What place do the Urantia papers have...

Since: Jan 12

Kingman, Arizona

#21 Jul 23, 2012
Open Minded Bible Student wrote:
<quoted text>
What is the Urantia Book? I dont think I heard of it...
Good question. And by the way I'd like to give kudos to MakesTheTruthHis Own. Excellent posts.
The Urantia Book is a new revelation to our world from God's government via his angels and their records, particularly of Jesus' life and teachings on Earth. Earth, by the way, is called "Urantia" in the book, so "The Urantia Book" is "The Earth Book." It claims to be the 5th "epochal" revelation of religious truth to our world. Jesus' visit was the 4th. Melchizedek before that 4000 years ago was the 3rd. Adam and Eve, 38,000 years ago was the 2nd. And 500,000 years ago the first "Planetary Prince" arrived with his staff. We now know him as The Devil. He went bad in The Lucifer Rebellion. The Devil, Lucifer, Satan and Beelzebub are all different personalities. As noted, The Devil was our original world ruler (for God's government). Lucifer was the "System Sovereign," God's government's ruler over 1000 worlds. Satan was Lucifer's right hand man. Beelzebub was a minor player in the Rebellion.
I've had a Urantia Book since 1959 when my grandmother in Chicago sent me one. She and her sister were involved in the reception/materialization of the book. The book has been printed since 1955.

I see sidgi wrote:
"There is nothing "Christ-like" in the Urantia book."

How would sidgi know that? He hasn't read it. It's a ridiculous statement if one hasn't read The Urantia Book. The last 700 pages of the book are "The Life and Teachings of Jesus." This record is taken from human sources when they are adequate and correct, and supplemented by the records that God's angels keep.

sidgi says:
"Jesus words were written down by his disciples."

Jesus words and doings were also perfectly recorded by God's angels. And now we have that record.

sidgi says:
"Some were eye witnesses, some, just close enough that their investigative work wasn't that far removed from his lifetime."

Oh, but they were removed. The human records weren't written down until 30-60 years after Jesus died. And that, from memory and stories that were going around. And we don't have ANY original copies of any of the gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.

sidgi says:
"The Urantia book was put together in the 1950's by obvious frauds trying to gain some notoriety."

Oh my God! sidgi knows nothing of the story or the people surrounding The Urantia Book, he's taking wild shots in the dark, lashing out. Well, it's worse than that. Since I know he doesn't know what he's talking about with regard to The Urantia Book and the people involved, I also know that his above statement about "obvious frauds trying to gain some notoriety" is what is called "BEARING FALSE WITNESS" and bearing false witness is a sin, a violation of one of the ten commandments. Look at that. He doesn't know any of the people involved or anything about them, and yet he's bearing false witness against them by accusing them of being "obvious frauds trying to gain some notoriety". The Pharisees did the same to Jesus, they said, "He hath a devil, and is mad; why hear ye him?" (John 10:20) False witness. It's a sin.

sidgi says:
"Anyone that would swallow that garbage to the extent of taking their own life, would be mentally unbalanced. Either you are a liar, or you've swallowed someone else' lie, or you feel guilty for any contribution you may have made to his demise. Personally, I still believe the 1st choice."

What garbage? 2000 years and human nature hasn't changed, we still have Pharisees with us.'Your religion is not what I believe (even though I haven't read it) so it's garbage.' I would not want to be in the position of having mindlessly called God's new revelation to our world "garbage" simply because it was not what I already believed. Nor does sidgi know why anyone took their own life, but it's been suggested, I think, that it was because of Jehovah's Witness un-Christian, un-Godly shunning.

Since: Jan 12

Kingman, Arizona

#22 Jul 23, 2012
Open Minded Bible Student wrote:
<quoted text>
What is the Urantia Book? I dont think I heard of it...
I answered this but so far the reply hasn't appeared here. I'll check tomorrow and see if it's here by then. If not, I'll repost it.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#23 Jul 23, 2012
Furchizedek wrote:
<quoted text>
sidgi wrote: "I guess the only reason someone is here promoting it, is because at one time they were a Jehovah's Witness."
Amazing. I read almost the exact same sentence the other day on a Mormon forum. The guy there said the same thing, that the reason someone was promoting The Urantia Book there was because they were probably a disgruntled former Mormon. And how can anyone use the derogatory term, "Urantia peddler" when his own religion goes door to door peddling Jehovah's Witnessism?(What do you call it?)
as I am neither Jehovah's Witness nor Morman, and I am not peddling anything to anyone. Your point doesn't asses my position. I am just someone on a discussion board that values what the bible does say. If you wish to be a humanist, or demon worshiper, or a part of any other of many, non-bible valuing pursuits, that's your business. But I am just calling it what it is, in that regard.

