Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#244 Jun 26, 2012
JesusMyKing wrote:
<quoted text>
WOW!! Basically then, encouraging the mother to trust the brothers. Do they also tell her that some of the brothers could also be a danger to her children, and for her to keep a close eye on these substitute fathers/spiritual fathers?
no, its only those outside that are the danger, when a brother has priveleges he is regarded as accepable and clean so why would any parent think otherwise, I mean this is Jehovahs clean organization, the poor parent has no idea that he may be a so called repentant child abuser.

Or one that has used the easy way of getting childrens trust before they abuse and the child or parent complains but the damage is done, as we have seen in most of these cases, they start of somewhere don't they. Because of the policies in the JW it makes it easy for pedophiles to thrive.

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#245 Jun 26, 2012
array wrote:
<quoted text>no, its only those outside that are the danger, when a brother has priveleges he is regarded as accepable and clean so why would any parent think otherwise, I mean this is Jehovahs clean organization, the poor parent has no idea that he may be a so called repentant child abuser.
Or one that has used the easy way of getting childrens trust before they abuse and the child or parent complains but the damage is done, as we have seen in most of these cases, they start of somewhere don't they. Because of the policies in the JW it makes it easy for pedophiles to thrive.
Very well put!

“New one man.”

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#246 Jun 26, 2012
Thirdwitness wrote:
So who is telling the truth? Candace or her parents? Both can't be true.
You take your child to a friends to play games. They actually go to the zoo.

Your child says we went to the zoo.

You say you did not take your child to the zoo.

Which isn't true?

Since: Feb 07

RI

#247 Jun 26, 2012
Thirdwitness wrote:
So who is telling the truth? Candace or her parents? Both can't be true.
Yes, both can be true. You need to get past the black or white thinking. There are often shades of grey.
diogenes

Dallas, TX

#248 Jun 26, 2012
RedhorseWoman wrote:
<quoted text>
And if she was too afraid to say that they didn't go out in service? Or, maybe they DID go out in service for a short while before going to his home. A terrorized child is not going to risk talking about something if she or her family were being threatened.
Was her father specifically asked if she ever was taken out in field service by Kendrick? Can you post the questioning that raised this point? Thanks.
This whole line of reasoning is moot anyway. Candace herself says the purpose for visiting Kendrick was to babysit.

1 A. And my dad would pick me up.
2 Q. Your dad would pick you up?
3 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
4 Q. Where would your dat pick you up?
5 A. Back at the Kingdom Hall.
6 Q. Do you know,what was the purpose for you going
7 to Jonathan Kendrick's home in your parent's eyes? Do
8 you have any idea?
9 A. I think they saw him as a trusted person to
10 babysit me.
11 Q. What would your parents do when you were with
12 Jonathan Kendrick?
13 A. I don't know. I wasn't with them.
14 Q. And starting from about age nine he would take
15 you to his house several times a month?
16 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
17 Q. Every month?
18 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
19 Q. Until 1997?
20 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#249 Jun 26, 2012
Diogenes could you give me the link to where these Q and A are?

Thank you.
diogenes

Dallas, TX

#250 Jun 26, 2012
JesusMyKing wrote:
Diogenes could you give me the link to where these Q and A are?
Thank you.
You can't find it all in one place. You have to sort through hundreds of documents to piece it all together. However the bulk of it can be found here:

http://apps.alameda.courts.ca.gov/domainweb/s...

Pages 74 - 87

Bear in mind that this is part of the complaint filed by the plaintiffs attorneys. As such the deposition exerpts will be those that puts the plantiffs case in the best light possible.

Since: Feb 07

RI

#251 Jun 26, 2012
diogenes wrote:
<quoted text>
This whole line of reasoning is moot anyway. Candace herself says the purpose for visiting Kendrick was to babysit.
1 A. And my dad would pick me up.
2 Q. Your dad would pick you up?
3 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
4 Q. Where would your dat pick you up?
5 A. Back at the Kingdom Hall.
6 Q. Do you know,what was the purpose for you going
7 to Jonathan Kendrick's home in your parent's eyes? Do
8 you have any idea?
9 A. I think they saw him as a trusted person to
10 babysit me.
11 Q. What would your parents do when you were with
12 Jonathan Kendrick?
13 A. I don't know. I wasn't with them.
14 Q. And starting from about age nine he would take
15 you to his house several times a month?
16 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
17 Q. Every month?
18 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
19 Q. Until 1997?
20 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
I asked you if her father was specifically asked if she went out in field service with Kendrick. YOU said that her FATHER stated that she never went out in service.

