why Jehovah's Witnesses ?
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Mumple

Milton, PA

#1 Oct 10, 2013
Jehovah’s Witnesses seem to believe that among all of the religions calling themselves Christian, they are the ‘one and only’ chosen by Jesus to represent his interests. I’ve looked at their claim from different viewpoints and can’t see where the bible points to such an outworking. There is no unambiguous or clearly stated scriptural precedent. They don’t, as an organization, have any more evidence of holy spirit within their ranks, than any other religious body. The “…by their fruits you will recognize them ” standard, seems to hit them just as hard as any other religious group. They claim to have the ‘truth’, but when examined, their truths aren’t any more outstanding that many other groups. In fact, their unique doctrine doesn’t hold up under scriptural scrutiny. It often turns out to be nothing but plausible possibilities. It would be supportive evidence if something concrete could be shown, but so would the unprovable claims of other religious groups based on the bibles content.

The ‘wish’ to believe it seems to be the driving factor, more than actual sound bible doctrine. The circular reasoning used to make their claim would confuse anyone not familiar with the bible’s content, and even some that are, into believing that they ‘ have something there’. Let’s, just for the sake of this inquiry, suppose that I have at least some familiarity with the bible. How would you demonstrate your claim of exclusivity? I’m not asking for references to Watchtower publications. If it’s the truth, and you know it’s the truth, you should be able to show me from the bible. The bible contains God’s words. Watchtower publications, while referring to God’s words occasionally, contain men’s words and thoughts about God’s words. Most men can do their own thinking about God’s words. God wasn’t happy about Moses’ wish to place Aaron between himself and the nation of Israel, why would he want someone between Jesus and his followers? Show it from the bible if you believe you have a valid position. Or run and hide rather than expose yourselves to God's actual light from the bible.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#2 Oct 10, 2013
let's see now. 4 hours and not one attempt at answering. I'm not going to taunt. It's enough to see that there are no takers.

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#3 Oct 10, 2013
Mumple wrote:
let's see now. 4 hours and not one attempt at answering. I'm not going to taunt. It's enough to see that there are no takers.
It will be hard for a JW to explain because they themselves do not have a clear cut answer; certainly not one provable from the Bible.

Since: Feb 07

RI

#4 Oct 10, 2013
It's doubtful that any JW will be able to provide definitive proof.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#5 Oct 10, 2013
if what you two say is true, then why would anyone risk their life on it? Faith is based on the evident demonstration of reality, not someone's imagination. If what someone believes in is beyond their comprehension, then it isn't based on faith. That would make anything based on that belief a faithless act, if acted upon. I realize that most here don't make decisions based on principle, so that kind of thinking is beyond their ken, but understanding the underlying principles in God's purpose for mankind is the only way a person can ever get to know God, from their bible reading.
Thirdwitness

United States

#6 Oct 10, 2013
3 scriptures prove we are God's organization.

John 17:3
John 17:26
Matthew 24:14
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#7 Oct 10, 2013
Thirdwitness wrote:
3 scriptures prove we are God's organization.
John 17:3
John 17:26
Matthew 24:14
Only three scriptures?

What makes us Jehovah Gods people is the covenant Jesus mediates between God and men..and that covers all the message incorporated in Jesus sayings.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#8 Oct 10, 2013
Thirdwitness wrote:
3 scriptures prove we are God's organization.
John 17:3
John 17:26
Matthew 24:14
Only three scriptures??

What proves we are Gods people is the whole new testament [ covenant] teachings of Jesus .

As Gods people through his covenant arrangement, each individual is promised to have God write his Laws on our hearts and in our minds

Organization not a biblical word and just swallows individuals up.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#9 Oct 10, 2013
Thirdwitness wrote:
3 scriptures prove we are God's organization.
John 17:3
John 17:26
Matthew 24:14
how so? The fact that these verses exist in the bible proves nothing, except the sentiments expressed. I knew that you, or anyone else, wouldn't be able to make an unambiguous defense of your position. how does the fact that taking in knowledge of God can lead to everlasting life prove anything regarding your religion above anyone else'. How does the fact that Jesus is concerned with God's name make your religion paramount? How does the fact that Jesus said the good news would be preached in the entire inhabited earth make the witnesses an exclusive religion, doing God's will?

The only factor that needs established here regarding your religion, is....did God appoint your religion to those tasks, or did you appoint yourselves? Just taking up the flag and running with it qualifies 'no one for nothing', as the saying goes. Show that God appointed you, as a group, or any other way. If you can't, then it is just presumption. Anyone can read those verses, and say....."this applies to us, because we do this....." apparently that is what happened in the witnesses' case, because that is the only kind of evidence they have.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#10 Oct 10, 2013
little lamb wrote:
<quoted text>
Only three scriptures?
What makes us Jehovah Gods people is the covenant Jesus mediates between God and men..and that covers all the message incorporated in Jesus sayings.
Try proving that in regards to the Witnesses exclusively. Show that God appointed the witnesses alone, to that position.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#11 Oct 10, 2013
little lamb wrote:
<quoted text>
Only three scriptures??
What proves we are Gods people is the whole new testament [ covenant] teachings of Jesus .
As Gods people through his covenant arrangement, each individual is promised to have God write his Laws on our hearts and in our minds
Organization not a biblical word and just swallows individuals up.
remember my accusation of platitude use on your part? Those words do not apply to the witnesses exclusively. They apply to anyone wishing to do God's will. Not one verse has been shown to place Jehovah's Witnesses in that position, alone. That is the point of this thread. You can't possibly show it. It doesn't exist.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#12 Oct 10, 2013
Mumple wrote:
<quoted text>
remember my accusation of platitude use on your part? Those words do not apply to the witnesses exclusively. They apply to anyone wishing to do God's will. Not one verse has been shown to place Jehovah's Witnesses in that position, alone. That is the point of this thread. You can't possibly show it. It doesn't exist.
I was answering Thirdwitnesses post...that three scriptures are not what makes us Jehovah Gods people

It is the whole new testament Jesus mediates, whereby Jehovah says " he will become our God and we his people."

