No Muslim can think of profaning holy Prophet (PBUH): Altaf

There are 20 comments on the Daily Times story from Jan 11, 2011, titled No Muslim can think of profaning holy Prophet (PBUH): Altaf. In it, Daily Times reports that:

'Even minorities living in Pakistan cannot blaspheme against the holy Prophet , hence I appeal to religious leaders of every shade of religious persuasion to stop their demonstrations after clear assurances from Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani that no amendment is being made in the blasphemy law,' Altaf said while talking to an assembly of MQM ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Daily Times.

MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#38257 Feb 24, 2013
Mahmood wrote:

Its nobody's fault, I'm not blaming anyone. Its just like singing a song in language you dont understand. I can sing a Russian song fluently without understanding one word of Russian. Just about any (muslim) kid in India can recite first sura of the Koran but ask them to translate it, they cant. You cannot blame them, they dont know Arabic. Go to any mosque in the sub-continent, and I can gurantee you, that 99% of the congregation know little or nothing about their faith. Ask them a question and they'll tell you to go to the imam/mullah.

I never had doubts about the Koran at age 11. I used to kiss the Koran before getting on a plane. Doubts began to emerge around 10 years ago, and now its fully blossomed - ripe and ready to strike.

Now lets get to the heart of the matter. My childhood, education, and zero knowledge of Arabic is totally irrelevant to the questions I am asking. I am asking you to prove that both Ayat al Kursi and 112 were orignally a part of the Koran and not a product of some interpolation? The only way for you to do that is come up with the orignal manuscript of the Koran. That Phd from Medina Univ may carry weight among the Wahabis. Other muslims like the Shias, Sufis, and Ismailis wont give him a second look.


Looking forward to your response. Do youself a favour. Go buy some halal sausages, mix it with scrambled eggs, and add some pickles to it - delicious. That is what I had for b'fast this morning.
Ans.

Dear Mahmood Sahib

Let us forget about MY Problem let us discuss about YOUR problem.

Why are you hiding info about your parents and how much religious education they gave you?

Is there any feeling of shame associated with it?

Why are you changing your stand? First you said that you started having doubts about Quran at the age 11 . Now you "extended" it to 21!!

Why did you not ask Muslim scholars of your city of your doubts? Why did you not started learning Arabic to find out the truth?

Why did you think that books written by Christian Scholars about Quran and prophet and Islam are "more authentic" than written by Muslims?

Would any Christian, Jew or Hindu accept translations done by Muslims of their own scripture more authentic than what their own scholars did?

You are not telling your full story; to me it seems that you are hiding some thing.

Open up a little more about your "doubting years"?

May be we could still straighten out your "kink"

PS:

And do not think that you will annoy me with your little 'puns'. I can see when you are cornered.

You want to get out of the whole by using these verbal juggleries.
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#38258 Feb 24, 2013
Observer wrote:
MUQ

Bottom line is there is no written evidence or proof of any part of Koran written during prophet's time. Not one single page. It took as long as 20 years for the third Caliph to write out what he had memorized to bring out the first written Koran! 20 years to write what was fully memorized!!! Quite an accomplishment. No Muslim scholar asks why so long?
This third Caliph meets his fate typical Islamic style. He was assassinated!! His funeral held in secrecy and his body buried in a Jewish graveyard because katus did not want him buried in a Muslim graveyard!!!. Later katus broke the walls of this Jewish graveyard and proclaimed it a Muslim graveyard so the Caliph could be buried in a Muslim graveyard.
Indeed the history of Islam is fascinating, bloody assassinations, killings all detailed in a book called the Koran revealed by none other than Allah himself.
You are right about one thing though. NONE of the books in Gods name can match that.
Ans.

The Top line is that you are putting conditions on Quran which you cannot put on any other scriptural book in the world.

Who said it took 20 years for third Caliph to memorize the Quran?

The Quran was written down fully within two years of prophet's death by the First Caliph Abu Bakr.

Third Caliph made authentic copes of that Quran and send it to different cities and two of these copies survive to this day.

And you are not aware the importance of Quran in Muslim's lives, other wise you would not have dismissed the memorization part so easily.

This is the sickness and jealousy on your part. Since there is no proof of authenticity of any of your own scriptures you start putting absurd condition on Quran.

I am right , Quran is revealed by Allah and no book in the word can match it.

Rest of your post does not need any reply. It only shows your mean thoughts and uncouth words.
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#38259 Feb 24, 2013
Observer wrote:
<quoted text>
Mahmood,
I read your posts with interest. You post very probing questions which MUQ ducks or avoids. He tends to flip-flop and anyone can see MUQ cannot answer you. He tends to copy paste verses ad nauseum which no one reads. If one looks with an inquiring mind, there are a lot of inconsistencies and contradictions in the Koran. All religious books are written by humans and every one of them have been in some way tainted by human prejudices and biasis. It is pretty hard to believe that the Koran or for that matter any other religious book is written by God.
Keep posting. MUQ types of every faith must be exposed for their hypocrisies and the falsehoods propogated by these religous charlatans in the name of God.
There is a saying "birds of the same father stock together"....but it is proven wrong!!

Birds of different flocks gather together !! If it is to attack Islam.

We see, Hindus, Jews, Sikhs, Atheists, Apostates ... all joining hands to attack Islam. They all pat each other with what good works each has done.

This "ganging up" itself is a proof that Islam is truth.

In Quran Allah calls guidance as NOOR in singular and falsehood as DHULUMAAT in plural.

And at another place is says "What is left after truth but falsehood?"

I am not disheartened when I see these Anti Islamic people supporting each other, in fact it increases my faith.

