No Muslim can think of profaning holy...

No Muslim can think of profaning holy Prophet (PBUH): Altaf

There are 54731 comments on the Daily Times story from Jan 11, 2011, titled No Muslim can think of profaning holy Prophet (PBUH): Altaf. In it, Daily Times reports that:

'Even minorities living in Pakistan cannot blaspheme against the holy Prophet , hence I appeal to religious leaders of every shade of religious persuasion to stop their demonstrations after clear assurances from Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani that no amendment is being made in the blasphemy law,' Altaf said while talking to an assembly of MQM ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Daily Times.

Vedic Rationalist

New Delhi, India

#48090 Sep 17, 2013
number four wrote:
<quoted text>All farming was created by MAN
All animal husbandry was created by MAN
All medicine was created by MAN
All mathematics was created by MAN
All astronomy was created by MAN
does "or" does not MAN know what it is doing ...???
Man has a mind, which is blank at birth, then babies start learning (rationalising) when they become conscious. We learn a lot of things, but still so much more is unknown. Some of our knowledge may be wrong. So our knowledge must be evolutionary and constantly be able to upgrade and correct itself.

Only those with sufficient intellect, versed in the ways of logics and having control on ones ego, can change and better themselves. For them only are the fruits of progress, that always get sweeter with effort and increasing confluence with truth.
Mahmood

Schomberg, Canada

#48091 Sep 17, 2013
number four wrote:
<quoted text>..the "Golden rule"....??..He who has the 'gold' makes the rules , the golden rule .
nah, I'm kidding ..I know what you meant ..
if you truly wished the very best for those you love ...you would want them to enter into Gods' kingdom , at the end of this life ..
Gods kingdom in my opinion is just an illusion....you better hope I am wrong.
number four

Since: May 12

Las Vegas, NV

#48092 Sep 17, 2013
Vedic Rationalist wrote:
<quoted text>
Man has a mind, which is blank at birth, then babies start learning (rationalising) when they become conscious. We learn a lot of things, but still so much more is unknown. Some of our knowledge may be wrong. So our knowledge must be evolutionary and constantly be able to upgrade and correct itself.
Only those with sufficient intellect, versed in the ways of logics and having control on ones ego, can change and better themselves. For them only are the fruits of progress, that always get sweeter with effort and increasing confluence with truth.
"you" lie ...you claim our minds are blank slates ....

at the 'same time' you claim ..."Read the vedas and darmas (spelling)
"

you "believe" there is TRUTH...yet, you shy away from it ...curious ..??

You do "not" wish to be associated with the 'abrahamic religions'...??

you know what is true ....!!
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#48093 Sep 17, 2013
Neville Thompson wrote:
<quoted text>
By the way my Mother can trace her genealogy to before Islam commenced so that proves records were kept .
Is your "Mother's genealogy kept in "official Roman Records"?

Vow, she must be a princess!!

I congratulate you !!

Can I kiss your hand?
number four

Since: May 12

Las Vegas, NV

#48094 Sep 17, 2013
Mahmood wrote:
<quoted text>
Gods kingdom in my opinion is just an illusion....you better hope I am wrong.
...I actually "hope" you are right ...having immortal existence ....is terrifying ...!!..What, if I squander my one chance ..??

