The WTBTS appeal
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Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#278 Jun 22, 2012
Searching wrote:
Could it be that Babylon the Great has now fallen? Makes one to wonder.
could be that the signs of distress are there.
Corinthian

Argyle, FL

#279 Jun 22, 2012
FH Chandler wrote:
<quoted text>
There's a difference between walking away from a battered spouse and walking away from the teachings of a religious sect such as the JWs which, by comparison [with, for instance, Islam] isn't all that tough.
Corinthian:[Because of my aunt being close to] both Chris and [the family with the boys], she knew he had been disfellowshipped for molesting the boys...
[Emphasis added]
Don't take my disregard for your personal story as an insult, as it is not meant to be; it simply doesn't have much to do with the point I was attempting to make in my post which you responded to, or in my opening paragraph.
As to the emphasized point, it's interesting, then, that with regard to the recent civil action we're all discussing, that the Conti's, Mr. Conti being a "devout" JW then and today according to his daughter, who were said to be "friends" of Mr. Kendrick in testimony, were not aware both of his removal as an MS, and the reasons for it. Another person testifying in the case - with less relevance to it than Toy/Toi Register [now Haynes], but whose testimony was, inexplicably, NOT excluded - Ms. Francis stated that Mr. Kendrick spent nights at her and her husband's house due to the problems in his marriage to Evelyn Kendrick, and that he was more than free with information regarding his homelife; she testified that he claimed that he and his wife were sleeping in separate rooms, but that "Andrea" [15 years old, at the time] was engaging in sexual activity with her boyfriends in the next room. So, forgive me if, based on common sense as illustrated by your experience, I simply don't believe that there's no way that the Conti's, "friends" [the adjective "close" was battered around in the court documents] of Mr. Kendrick did not know about what was occurring in his home-life, or how it translated into his removal as an MS.
Corinthian: The BIGGEST thing that sticks out in my mind of her telling me this (besides the molestations, of course) is this... My aunt said at the meeting when Chris' disfellowshipping was announced, his family cried and wailed in the Kingdom Hall as if they were at a funeral<-----HER WORD. When I asked her why...her response was as followed, verbatim..... "Because once you are disfellowshipped, you are viewed as dead in the eyes of Witnesses.". She said this with tears in her eyes.
I've had this notion reiterated to me over the years by my other Witness family members. Where would they get this notion? WHY would they think this if it wasn't an understood concept for that person to become spiritually dead to Witnesses?
Reply: I don't doubt any of what you've related above.
I would point out that one need not be disfellowshipped to walk away from the JW sect; I myself am simply "inactive" as far as they're concerned.
I would also point out that even if one is considered "spiritually dead" by people whose beliefs one doesn't or no longer shares, and forgive me if this sounds callous... so what?
"Spiritually dead" [in the eyes of people whose belief in an intangible "god" that may or may not exist] is not "dead" in any true sense of the word. It's not even "harm" in any true sense of the word. If people decide to have nothing to do with you cease to share their specific dogma regarding an intangible "god" that may or may not exist, then those people don't really care about you, do they? That, or their priorities are not properly aligned.
In either case, you're better off without such people in your life and, in the long run, will be happier for not being involved with them.
Which isn't to say it's "easy," but any difficulty you have in walking away isn't because they'll literally murder you for leaving.
Chan~

Thanks for your response. Read it and will comment later.

Corinthian
JJJ

Sydney, Australia

#280 Jun 22, 2012
unlisted wrote:
Lise it is all over... just click on jehovah witness org or watchtower org to pay//
better yet silent lambs has the actual papers on their site... how are you... come on over to the friends thread. no religion just friends talking about pets, plants and friends.. hugs...
JJJ you are correct the catholic church.. mine tried to do damage control but it backfired on them Catholics went on national TV saying it was a disgrace. i am no longer a roman catholic but a catholic as others are also. the way the Catholics and other faiths were abused here ---now the table has turned and the flood gates opened. hopefully many many more now will come out in protest of the men in NY to get out... hope all is well with you.
I'm fine unlisted thankyou for asking.

I hope you take a break away from here. This forum is not a healthy place.

