most powerful asset. All of us need to get informed and get involved!

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#12 Jan 31, 2009
THis will be my last post on the matter of the Mountain Meadows Massacre. I think I have covered everything that is humanly possible. I trust those with a sincere desire for truth will re-read my previous posts, do their research and check out this very serious matter for themselves! I will repost the last two posts to various internet forums and blogs on occassion as I feel it is needed. here is a particularly moving description of the Mountain Meadows by a man who visited the scene in 1910: from http://www.utlm.or g/onlinebooks/mead ows3.htm “The once carpet of grass has vanished, and in its place is a dense growth of mountain sage. The spring that supplied the Fancher company with water now oozes up from a bog near the bottom of the gully. And all around the landscape is an indescribable desolation - a vista of gray sage and barren hills. Seemingly, the God of Justice has visited the locality with the withering blight of his displeasure - but Mormonism yet lives, aggressive, arrogant and defiant. As the occasional visitor, with bared head, stands by the desert grave, his imagination recalls the death march up the valley. Through the silence of more than fifty years is heard the echoes of exploding firearms. The shrieks of women and children mingle with the frenzied cries of fiends incarnate, then the death like silence returns. He seems to feel the touch of spirit hands, to hear the murmur of spirit voices pleading for remembrance of their wrongs, and for human justice for the false and criminal leaders of the system whose doctrines and example inspired their destruction, and who continue to traduce their victims as their only defense of the ruthless murder of those who surrendered under the sacred aegis of the flag of peace!
there it is

Demotte, IN

#13 Feb 1, 2009

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#14 Feb 2, 2009
Thank you there it is for posting this informative website!
we all need to get informed and get involved!
We can not let atrocities in the name of religion
continue! demotheocracy is a present and active danger! the block votes done by churches are already effecting our democracy with their blatent theocracy threat! We don't need another taliban!
True democracy can not survive the most dangerous problem of all, the problem of apathy! this is being used by all misguided theocracy advocates!

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#15 Feb 2, 2009
there it is wrote:
When will the church issue a REAL apology and amends for this outrage?
http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-ORD4bRclc6NriC...
There never will be one. Open thy mind and thou shalt understand thy own ways of idiocy that others have been so gulible for swallowing as yourself.
No evidence exists, no evidence has existed, to tie B. Young, his counselors or the 12 apostles of his time to the MMM incident. The conspiricy theory is great that B. Young was behind it all but unfortunately for the conspiricy theorists, the hard evidence is lacking.
So, with no evidence to show no guilt, no apoligy will be given for something that cannot be proved was done. Does that make any sense to you? The first presidency of that church has on more then one occasion apoligized for the members that were involved in the MMM incident. But that is all they needed to say.
This is like the 9-11 incident and the conspiricy theorists idiots who run about ranting and raving that Bush should be admiting his guilt behind the 9-11 attack and making apoligies for his guilt for setting it all up. Like the MMM incident and B. Young, there is no evidence for a tie though the idiot conspiricy theorists continue to claim there is.
So as any judge of a court of law would say, bring forth the hard evidence to show/prove guilt and you will get results and an apoligy.

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#16 Mar 2, 2009
I found this site that actually has some of the official US court transcripts and a lot of other information that exposes the mormon's attempt at disinformation:

http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftri...

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#17 Mar 3, 2009
I have been posting the two most important commandments according to Jesus on the mormon threads and have been attacked over and over. I was somewhat puzzled as the Mormons claim to be Christian yet they reject the two most important commandments as unimportant. I now understand, the problem is they do not believe in divine LOVE!
I was put down again this morning with this comment by No Surprise who said "By the way, love is not a mystery. Love is an emotion. You may address it as a mystery to give your doctrine a touch of the unexplainable but that is all your doing. "