As far as I'm concerned, there are only two spiritual choices. One is straight forward, and the other is in any other direction that might be chosen. God's way can be discerned by the things made, and the bible. Satan's way can be discerned by what has become of the things God has made, and the bible. It takes time and honest effort to determine which is which. The most that any book, offering something different or apart from the bible could be, would be a shortcut to the knowledge of God. There is nothing shorter than straight forward.

sidgi

Since: Jan 12

Kingman, Arizona

#24 Jul 23, 2012
>sidgi wrote: "...I am neither Jehovah's Witness nor Morman, and I am not peddling anything to anyone."

Yes you are. Whatever you are you are certainly peddling the bible, or your or your sect's interpretation of it. Look, below, at the bible box you're in. You said, "Or apart from the bible..." There you go. That's the box you're in and that's what you're pushing regardless of what religion label you apply or don't apply to yourself. You're not a Jew, so you must be some flavor of Christian, now trying to operate under the label radar, but still, nothing is valid according to you, "apart from the bible." I'm new here so maybe I missed it, you say you're not a JW or a Mormon, well, what are you? YOU ARE SOMETHING, Christian-like of some sort, you're up to your neck in "the bible."

And I want to press you on your bearing false witness against people you know nothing of, calling them "obvious frauds" and so forth as you did. Don't you understand that is a violation of the commandment? If you were in a court of law and you had done that, the Judge would have said, "On what basis do you call these people "obvious frauds, Mr. sedgi?" And your reply would have been, "Your Honor, they are obvious frauds because they don't believe in or teach what I believe in, therefore they must be frauds." Please address this issue of your bearing false witness. Whatever religion you are, I'm sure whatever bible based Christian sect you belong to the commandment against bearing false witness still applies. Don't you see it applies to YOU and that you are doing exactly what it says "Thou shalt not..." do? Are you blinded by self righteousness? Why is it that hypocrites and blasphemers and false witness bearers can't see their own hypocrisy, blasphemy, and false witness?

>sidgi wrote: Your point doesn't asses my position. I am just someone on a discussion board that values what the bible does say. If you wish to be a humanist, or demon worshiper, or a part of any other of many, non-bible valuing pursuits, that's your business. But I am just calling it what it is, in that regard.

I am a humanist or demon worshipper because I don't believe in the bible as you do? Because I believe in God from a different book? I believe in God, I believe in the Trinity, I believe in the Divinity of Jesus, I believe Jesus is the Son of God, and I believe in the Resurrection, and you're calling me a humanist and demon worshiper? You could well be in a lot of trouble on Judgment Day.

Mat 7:22-23 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Who is Jesus referring to? Jews? Muslims? Hindus? Buddhists? None of those prophecy in His name or claim to cast out devils or to have done many wonderful works. Only fundamentalist Christians do those things.

>sidgi wrote: As far as I'm concerned, there are only two spiritual choices. One is straight forward,

Let me guess. "straight forward" is your way, right? It's your bible way, is that right? No other way on earth is "straight forward," just your way and your bible way, right?

>sidgi wrote: and the other is in any other direction that might be chosen.

Which is not your way, right?

>sidgi wrote: God's way can be discerned by the things made, and the bible.

Your way and God's way and the bible's way are the same, right? Anyone who doesn't believe as you do is not on the right path, right?

>sidgi wrote: Satan's way can be discerned by what has become of the things God has made, and the bible. It takes time and honest effort to determine which is which. The most that any book, offering something different or apart from the bible could be, would be a shortcut to the knowledge of God. There is nothing shorter than straight forward.
sidgi

There it is again, the box you're in: "apart from the bible"

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#25 Jul 24, 2012
Good morning furchizedek, thank you for your post.

Ill look into the urantia when I have the time to get my hands one one... Im VERY curious! Ill read it before making any judgement...

SIDGI believes in God and Christ but doesnt believe in organized religion... which im starting to think that way aswell...