as, many before me have ...Hitler, Mohammad ,Saddam ,Pol Pot ,Elizabeth Tailor , the Deli rapists ......
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#48095 Sep 17, 2013
Neville Thompson wrote:
<quoted text>
More so that his name was not Jesus so if they got it wrong in name why couldn't the history of Islam be the same ?
Islam has its "own source" than these Roman Records....Islam' "source" is the ultimate source of all knowledge, Creator of this Universe.
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#48096 Sep 17, 2013
Vedic Rationalist wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do you try to be more clever than you really are? Why leave out half a sentence? Every part where there are sensors for pain..., we have sense of pain.
Hair or nails do not have sensors, or nerves to carry signals. So no pain or any other sense in them. Same in many internal parts, where there are no sensors, but blood vessels exist, still no sense of pain. Pain is sensed at sensory receptors, pain signals are carried to brain by nerves, brain get signals and we feel pain. SENSORY NERVES CARRY SENSORY SIGNALS TO BRAIN. Cut off these nerves, and no senses from that area.
Nerves aggregate within the spinal chord from various parts of our body. The spine has 2 main functions, support body physically, and carry and protect our nerves. Mainly 2 types of nerves, sensory and mortor....
But blood vessels don't carry pain, they cary blood. When nerves are destroyed or disconnected, like when people have a damaged spine, patient has paralysis, loss of sensation, as well as mortor nerves are broken so loss of movement, even when blood vessels are intact.
Pick up a class nine school science text book PLEASE.
Cutting off blood vessels to brain will only stop blood flow to brain not the senses. so feeling of pain will only stop with loss of conciousness and death. Try a simple experiment, tie a elastic or rubber band some what tightly around your neck, and slowly you will feel heady as blood flow to brain is restricted. But you are still concious, and can STILL FEEL when you arm is touched. You will lose conciousness and sensory perception only after a minute or so.
<quoted text>
Heart beating does not mean pain, never said that, why are you purporting I did? Again trying to be clever and specious? I said heart beating is an involuntary function, and ecen if spinal chord (carrying nerves to heart) is severed at neck, heart still beats, as can be seen in any jhatka chicken shop and a freshly culled skinned chicken.
The brain is the seat of conciousness, not the heart, which just pumps blood, which carries nutrients and oxygen nto all various parts of body.
Again pick up a school book on biology. Your quran is usless in this regard, certainly obsolete by 1400 years.
<quoted text>
Did answer, even tho the question was again irrelevant. If no man is able, so we make machines and devices, used in slaughter houses. What is the need to do it by hand. At one time humans did not have knives, had to kill with stones. We dont need to kill by stones anymore tho, that would be stupid. Clearly we can evolve. Unless you are stuck in the 7th century for some egotistic reason, and choose to remain stupid.
I think we have said enough on this topic....we can go on endlessly and discussion will never stop.

Once we have said our position to each other, it is over.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#48097 Sep 17, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
The basic problems with all these discussions and not coming to any conclusions, even after 1000 s of posts, is that people do not ask "basic questions".
And without answering "basic questions" they jump to higher questions.
This approach never works in any other field, why should it work in religious discussions.
How come some one who does not understand simple numerical system, start commenting on complex mathematical problems like "Binomial Theorem"?
In the field of religion, the three basic questions are:
a. Did man create himself or is Created?
b. Is there a purpose of human life on this earth or it is just an animal life?
c. Who can decide the purpose of human life? Man or his Creator?
These are the basic questions, and unless we answer them, there would be no use or advantage of all these "glossy discussions".
My advice to you is therefore, to concentrate on these basic questions and leave others till we have reached any conclusion on them.
Why waste each other' time?
Then what can be more basic question than the one which I asked? How are we to arrive at the answers for your so called "three basic" questions? Is it by faith or by reasoning and direct experience?

As for your three basic questions, it is only for the first one that we maybe be able to answer from a surface consciousness. The other two questions demand deep contemplation where we have to go deep within ourselves to find answers.

MUQ, you may have never experienced deep contemplation where the ordinary surface mind falls silent and becomes receptive to higher knowledge. Hence it is difficult for you to understand things which do not have their origins in the ordinary, restless surface mind. The answers we arrive at depends upon the depths of our consciousness. A superficial perspective will only give us a superficial answer that only touches the surface of truth.

I will just try to answer one of your questions, so that you can see how our perspectives differ. I will answer your first question. From our ordinary surface minds our creation is a big mystery. By "our creation" I mean "our sense of identity" and not biological creation of our bodies. Who created this sense of "I" within us and it's a mystery. But it's a mystery only as long as we remain in the surface part of our being. The mystery gets solved only when you go deep inside. It's an answer that has to be felt and experienced in the depth of our being. We cannot intellectualize the answer.

Now here are some questions for you to answer. If God indeed has created the universe, then is that creation part of a cyclical process, or is our present creation the first and last one?

And what do you mean by "glossy discussions?" Is it a euphemism for "couch philosophy?"
Vedic Rationalist

Delhi, India

#48098 Sep 17, 2013
number four wrote:
<quoted text>"you" lie ...you claim our minds are blank slates ....
Only at the time of the minds birth is it blank, empty. The mind is primarily a thought machine. And connected to sensory apparatus eyes, ears, nose, and with our memory, and it becomes a learning machine. To learn is what the mind does on its own, from birth, no one has to teach it to start learning. Most of Everything else must be learned, from how to move and arm, to how to walk and speak...

