What is the trinity?

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#4953 Sep 17, 2013
Schleptik wrote:
When it says that Jesus thought it not robbery to be equal to God, it is telling you that he did not set himself up like Satan did against God.
Hi Schleptik

I agree that when one reads verses like Philippians 2:6 they must always relate it to the fundamental principle on which the Bible was written. Genesis 3:-5 gives the reason for the Bibles existence.

“Genesis 3:3-5 3 but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said,‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.’” 4 The serpent said to the woman,“You surely will not die! 5 For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

Jesus made it clear by constantly giving credit to his Father and by demonstrating that he had not come to Earth to attempt to seek equality to God like Adam had done, but to demonstrate that a perfect man, could when given free choice, and tempted like Adam, would not grasp an opportunity to try to be like God — that was the primary reason for the Bible been written.

Had Adam not sinned there would have been no reason for writing the Bible because Satan would have been incorrect in his challenge to Gods authority – there would have been no need to have a perfect man show that when tempted with free choice refuse to seek equality with God.

To destroy Satan and Adam, and not allow a future perfect man be subject to the same test, would have left the issue of free choice unresolved.

All the Best

Dave

“Photo of JW gathering”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#4954 Sep 17, 2013
Matt13weedhacker wrote:
<quoted text>
Come by me again?
Where does John 1:1 say: "...ALWAYS..."?
Where does John 1:1 say: "...ETERNAL..."?
I must have missed that, and so did John the writer.
WHY ARE YOU SO SELECTIVE IN REQUIRING SCRIPTURE?

It is a FACT that the word, "ORGANIZATION" appears 16,789 times on the CD put out by Satan's organization, the jehovah's witnesses.

But the word, "ORGANIZATION" NEVER APPEARS IN THE OLD OR NEW TESTAMENT.

jehovah's witnesses FALSELY CLAIM that belonging to an organization is essential for salvation.

"To receive everlasting life in the earthly Paradise we must identify that organization and serve God as part of it." Watchtower 1983 Feb 15 p.12

Yet the word "organization" never appears in the Bible!

The Scriptures repeatedly state that it is faith in Jesus that results in everlasting life.

Once again it is clear that religions which teach lies are a FALSE RELIGION.

jehovah's witnesses are indeed a false religion BECAUSE THEY TEACH LIES.
dee lightful

Stanley, NC

#4955 Sep 17, 2013
Matt13weedhacker wrote:
<quoted text>
Come by me again?
Where does John 1:1 say: "...ALWAYS..."?
Where does John 1:1 say: "...ETERNAL..."?
I must have missed that, and so did John the writer.
you miss a lot because you have no comprehension and that is why you play with words instead of understanding the whole of what is written.

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4956 Sep 17, 2013
beckyss wrote:
<quoted text>

The immortal spirit of God which lived in and through Christ did not die, the body did.
So it was just Adams body that died?

And Adams immortal God spirit just carried on living?

That's where ( your ) teaching goes from - my - point of view.

Jesus = ransom for = an immortal god soul-spirit with a separate conscious body?

Or

Jesus = ransom = soul for soul?

What did Jesus give on our behalf?

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4957 Sep 17, 2013
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>

If Jesus wanted to say He was inferior to God ---((( IN NATURE )))--- He --- would have said,“The Father is ((( BETTER ))) than I.”
You mean, like where it says Jesus: "...BECAME BETTER THAN THE ANGELS..." at Hebrews 1:4?

Hebrews 1:4

NET Bible

"...Thus he ((( BECAME ))) so far ((( BETTER THAN ))) the angels as he has inherited a name superior to theirs..."

Jesus: "...BECAME BETTER THAN THE ANGELS..." in nature?

Or in name?

What do the scriptures say?

I will be very interested in your answer to that simple question Erik?

Will you give a simple answer to a simple question?

Or will you divert and hide?