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#26 Jul 24, 2012
I have read a little of this book which was linked on here by Futerman a few months ago, no where do they give any recognistion of the ransom sacrifice.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#27 Jul 24, 2012
Furchizedek,

I readily admit that I recommend the bible as the word of God. I don't peddle any religion, however. If anything, I peddle the notion that someone might be able to find out the things God requires from mankind by reading it, learning from it, and living a life in cooperation with the things learned.

You say that is a box. All you've offered is another box. Is your box somehow prettier? That is what Satan offered Eve; a prettier box. Yet look what happened, because she was deceived. Someone went out and wrote the urantia book.

sidgi

Since: Jan 12

Kingman, Arizona

#28 Jul 24, 2012
Open Minded Bible Student wrote:
Good morning furchizedek, thank you for your post.
Ill look into the urantia when I have the time to get my hands one one... Im VERY curious! Ill read it before making any judgement...
SIDGI believes in God and Christ but doesnt believe in organized religion... which im starting to think that way aswell...
Great, take a look, give it a read. That's all anyone can ask. If you read 10 pages a day you'll have it done in 6 months.

"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." Lao-tzu

I say, skip the Foreword for now, start at Paper 1, The Universal Father, or perhaps at Paper 121 and read to the end.

And by the way, The Urantia Book is NOT organized religion. It's just a new revelation from God's government, a book. There is nothing to join, no priests, no churches, etc.

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#29 Jul 24, 2012
I started reading it but wow, that's a pretty thick book (smile), but interesting.

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#30 Jul 24, 2012
Furchizedek wrote:
<quoted text>
Great, take a look, give it a read. That's all anyone can ask. If you read 10 pages a day you'll have it done in 6 months.
"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." Lao-tzu
I say, skip the Foreword for now, start at Paper 1, The Universal Father, or perhaps at Paper 121 and read to the end.
And by the way, The Urantia Book is NOT organized religion. It's just a new revelation from God's government, a book. There is nothing to join, no priests, no churches, etc.
Does the Urantia book not state that Jesus' death was not needed for forgiveness of sins? That it was only the ignorance of man that crucified Jesus, and that sins would have been forgiven either way?

Since: Jan 12

Kingman, Arizona

#31 Jul 24, 2012
array wrote:
I have read a little of this book which was linked on here by Futerman a few months ago, no where do they give any recognistion of the ransom sacrifice.
You are almost correct, and here's the deal using the bible:

"And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people." (Matthew 9:35)

"And it came to pass...that Jesus went throughout every city and village, preaching and showing the glad tidings of the kingdom of God: and the twelve were with him..." (Luke 8:1)(Also see Matthew 4:23, Mark 1:14, and Luke 4:43.)

Do you see? Jesus and the 12 real apostles preached the gospel to the people. At the feeding of the 5000 there were over 10,000 people (see Matthew 14:21) hearing Jesus and the 12 real apostles preach "the gospel of the kingdom" and "the glad tidings of the kingdom of God." And this was just one of many such stops on the preaching tours. The real gospel comes from Jesus. No where in the New Testament can you show anyplace where Jesus and his 12 real, personally chosen and trained apostles ever preached any gospel to the people regarding Jesus as a "ransom sacrifice" or that the "Good News" was that Jesus had come to die for their sins, while Jesus was alive. Your "ransom sacrifice" gospel does not come from Jesus. It's derived from the doctrines of men. It's not in The Urantia Book because it's false and Jesus never taught it. If Jesus had come to be a "ransom-sacrifice" He would have said, "“To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should be a ransom-sacrifice and die for the sins of the world.”(John 18:37)

Also, "regular" Christians do not use the "ransom" idea. That's pretty much a Jehovah's Witness emphasis. A ransom is paid to a kidnapper to secure the release of hostages. A "sacrifice" is a completely different idea. You won't hear regular Christians emphasizing the ransom idea. You probably should pick one or the other. It may be wrongly recorded in the bible that Jesus spoke privately to his apostles about being a ransom, and that his blood was for "the remission of sins," but it never happened and He certainly never told the people that.

So what did Jesus tell the people? What did they need to know? They needed to know how to attain salvation, eternal life:

[b]...Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?[/b](Luke 10:25)

"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself." (Luke 10:27)

The above constitutes "doing the Father's will," loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself. And Jesus says: "Not every one who says to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." (Matthew 7:21) Love your fellow man and love God and YOU WILL have eternal life, you will be saved. That's Jesus' gospel. And that's why the "ransom-sacrifice" is not in The Urantia Book, or why The Urantia Book does not validate it.

