Malaysian Christians fight for Allah

Malaysian Christians fight for Allah

There are 20 comments on the Commonweal story from Oct 14, 2013, titled Malaysian Christians fight for Allah. In it, Commonweal reports that:

Today an appeals court in Malaysia delivered a major setback to the religious freedom of Christians.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Commonweal.

hahahaha

Chengdu, China

#1 Oct 15, 2013
match of the year hahaha
warner

Dublin, Ireland

#2 Oct 15, 2013
Well they are mad! Someone needs to have a serious word with them and tell them that in the end the Giant will eat them for breakfast(blasphemy).
NAJIB seremban

United States

#4 Oct 19, 2013
allah belong to muslim only ..
bmz

Boulder, CO

#5 Oct 20, 2013
fk allah...that goes to prove allah belongs to everyone. me...for writing that.
anak sabah

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#6 Oct 30, 2013
itu semua salah indonesia negeri tukang cipta tulis menulis perkataan.... entah dari mana nama A itu datang? seharusnya nama tuhan kristen mesti nya dari alkitab tulen.

sehingga zaman kini, kristen masih cuai mengguna nama tuhan kristen yang sebenarnya.

tolong teliti betul yah...nama tuhan kristen sebenar nya..

lihat kamus concordance greek

kaji semula betul betul hai pencipta buku alkitab bahasa.

tapi ini tak, malas malas saja, nak abai rukun cipta tuhan, biar didenda.

kerajaan pula disalahkan.
sedangkan itu bukan kesalahan mereka,
tapi yang nak di salahkan tu adalah si tukang tulis indonesia bandung.

biar pun apa, alkitab bahasa harus di ubah nama tuhan yang sebenar benar nya!!!!!!!

SEBAB NAMA "allah" itu bukan nama tuhan kristen.

berdosa besar jika memanggil nama nya tu,
tuhan pun tak akan mendengar doa doa mereka kerana nama tu nama syaitan tuhan palsu.

tobat tobat ya..
anak sabah

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#7 Oct 30, 2013
berpura pura tak tahu kah??

dah tahu pun tak dipedulikan.

dah kata harus di tukar nama tapi masih di abai.

geram!!!!!!!

bertobat hai bandung indon.
jika engkau hormati tuhan yesus, sila tukar nama.
anak sabah

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#8 Oct 30, 2013
kerana tu lah dosa besar memanggil TUHAH KRISTEN sebarangan?? tak sedar lagi?

sedar diri !!!

berani kamu kristen memanggil nama tuhan kristen sesuka hati?

cuba teliti betul betul apa dia ribuan jenis nama tuhan kristen itu?

pemalas punya kristen.
sungguh tak adil.
geram!
tukarnama

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#9 Oct 30, 2013
biar pun dari english kristen malaysia juga sama

asyik pakai satu nama tuhan saja?

sedangkan nama tuhan kristen berpuluh jenis,
ya, berjenis nama, beranika nama, mysteri

kristen malaysia memang lain macam punya itik
susah nak di tegur, biar pun di tegur, tak di peduli
zaman purba punya otak

jika tak tobat nanti akibat nya.

jika dah tobat, apa boleh buat,

ribuan tahun berlalu dah di abai menikmati tuhan ini yang sungguh luarbiasa,

nasib baik kristen malaysia sementara...jika masih belum sedar, sedari lah sekarang sebelum terlambat...

tukar nama cepat!!
tukarnama

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#10 Oct 30, 2013
anak sabah wrote:
berpura pura tak tahu kah??
dah tahu pun tak dipedulikan.
dah kata harus di tukar nama tapi masih di abai.
geram!!!!!!!
bertobat hai bandung indon.
jika engkau hormati tuhan yesus, sila tukar nama.


buat apa u susah payah berkata kata...orang malaysia memang degil punya...

