why cant jws answer simple questions?
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3912 Mar 27, 2013
Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
The holy spirit is of the Father.
Mat 12:18 Behold, my servant whom I have chosen, my beloved with whom my soul is well pleased. I will put MY Spirit upon him.
Acts 2:17 And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out MY Spirit upon all flesh.
Mat 10:19 But when someone arrests you, don't worry about what you will say or how you will say it. At that time you will be given the words to say. 20 But you will not really be the one speaking. The Spirit from your Father will tell you what to say.
"put MY Spirit upon him"
"pour out my Spirit"
"The Spirit from your Father"
These are not the things done with a person. But God's force or personality - yes!
If your mother walks into the room, none would say that the spirit of your mom is another person separate from your mother. It is simply her "force" or "personality" that proceeds from her.
:)
Please could you tell me, how is it that the Holy Spirit has power just as God [the Father], Jesus Christ and Satan have?

If the Holy Spirit is God's power [active force], how is it, then, that the Holy Spirit in Luke 1:35 is not identified as God's power [active force] but rather two distinct Beings [the HOLY SPIRIT and the power on the HIGHEST (God)]?

How do you explain these?

Power of the Holy Spirit:

"And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." (Luke 1:35, KJV)

"And Jesus returned in the power of the Spirit into Galilee: and there went out a fame of him through all the region round about." (Luke 4:14, KJV)

"Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost." (Romans 15:13, KJV)

Power of God:

"Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God." (Matthew 22:29, KJV)

"And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?" (Mark 12:24, KJV)

"And they were all amazed at the mighty power of God. But while they wondered every one at all things which Jesus did, he said unto his disciples," (Luke 9:43, KJV)

"Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God." (Luke 22:69, KJV)

"To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God." (Acts 8:10, KJV)

Power of Jesus Christ:

"In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ," (1 Corinthians 5:4, KJV)

"For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty." (2 Peter 1:16, KJV)

Power of Satan:

"To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me." (Acts 26:18, KJV)

Or is God sharing His power [active force] with Jesus Christ and Satan?
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3913 Mar 27, 2013
Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
I disagree. Members of the early Christian church met together not on the Sabbath but on Sundays.
Furthermore, the observances of the Mosaic Law, including the Sabbath, ceased by having been fulfilled by the perfect sacrificial blood of Jesus.
:)
You don't know the Scriptures! The Mosaic Law DOES NOT include the Ten Commandments [commonly known as 'Moral Law']; the Mosaic Law is the ceremonial law [and the law feasts].

However, please could you provide scriptural evidence that,

1) the Christian church worshiped God on Sunday?,

2) the seventh-day Sabbath is Sunday not Saturday?,

3) God transferred the solemnity of the seventh-day Sabbath to Sunday [the first day of the week]?, and

4) the observance of the Sabbath ceased?
AngelFire

Australia

#3914 Mar 27, 2013
Terri wrote:
<quoted text>
Hello again Angelfire
All of us here can see that you and others here have made it clear that the Sabbath rest is stopped. So thanks to all of you.
I think Rudi will go on and on and on, as you say because he has satans' judging spirit in him. You have proven that also and Rudi has given the evidence of his judging nature again. He is really ill and diseased and will not stop.
We here saw his post about condemning you. You have soooooo proved everything you said about the sabbath being stopped and Rudi going on virtually talking to the breeze.
We know Rudi thinks his ability to keep coming up with nonsense and posting makes him think he is still debating. Well Rudi, your debate is OVER. Everyone can see accept you.
The non sabbatarians have made their point and now Rudi is just trying to look as if he knows what he is saying, while we all know Rudi has no idea and cannot use the scriptures to support his view. All he can do is post and hope you all get so exasperated you leave.
Please Rudi, stop your babbling, because you are making a fool of yourself and what ever faith you represent.
Cultists really can't help it. They get this stuff drummed into them, like the WTS do with many of their man made doctrines. It is very sad to see. Rudi is no doubt a nice bloke, but all the judging and condemnation over the Sabbath is false, and as you say, that is obvious. Again, Thanks for your kind words.

What I was asking ages ago was about the latest from the WTS. I'd really like to see if a JW has an opinion on the apostles being sacked as the faithful and discreet slave. None have had an opinion on it at all.

There's not much use being on this thread if there are no REAL JWs to speak up. The pretenders, of course, don't count.