Since: Feb 08

Laurel, MD

#281 Jun 22, 2012
Nomi wrote:
I believe there is more to the story than we have as yet found out about.
OMG Nomi I was abused by two JW is there more to my story give me a break!!!!!! dear god they should be lucky I don't sue their butts off!!!!!!
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#282 Jun 22, 2012
lise2468 wrote:
<quoted text>OMG Nomi I was abused by two JW is there more to my story give me a break!!!!!! dear god they should be lucky I don't sue their butts off!!!!!!
I know..right? She is so annoying but I try to think of my mom..but then I say, No...even my mother who loves being a JW would never protect them in this case!

“Houston, TX”

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#283 Jun 23, 2012
Searching wrote:
Could it be that Babylon the Great has now fallen? Makes one to wonder.
Was Sandusky a Jehovah's Witness?

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#284 Jun 23, 2012
Hoodwinked wrote:
<quoted text> I know..right? She is so annoying but I try to think of my mom..but then I say, No...even my mother who loves being a JW would never protect them in this case!
Those who will protect this pedophile are sick people. But we have to remember that they have been lied to so much by the GB aka F&DS that they are blinded to the real truth of what has gone on. Those who have never had something like this to happen to someone close to them has never really seen how things are handled.

What is good about this coming out is, it might help others to get out. NO matter if they overthrow it or not, it has come out in the light of day now.

NMB

Since: Dec 06

Location hidden

#285 Jun 23, 2012
Self Righteous wrote:
<quoted text>
Was Sandusky a Jehovah's Witness?
You know that this is going to provoke all kinds of stupidity, right?
dee lightful

Piedmont, SC

#286 Jun 23, 2012
NMB wrote:
<quoted text>
You know that this is going to provoke all kinds of stupidity, right?
Self Righteous is doing that.
red blood relative

United States

#287 Jun 23, 2012
The Real Karen wrote:
<quoted text>
Those who have never had something like this to happen to someone close to them has never really seen how things are handled.
.

it was one of the things that kept irritating me to try to figure out "what is wrong with this picture".
they had me hook line and sinker with their 'doctrines', but
i noticed all the corruption in committee meetings and on the body of elders, and every time i stood up for justice, i was threatened and silenced.

it all finally caused me to step back, and then i started investigating 1914, and 1874, and noticed the huge COVER-UP LIES, of their own appointment by god...... that was it, poof, i was gone.
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#288 Jun 23, 2012
The Real Karen wrote:
<quoted text>
Those who will protect this pedophile are sick people. But we have to remember that they have been lied to so much by the GB aka F&DS that they are blinded to the real truth of what has gone on. Those who have never had something like this to happen to someone close to them has never really seen how things are handled.
What is good about this coming out is, it might help others to get out. NO matter if they overthrow it or not, it has come out in the light of day now.
So true.
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#289 Jun 23, 2012
lise2468 wrote:
<quoted text>OMG Nomi I was abused by two JW is there more to my story give me a break!!!!!! dear god they should be lucky I don't sue their butts off!!!!!!
You should look into a lawsuit Lise. What they allowed to happen to you was beyond wrong!
Corinthian

United States

#290 Jun 23, 2012
Chan~

I know your disagreement or dismissiveness isn't meant to insult me and I don't take it that way. While I don't agree with some of the names you call others....some of them ARE creative and I do appreciate wit (ie: Sharpton's Knights of Saint Sizzurp, lmao). Anyway....

We'll just have to disagree on the fear of leaving a religion due to LOSING everything and everyone your life is structured around to a battered spouse's FEAR OF LEAVING a battering spouse. Fear is an extremely compelling emotion and often-times the risk of those realities those fears are rooted in can be pretty devistating. Witnesses have it pounded in their heads over and over in a pretty convincing way that if they aren't a Witness they are going to die ...... Losing their family, friends and life as they know it is "only" a spiritual death. Seriously?!? You don't see the gravity of that? For some, those risks/fears are worth it and they don't struggle so much. For a Witness who believes death is simply "nothingness", I can see how living shunned could be hell and a great motivator to NOT leave. Sure, free will and all....come on, you ARE an intelligent and reasonable guy, I know you see the similarities I've mentioned, even if it's not a real-life physical execution.

Cuz has told me a jillion times, "see, if you were a Witness, no matter where you moved, you'd have instant friends.". I wouldn't have given it much thought EXCEPT she did tell me a jillion times because it was THAT IMPORTANT to her.

I know I'm on a soapbox, but I would appreciate it if you'd humor me a tiny bit.