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4958 Sep 17, 2013
very smart scientist wrote:
<quoted text>The soul can not be destroyed.The body was sacrificed kid not the soul.he shed his earthly blood for our sins .Didn't you get the memo?
Really?

Isaiah 53:12

English Standard Version (©2001)

"...Therefore I will divide him a portion with the many, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong, because he poured out ((( HIS SOUL TO DEATH ))) and was numbered with the transgressors; yet he bore the sin of many, and makes intercession for the transgressors..."

Hmmm.

I don't see the word: "...BODY..." mentioned here?

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4959 Sep 17, 2013
very smart scientist wrote:
<quoted text>The soul can not be destroyed.The body was sacrificed kid not the soul.he shed his earthly blood for our sins .Didn't you get the memo?
Are you sure?

Matthew 20:28

New World Translation

"...Just as the Son of man came, not to be ministered to, but to minister and to give his [Gk.,( PHYSCI )]((( SOUL ))) a ransom in exchange for many..."

Literally: "...THE ((( SOUL ))) OF-HIM..."
Erik

Falkirk, UK

#4960 Sep 17, 2013
Matt13weedhacker wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean, like where it says Jesus: "...BECAME BETTER THAN THE ANGELS..." at Hebrews 1:4?
Hebrews 1:4
NET Bible
"...Thus he ((( BECAME ))) so far ((( BETTER THAN ))) the angels as he has inherited a name superior to theirs..."
Jesus: "...BECAME BETTER THAN THE ANGELS..." in nature?
Or in name?
What do the scriptures say?
I will be very interested in your answer to that simple question Erik?
Will you give a simple answer to a simple question?
Or will you divert and hide?
I will answer your questions when you answer my previous questions which you did not answer...

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4961 Sep 17, 2013
Mega Rude wrote:
There would be ZERO jehovah's witnesses in the world.
In John 5:39-40 Jesus says,“You are searching the Scriptures, because you think that by means of them you will have everlasting life…And yet you do not want to COME TO ME that you may have life.”
Jehovah’s Witnesses are constantly “searching the scriptures”, but do they come directly to Jesus as he says they should (Mt 11:28, Jn 5:40)?
Do Witnesses “come” to Jesus by praying directly to him?
NO! It's not allowed by the GB. The witnesses are exactly like the people Jesus was talking about in John 5:39-40!
Jesus is the way: "...((( TO )))..." where?

John 14:6

"...COMES ( TO ) THE FATHER EXCEPT --- THROUGH --- ME..."!

Siiigghhhh.

“Read God's Word”

Since: Aug 12

Location hidden

#4962 Sep 17, 2013
hi Dave I agree with your assessment of why the Bible was written, why God selected a seed, completely. Thank you. There are some interesting points in the scriptures you bring out, but perhaps we can discuss it another time in greater detail.
I hope to get back to you regarding the idea that scripture absolutely must be compared with scripture in times of question. Regards.(Also common should prevail as well.)

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4963 Sep 17, 2013
Mega Rude wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's the facts...
The jehovah's witnesses teach that the only true name for God is "jehovah", and that the only way God's name can be sanctified is by calling God by His true name.
This false religion claims that to call God by any other name is to dishonor Him.
Since the jehovah's witnesses put an exclusive emphasis on the name "jehovah", how can they honestly say they are being obedient to Acts 1:8?
Keep in mind the insertion of the name jehovah in the New Testament by jehovah's witnesses goes completely against what is found in the early manuscripts of the New Testament.
Jesus said to the disciples in Acts 1:8 "You will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be MY witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth".
There is only one name by which true followers of God should be identified. We are called to be witnesses of Jesus Christ, not the fake, fabricated name, jehovah!
Those of you who defend Satan's cult, the jehovah's witnesses should consider the truth:
In whose name should we meet together?(Matthew 18:20; 1 Corinthians 5:4)
Demons are subject to whose name?(Luke 10:17; Acts 16:18)
Repentance and forgiveness should be preached in whose name?(Luke 24:47)
In whose name are you to believe and receive the forgiveness of sins (John 1:12; 3:16; Acts 10:43; I John 3:23; 5:13)
By whose name, and NO OTHER, do we obtain salvation (Acts 4:12)
Whose name should be invoked as we bring our petitions to God in prayer?(John 14:13, 14; 15:16; 16:23, 24)
In whose name is the Holy Spirit sent?(John 14:26)
Whose name and authority was invoked by the disciples in healing the sick and lame?(Acts 3:16; 4:7-10, 30)
Whose name did Paul tell us to call upon (1 Corinthians 1:2)?
Whose name is above every name (Ephesians 1:21; Philippians 2:9-11)
The answer to each of these questions is Jesus Christ, not the fake, fabricated jehovah.
Real Christians are called to be witnesses of Jesus Christ.
False Christians witness for the fake, fabricated jehovah.
Sent "...FROM..." where?