The WTS now say that the apostles were not the ones to give food at the right time. Given the apostles contibuted to the bible writings that we are using I find this claim totally unscriptural. It's a valid topic, and if there are any REAL JWs here I'd like to see them defend the WTS reasonings behind it.

The question may not be simple but it is an important one the JWs may need to defend in the field.

“Believe & Salvation is yours”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#3915 Mar 27, 2013
Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
Does that go also for the Opposition vs JWs? Let's have an agreement to disagree on some things?
:)
My understanding is that both Rudi and Angel believe in:
1. God came to us in the flesh as Jesus and was crucified,
2. God in the flesh as Jesus died, was buried and physically resurrected on the third day.
3. They believe that only through Christ you have salvation and not through an organization.

These are the gospel of Jesus that is to be preached.

Do you believe that only through Christ you have salvation and not through a man made organization?

Do you preach the gospel of Jesus and not a man made organization message?

Agape
Hope
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3916 Mar 27, 2013
Stanley Walker wrote:
<quoted text>
Commonly known by who? The Israelites? First century Christians? Or by who exactly?
<quoted text>
True. But who was it issued to? Israel or mankind?
<quoted text>
True. But who was it issued to? Israel or mankind?
<quoted text>
Was that the apostles? Or who exactly?
The Ten Commandments, known as God's Moral Law, was given to mankind not only to the Israelites.
AngelFire

Australia

#3917 Mar 27, 2013
Rudi wrote:
<quoted text>
You don't know the Scriptures! The Mosaic Law DOES NOT include the Ten Commandments [commonly known as 'Moral Law']; the Mosaic Law is the ceremonial law [and the law feasts].
However, please could you provide scriptural evidence that,
1) the Christian church worshiped God on Sunday?,
2) the seventh-day Sabbath is Sunday not Saturday?,
3) God transferred the solemnity of the seventh-day Sabbath to Sunday [the first day of the week]?, and
4) the observance of the Sabbath ceased?
Rudi we all know that you do not know what you should be doing. As Terri said you are only debating with yourself on this one.

Many of us have already shown you that the Sabbath was STOPPED as spoken to in Hosea. What is it with you that you absolutely refuse to follow the scriptures?

Hosea 2:11: "I will stop all her celebrations: her yearly festivals, her New Moons, her Sabbath days-all her appointed feasts."

You cannot jump over at least 2 hurdles Rudi. One being the FACT that Jesus never spoke to the Sabbath rest and the FACT that the Sabbath is a celebration, and was STOPPED, meaning all of them.

Now as everyone can see, Rudi has totally lost any credibility in maintaining the Sabbath at all, and now wishes to take everyone here down the garden path into some long winded discussion about what day the Sabbath was on.

Rudi, you have yet to show any credible support for your Sabbath, let alone worrying about what day it was on.

Now come on fess up... You cannot explain the most important thing which is, why on earth would Jesus speak at length about every other command plus a few others and not the Sabbath rest? The OBVIOUS answer is was STOPPED.

I maintain that until you come up with a plausible and scripturally supported reason for this HUGE ommision, then anything you claim cannot possibly have any merit.

You are putting false words and interpretations into Jesus mouth that He did not say.

“Believe & Salvation is yours”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#3918 Mar 27, 2013
Boni,

If JW's can't believe in:

1. God came to us in the flesh as Jesus and was crucified.
2. God in the flesh as Jesus died, was buried and physically resurrected on the third day.
3. Only through Christ you have salvation and not through an organization.

JW's believe that only through association with a man made organization you have salvation and not through Christ alone.

JW's preach the gospel of a man made organization and not Jesus.

Do you believe you are in the Body of Christ if you CAN'T even pray to Him; bow down to worship Him; preach this good news of Him for what He has done for ALL of us?

Agape
Hope
AngelFire

Australia

#3919 Mar 27, 2013
HopeReigns wrote:
<quoted text>
My understanding is that both Rudi and Angel believe in:
1. God came to us in the flesh as Jesus and was crucified,
2. God in the flesh as Jesus died, was buried and physically resurrected on the third day.
3. They believe that only through Christ you have salvation and not through an organization.
These are the gospel of Jesus that is to be preached.
Do you believe that only through Christ you have salvation and not through a man made organization?
Do you preach the gospel of Jesus and not a man made organization message?
Agape
Hope
We know the WTS preach obedience to the GB who claim to speak for God and know better than the rest of us.