degil & bongkak itu polisi mereka. bodoh ya
tukarnama

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#11 Oct 30, 2013
anak sabah wrote:
itu semua salah indonesia negeri tukang cipta tulis menulis perkataan.... entah dari mana nama A itu datang? seharusnya nama tuhan kristen mesti nya dari alkitab tulen.
sehingga zaman kini, kristen masih cuai mengguna nama tuhan kristen yang sebenarnya.
tolong teliti betul yah...nama tuhan kristen sebenar nya..
lihat kamus concordance greek
kaji semula betul betul hai pencipta buku alkitab bahasa.
tapi ini tak, malas malas saja, nak abai rukun cipta tuhan, biar didenda.
kerajaan pula disalahkan.
sedangkan itu bukan kesalahan mereka,
tapi yang nak di salahkan tu adalah si tukang tulis indonesia bandung.
biar pun apa, alkitab bahasa harus di ubah nama tuhan yang sebenar benar nya!!!!!!!
SEBAB NAMA "allah" itu bukan nama tuhan kristen.
berdosa besar jika memanggil nama nya tu,
tuhan pun tak akan mendengar doa doa mereka kerana nama tu nama syaitan tuhan palsu.
tobat tobat ya..
dah cukup kata belum?
malaysia kristen tak kisah menukar nama tuhan..
sungguh sedih hingga hari ini masih degil nak gunakan nama allah itu,
bodoh lagi degil lagi bodoh lagi malas
jika pandai kapan masih guna sebarangan nama??
tukarnama

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#12 Oct 30, 2013
jika begitu, esok, kerajaan akan tarik balik semua alkitab bahasa & cetakan terbaru nama allah di singkir dari alkitab dan di ganti nama tuhan kristen sebenar nya..

hooray......!!
radar reread

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#13 Oct 30, 2013
IS ALLAH OF THE MUSLIM/ISLAM RELIGION THE SAME AS THE GOD OF THE BIBLE ?

This critical question was twice asked of and well answered by our friends in ministry

We thought you would appreciate it.

Question: The word "Allah" as used in your September 1993 issue is not correct. The Hausa translation of the Bible in northern Nigeria uses Allah as a designation for the true God. Allah istherefore the same divine being in both the Islamic and Jewish faiths and the one who became man for the salvation of mankind.

Answer: The translators, by using a term familiar to the Muslims in northern Nigeria, no doubt thought they were being helpful. But by using Allah in the Hausa language, they have succeeded, instead, in creating confusion. Allah is no mere linguistic designation for God, asDios in Spanish or Dieuin French. Allah is thename of the god of Islam. In fact, Allah was the name of the chief god among the numerous idols in the Kaaba in Mecca, which represented the deities of travelers passing through in the caravans. Allah was the god of the local Quraish, Muhammad's tribe, before Islam was invented. Muhammad smashed the idols but kept the black stone which is still kissed today by Muslims. He kept, too, the name Allah for the god of Islam (its sign was the crescent moon) in order to appeal to his own tribe.

Allah has definite characteristics: he is not a father, has no son, is not a triune being but a single (and thus incomplete) entity who destroys rather than saves sinners, has compassion on only the righteous, does not deal in grace but only rewards good deeds, has no way to redeem the lost sinners, etc. Allah is not the God of the Bible.

The God of Israel, too, has a name, YHWH, now pronounced Jehovah but more anciently asJahweh. Most Christians are unaware of God's name because the Old Testament substitutes Lord for YHWH. In Exodus 6:3 God says,''Bymy name YHWH was I not known to them"; and at the burning bush when Moses asked His name, God explained the meaning of it by saying I AM THAT I AM; thusYHWH means not just one who is, but the self-existent One who is in and of Himself (Ex. 3:13-14).

The God of the Bible is love, an impossibility for Allah. As a single entity, Allah was lonely and could not love or fellowship until other entities came into existence. Not so withYHWH (Jehovah). He is three persons in One: Father, Son and Holy Spirit, complete in Himself and in need of no others to love and fellowship with ("The Father loveth the Son" [John 3:35], there is communion within the Godhead, etc.). Only of this God could it be said that He is love in Himself.

Allah could never say, "Let us make man in our image" (Genesis 1:26) and the Muslim scholar has no explanation for this expression, which is even found in the Koran's paraphrase of this Bible verse. We could point out other reasons, but this should be enough to show that to use in the Hausa translation the nameAllah for the God of the Bible is a great error! In fact Allah is a false god on a par with any other pagan deity.

Question:(condensed to save space--full question will be posted on our website): In response to (your) article I read on the internet (on someone else's website), entitled "Is Allah, of the Muslim/Islam religion, the same God of the Bible?" I would like to make a few comments and ask some questions. Please give me chapter and verse from the Qur'an....lf l do not hear from you I will assume you have no proof and are spreading lies about Islam.
radar reread

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#14 Oct 30, 2013
Answer: This has been discussed in these pages in the past. That Allah is not the God of the Bible is very clear. The biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) nearly 9,000 times.