Who is it who: "...RECEIVES..." the spirit in Acts?

And: "...FROM..." whom?

Who sent it to him?

And who: "...SENDS..." both?

[1.] "...THE SON..." and?
[2.] "...THE SPIRIT..."?

In the first place?

“Read God's Word”

Since: Aug 12

Location hidden

#4964 Sep 17, 2013
common SENSE :-)
very smart scientist

Arlington Heights, IL

#4965 Sep 17, 2013
the Mad JW wrote:
<quoted text>
DarkDementedDee has demonstrated this for us continually, as she clings to the antichristian dogma of Churchianity.
Well put!
(Yet note that she says " convincing oneself of a truth" is ALSO self-deception.Let this serve as a WARNING: Just say "NO!!!" to church)
You must have been an only child that was never held or bonded with your parents hah?I bet you had blue hair and all kinds of nose rings and ear rings when you were a teen.you crave attention.You are indeed sick my friend .Please seek professional help A.S.A.P.!!!!!

“Read God's Word”

Since: Aug 12

Location hidden

#4966 Sep 17, 2013
Matt, just to add to your point, the Bible says at Romans 6:9 that after Christ was raised from the DEAD he DIES NO MORE. There are not too many ways a person can twist that scripture. He died, then he was resurrected and he dies NO MORE.:-)
Romans 6:9 - knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#4967 Sep 17, 2013
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
Boni, I don't like to do this, but I feel I have to; In my view, you ARE a SPURIOUS and EVIL controlled Jehovah's Witness.
This is why:
You remember, when I was quoting from other sources and you accused me of COPY-PASTE? I think so, unless your brain is smaller than the brain of an ant!
Now, on post 4813,'the Mad JW' quoted from another source, according to your own words 'COPY-PASTE' without giving the source; YET, you, AN EXCELLENTLY HONEST AND AND EXCELLENTLY GOOD STANDING PERFECT JW never said ANYTHING about it to 'the Mad JW's' COPY-PASTE.
In my view, you are a HYPOCRITE just as any other Jehovah's Witness [Pharisees] in the Bible, who tried to destroy Jesus Christ because He claimed to be God; and so it is today...
Let's see, you admit that you were quoting from other sources when I accused you of "COPY-PASTE". And that makes me "SPURIOUS and EVIL"?

I'm afraid you'll have to explain that one to me again. LOL

Secondly, I branched off Dr SOS post 4849. Dr SOS made a mindless remark on a point of my post.

Thirdly, was Mad JW's 4813 post a quote from another source? If you want to charge Mad JW for plagiarism, then have the source available for all to see what you are charging him with. So far you are offering nothing more than your usual hot air. A missed opportunity in your post 4819.

Fourthly, and as usual, not you nor anyone from your camp refuted the contents of 4813. All you did was express your reactions and petty objections to it.

Fifthly, Jesus never claimed to be God nor "God the Son". There is no verse in the Bible that explicitly teaches the Trinity.

Now, it appears to me who is the actual one spraying spurious and evil things. Such ones reveal themselves.