The Urantia Book actually does "give recognition of the ransom sacrifice." It says it's wrong.

188:4.3 Mortal man was never the property of the archdeceivers. Jesus did not die to ransom man from the clutch of the apostate rulers and fallen princes of the spheres. The Father in heaven never conceived of such crass injustice as damning a mortal soul because of the evildoing of his ancestors. Neither was the Master’s death on the cross a sacrifice which consisted in an effort to pay God a debt which mankind had come to owe him.

188:4.4 Before Jesus lived on earth, you might possibly have been justified in believing in such a God, but not since the Master lived and died among your fellow mortals. Moses taught the dignity and justice of a Creator God; but Jesus portrayed the love and mercy of a heavenly Father.

Since: Jan 12

Kingman, Arizona

#32 Jul 24, 2012
Hey, isn't there a Preview" feature?
Kevin 321 wrote:
<quoted text>
Does the Urantia book not state that Jesus' death was not needed for forgiveness of sins? That it was only the ignorance of man that crucified Jesus, and that sins would have been forgiven either way?
Um, yes and no. Yes, Jesus' death was not needed for the forgiveness of sins. But then Jesus says that himself in the New Testament:

"For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:" (Mat 6:14)

Then Jesus further states that if you don't forgive, you won't be forgiven, apparently no matter who you think died for your sins:

"But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." (Mat 6:15)

What got Jesus crucified is that he ran afoul of the religious authorities, and they decided they needed to get rid of him and shut him up. He did not need to die THAT way, it's just the way it worked out. Even today, if you make yourself a thorn in the side of the religious or political authorities, they will find a way to shut you up. Jehovah's Witnesses and Amish and others do this by shunning. The Catholic Church used to do it by burning people at the stake. Entrenched authority does not take well to being challenged or contradicted.

The real gospel is not about sins being forgiven, it's about attaining salvation by doing the Father's will. If one is doing the Father's will to the best of their ability and is right with God, of course their sins will be forgiven. We should be less concerned about US and OUR sins and more concerned with God and with doing His will.

Elijah and Enoch did the Father's will perfectly. They aligned their wills with God's will so perfectly that they "fused" with the fragment of God that is within everyone.(Luke 17:21) When this happened they were "translated" (Heb 11:5) in a "chariot of [spiritual] fire" (2Ki 2:11) directly to the "mansions" (aka, "heaven")(John 14:2), bypassing normal mortal death. The Urantia Book talks about these "mansions" as "The Mansion Worlds," one through seven. Paul talks about a man who ascended to the third Mansion World, or the "third heaven." (2Co 12:2)

And if Jesus died for our sins, why would they have to be forgiven? I'm just asking. If He died for them, they'd be gone, washed away in the blood of the Lamb, and so on and so forth.
bible thumper

United States

#33 Aug 4, 2014
Richies Cool Man Diary wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL!!!!
lol! So true. Proselytizing comes in many forms. Missionaries went to help those in need, but also to convert. That's not a bad thing, is it?

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#34 Aug 5, 2014
bible thumper wrote:
<quoted text> lol! So true. Proselytizing comes in many forms. Missionaries went to help those in need, but also to convert. That's not a bad thing, is it?
The Urantia supporters are trained in proselyting techniques and have the same basic goal as the WTBTS. It doesn't take much searching on their forums and other communications online to see that. That's why some of their adherents posting here seem to be adverse to logical argument. They dismiss, avoid, redirect, etc any legitimate concerns people might have, the same way any good salesman does, always presenting a positive outlook.(think spin) Avoidance of, and feigned misunderstanding of any legitimate criticism, and unwillingness to address legitimate concerns is the work of the day. Basic dishonesty is not a tool that someone representing the God of Truth would employ. Just a few things from the proverbs of Solomon to ponder.....(note that it's not reams and reams, just a few poignant statements to ponder)