What you just posted once again was NOT the testimony from her father that you claimed was presented.

And, babysitting in the JW world can take many forms...one of which is going out in field service for several hours. Also, the statement about "babysitting" was her IMPRESSION of what her parents thought.

Where is the statement from her parents that explicitly stated that Kendrick was asked to babysit and that such babysitting did not take the form of going out in field service?

“John 4:23,24”

Since: Oct 09

Location hidden

#252 Jun 26, 2012
diogenes wrote:
<quoted text>
This whole line of reasoning is moot anyway. Candace herself says the purpose for visiting Kendrick was to babysit.
1 A. And my dad would pick me up.
2 Q. Your dad would pick you up?
3 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
4 Q. Where would your dat pick you up?
5 A. Back at the Kingdom Hall.
6 Q. Do you know,what was the purpose for you going
7 to Jonathan Kendrick's home in your parent's eyes? Do
8 you have any idea?
9 A. I think they saw him as a trusted person to
10 babysit me.
11 Q. What would your parents do when you were with
12 Jonathan Kendrick?
13 A. I don't know. I wasn't with them.
14 Q. And starting from about age nine he would take
15 you to his house several times a month?
16 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
17 Q. Every month?
18 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
19 Q. Until 1997?
20 A.(Witness nods head affirmatively.)
You just untwisted one of RHW's twists.

Now what will she do to muddy up the picture?

“John 4:23,24”

Since: Oct 09

Location hidden

#253 Jun 26, 2012
Line 13A is deeply sad.

Since: Feb 07

RI

#254 Jun 26, 2012
diogenes wrote:
<quoted text>
You can't find it all in one place. You have to sort through hundreds of documents to piece it all together. However the bulk of it can be found here:
http://apps.alameda.courts.ca.gov/domainweb/s...
Pages 74 - 87
Bear in mind that this is part of the complaint filed by the plaintiffs attorneys. As such the deposition exerpts will be those that puts the plantiffs case in the best light possible.
Where is her father's statement that you said he made?
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#255 Jun 26, 2012
diogenes wrote:
<quoted text>
You can't find it all in one place. You have to sort through hundreds of documents to piece it all together. However the bulk of it can be found here:
http://apps.alameda.courts.ca.gov/domainweb/s...
Pages 74 - 87
Bear in mind that this is part of the complaint filed by the plaintiffs attorneys. As such the deposition exerpts will be those that puts the plantiffs case in the best light possible.
And this is Dio is the result of 12 jurors who heard not only ALL the evidence but got to see the witnesses face to face!!

http://apps.alameda.courts.ca.gov/domainweb/s...

Did Jonathan Kendrick sexually batter Candace Conti? Yes

Was elder ________ as an agent of Watchtower and the North Fremont Congregation, negligent? Yes

Was elder _______ as an agent of Watchtower and North Fremont Congregation, negligent? Yes

Were the elders in the Service Dept, as agent of defendant Watchtower negligent? Yes

Do you find by clear and convincing evidence that any of the negligent conduct of the Watchtower that was a substantial factor causing harm to plaintiff Candace Conti was engaged with malice by managing agent of defendant Watchtower?
YES
Thirdwitness

Euless, TX

#256 Jun 26, 2012
Thirdwitness wrote:
I agree that would be an outstanding policy and that is the policy the WTS should implement. Oh wait look, that is already their policy.
.
April 8, 1997 Awake: "Of course, children should also be warned about—and urged to report to authorities—any person making improper advances toward them, including people they know"
Marvin Shilmer wrote:
<quoted text>
I shared that at a KM school back in 2001-2. I was instructed not to EVER deviate from the script again, and that how Watchtower wanted elders to respond and say to allegations of child abuse is found in letters to elders giving this instruction. Then I was again told to never, ever deviate from the script again.
So tell me why that bit of good sense is not found in any of the MANY letters elders have been sent by Watchtower specifically addressing allegations of child molestation?
Marvin Shilmer
Urging is not deviating from the script. It's part of the script. Here's some more of the script.