The organization does not minister the new covenant to people, it tells people it is not for the majority...and that people can have Jehovah as their God by joining their organization.

So rather then have a covenant relationship with God built on legally better promises, they have set up an illegal way of being Gods people..

And when we are reconciled to Jehovah God through Jesus Christ, and have Jehovah as our God..it is in his name to prove to be our God..

He protects us and defends us..he proves himself our God.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#13 Oct 10, 2013
little lamb wrote:
<quoted text>
I was answering Thirdwitnesses post...that three scriptures are not what makes us Jehovah Gods people
It is the whole new testament Jesus mediates, whereby Jehovah says " he will become our God and we his people."
The organization does not minister the new covenant to people, it tells people it is not for the majority...and that people can have Jehovah as their God by joining their organization.
So rather then have a covenant relationship with God built on legally better promises, they have set up an illegal way of being Gods people..
And when we are reconciled to Jehovah God through Jesus Christ, and have Jehovah as our God..it is in his name to prove to be our God..
He protects us and defends us..he proves himself our God.
Well, I was relating to the topic of this thread. It has to do with why Jehovah's Witnesses claim of exclusively representing Jesus, to the exclusion of all other religious organizations. I seems that they started in with that premise, and still hold to it. I am looking for their biblical validation of that. It seems that you claim some relationship with them, maybe you could answer the question.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#14 Oct 10, 2013
Mumple wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, I was relating to the topic of this thread. It has to do with why Jehovah's Witnesses claim of exclusively representing Jesus, to the exclusion of all other religious organizations. I seems that they started in with that premise, and still hold to it. I am looking for their biblical validation of that. It seems that you claim some relationship with them, maybe you could answer the question.
I don't mind answering you ...its because of Jehovah Gods name.

A true prophet is to speak only in Jehovah's name.

Any prophet who spoke in the name of any other god, was to be rejected by LAW..

Its what gives a prophet his legibility

And of all the churches only the witnesses spoke in Jehovah's name.

However scripture warns that a prophet who speaks in Gods name a prophesy that doesn't come true..is false...and has the death penalty upon them.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#15 Oct 10, 2013
Deuteronomy 18 [19]
It shall come about that whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him.

[20]'But the prophet who speaks a word presumptuously in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or which he speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#16 Oct 10, 2013
That is why the organization had so much success in the beginning, it spoke according to Law in Jehovah gods name

But Moses foretold

Deuteronomy 18:18

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him.

And many claim this position as being themselves...

but Jesus is the fulfillment of the Law..

and this prophet Moses is talking about is Jesus Christ..the rest of us are to be in union with him.

And not go it alone and proclaim we are that prophet, as the watch tower has done, in trying to draw men to themselves..
"
Mumple

Milton, PA

#17 Oct 10, 2013
little lamb wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't mind answering you ...its because of Jehovah Gods name.
A true prophet is to speak only in Jehovah's name.
Any prophet who spoke in the name of any other god, was to be rejected by LAW..
Its what gives a prophet his legibility
And of all the churches only the witnesses spoke in Jehovah's name.
However scripture warns that a prophet who speaks in Gods name a prophesy that doesn't come true..is false...and has the death penalty upon them.
Well, I'm asking for unambiguous biblical representation of it, not your personal opinion. If you read the first post, and think about what's being asked for, it will become clear to you that men's thoughts about the subject don't really hold much credibility.
Mumple

Milton, PA

#18 Oct 10, 2013
little lamb wrote:
Deuteronomy 18 [19]
It shall come about that whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him.
[20]'But the prophet who speaks a word presumptuously in My name which I have not commanded him to speak, or which he speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die.
That scripture condemns Jehovah's Witnesses. They are all speaking presumptuously in God's name, if He didn't send them. Show biblically where he sent only them.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#19 Oct 10, 2013
Mumple wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, I'm asking for unambiguous biblical representation of it, not your personal opinion. If you read the first post, and think about what's being asked for, it will become clear to you that men's thoughts about the subject don't really hold much credibility.
Have posted the scriptural references..hope you can read the posts

Deuteronomy 18 [18-20] if not..
Mumple

Milton, PA

#20 Oct 10, 2013
little lamb wrote:
That is why the organization had so much success in the beginning, it spoke according to Law in Jehovah gods name
But Moses foretold
Deuteronomy 18:18
I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him.
And many claim this position as being themselves...
but Jesus is the fulfillment of the Law..
and this prophet Moses is talking about is Jesus Christ..the rest of us are to be in union with him.
And not go it alone and proclaim we are that prophet, as the watch tower has done, in trying to draw men to themselves..
"
Are you on both sides of the issue? In one post you claim it is because of Jehovah's name that they fit the bill, and in another you say the Witnesses have drawn men after themselves. Which is it, it can't be both?

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