17 He that launches forth faithfulness will tell what is righteous, but a false witness, deception.

5 A faithful witness is one that will not lie, but a false witness launches forth mere lies.

25 A true witness is delivering souls, but a deceitful one launches forth mere lies.
FutureMan

West End, Australia

#35 Aug 5, 2014
sidgi wrote:
<quoted text>
The Urantia supporters are trained in proselyting techniques and have the same basic goal as the WTBTS. It doesn't take much searching on their forums and other communications online to see that. That's why some of their adherents posting here seem to be adverse to logical argument. They dismiss, avoid, redirect, etc any legitimate concerns people might have, the same way any good salesman does, always presenting a positive outlook.(think spin) Avoidance of, and feigned misunderstanding of any legitimate criticism, and unwillingness to address legitimate concerns is the work of the day. Basic dishonesty is not a tool that someone representing the God of Truth would employ. Just a few things from the proverbs of Solomon to ponder.....(note that it's not reams and reams, just a few poignant statements to ponder)
17 He that launches forth faithfulness will tell what is righteous, but a false witness, deception.
5 A faithful witness is one that will not lie, but a false witness launches forth mere lies.
25 A true witness is delivering souls, but a deceitful one launches forth mere lies.
This is such a blanket statement from you that I just had to respond to this reply of yours.

I might read and study the Urantia book and support it's concepts, but I also read and study the Bible as well as a variety of other literature wherever on-line or in written literature, or I have done so in the past anyway as I do not have much time to do this now days nor the will power.

My main goal is in the direction of the truth, wherever it may lead and so I am constantly on the move and learning about the world and the universe around me as to it's realities, whether that maybe spiritual or indeed physical.

The Urantia book believe it or not does not have any organized religion surrounding it except for small groups which have formed who adhere to it's precepts.

I believe much of it is of value to me personally, but so do I believe much of the Bible to be of value to me as well and other writings that I have read.

To grow spiritually should be the main goal of any person who seeks spiritual truths and meaning in their life.
This will also eventually lead to eternal life as Jesus had promised those who heed his teachings.

Along with life extension will come changes of density from our third density human state to higer densities or levels of existence, to finally become a being with a spirit body that could potentially be resident with God himself in "Paradise".

This is the opportunity that is now held out to all human beings on this planet who allow God's Spirit to lead them.

We all can be sons and daughters of God and eventually spirit sons as well.

But that is our choice.

The invitation is now open, but will we accept it?

Since: Aug 12

Aberdeen, UK

#36 Aug 5, 2014
sidgi wrote:
<quoted text>
The Urantia supporters are trained in proselyting techniques and have the same basic goal as the WTBTS. It doesn't take much searching on their forums and other communications online to see that. That's why some of their adherents posting here seem to be adverse to logical argument. They dismiss, avoid, redirect, etc any legitimate concerns people might have, the same way any good salesman does, always presenting a positive outlook.(think spin) Avoidance of, and feigned misunderstanding of any legitimate criticism, and unwillingness to address legitimate concerns is the work of the day. Basic dishonesty is not a tool that someone representing the God of Truth would employ. Just a few things from the proverbs of Solomon to ponder.....(note that it's not reams and reams, just a few poignant statements to ponder)
17 He that launches forth faithfulness will tell what is righteous, but a false witness, deception.
5 A faithful witness is one that will not lie, but a false witness launches forth mere lies.
25 A true witness is delivering souls, but a deceitful one launches forth mere lies.
Usually I just ignore statements made in innocence because I'm more interested in respecting people (unlike yourself), but this post is beyond a joke. I've never known so much presumptuous arrogance before I came across yourself...who's too big and clever for any religion (even denying your own scriptures).

- "Trained proselytizers"?

Wow that's ignorant on so many levels;

1) You better tell that Jesus guy off then, he was pretty good at converting people

2) Where is the training? Show me the Urantia church?

FTR, I discovered the Urantia book by accident. It is against the very principles of the book to force it upon anyone. Admittedly, my "preachy side" (which I am working on) I probably get from being raised a JW...preaching in my family was a passion and highly regarded as a supreme privilege.

- "Adverse to logical argument"?

This one IS funny. It's because you're trapped in such a constrained bubble that logic CAN'T be used...you will simply retort "but but but THE BIBLE SAYS it's ok to hate that enemy because God hates them" (for example). Don't get me started with logic lol. Let me remind you that when reality was pointed out to you on the other thread, you just said "whatever". When you don't like the sound of something you automatically dismiss it as "untruth", that is not logical/objective/rational. You then resort to ad hominem by putting the other person's credentials down while exulting your 60+ years of "wisdom". That is your typical argument style. When people don't understand what you're getting at because you've posted 2 lines of nothing, you then dance around victorious making out that they are not as wise as you are (i.e. because they aren't mind readers).