It is quite repulsive to suggest that I or anyone should oppose the WTS just for the heck of it. ALL of us believe that we should not kill, theive etc etc. Religions have lots in common.

It's the differences that more show the one that have Gods approval. The condemnation of the individuals of Christendom, celebrations they have no right to judge over, pagan sacrifice relating to blood doctrine, shunning, failed dates, jumping from Christendoms Adventistism to pyramids then to false dates etc indicates that the WTS are not the 'the ones' approved by God

Now the WTS have sacked the apostles.

Indeed the JWs now bow down to the governing body as the faithful and discreet slave. It's too bad none of the JWs are prepared to defend this outrageous claim.
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3920 Mar 27, 2013
AngelFire wrote:
<quoted text>
Rudi we all know that you do not know what you should be doing. As Terri said you are only debating with yourself on this one.
Many of us have already shown you that the Sabbath was STOPPED as spoken to in Hosea. What is it with you that you absolutely refuse to follow the scriptures?
Hosea 2:11: "I will stop all her celebrations: her yearly festivals, her New Moons, her Sabbath days-all her appointed feasts."
You cannot jump over at least 2 hurdles Rudi. One being the FACT that Jesus never spoke to the Sabbath rest and the FACT that the Sabbath is a celebration, and was STOPPED, meaning all of them.
Now as everyone can see, Rudi has totally lost any credibility in maintaining the Sabbath at all, and now wishes to take everyone here down the garden path into some long winded discussion about what day the Sabbath was on.
Rudi, you have yet to show any credible support for your Sabbath, let alone worrying about what day it was on.
Now come on fess up... You cannot explain the most important thing which is, why on earth would Jesus speak at length about every other command plus a few others and not the Sabbath rest? The OBVIOUS answer is was STOPPED.
I maintain that until you come up with a plausible and scripturally supported reason for this HUGE ommision, then anything you claim cannot possibly have any merit.
You are putting false words and interpretations into Jesus mouth that He did not say.
I think you are more confused than Satan himself. I am not talking about the Mosaic Law; I am talking about the Ten Commandments [the Moral Law].

You said the seventh-day Sabbath was abolished therefore we no longer need to keep it because Jesus never told us to keep the Sabbath in the NT since it has been abolished.

Please note, Jesus never told us in the NT that, "Thou shalt have no other gods before me". Can we serve other gods? The answer is, NO!

He never told us in the NT, "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me". Can worship idols? The answer is, NO!

He never told us in the NT, "Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain" either. Can we take God's name in vain? The answer is, NO!

But let me ask you, how would you feel if I or anybody else were to believe you and Terri and follow your false teachings [doctrine] rather than the Scriptures and have other gods, worship idols and take God's name in vain? How do you feel misleading others with your falsehoods? However, according to you and Terri, I can do these things simply because Jesus never talked about these [things] in the NT. Your and Terri's argument is that the first four commandments of the Decalogue were destroyed, abolished or made void, reason why we don't need to keep them. What a foolish teaching, assumption and belief! Moreover you call me a hypocrite, full of hubris and rhetoric, stupid, etc. But why don't you look at yourself first?

Jesus said,

"27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,
28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you." (Luke 6:27-28, KJV)

Do you follow Jesus' teachings in Luke 6? NO! Are you Christ-like? NO!

God is "...shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments." (Ex. 20:6, KJV)
dr fill

Medinah, IL

#3921 Mar 27, 2013
Maravilla wrote:
<quoted text>
.
. I agree to the banana peel rendition.. My theory is..It won't be to long and the Governments will turn against..ALL religions.. As the greater greed will see their ( not for profit properties.. As a hugh eminent domain asset... But then ..I expect you know that to.. as the bible doth say so..
I agree mars,But I think that all churches should pay taxes like any other business.They sell faith,Hope and a product that is invisible.Why should all the rest of the businesses in the world pay taxes on products that realy exists and can be used for real when another company pays nothing for selling thin air>
dee lightful