Yet Allah is not called by that name even once in the Koran. Why not, if Allah is the same God? God is also referred to asElohim more than 2,500 times in the Bible, but again that word never appears for Allah in the Koran. Why? The God of the Bible is called "The God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob “Israel" (Jacob's name was changed by God to Israel later in life, so he is referred to by either name). He is the father of the Jews.

The God of the Bible revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush by this name ("God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob “Israel") and told Moses, "this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations" (Ex 3:1-16).

If Allah is the God of the Bible, why is he never called by these names? The God of the Bible tells us again and again that He is the God of the Jews. Many times He is called "the God of Israel." Yet there is such hatred for Israel among Muslims! The Koran talks about Abraham and Ishmael, even claims they built the Kaaba, but gives Isaac no prominence.

The Bible mentions Isaac favorably and prominently more than 150 times. God very clearly says that His covenant is with Isaac, not with Ishmael (Genesis 17:19-21), from whom the Arabs claim they are descended. The God of the Bible calls the Jews His chosen people. He loves them and gave the land of Israel to them as an heritage forever, as hundreds of verses in the Bible declare. Islam denies this basic biblical truth.

The Jews are certainly not Allah's chosen people! How can Allah be the God of the Bible, yet not choose the Jews?

In your Koran, as you must know, Allah commands Muslims, "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends 1Surah 5:51, A1 Hi1-a1i, v. 54, Jusuf a1i), so Allah is not the God of the Christians either. In thehadith, Muhammad himself said, "The last hour will not come before the Muslims fight the Jews, and the Muslims kill them" (Mishkat al Masabih Sh. M. Ashraf, 1990, pp. 147, 721, 810-11, 1130, etc.)

Islam's god hates the Jews; the God of the Bible loves them as His chosen people! Allah is very clearly not Jehovah, Elohim, the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, the God of the Bible!

The God of the Bible chose Jerusalem as His holy city. Forty times He calls Jerusalem "the city of David" and repeatedly He promises that the Messiah will be descended from David and will rule on David's throne in Jerusalem over the whole world (2 Chronicles 6:6; 33:7; 2 Samuel 7: 16; Psalm 89:3-29, etc.). Never does the Bible (or the God of the Bible) mention Mecca or Medina, but Jerusalem is mentioned more than 800 times. Yet Allah never mentions Jerusalem. How can this be if Allah is the God of the Bible? And how can the Muslims today claim Jerusalem as a holy city of Islam, when it isn't even mentioned in the Koran? That recent claim comes from those who want to take that city from the Jews.

That Allah has no son is further proof that He is not the God of the Bible, who definitely has a Son, as both the Old and New Testaments declare. Psalms 2 says, "Kiss the Son." Referring to the God of the Bible, Solomon says, "What is his son's name...?" (Proverbs 30:4). The angel Gabriel, whom Islam claims to honor, told the virgin Mary (Islam accepts the virgin birth of Jesus), " And, behold, thou shalt...bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be...called the Son of the Highest ...the Son of God...and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David..." (Luke 1:31-35). That throne is in Jerusalem, not in Mecca.
radar reread

