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Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#1
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Why do you think that being in the new covenant is the only way to be saved and that the ransom sacrifice and the pouring out of Jesus' blood is not enough?
art

London, UK

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#2
Oct 4, 2013
 
beacause thats old hat now and there is no money in preaching the bible without some kind of angle, like the magazines and building K/H for the Watchtower .org
Think of the countless religions invented just in teh last 50 years and they all seem to end up with millions of dollar in the bank all tax free.
Let's be honest Most all religions are rackets set up for the inrichment & benifit of those at the top.
I have never ever known any religion who did not at some point want MONEY.
I can remember poor ol J Swaggart on TV crying for forgiveness because he had sinnned.
Or was it because he had been caught.
it pays to be cynical where belief is concerned
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#3
Oct 4, 2013
 

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This is for people like Little Lamb who devalue the ransom sacrifice by saying its not good enough to bring people everlasting life on earth. You must be also in the new covenant.
Unknown

Adelaide, Australia

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#4
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Thirdwitness wrote:
Why do you think that being in the new covenant is the only way to be saved and that the ransom sacrifice and the pouring out of Jesus' blood is not enough?
The new covenant and the blood go hand in hand. One cannot be sprinkled with the blood without being in the new covenant and one cannot be in the new covenant without being sprinkled with the blood. It's the blood that ratified the covenant for humanity.
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#5
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Unknown wrote:
<quoted text> The new covenant and the blood go hand in hand. One cannot be sprinkled with the blood without being in the new covenant and one cannot be in the new covenant without being sprinkled with the blood. It's the blood that ratified the covenant for humanity.
“I am writing you (fellow anointed ones in the new covenant who are to be kings and priests in heaven) these things that you may not commit a sin. And yet, if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one. And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the whole world’s(those not in the new covenant)--1 John 2:1, 2 (parenthesis mine).
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#6
Oct 4, 2013
 

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"who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all"--1 Timothy 2:6.

Its for all, not just those in the new covenant. Why do you folks devalue the ransom sacrifice and say it is only for those in the new covenant?
Pat

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#7
Oct 4, 2013
 

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The new covenant is an agreement between parties in this case of God he set the terms
The terms God has set are these: Believe what he says about Jesus Christ, turn from your life of self-reliance and put your confidence totally in Christ to wash you clean of sin
Jesus said

Luke 22:20
20 And likewise the cup after they had eaten, saying,“This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood.

Hebrews 9:15
Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.

1 Corinthians 11:25

25 In the same way also he took the cup, after supper, saying,“This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.”

Jesus said
And he said to them,“This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many.

The new covenant comes through the death of Jesus Christ. The new covenant means we can go directly to God through Christ.
ALL Christians are part of the new covenant if they believe what Christ did and what God has said about the blood sacrifice the new covenant is about blood , poured out blood and what that means for mankind .If someone does not want to be included in the new covenant then Christ is not their savior they remain in their sin and have no relationship cannot even approach God.

This covenant is a gracious covenant in which Jesus purchased a people by his death on the cross so that all those for whom he died will receive full forgiveness of sins and become incurable God-lovers.
Christians agree with God to follow his rules God agrees to do things as well and He did he sent His son to die for us so we could be reconsiled to God and gain eternal life .When we take the emblems we are remembering what Christ's death meant for us and we are acknowkedging his death and resurection until he comes .
Pat

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#8
Oct 4, 2013
 

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5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#9
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Pat wrote:
Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance,
Called for what? Eternal inheritance where?
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#10
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Isn't the new covenant supposed to do what the old covenant didn't do?

"And now if YOU will strictly obey my voice and will indeed keep my covenant then YOU will certainly become my special property out of all [other] peoples because the whole earth belongs to me. 6 And YOU yourselves will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."--Exodus 19:5,6.
Pat

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#11
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Thirdwitness wrote:
Isn't the new covenant supposed to do what the old covenant didn't do?
"And now if YOU will strictly obey my voice and will indeed keep my covenant then YOU will certainly become my special property out of all [other] peoples because the whole earth belongs to me. 6 And YOU yourselves will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."--Exodus 19:5,6.
It does the old one was full of laws and rules that could not be kept , the new one assures believers of forgiveness and eternal life and a relationship with the Father we can become adopted sons and daughters , Christ's blood cleanses us , the blood of animals could not do that .
Pat