:)

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#4968 Sep 17, 2013
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
You JWs are wrong and just a couple of things,
1) the church is the body of Christ (Eph. 5:23; Col. 1:24) made up of people and not objects, such as an active force or power; we find the same pattern in Revelation 21:2 where we read that, "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband." (KJV). Again, in Revelation 21:2, "the holy city", which is the "bride", are people and not objects, such as an active force or power.
and
Read Ephesians 5:22-32 and confirm for us that the church is spoken of as a "bride". If so, then the church is personified exactly as I've claimed.
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
2) the Holy Spirit has the same attributes as [God] the Father and the Son have; therefore, just as the church or the holy city, which in a way may be [considered] an object, actually is a person, a Divine Entity, as [God] the Father and the Son are.
Details, please.

:)

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#4969 Sep 17, 2013
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
You said, I quote,
"The Scriptures are clear that both God the Father and Jesus Christ are separate, unequal, and distinct persons."
Firstly, Philippians 2:6 tells us that Jesus is equal with God;
"Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:" (KJV)
Read that again. Doesn't say that Jesus is equal with God.

Try modern English translations to make the point clearer.

RSV Php 2:6 who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped,

NASB Php 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,

NLT Php 2:6 Though He was God, He did not think of equality with God as something to cling to.
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
and, secondly, yes, the Father and the Jesus are separate and distinct persons, YET, they are ONE.
" I and my Father are one." (John 10:30, KJV)
Then Christians are God because we are one with the Father too!

John 17:21 I pray that they will all be one, just as You and I are one—as You are in Me, Father, and I am in You. And may they be in Us so that the world will believe You sent Me. 22 "I have given them the glory You gave Me, so they may be one as We are one.

Now what?

:)

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#4970 Sep 17, 2013
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
I will answer your questions when you answer my previous questions which you did not answer...
It was you who proposed the theory.
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>

If Jesus wanted to say He was inferior to God ---((( IN NATURE )))--- He --- would have said,“The Father is ((( BETTER ))) than I.”
You believed you were correct.

Will you face up to the consequences?

It says Jesus: "...BECAME ((( BETTER ))) THAN THE ANGELS..." at Hebrews 1:4.

Hebrews 1:4

NET Bible

"...Thus he ((( BECAME ))) so far ((( BETTER THAN ))) the angels as he has inherited a name superior to theirs..."

Note those two words:

[1.] "...BECAME..." and
[2.] "...BETTER..."

Based on your hypothesis and teaching of:
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>

If Jesus wanted to say He was inferior to God ---((( IN NATURE )))--- He --- would have said,“The Father is ((( BETTER ))) than I.”
"...I AM..." asking you, did Jesus: "...BECAME BETTER THAN THE ANGELS..." in nature?

Or in name?

What do the scriptures say?

I will be very interested in your answer to that simple question Erik?

Will you give a simple answer to a simple question?

Or will you divert and hide?

You have diverted once.

Your trying to hide.

Answer the simple question!

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#4971 Sep 17, 2013
Erik wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's sort this out first
"Boni wrote:
<quoted text>
I trust what is verifiable.
Regarding the Emphatic Diaglott: What's in your hand isn't. What's in archive.org is!
Eat it!
:)
Boni, I don't like to call anybody 'liar', but to me you are a 'SPURIOUS LIAR' and I tell you why.
I said that in the Emphatic Diaglott I have John 1:1 reads,
"In the Beginning was the LOGOS, and the LOGOS was with GOD, and the LOGOS was God."
You said it is not true and you only trust what is verifiable and you gave me the link where to read the Emphatic Diaglott. And guess what, it reads EXACTLY the same as in the Emphatic Diaglott I have, which I quote again,
"In the Beginning was the LOGOS, and the LOGOS was with GOD, and the LOGOS was God."
Do you really believe that I am nuts? Or, again, you want me to believe what you are saying and not what I am reading or seeing?! Hmmm...Satan's diabolical knowledge blinded you completely...I feel sorry for you..."
ANY COMMENTS or ANSWER? OR YOU SKIPPED THIS POST...? Looks like...
This is what separates the man from the boy.