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#15 Oct 30, 2013
Muslims insist that the name " Allah" must be used in every language; it cannot be translated Dios in Spanish, Dieu in French, or God in English. Muslims thus treat " Allah" not as a generic word for God, but as the name of a particular god. In fact, Allah was the god of the Kuraishtribe centuries before Muhammad was born. You deny that he was the chief god in theKaaba, but you admit there were for centuries 360 idols in the Kaabaand one of these was called Allah. What is Allah doing in a temple among 360 idols if he is the God of the Bible, who forbids idolatry? Why does Islam keep this idol temple, and why must Muslims to this day make a pilgrimage there? That Allah was the chief idol in theKaaba is documented history. Let me quote one of the greatest historians: The desert Arab...feared and worshiped incalculable deities in stars and moons....Now and then he offered human sacrifice; and here and there he worshiped sacred stones. The center of this stone worship was Mecca (with) the Kaaba and its sacred Black Stone...in its southeast corner, five feet from the ground, just right for kissing.…
Within the Kaaba, in pre-Moslem days, were several idols representing gods. One was called Allah...three others were Allah's daughters, al-Uzza, al-Lat, and Manah. We may judge the antiquity of this Arab pantheon from the mention of A1-il Lat (AI-Lat) by Herodotus [fifth century B.C. Greek historian] as a major Arabian deity .The Quraish[Muhammad's tribe controlling Mecca] paved the way for monotheism by worshiping Allah as chief god; He was presented to theMeccans as the Lord of their soil, to Whom they must pay a tithe of their crops and the first-born of their herds. TheQuraish, as alleged descendants of Abraham and Ishmael, appointed the priests and guardians of the shrine and managed its revenues (Will Durant, "The Story of Civilization," IV: 160-61).
The Kaaba still stands, without its idols, but with the Black Stone. The pilgrimage to the Kaaba, to...kiss the sacred stone, to run between Safa andMarwa, and to climb Mount Arafa, was practiced by pious pagan Arabs for centuries before Muhammad. Why did your prophet keep, as part of Islam, these pagan rituals?
You say "Islam is the religion of Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus..." Do you think Adam, Abraham, Moses,Jesus, et al. journeyed to the idol temple, theKaaba, and kissed its Black Stone? Impossible! Not one follower of the God of the Bible would ever have gone near the Kaaba, because the God of the Bible forbids any association with idols; and you admit (as history tells us) that theKaaba was filled with idols before Muhammad destroyed them all. In history and the Bible, you will find no mention of Islam or any religion like it. How could you have Islam without the Koran and Muhammad?
The only people who journeyed to theKaaba and kissed the Black Stone were pagan Arabs who worshiped one or more of the idols within and around it. Muhammad started a new religion called Islam to which Arabs, Persians, Egyptians, Turks and everyone else in the region had to convert at the point of the sword. They became Muslims, and there is no way you can say that Islam was the original religion of that or any other region.
You ask me to explain, "The God of the Bible is love, an impossibility for Allah." If Allah is a single being, as Muslims insist, then he cannot be love in and of himself, because he had no one to love until he created others; but the God of the Bible is love in and of Himself because He is three Persons but One God. Father, Son and Holy Spirit loved and communed with one another before men or angels were created.
radar reread

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#16 Oct 30, 2013
While the Jews know that Allah is not Jehovah, they try to say (as Muslims do for Allah) that Jehovah is a single being. If so, then why does the Bible refer to Him more than 2,500 times with the pluralElohim (gods)? Interestingly, however, always with the plural noun there is a singular verb. One cannot escape the plurality combined with singularity repeatedly used.
The famous shema(Dt 6:4), the most fundamental saying about God for a Jew, declares, "Hear, O Israel: Jehovah ourElohim is one Jehovah." Far from declaring that the God of the Bible is a singular being, the Hebrew word translated "one" is echad, which means a unity of several becoming one, as when God said the man and woman became "one (echad) flesh" (Genesis 2:24); when many soldiers became "one (echad) troop" (2 Samuel 2:25) or when two sticks became "one (echad) stick" (Ezekiel 37:17) etc.
The Bible teaches that God's very essence is love and says, "God is love" (1 John 4:8). This is not true of Allah. The Bible repeatedly speaks of God's love for man and the love we must have for Him. But love is scarcely mentioned in the Koran. Not once is "love" listed in the index of the popularMarmaduke Pickthalltranslation of the Koran. Of Allah's 99 attributes, love is not one. The Koran does say that Allah loves "the beneficent" (Surah2:195), "the stedfast ( and) those whose deeds are good" (Surah 3:146-48), and "those who battle for his cause" (Surah 61:4). But never does it say he loves all mankind, much less sinners; but the God of the Bible loves sinners, even those who hate Him. Allah is said to be merciful, but he does not show mercy to those who need it.
radar reread