----------
----------

Is that direct and honest enough? Would you prefer me to utilize this writing style towards you from now on? Or would you prefer me to try and be diplomatic/tactful like I have in the past which you then accused me of being dishonest and salesman-like? Somebody else told me to call it how it is (a spade a spade - "you're a narrow minded bigot"), but that was against my religious convictions (to put others down)...

BTW, if I am being a salesman (just sharing what I find wonderful), what are you doing here? Just dropping by to criticize everyone, tell them how "foolish" they are, and trying to get them to think exactly the same way as yourself...

Since you like the book of Proverbs so much, here's one for you:

(Proverbs 26:5) Answer a fool as his folly deserves, That he not be wise in his own eyes.

Sorry, was that insulting? Never stops you though does it :)

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#37 Aug 5, 2014
FutureMan wrote:
<quoted text>
This is such a blanket statement from you that I just had to respond to this reply of yours.
I might read and study the Urantia book and support it's concepts, but I also read and study the Bible as well as a variety of other literature wherever on-line or in written literature, or I have done so in the past anyway as I do not have much time to do this now days nor the will power.
My main goal is in the direction of the truth, wherever it may lead and so I am constantly on the move and learning about the world and the universe around me as to it's realities, whether that maybe spiritual or indeed physical.
The Urantia book believe it or not does not have any organized religion surrounding it except for small groups which have formed who adhere to it's precepts.
I believe much of it is of value to me personally, but so do I believe much of the Bible to be of value to me as well and other writings that I have read.
To grow spiritually should be the main goal of any person who seeks spiritual truths and meaning in their life.
This will also eventually lead to eternal life as Jesus had promised those who heed his teachings.
Along with life extension will come changes of density from our third density human state to higer densities or levels of existence, to finally become a being with a spirit body that could potentially be resident with God himself in "Paradise".
This is the opportunity that is now held out to all human beings on this planet who allow God's Spirit to lead them.
We all can be sons and daughters of God and eventually spirit sons as well.
But that is our choice.
The invitation is now open, but will we accept it?
I've accepted the bibles version of both events, and salvation. I've also accepted the creators principals to the best of my ability. Why in the world would I dilute it with some supposed wisdom that makes a mockery of it? A man's spirit, is the dominant purpose he shows. Spiritual things, in a fleshly body, have to do with that. Dilly-dallying with some other explanation of it is foolishness. I can tell that none of you Urantia supporters have the knowledge of the bible to show that you are able to make an honest comparison of it with anything else. Selfishness is the dominant spirit of this world. Do you believe that someone seeking God's pure spirit could ever settle for anything less?

Since: Aug 12

Aberdeen, UK

#38 Aug 5, 2014
Let's see Sidgi's "positive spin" on this one:

Why did God require millions of animals and even his own SON to be slaughtered for forgiveness of sin that we were supposedly born with?

Please use logic. Thank you.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#39 Aug 5, 2014
It doesn't take a genius to put together the similarities to the Watchtower organization. Also the attempts at internationalizing the "brotherhood" to accomplish it's goals. Notice I said it's goals, not God's. The reason I say attempts, is because there have been upheavals within it's community at the highest levels, where selfish man-type reasoning has prevailed over it
's original direction. That's not to say it's original direction was any less selfish, just that it shows that there is just as much disorder in your organization as any other man made vehicle. Here are just a few links, if the moderators will allow them, as proof. There are tons more on a Google search if anyone is willing to do one. I suggest using different variables in tone of the query and doing more than one. copy and paste them in your address window as I've numbered them to not be live.(eliminate the number at the front of each one in your copy

1https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/ groups/ubees/conversations/mes sages/29

2http://urantianow.com/family- life/pilot-program/month-one/

3http://urantianow.com/family- life/pilot-program/month-two/

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#40 Aug 5, 2014
Brother P wrote:
Let's see Sidgi's "positive spin" on this one:
Why did God require millions of animals and even his own SON to be slaughtered for forgiveness of sin that we were supposedly born with?
Please use logic. Thank you.
So you're saying that because you personally can't make sense of something, you are rejecting it? That is exactly how Satan deceived Eve. "Is it really so...." I'll bet there are a ton of things in the Urantia you can't make sense of. Like it's "tidal theory" that relies on outdated scientific data, and has to be explained away.

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