A December 1, 2000 letter also offers the same comments as the 1992 letter stating: "all in the Christian congregation will want to consider their personal and moral responsibility to alert the appropriate authorities..." But please take note of what is stated after the above quote and of one of the scriptures cited. The letter continues: "His(the elder's) counsel should always include advising the complainant that the congregation cannot take over the God-given responsibility of the ‘superior authorities’ in dealing with crime. Accordingly, the complainant should consider his or her responsibility to report the matter to the authorities without delay.(Compare Romans 13:4, James 4:17) Such authorities might include the family doctor, the head teacher of the child’s school, the social services, the NSPCC, or the police."

The cited scripture, James 4:17 reads, "Therefore, if one knows how to do what is right and yet does not do it, it is a sin for him." Clearly the elders, according to these instructions, upon reading the scripture would be encouraging the accuser to inform the authorities if he was indeed molested or knew of molesting. The complainant is clearly being counseled to carry out that responsibility. There is no doubt that reporting the abuse is here being scripturally encouraged by the Watchtower Society.

But the letter continues to give the elders instructions to give even further encouragement for the victim to inform the authorities: "The elder should explain to the complainant that he himself might have a duty to report the matter to the proper authorities. If the complainant is a child the elder might offer to accompany him or her to discuss the situation with a parent (but not the alleged abuser) or to one of the above authorities." Yes the elder would even offer to go with the victim to the police thus encouraging the victim to inform the proper authorities. And yet with all the above documented information, opposers would have us believe that the elders and Watchtower Society attempts to protect pedophiles and in turn disfellowship or reprove the accuser for making a report to the authorities. Frankly put, it is absurd.
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#257 Jun 26, 2012
Thirdwitness wrote:
So who is telling the truth? Candace or her parents? Both can't be true.
Who do you think is telling the truth Third?
See, no matter who you pick..the Watchtower isn't looking good!!
http://apps.alameda.courts.ca.gov/domainweb/s...
Becuase that's what this is really about right? If Candace just sued the molester, you wouldn't be trying to drag her through the mud, right?
diogenes

Dallas, TX

#258 Jun 26, 2012
RedhorseWoman wrote:
<quoted text>
I asked you if her father was specifically asked if she went out in field service with Kendrick. YOU said that her FATHER stated that she never went out in service.
Please show where I stated that Candace never went out in service?

“KeepProclaiming Christ Death ”

Since: Dec 09

Lynchburg, VA

#259 Jun 26, 2012
Thirdwitness wrote:
Did you know that Candace Conti's parents let her go home with Kendrick almost every Sunday after the meeting alone for about two years? Take a look at the deposition Candace Conti gave making this claim.
Q = Attorney's question.
A = Conti's answer.
13 A. He (Kendrick) would take me to his house after meetings.
14 Q. Were these day meetings Or night meetings?
15 A. Sunday meetings.
.......
Q. And starting from about age nine he would take you to his house several times a month?
A. Witness nods head affirmative1y.
Q. Every month?
A. Witness nods head affirmative1y.
19 Q. Until 1997
20 A. Witness nods head affirmative1y.
........
23 Q. Referring to the abuse that took place in Kendrick's home, was anyone else present during any of 'these instances?
A. NO.
And all these visits she made alone to Kendrick's house did you know that her parents NEVER themselves went to Kendrick's house?
Q. Was he someone who would visit your parents'
14 home?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Your parents visit his home?
17 A . No.
And then rather than pick her up at Kendrick's home after she went there alone virtually every sunday her parents or parent would simply meet back at the Kingdom Hall and pick her up there.
Q. What would happen after these incidents?
A. He would take me home.
Q. And...?
A. And my dad would pick me up.
Q. Your dad would pick you up?
A. Witness nods head affirmative1y.
Q. Where would your dad pick you up?
5 A. Back at the Kingdom Hall.
What do you think of Candace Conti's parents?
I wonder why she never objected to going home alone with this molester every Sunday?
After Kendricks molested his step daughter Andrea, he confessed to the elders. They then wrote the Watch Tower Society in a letter dated December 1993 saying Andrea was a promiscuous girl with boys at school. It seems they wanted Andrea to look bad. You know what they say about demeaning someone, it is a way to make yourself look better. What a cheep shot the elders took at these two girls because one of their Ministerial Servants raped them. You didn't say it was the children's fault in the Catholic's child abuse cases.
diogenes

Dallas, TX

#260 Jun 26, 2012
Lordylordy9111 wrote:
<quoted text>
After Kendricks molested his step daughter Andrea, he confessed to the elders. They then wrote the Watch Tower Society in a letter dated December 1993 saying Andrea was a promiscuous girl with boys at school. It seems they wanted Andrea to look bad. You know what they say about demeaning someone, it is a way to make yourself look better. What a cheep shot the elders took at these two girls because one of their Ministerial Servants raped them. You didn't say it was the children's fault in the Catholic's child abuse cases.
Before you jump all over elders (which I believe is a very watered down version), perhaps you should hear what Evelyn (her mother) had to say to the police.