I understand now why they appear to be so cold and uncaring. I was especially shocked at their apparent indifference to the horror of the Mountain Meadows Massacre. It is clear now, their religion is focused on the false teachings of Joseph Smith and his patriarchal hierarchical structure with promises of power for men and subjugation of women that is in direct opposition to the LOVE stressed by Jesus.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#18 Mar 3, 2009
Grandpasmurf952 wrote:
No Surprise said "By the way, love is not a mystery. Love is an emotion. You may address it as a mystery to give your doctrine a touch of the unexplainable but that is all your doing. "
I respectively disagree with the above statement and if we are to accept the words of Jesus in the King James version Mathew 22:37 "Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind." we can see that so does Jesus. Note that it says "with all thy heart, soul, and mind.
Where do emotions reside?
NOw let us look at 1 JOhn 4:16 "And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him."
Now then No Surprise, the Bible says God is LOVE,
you say love is just an emotion.
Let's see what others have to say about the word LOVE.
here is a nice explanation of the statement "God is LOVE" :
http://www.kriyayoga.com/love/god.html
here is a site with a lot of information about the sacred nature of love:
http://www.kriyayoga.com/english/on_your_wing...
If you do a simple search on the internet you will find a wealth of information on LOVE and it's importance in our spiritual understanding.
So you see, No Surprise, I am not alone with some wacky ideas, trying to undermine your faith. I am just one of many who recognize the wonders of God's LOVE and simply want to share it. You and the other Mormon's are in real need of this recognition. The Mountain Meadows Massacre was a direct result of your prophet's placing their personal ideas above the true and simple message of LOVe that Jesus brought us. There is a lot of useful information available concerning LOVE. Get informed!
You are just so ego pumped up and full of your own self righteousness you can't even see straight for understanding base ideas and comprehensions.

The following is just for you Smurf. I realize now that of the many things that many accept and believe in that you do not and you wish to set forth your 'own' ways of doing and believing but you should stick to somethings like the definition of words. Love is an emotion. Love has probably one of the widest ranges of definitions for a single word of most words that exist.

Definitions of 'emotion'(ĭ-m&#33 3;́shən)
Dictionary.com · The American Heritage® Dictionary -(3 definitions)

[French émotion, from Old French, from esmovoir, to excite, from Vulgar Latin* exmovēre, Latin ex-, ex-,+ Latin movēre, to move.]

(noun)
1. A mental state that arises spontaneously rather than through conscious effort and is often accompanied by physiological changes; a feeling: the emotions of joy, sorrow, reverence, hate, and love.
2. A state of mental agitation or disturbance: spoke unsteadily in a voice that betrayed his emotion. See synonyms at feeling
3. The part of the consciousness that involves feeling; sensibility:“The very essence of literature is the war between emotion and intellect”(Isaac Bashevis Singer)

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#19 Mar 4, 2009
No Surprise, you are really busy trying to detract from the truth. I am not putting forth anything but reminding people about the two most important commandments according to Jesus. You attack these two commandments, claiming love is just an emotion, ignoring the fact that these are not my claims, the two commandments were put forth by Jesus, the word LOVE has had a mystical aspect according to various spiritual paths world wide, not just Jesus. So go ahead and continue to attack Jesus, the one you falsely claim to follow.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#20 Mar 4, 2009
Grandpasmurf952 wrote:
No Surprise, you are really busy trying to detract from the truth. I am not putting forth anything but reminding people about the two most important commandments according to Jesus. You attack these two commandments, claiming love is just an emotion, ignoring the fact that these are not my claims, the two commandments were put forth by Jesus, the word LOVE has had a mystical aspect according to various spiritual paths world wide, not just Jesus. So go ahead and continue to attack Jesus, the one you falsely claim to follow.
This post explains my point EXACTLY of what you do not see. No one is attacking the two greatest commandments that all the laws and prophets rest on.(Note the other part I added that you don't that you purposefully leave out so to decieve others?) Show me a quote where someone in these threads speak against/attack the lesson teachings of the two greatest commandments. NO ONE HAS! They have attacked the way you twist the scriptures to fit your new found dogma. That they do! Just as you attack theirs!
Next, you can claim love has some mystical aspect to it all you want. Anyone can claim that and there is nothing wrong with that. But many do not see a mysticalness of love any more then they see a mysticalness to the birth of a human or an animal. They are all wonders in their own rights. But love has to do with an internal feeling you can spontainously feel or a feeling you can develope with time.
You want a mystery? Here's a mystery. How can you claim God has told you the truth and everyone else is thus wrong? Now if your going to disagree with that then your telling me God has more then a single truth of himself. That means he might have many truths of himself. That would mean the truths that Muslims hold of God are true and the truths that Catholics hold of God are true... according to your logic if you believe that God has more then one truth of himself. Now if he just has a single truth and he has told it to you, then we are back to you claim you are right and everyone else is wrong. And you don't think your full of yourself? lol Yeah, right. You've become your own worst enemy and have become your own Joseph Smith. lolol

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