Stanley, NC

#3922 Mar 27, 2013
Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
A person that wallows in all that venom and sour-blood definitely needs a smile and a ray of Christian sunshine.
I do it for you too, Dee!
It's one of the free services I provide around here.
Have a nice day!
:)
Since when is truth venom? Making sure the innocent know the WTS is two faced by using their own material and the scriptures as written is the true witnessing for Jesus. It is true love for fellow mankind and
.
If your smile is sincere it would be welcome and returned but too often the smile from a JW is not sincere but a ploy to think love bombing would sway someone with at least some basic knowledge of scriptures who can read in context.
.
When you can sit down and talk and listen to what other say, like an adult ,without the smart aleck remarks, then you might be taken as sincere.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#3923 Mar 27, 2013
Rudi wrote:
<quoted text>
Please could you tell me, how is it that the Holy Spirit has power just as God [the Father], Jesus Christ and Satan have?
If the Holy Spirit is God's power [active force], how is it, then, that the Holy Spirit in Luke 1:35 is not identified as God's power [active force] but rather two distinct Beings [the HOLY SPIRIT and the power on the HIGHEST (God)]?
How do you explain these?
Power of the Holy Spirit:
"And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." (Luke 1:35, KJV)
"And Jesus returned in the power of the Spirit into Galilee: and there went out a fame of him through all the region round about." (Luke 4:14, KJV)
"Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost." (Romans 15:13, KJV)
Power of God:
"Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God." (Matthew 22:29, KJV)
"And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?" (Mark 12:24, KJV)
"And they were all amazed at the mighty power of God. But while they wondered every one at all things which Jesus did, he said unto his disciples," (Luke 9:43, KJV)
"Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God." (Luke 22:69, KJV)
"To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God." (Acts 8:10, KJV)
Power of Jesus Christ:
"In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ," (1 Corinthians 5:4, KJV)
"For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty." (2 Peter 1:16, KJV)
Power of Satan:
"To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me." (Acts 26:18, KJV)
Or is God sharing His power [active force] with Jesus Christ and Satan?
You are asking how the power of God has power?

Would you like to think about that for a minute?

You saw the verses I provided where the spirit of God comes FROM the Father?

Acts 2:17 And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out MY Spirit upon all flesh.

Ephesians 3:16 He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through HIS Spirit in the inner man.

1 John 4:13 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of HIS Spirit.

Matthew 12:18 Behold, my servant whom I have chosen, my beloved with whom my soul is well pleased. I will put MY Spirit upon him.

C'mon, Rudi. Pay attention!

Oh! And about the "power of Satan" thing. Think .... how does Satan influence people for bad? God doesn't influence people for good?

:)
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3924 Mar 27, 2013
Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
You are asking how the power of God has power?
Would you like to think about that for a minute?
You saw the verses I provided where the spirit of God comes FROM the Father?
Acts 2:17 And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out MY Spirit upon all flesh.
Ephesians 3:16 He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through HIS Spirit in the inner man.
1 John 4:13 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of HIS Spirit.
Matthew 12:18 Behold, my servant whom I have chosen, my beloved with whom my soul is well pleased. I will put MY Spirit upon him.
C'mon, Rudi. Pay attention!
Oh! And about the "power of Satan" thing. Think .... how does Satan influence people for bad? God doesn't influence people for good?
:)
Boni, you haven't answered my questions as you haven't read my post properly, please could you read it again and answer my questions?

Please could you tell me, how is it that the Holy Spirit has power just as God [the Father], Jesus Christ and Satan have?

If the Holy Spirit is God's power [active force], how is it, then, that the Holy Spirit in Luke 1:35 is not identified as God's power [active force] but rather two distinct Beings [the HOLY SPIRIT and the power on the HIGHEST (God)]?

How do you explain these?

Power of the Holy Spirit:

"And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God." (Luke 1:35, KJV)

"And Jesus returned in the power of the Spirit into Galilee: and there went out a fame of him through all the region round about." (Luke 4:14, KJV)

"Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost." (Romans 15:13, KJV)

Power of God:

"Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God." (Matthew 22:29, KJV)

"And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?" (Mark 12:24, KJV)

"And they were all amazed at the mighty power of God. But while they wondered every one at all things which Jesus did, he said unto his disciples," (Luke 9:43, KJV)

"Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God." (Luke 22:69, KJV)

"To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God." (Acts 8:10, KJV)

Power of Jesus Christ:

"In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ," (1 Corinthians 5:4, KJV)

"For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty." (2 Peter 1:16, KJV)

Power of Satan:

"To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me." (Acts 26:18, KJV)

Or is God sharing His power [active force] with Jesus Christ and Satan?