If there be a god, how ever you define it, you must use your mind to learn of it.. If that god does not exist,(as you defined it) then that too is what you can only learn about. And all you have is the mind, the thought machine you are born with, at your disposal.
at the 'same time' you claim ..."Read the vedas and darmas "(spelling)
Ved is just a concept, a systematic method to uncover the truths of the universe. The word in old sanskrit just means to reveal, to uncover. The word is not important, disposable, changeable. Language is secondary, the meaning / concept is real, and universal. You don't have to read a word of any ancient books ever, and still if you can learn, if you have the will, the curiosity, the want, to know,-you will always find a way 'to know'.

Dharma is just a concept too, simply it is the idea that rational rules are food for society. No hi fi philosophy stuff, just practical, and simple to understand. And again the word is not important, the concept is. Call it 'System of rational laws for society to constrain bad harmful behaviour so society and individuals are happy peaceful and progressive'.
you "believe" there is TRUTH...yet, you shy away from it ...curious ..??
You do "not" wish to be associated with the 'abrahamic religions'...??
you know what is true ....!!
No I don't really know much. But I have no problems feeling kinship with people of abrahamic faith, or any other faith or non faith. To feel love for those you disagree with is not that difficult is it?

Most religions seem to me to be just a step in a multi step approach to getting human society to better itself, become more civil and gentle and progressive. Or they are corrupted or half baked iterations of a better system.
.
.
What is true, is all of existence, and the tiny instant of time that our physical senses connects our mind to the universe, that we call the present. The past is just memory . And future a function of all the variables and contants that make up the present. The universe does not seem to care what we know, or that it is all too complex for any seekers of truth there maybe, or one who wants to dare predict what is to come.

So I don't know all that is true, truth is I dont really know much. That much of truth I do know.
Vedic Rationalist

Delhi, India

#48099 Sep 18, 2013
I meant - good for society, not food for society.

That sounded esoteric tho, huh? LOL.
Dak-Original

Edinburgh, UK

#48100 Sep 18, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Is your "Mother's genealogy kept in "official Roman Records"?
Vow, she must be a princess!!
I congratulate you !!
Can I kiss your hand?
Vow?

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

May the Force be with You .

#48101 Sep 18, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Is your "Mother's genealogy kept in "official Roman Records"?
Vow, she must be a princess!!
I congratulate you !!
Can I kiss your hand?
Yes I caught out your known history that does not stack up to as you desire

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

May the Force be with You .

#48102 Sep 18, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Islam has its "own source" than these Roman Records....Islam' "source" is the ultimate source of all knowledge, Creator of this Universe.
Where is all that of history that is written down for Muhammad to learn from ?
Which religion taught Muhammad their history otherwise who else taught him Islam's history ?

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

May the Force be with You .

#48103 Sep 18, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Is your "Mother's genealogy kept in "official Roman Records"?
Vow, she must be a princess!!
I congratulate you !!
Can I kiss your hand?
Are you taught to humble yourself in kissing another persons hand ?

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#48104 Sep 18, 2013
number four wrote:
<quoted text>...I've already told this story ...The Generals have us by the balls ...many politicians wish to say "we spend too much tax dollars on defense !"....the Pentagon replies ...."okay , dare to cut our spending ..and..We will close bases and research facilities IN YOUR STATE ..!!"
So "now" this elected official is now known as the politician THAT LOST PEOPLES JOBS ..!
end, of her or his career ..
you don't "like" our defensive posture ....UNITE ...!! AND, TAKE US DOWN ...!!!...
(but, be fore warned ...any single Nation is no match for United States of America ...)
but, our battle is against poverty and drug abuse...and, in this we "need" allies ..!!
Kerala Hindus EAT BEEF.

You wanted to know if it is ok for you to be pluralistic and be a Hindu who could eat beef,right?

As for Pentagon,Hexagon,Octagon,,,I give a hoot!

Just tax those gun sales HEAVILY and see that US citizens get a good health care with that extra cash.....was watching a movie called 'John Q' and I suddenly got this idea..and wanted to pass it on to you?

An Indian-American girl,Hindu,got the Miss America 2014 title..feels nice...she seems a bright one who wants to become a physician.

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#48105 Sep 18, 2013
http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2...

Your death has not been of waste..some justice done.

Rest in peace,dear sister,Neeraja!

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#48106 Sep 18, 2013
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neerja_Bhanot

Courage exemplary!:):):)

Her killers are dying dog's death...Muslim filth!
Vedic Rationalist

Delhi, India

#48107 Sep 18, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
I think we have said enough on this topic....we can go on endlessly and discussion will never stop.
Once we have said our position to each other, it is over.
OK

But it is not just my position. I form my position from what the universe tells me. While you are stuck with the unchanging quran.