I quoted my reference which is easily accessible which anyone - friend, foe, or neutral - can confirm. You keep insisting that we believe what you claim in your hand ... not happening! LOL

Here it is again. I give you the link and page number.

Emphatic Diaglott John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the God, and a god was the Word.

http://archive.org/details/emphaticdiaglott00...

(Actual book facsimile from The Internet Archive - a non-profit organization that has no connection with the WTS. See page 303 in the interlinear reading for the literal translation.)

There is more. See the continuation....

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#4972 Sep 17, 2013
Continuation for Erik ....

Then to underscore the point, in another discussion I added a quote from Wikipedia, another publicly accessible source, which CORROBORATED MY QUOTE from the Emphatic Diaglott -- assuming, of course, that you wouldn't click verify the original source from archive.org .

***
1966, 2001 The Good News Bible reads: "...and he was the same as God."
1970, 1989 The Revised English Bible reads: "...and what God was, the Word was."
14th century - Wycliffe's Bible (from the 4th-century Latin Vulgate) reads: "In the beginning was the word, and the word was at God, and God was the word.
1956 The Wuest Expanded Translation reads:“In the beginning the Word was existing. And the Word was in fellowship with God the Father. And the Word was as to His essence absolute deity”[6]
1808 “and the Word was a god”- Thomas Belsham The New Testament, in An Improved Version, Upon the Basis of Archbishop Newcome’s New Translation: With a Corrected Text , London.
1864 “the LOGOS was God, This was in the Beginning with God” A New Emphatic Version (right hand column)
1864 “and a god was the Word”(left hand column interlinear reading) The Emphatic Diaglott by Benjamin Wilson, New York and London.
1867 “In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son. And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God”- The Joseph Smith Translation of the Bible.
1935 “and the Word was divine”- The Bible—An American Translation, by John M. P. Smith and Edgar J. Goodspeed, Chicago.
1955 “so the Word was divine”- The Authentic New Testament, by Hugh J. Schonfield, Aberdeen.
1978 “and godlike sort was the Logos”- Das Evangelium nach Johannes, by Johannes Schneider, Berlin.
1822 "and the Word was a god." - The New Testament in Greek and English (A. Kneeland, 1822.);
1863 "and the Word was a god." - A Literal Translation Of The New Testament (Herman Heinfetter [Pseudonym of Frederick Parker], 1863);
1885 "and the Word was a god." - Concise Commentary On The Holy Bible (R. Young, 1885);
1879 "and the Word was a god." - Das Evangelium nach Johannes (J. Becker, 1979);
1911 "and the Word was a god." - The Coptic Version of the N.T.(G. W. Horner, 1911);
1958 "and the Word was a god." - The New Testament of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Anointed" (J. L. Tomanec, 1958);
1829 "and the Word was a god." - The Monotessaron; or, The Gospel History According to the Four Evangelists (J. S. Thompson, 1829);
1975 "and the Word was a god." - Das Evangelium nach Johannes (S. Schulz, 1975);
1962, 1979 "'the word was God.' Or, more literally,'God was the word.'" The Four Gospels and the Revelation (R. Lattimore, 1979)
1975 "and a god (or, of a divine kind) was the Word" Das Evangelium nach Johnnes, by Siegfried Schulz, Göttingen, Germany
***
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_1:1#John_1:...

"1864 “and a god was the Word”(left hand column interlinear reading) The Emphatic Diaglott by Benjamin Wilson, New York and London."

You are busted again, Erik!!!!!!!

What do you have to corroborate what you say in your Emphatic Diaglott?? NOTHING!!!!!!

You are busted some more!!!! LOL

Your intellectual cowardice and dishonesty is in plain sight for all to see.

Have a nice day!

:)

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