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#3925 Mar 27, 2013
dr fill wrote:
<quoted text> I agree mars,But I think that all churches should pay taxes like any other business.They sell faith,Hope and a product that is invisible.Why should all the rest of the businesses in the world pay taxes on products that realy exists and can be used for real when another company pays nothing for selling thin air>
.
.Hmm! I think what they sell ..is a like a bowl of mystery soup.. When your served it.. there is no way of disecting it and figureing out what it is what.. It is purreed to the point that it hardly needs digesting to excrete it.. So..it is of little or no nutritional value..

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#3926 Mar 27, 2013
Rudi wrote:
<quoted text>
You don't know the Scriptures! The Mosaic Law DOES NOT include the Ten Commandments [commonly known as 'Moral Law']; the Mosaic Law is the ceremonial law [and the law feasts].
However, please could you provide scriptural evidence that,
1) the Christian church worshiped God on Sunday?,
2) the seventh-day Sabbath is Sunday not Saturday?,
3) God transferred the solemnity of the seventh-day Sabbath to Sunday [the first day of the week]?, and
4) the observance of the Sabbath ceased?
1.
Acts 20:7 On the first day of the week we met to break bread together. Paul spoke to the people until midnight because he was leaving the next morning.

1Co 16:2 That is, each Sunday each of you must put aside part of what you have earned. If you do this, you won't have to take up a collection when I come.

And let's look at some of the Anti-Nicene Writings as to clues to the early Christian customs on this matter:

Didache 14 But every Lord's day gather yourselves together, and break bread, and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure.

Epistle of Ignatius 9 No longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day [Sunday].

Justin Martyr, First Apology, 67 And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things.... But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration.

I have to stop here.

I regret that I'm getting interrupted at work, and my lunch is over anyway. I should have started this earlier in my lunch.

Rudi, I think I presented enough to show that the early Christians met together on Sunday rather than on Saturday (Sabbath). Points 2 through 4 has already been covered by others. I suggest you go over them. But if you want to hear it from me, just say so. I try to continue either tonight or tomorrow.

Thanks.

“By grace you have been saved”

Since: May 09

Fenwick, UK

#3927 Mar 27, 2013
Why can't AngelFire answer simple questions?
AngelFire

Australia

#3928 Mar 27, 2013
Rudi wrote:
<quoted text>
I think you are more confused than Satan himself. I am not talking about the Mosaic Law; I am talking about the Ten Commandments [the Moral Law].
You said the seventh-day Sabbath was abolished therefore we no longer need to keep it because Jesus never told us to keep the Sabbath in the NT since it has been abolished.
Please note, Jesus never told us in the NT that, "Thou shalt have no other gods before me". Can we serve other gods? The answer is, NO!
He never told us in the NT, "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me". Can worship idols? The answer is, NO!
He never told us in the NT, "Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain" either. Can we take God's name in vain? The answer is, NO!
But let me ask you, how would you feel if I or anybody else were to believe you and Terri and follow your false teachings [doctrine] rather than the Scriptures and have other gods, worship idols and take God's name in vain? How do you feel misleading others with your falsehoods? However, according to you and Terri, I can do these things simply because Jesus never talked about these [things] in the NT. Your and Terri's argument is that the first four commandments of the Decalogue were destroyed, abolished or made void, reason why we don't need to keep them. What a foolish teaching, assumption and belief! Moreover you call me a hypocrite, full of hubris and rhetoric, stupid, etc. But why don't you look at yourself first?
Jesus said,
"27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,
28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you." (Luke 6:27-28, KJV)
Do you follow Jesus' teachings in Luke 6? NO! Are you Christ-like? NO!
God is "...shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments." (Ex. 20:6, KJV)
As usual, not one scripture you posted says anything about keeping the Sabbath rest. What is it with you Rudi? You appear to have no idea what you are talking about. You also dance with sinners on the Sabbath remember!

In fact again you support what I say, that Jesus spoke to many commandments, gave us extra ones, but neverever once spoke to keeping the Sabbath rest.

As fo rme me Rudi, I do no tthink Jesus or the apostles were stupid not forgetful. I do not believe Jesus spoke to all OTHER commandments very clearly but just was areal dummy and never mentioned this Sabbath rest of yours.

You appearently think Jesus was a dummy. You are suggesting that the the not keeping of the Sabbath rest will condemn us and Jesus never bothered to speak to this clearly as he did adultery, murder, bearing false witness, stealing etc etc.

So you may continue in your belif that Jesus and God are both dumb.

However, I actually believe Jesus is extremely intelligent. Therefore the reason why Jesus never mentioned the keeping of the Sabbath rest was because it was stoped as phropesied in Hosea.