Pick up a good book on secondary school biology that has a chapter on the human central nervous system. Or google 'central nervous system'.

You will find that nerves carry electric signals, like wires, to and from brain to various parts of the body. Sensory nerves carry signals from sensors on skin and eslewhere in the body, to the brain. Brain processes this signal and we feel pain. Then brain may decide to move arm or leg in response, sends signals down a mortor nerve which carries signals from brain to muscles. When muscles of arm get signal from brain the muscle contracts and arm moves.

Spinal Chord is at the base of the brain. Thru the Spinal Chord goes a thick bunch of nerves that connects the brain to various parts of the body, limbs and organs. Almost all nerves are inside the spinal chord in the higher neck. Going further down more and nerves disperse out from the spinal chord. So an injury in the lower back spine can cause paralysis in the legs. But an injury in the spine in the neck area can cause a whole body paralysys, except the face eyes ears etc. Go higher up and even eyes ears can be effected

Read this too about the peripheral nervous system-
http://en. m .wikipedia. org/wiki/Peripheral_nervous_sy stem

Peace
Vedic Rationalist

Delhi, India

#48108 Sep 18, 2013
Pluralism means to be tolerant and non violent towards people with varid ideas and behaviours. Pluralism means to allow all others the right to autonomous thought, ie to form and hold their own opinion, as well as the right to voice their opinion, even if you disagree, or even if majority disagrees.

But those people who hold the idea of violent intolerence, like those who take insult and think it is OK to react violently to curb some ideas they do not agree with- are not pluralistic people. Such people must be reformed, or put in jails or thrown out of pluralistic societies.

Examples are the fundamentalists that riot violently when a religious book is burnt or criticised, be it qoran or gita or bible or guru granth saheb or picture of shivaji. These people are not worthy of living in a pluralistic society.

The church took insult when galileo voiced his opinions, islamists take insult when people call out the violence by mohammad in the quran. Shiv sena goes on a rampage when shivaji is criticized. We all know the church was wrong and galelio was right. Same goes for mohammad. Point is the religious fundamentalist can have their opinions, can disagree with all of science, like MUQ can with secondary school biology. But they have no right to resort to violence. If someone wants to say openly that mohammad was an evil man that fooled a lot of people, muslims should give him the right to say so in public. If some one draws cartoons of mohammad, or nude paintings of saraswati like MF Hussain did, they can disagree, choose not to see the cartoons/paintings, but they MUST defend the right of the cartoonist/painters to draw mohammad/saraswti any way he/she wants to. Any thing less is not pluralism or hinduism and infringes on the rights of others.

Religious groups have to either accept pluralism or reject it. Then pluralist govt should put them in jail, try reform them, keep them in jail until they learn better civilized ways.
.

So non violence ie AHINSA, will always lead to pluralism, will lead to feeling of safety for people of varid ideas, which will let various ideas to come up and people can debate on them. In a peacful pluralistic society, different ideas can compete with eachother and usually, and eventually the better ideas will win over more free thinking minds.

And when better ideas come up, people progress faster. SO-
AHINSA always leads to PLURALISM
PLURALISM always leads to PROGRESS.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#48109 Sep 18, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Islam has its "own source" than these Roman Records....Islam' "source" is the ultimate source of all knowledge, Creator of this Universe.
You are insane MUQ!

You need a Savior MUQ!

And only God can save you, and that is why Jesus died on the cross to save sinners from the fires of hell.
But Muslims reject Gods saving grace.

You don't get it Muslims one sin against God sends you to the fires of hell Muslim!

Your good deeds don't take away Gods wrath against your sins.

You were created in the image of God to do good deeds so your good deeds does not take away Gods wrath against the sin you commit.
You are punished for your sins.

You are an insane idiot Muslim!
Does the good deeds of a thief stop the thief from being punished when the thief is caught?
the answer is NO!

That one sin of stealing wipes out all his good deeds he is punished for that one sin of stealing.

Jesus was sent by God His Father to pay the punishment for that one sin so that your good deeds can be accounted to you as righteousness.

With out you accepting Jesus as your savior you have no one to save you from being punished for that one sin, and only God knows how many sins you commit in your life.

Your belief in the teachings of Muhammad is insanity!

That is why you need Jesus Christ as your Savior.

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