And it doesn't seem "too crazy" to me that neither Conti nor her family would know about previous allegations. my Aunt was very close to the mother of the victims. I think she even payed for the boys to get mental help (3 little boys, what a shame). I doubt that Chris would announce to folks that he molested at LEAST 3 boys. I also think there are things I'm told because I am on the outside of the religion but am very close to my Aunt and Cuz that they wouldn't discuss with those inside for fear of accusations (gossip, slander, divisiveness, etc). Telling someone about marital/relationship problems is easier than telling someone that the person you are married to is a child molester.....maybe? There's a whole new level of shame there....I'd rather tell someone I married an asshat than a child molester.

I have an affinity for the Witnesses, but I also try to look at the religion realistically. I agree with people being "better off" without them under the circumstances you described, and that they will be better in the long run.

Okay, getting my feet done, am relaxed, and will reply to more later.

Corinthian

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#291 Jun 23, 2012
Hoodwinked wrote:
<quoted text> You should look into a lawsuit Lise. What they allowed to happen to you was beyond wrong!
I completely agree x
comeuppance

Jefferson City, MO

#292 Jun 23, 2012
There is a gigantic difference between being disfellowed and inactive. I too am inactive, and my family can still talk to me and friends are not banned from speaking to me, or you, Chan. If we stopped believing we don't care if we are considered spiritually dead by these men. We know we aren't, at least I do, and it is immaterial to us. But to people who are disfellowshipped and still believe, they and their families are in a belief that they are lost, they are dead to God. There is a big difference in how that is viewed by the person in question, and how it emotionally effects them. Anyone can see that.

But truthfully, I do think that arguing this is a colossal waste of time, as far as changing the views of either side. For those of us that no longer view the sect as having the truth, we feel freed and glad of it. For those that believe completely with all their souls, they think they are in peril to even look at any logic that maybe they are being led about by their noses. Logic doesn't play into it at all. They are not in control of their own minds, to a large extent, because of the fear that they will be made dead to God if they do.
comeuppance

Jefferson City, MO

#293 Jun 23, 2012
Hoodwinked wrote:
<quoted text> I know..right? She is so annoying but I try to think of my mom..but then I say, No...even my mother who loves being a JW would never protect them in this case!
My hardcore JW mom shocked me in this. She has been a witness for almost 40 years and has defended them to almost her last breath. But she said, they are wrong this time. In fact, she looked straight at an elder and told him that if a certain brother that has been accused of sexual abuse and just ran, moved on to another congregation, turns out to have molested her granddaughters, they won't need to worry about reporting him, but they will need a judicial committee for her, because he will be a "dead son of bitch," and she will give up her eternal life. Yeah, my MOM said that. 70 years old and full of righteous wrath. The elder just stared at her a moment, and then told her he understood. WOWWWWWW!!! Go MOM!!! I think she realizes her own blame in the past, and is determined not to repeat it.
unlisted

Greensboro, NC

#294 Jun 23, 2012
hi jjj i may b it is a dangerous place when people begin stalking and post real names you take care.... we are on the friends thread no religion.. just friends..
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#295 Jun 23, 2012
comeuppance wrote:
<quoted text>
My hardcore JW mom shocked me in this. She has been a witness for almost 40 years and has defended them to almost her last breath. But she said, they are wrong this time. In fact, she looked straight at an elder and told him that if a certain brother that has been accused of sexual abuse and just ran, moved on to another congregation, turns out to have molested her granddaughters, they won't need to worry about reporting him, but they will need a judicial committee for her, because he will be a "dead son of bitch," and she will give up her eternal life. Yeah, my MOM said that. 70 years old and full of righteous wrath. The elder just stared at her a moment, and then told her he understood. WOWWWWWW!!! Go MOM!!! I think she realizes her own blame in the past, and is determined not to repeat it.
Love it!!
unlisted

Greensboro, NC

#296 Jun 23, 2012
hi comeuppnance it sounds like people are waking up and seeing this org is dirty as others they spoke about.. good for your mom!!!!!!!

Lise should check to see if there are others who will come forward and go into a lawsuit with all of them... they need to contact the lawyer who defended this young brave woman.

“Bustin' Myths”

Since: Dec 09

Location hidden

#297 Jun 23, 2012
Nomi wrote:
I believe there is more to the story than we have as yet found out about.
Yes, it is highly likely that the WTB&TS is hiding much more than has been exposed in this court case. For once we agree.

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