Stop calling Jesus a dummy by your insinuations that He forgot to mention the Sabbath rest.
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3929 Mar 27, 2013
Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
1.
Acts 20:7 On the first day of the week we met to break bread together. Paul spoke to the people until midnight because he was leaving the next morning.
1Co 16:2 That is, each Sunday each of you must put aside part of what you have earned. If you do this, you won't have to take up a collection when I come.
And let's look at some of the Anti-Nicene Writings as to clues to the early Christian customs on this matter:
Didache 14 But every Lord's day gather yourselves together, and break bread, and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure.
Epistle of Ignatius 9 No longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord's Day [Sunday].
Justin Martyr, First Apology, 67 And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things.... But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration.
I have to stop here.
I regret that I'm getting interrupted at work, and my lunch is over anyway. I should have started this earlier in my lunch.
Rudi, I think I presented enough to show that the early Christians met together on Sunday rather than on Saturday (Sabbath). Points 2 through 4 has already been covered by others. I suggest you go over them. But if you want to hear it from me, just say so. I try to continue either tonight or tomorrow.
Thanks.
I am afraid you didn't answer my questions.

Let's try again! Please note, I am only interested what the Scripture says not others!

My post was:

You don't know the Scriptures! The Mosaic Law DOES NOT include the Ten Commandments [commonly known as 'Moral Law']; the Mosaic Law is the ceremonial law [and the law feasts].

However, please could you provide scriptural evidence that,

1) the Christian church worshiped God on Sunday?,

2) the seventh-day Sabbath is Sunday not Saturday?,

3) God transferred the solemnity of the seventh-day Sabbath to Sunday [the first day of the week]?, and

4) the observance of the Sabbath ceased?
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3930 Mar 27, 2013
AngelFire wrote:
<quoted text>
As usual, not one scripture you posted says anything about keeping the Sabbath rest. What is it with you Rudi? You appear to have no idea what you are talking about. You also dance with sinners on the Sabbath remember!
In fact again you support what I say, that Jesus spoke to many commandments, gave us extra ones, but neverever once spoke to keeping the Sabbath rest.
As fo rme me Rudi, I do no tthink Jesus or the apostles were stupid not forgetful. I do not believe Jesus spoke to all OTHER commandments very clearly but just was areal dummy and never mentioned this Sabbath rest of yours.
You appearently think Jesus was a dummy. You are suggesting that the the not keeping of the Sabbath rest will condemn us and Jesus never bothered to speak to this clearly as he did adultery, murder, bearing false witness, stealing etc etc.
So you may continue in your belif that Jesus and God are both dumb.
However, I actually believe Jesus is extremely intelligent. Therefore the reason why Jesus never mentioned the keeping of the Sabbath rest was because it was stoped as phropesied in Hosea.
Stop calling Jesus a dummy by your insinuations that He forgot to mention the Sabbath rest.
You didn't answer my questions.

Let's try again:

You said the seventh-day Sabbath was abolished therefore we no longer need to keep it because Jesus never told us to keep the Sabbath in the NT since it has been abolished.

Please note, Jesus never told us in the NT that, "Thou shalt have no other gods before me". Can we serve other gods? The answer is, NO!

He never told us in the NT, "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me". Can worship idols? The answer is, NO!

He never told us in the NT, "Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain" either. Can we take God's name in vain? The answer is, NO!
__________
But let me ask you, how would you feel if I or anybody else were to believe you and Terri and follow your false teachings [doctrine] rather than the Scriptures and have other gods, worship idols and take God's name in vain? How do you feel misleading others with your falsehoods? However, according to you and Terri, I can do these things simply because Jesus never talked about these [things] in the NT. Your and Terri's argument is that the first four commandments of the Decalogue were destroyed, abolished or made void, reason why we don't need to keep them. What a foolish teaching, assumption and belief! Moreover you call me a hypocrite, full of hubris and rhetoric, stupid, etc. But why don't you look at yourself first?
__________

Jesus said,

"27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,
28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you." (Luke 6:27-28, KJV)

Do you follow Jesus' teachings in Luke 6? NO! Are you Christ-like? NO!

God is "...shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments." (Ex. 20:6, KJV)
Rudi

Falkirk, UK

#3931 Mar 27, 2013
Stanley Walker wrote:
Why can't AngelFire answer simple questions?
AngelFire either has no answers or simply refuses to answer our questions!

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