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#12
Oct 4, 2013
 

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The new covenant comes through the death of Jesus Christ
In the same way, after the supper He took the cup, saying,'This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is poured out for you."
The new covenant means we can go directly to God through Christ
There is forgiveness of sins only through the new covenant. It's in the Bible, Hebrews 9:14-15
There is forgiveness of sins only through the new covenant.
God forgives all our sins (Matt 26:28, Acts 13:38). Our sins are not merely covered by the blood of bulls and goats, they are paid for and taken away by the Lamb of God (Jn 1:29
God remembers our sins no more (Heb 8:12, 10:17; Jer 31:34)
God credits us with the perfect righteousness of Jesus (2 Cor 5:21). Righteousness is not earned, it is received (Rms 5:17). Because of Jesus’ sacrifice our status before God is “perfect forever”(Heb 10:14).
God gives us the Holy Spirit to teach us (Jn 14:26
God gives us eternal life (Rms 6:23).
Every Christian is part of the new covenant but we must follow some basic things , believe , live within God's will , and say yes I accept the gift of eternal life through Christ's shed blood we remember him by partaking of the emblems which he calls his flesh and blood
By using these words "DO THIS", He sets forth a command, not a request. This command is to be obeyed by all Christians until His coming
TAKE, EAT, THIS IS MY BODY WHICH IS BROKEN FOR YOU, do this in remembrance of Me. In the same manner He also took the cup saying: This cup is the NEW TESTAMENT IN MY BLOOD, do this as often as you drink it in remembrance of Me (1 Corinthians 11:23-25)." Then after quoting Jesus, Paul goes on to say in the next verse, "For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you do show the Lord's death until He comes.
John 6:51-58: "I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world." 52 The Jews therefore quarreled among themselves, saying, "How can this Man give us His flesh to eat?" 53 Then Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. 54 "Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 "For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed. 56 "He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him. 57 "As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me. 58 "This is the bread which came down from heaven; not as your fathers ate the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread will live forever."
NOTICE THIS
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love."
"He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him."
WE MUST eat of his flesh and drink of his blood for Him to abide in us and to have eternal life and live forever .
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#13
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Thirdwitness wrote:
Isn't the new covenant supposed to do what the old covenant didn't do?
"And now if YOU will strictly obey my voice and will indeed keep my covenant then YOU will certainly become my special property out of all [other] peoples because the whole earth belongs to me. 6 And YOU yourselves will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."--Exodus 19:5,6.
Pat wrote:
<quoted text>
It does the old one was full of laws and rules that could not be kept , the new one assures believers of forgiveness and eternal life and a relationship with the Father we can become adopted sons and daughters , Christ's blood cleanses us , the blood of animals could not do that .
I'm talking about producing kings/priests.
Pat

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#14
Oct 4, 2013
 
Thirdwitness wrote:
Thirdwitness wrote:
Isn't the new covenant supposed to do what the old covenant didn't do?
"And now if YOU will strictly obey my voice and will indeed keep my covenant then YOU will certainly become my special property out of all [other] peoples because the whole earth belongs to me. 6 And YOU yourselves will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."--Exodus 19:5,6.
<quoted text>
I'm talking about producing kings/priests.
Well that was directed at Israel who during the great trib will accept Messiah and become part of the new covenant.The Bible speaks of God offering a new covenant to them and once they accept the Messiah Jesus they will be part of it and will benefit from God's promises .
little lamb

Collingwood, Australia

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#15
Oct 4, 2013
 
Thirdwitness wrote:
Why do you think that being in the new covenant is the only way to be saved and that the ransom sacrifice and the pouring out of Jesus' blood is not enough?
because Jesus the Great shepherd of the sheep has been raised from the dead, with the BLOOD of an EVERLASTING covenant...

And it is Gods purpose to bring many sons to glory, with the chief agent of life..JESUS CHRIST.

because that is what Adam lost us..our relationship to god our Father.

And it is the BLOOD of the covenant that Jehovah God has said ' he forgives us our sins.'

Hebrews 10 [16] " this is the covenant that I shall covenant toward them, after those days' says Jehovah ' I will put my Laws in their hearts and in their minds I shall write them'

[17].....And i shall by no means call their lawless deeds to mind any more.

Now where there is forgiveness of these , there is no longer an offering for sin.'

if you want to be Jehovah gods people..then you have to be in a covenant relationship with him

As it is only a new covenant promise, that Jehovah says ' he will become our God and we his people'
Pat

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#16
Oct 4, 2013
 
"The time is coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the Family of Israel and with the Family of Judah. It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke My covenant, and I turned away from them," declares the LORD.

"This is the covenant I will make with the Family of Israel after that time," declares the LORD. "I will put my Torah in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be My People. No longer will anyone teach his neighbor, or relative, saying,`Know the LORD,' because they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest," declares the LORD. "For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more."

This is what the LORD says, the One Who appoints the sun to shine by day, Who decrees the moon and stars to shine by night, Who stirs up the sea so that its waves roar. The LORD Almighty is his name: "Only if these decrees vanish from my sight," declares the LORD, "will the offspring of Israel ever cease to be a nation before me."

This is what the LORD says: "Only if the heavens above could be measured and the foundations of the earth below be searched out, would I reject all the Family of Israel because of all they have done," declares the LORD.
little lamb

Collingwood, Australia

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#17
Oct 4, 2013
 

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Thirdwitness wrote:
Thirdwitness wrote:
Isn't the new covenant supposed to do what the old covenant didn't do?
"And now if YOU will strictly obey my voice and will indeed keep my covenant then YOU will certainly become my special property out of all [other] peoples because the whole earth belongs to me. 6 And YOU yourselves will become to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation."--Exodus 19:5,6.
<quoted text>
I'm talking about producing kings/priests.
new covenant is about making sons ...

Deuteronomy 7:9

'Know therefore that Jehovah your God is God; he is the faithful God, keeping his covenant of love to a thousand generations of those who love him and keep his commandments.'
Tao itness

United States

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#18
Oct 4, 2013
 

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revelations chapter 20 clearly states that those who died for witnessing about Jesus and those who do not receive the mark of the beast, will come to life and rule as kings with Christ. it does not say some of the ones kiilled for witnessing about Christ or not taking the mark will rule but it is all faithful Christians I live at the time of the tribulation. also the great crowd wear white robes and serve in the temple day and night. only the priesthood service in God's temple..
Tao itness

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#19
Oct 4, 2013
 

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What is also interesting is the Levitical priesthood were to wear white robes while officiating in the temple! coincidence? I think not!
Thirdwitness

Oklahoma City, OK

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#20
Oct 5, 2013
 

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Those are all nice scriptures but you still haven't shown one that says the ransom sacrifice is not enough but you must also be in the new covenant.

And you ignored my scriptures.

How is Jesus a ransom for all, even those not in the new covenant?

How is Jesus a propitiatory sacrifice, "not just for our (new covenant ones) sins but that of the whole world"?

Why is the ransom simply not enough to save a person?

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