Pasir Gudang, Malaysia

#17 Oct 30, 2013
The God of the Bible, however, is merciful to all, ready to forgive confessed sin.
The first of the Ten Commandments is that we are to love the God of the Bible with our whole heart; but never does the Koran say a Muslim is to love Allah. You cannot love Allah, because he is unknowable. The God of the Bible can be known and repeatedly calls upon men to know Him; but the Koran says no one can know Allah because he is too great. In spite of being infinite, without beginning and end, and the Creator of the universe, the biblical God reveals himself so that men can know Him. Jesus himself said, "This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3). Those who don't know the God of the Bible are lost eternally. No one knows Allah.
The Bible is filled with prophecies of the coming of Messiah Jesus, but there is not one such prophecy in the Koran for Jesus or Muhammad. In fact, the Koran was written after Muhammad came, so it could not prophesy his coming, but the Old Testament prophesied the coming of Jesus centuries and even thousands of years beforehand. The Jewish prophets in the Old Testament said the Messiah would be crucified and rise from the dead the third day. Jesus came at exactly the time prophesied and died for the sins of the world, as the Bible says over and over. But the Koran contradicts this and says He didn't die on the cross at all, much less for our sins. The Bible says that the penalty for sin must be paid and that God himself had to come as a man to die for our sins. Allah did not do that.
How does Allah save sinners? It would be unjust to forgive the guilty without the penalty being paid. Where does Allah explain the penalty? When and by whom was that penalty paid? If Allah forgives, how does he forgive? Allah simply refuses to forgive or forgives whom he will, but there is no consistent or just basis for either. No Muslim can be sure Allah will forgive him. As a Christian I know for certain that I have been forgiven all my sins and that I have eternal life as a free gift from God through the death and resurrection of Christ and that I will be in heaven—not by my good works, but by Christ paying the penalty for my sins. Allah is merciful to those who dogood. The Bible says that none do good, all have sinned, and that God saves sinners if they believe in the Christ who died for them.
You ask where Allah says in the Koran, "Let us make man in our image." I don't read Arabic so can't find that exact place but I was told by an Arabic scholar that in the Arabic that is what it says. However, the God of the Bible said, "Let us make man in our image." If Allah is the same God, why didn't he say that? There are many contradictions within the Koran, and between the Bible and the Koran. Please refer to my book, A Cup of Trembling, which lists some of them.
Reprinted with permission
Abam

Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia

#18 Oct 30, 2013
"The Bible is not my book nor Christianity my profession. I could never give assent to the long,complicated statements of Christian dogma."
Abraham Lincoln (American Statesman, 1809-1865)

The greatest evil in the world today is the Christian religion.
H.G. Wells (1866-1946), British author

I found nothing grand in the history of the Jews nor in the morals inculcated in the Pentateuch. Surely the writers had a very low idea of the nature of their god. They made him not only anthropomorphic, but of the very lowest type, jealous and revengeful, loving violence rather than mercy.
Elizabeth Cady Stanton (1815-1902)

I believe Christ was a man like ourselves; to look upon him as God would seem to me the greatest of sacrileges.
Leo Tolstoy (1828-1910), Russian writer and philosopher

"There is not one redeeming feature in our superstition of Christianity. It has made one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites."
Thomas Jefferson (American Statesman, 1743-1826

Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man. Thomas Jefferson (American Statesman, 1743-1826

The Christian god can easily be pictured as virtually the same god as the many ancient gods of past civilizations. The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel, vengeful and capricious. If one wishes to know more of this raging, three headed beast-like god, one only needs to look at the caliber of people who say they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites.
Thomas Jefferson (American Statesman, 1743-1826

“Christians are like manure: spread them out and they help everything grow better, but keep them in one big pile and they stink horribly.”
― Francis Chan --

“Christian theology is the grandmother of Bolshevism.”
― Oswald Spengler, The Hour of Decision --

“One would go mad if one took the Bible seriously; but to take it seriously one must be already mad.”
― Aleister Crowley, Magick: Liber ABA: Book 4-
anybody

Singapore, Singapore

#19 Dec 22, 2013
if you really need to use the word allah which describe as god.
replace all the gods name for all religious & religious books to allah. be it in christianity, hindunism, buddhism etc. forget & change the god buddha, god siva, god kali, son of god jesus. change them all to allah. the sole god for all human..
bmz

Boulder, CO

#20 Dec 23, 2013
change all the rapist names and murdererer names to mohammad when you are at that. every criminal put to death, executed for their crime shall henceforth be known as mohammad. f.islam.
Onelawforall

London, UK

#21 Dec 23, 2013
Why would anyone want to worship allah? He is a god who chops off hands, flogs & stones women, commits genocide on pagans, calls for an eye for an eye and allows his followers to have sex with children.
allah is the Devil. He does not deserve worship.

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