This is taked directly from the police report:

FREEMONT POLICE DEPARTMENT

ON 03/04/94 AT APPROXlMATELY 1135 HOURS, SUSPECT JONATHAN AND HIS
WIFE KEDRICK THE FREMONT POLICE DEPARTMENT PER MY REQUEST.
I FIRST SPOKE WITH THE VICTIM'S MOTHER (EVELYN KENDRICK AND
OBTAINED AN AUDIO TAPED STATEMENT FROM HER. IN SUMMARY EVELYN
KENDRICK TOLD ME THE FOLLOW1NG INFORMATTION:

JONATHAN AND SHE HAD FOUND OUT HER DAUGHTER WAS HAVING SEX WITH
SEVERAL DIFFERENT BOYS IN A WEEKS PERIOD. THEY FOUND A DIARY WITH
EXPLICIT DETAILS. JONATHAN BECAME UPSET AND WENT TO ONE OF THE
80YS'S HOUSE WITH ONE OF THE CHURCH ELDERSS AND TOLD THE BOY'S
PARENTS. JONATHAN CONFRONTED THE VICTIM AND ASKED HER WHY SHE HAD
TURNED THEIR HOUSE INTO A BROTHEL.

It seems that her mother was far far more harsh than the elders.

Since: Feb 07

RI

#261 Jun 26, 2012
diogenes wrote:
<quoted text>
Please show where I stated that Candace never went out in service?
I never said that you stated that Candace never went out in service. YOU said that her father stated that she never went out in service with Kendrick. I asked if her father testified to this in the courtroom and asked if you would post his exact testimony here.

Your response to my request was to re-post Candace's statements, so I asked yet again for you to post her father's testimony.

Where is it, and why are you twisting my question?
diogenes

Dallas, TX

#262 Jun 26, 2012
RedhorseWoman wrote:
<quoted text>
I never said that you stated that Candace never went out in service. YOU said that her father stated that she never went out in service with Kendrick. I asked if her father testified to this in the courtroom and asked if you would post his exact testimony here.
Your response to my request was to re-post Candace's statements, so I asked yet again for you to post her father's testimony.
Where is it, and why are you twisting my question?
No you twist. First of all, you are the one that introduced this conjecture that Kendrick and Candace spent Sunday afternoon in field service. The court documents state that the parents deny ever letting Candace leave the kingdom hall alone with Kendrick after the meetings. That would naturally encompass all activities including field service.
Hoodwinked

Murrieta, CA

#263 Jun 26, 2012
diogenes wrote:
<quoted text>
Before you jump all over elders (which I believe is a very watered down version), perhaps you should hear what Evelyn (her mother) had to say to the police.
This is taked directly from the police report:
FREEMONT POLICE DEPARTMENT
ON 03/04/94 AT APPROXlMATELY 1135 HOURS, SUSPECT JONATHAN AND HIS
WIFE KEDRICK THE FREMONT POLICE DEPARTMENT PER MY REQUEST.
I FIRST SPOKE WITH THE VICTIM'S MOTHER (EVELYN KENDRICK AND
OBTAINED AN AUDIO TAPED STATEMENT FROM HER. IN SUMMARY EVELYN
KENDRICK TOLD ME THE FOLLOW1NG INFORMATTION:
JONATHAN AND SHE HAD FOUND OUT HER DAUGHTER WAS HAVING SEX WITH
SEVERAL DIFFERENT BOYS IN A WEEKS PERIOD. THEY FOUND A DIARY WITH
EXPLICIT DETAILS. JONATHAN BECAME UPSET AND WENT TO ONE OF THE
80YS'S HOUSE WITH ONE OF THE CHURCH ELDERSS AND TOLD THE BOY'S
PARENTS. JONATHAN CONFRONTED THE VICTIM AND ASKED HER WHY SHE HAD
TURNED THEIR HOUSE INTO A BROTHEL.
It seems that her mother was far far more harsh than the elders.
So what did you think of the mothers claim that she was also molested by an elders son....and the elders disfellowshipped her??

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