Here is an ex-Muslim who thinks Non Muslims translations and commentaries and writing about Islam are "more accurate and more authentic" than done my Muslim scholars?

Is there any cure to this sickness?

In fact these people are defeated in their own purpose. Quranic challenge to all man kind to bring some thing like it (and I mentioned Chapter 112 as an example, that humans are unable to bring anything like it). This challenge is itself a proof that Quran came from God.

No Humans can make this challenge and it cannot stand for 1400 years un challenged.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#38260 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
The Top line is that you are putting conditions on Quran which you cannot put on any other scriptural book in the world.
Who said it took 20 years for third Caliph to memorize the Quran?
The Quran was written down fully within two years of prophet's death by the First Caliph Abu Bakr.
Third Caliph made authentic copes of that Quran and send it to different cities and two of these copies survive to this day.
And you are not aware the importance of Quran in Muslim's lives, other wise you would not have dismissed the memorization part so easily.
This is the sickness and jealousy on your part. Since there is no proof of authenticity of any of your own scriptures you start putting absurd condition on Quran.
I am right , Quran is revealed by Allah and no book in the word can match it.
Rest of your post does not need any reply. It only shows your mean thoughts and uncouth words.
You are not realistic MUQ.
The Quran is compiled from scraps and pieces gathered together from unknown sources, and no one can verify they are words sent to Muhammad from God.

pakistani muslim

United States

#38261 Feb 24, 2013
agr mecca pr koi attack kre ga to sare muslim akathe ho jain gai r dunya mai aik baghawat ho jae gi r sara oil middle east mai hai r un ka oil bhi band kr dya jae ga r ye aik crusade ho ga r ap jano ya na jano pahle crusades mai jo ho chuka hai wo european jante hain
r ap mai nai somnak kai but ka poucha tha
r give evidence that he fucked her
dont ask frm me
r chalo allah nai nahi to bhagwan nai cast kiu banai hain
r shia sunni wahabi wagaira allah ya muhammad saw nai nhi banai hai
r satti pr to ap nai bat hi nahi ki hai r na hi buto ko pojne ki
ap nai aik question kai ilawa kisi bat ka joab nahi dya hai
shayed ap dena hi nahi chahte ho ya tal rahe ho
Mahmood Sahib

Shanghai, China

#38262 Feb 24, 2013
Why ? Why let us forget Your Problem.....Pagal Budhdhey ??? B'henchod Dimag ka marij tu, aur mein apni dimag ka ilaj karwaoon ?

Quran apni gaand mein daal ley dimag thik hou jaeyga !
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
Dear Mahmood Sahib
Let us forget about MY Problem let us discuss about YOUR problem.
Why are you hiding info about your parents and how much religious education they gave you?
Is there any feeling of shame associated with it?
Why are you changing your stand? First you said that you started having doubts about Quran at the age 11 . Now you "extended" it to 21!!
Why did you not ask Muslim scholars of your city of your doubts? Why did you not started learning Arabic to find out the truth?
Why did you think that books written by Christian Scholars about Quran and prophet and Islam are "more authentic" than written by Muslims?
Would any Christian, Jew or Hindu accept translations done by Muslims of their own scripture more authentic than what their own scholars did?
You are not telling your full story; to me it seems that you are hiding some thing.
Open up a little more about your "doubting years"?
May be we could still straighten out your "kink"
PS:
And do not think that you will annoy me with your little 'puns'. I can see when you are cornered.
You want to get out of the whole by using these verbal juggleries.
Mahmood Sahib

Shanghai, China

#38263 Feb 24, 2013
Why you vanish from forum when-

1) You are rammed , fkcd , flattened ?
Or
2) some Kattu chutiapanthi happens- like now UK kattus caught in aking bombs with curry souse ????

Kyon wee ? gaand mein daam nahi....ham kisi sE kaam nahi ?
lMl2000 wrote:
<quoted text>
I m running bit busy nowadays setting the future for you beggars. I shall look you guys as and when I get free. However, for you, I have some surprise planned ... So.... Tic toc ....!

“FREEDOM OF MIND & SOUL-”

Since: Aug 08

MILKY WAY

#38265 Feb 24, 2013
HK and Chaddi decided to meet over breakfast in a hotel to discuss Indo Pak trade.......

Chaddi came in ,with chewing gum in mouth to hide stink in his foul mouth...and conversation started ...

Chaddi: He.....he...What do you do with orange skin in India ?

HK: Throw it, and you ?

Chaddi: We make Marmalade out of it and export to India....in fact you may be having it with your bread now !

HK: Hmmm..Surprising !

Chaddi : He...he...what d'ya do with rotten fruits in India ?

HK: Hmmmm....throw it , and you ?

Chaddi : Ha...ha...We make cocktail juice and export them to India !

HK: Hmmmmmm....surprising !

HK ...irritated , angry picked up a call and shouted something and with calm continued his breakfast.....

Impatient Chaddi asked : Errrrr......what was that ?

HK: Nothing much ...just tell me what do you do with used condoms....?

Chaddi : Errr...nothing just throw them , and you ?

HK : We make Chewing Gum of them and export to Pak, in fact you are having one now...and I called the steward to collect some more from my room , make fresh ones and keep in your room for lunch !
lMl2000 wrote:
<quoted text>
I m running bit busy nowadays setting the future for you beggars. I shall look you guys as and when I get free. However, for you, I have some surprise planned ... So.... Tic toc ....!

“FREEDOM OF MIND & SOUL-”

Since: Aug 08

MILKY WAY

#38266 Feb 24, 2013
Lies......blatant lies......

There was no paper -ink tech with Baddus in Mohammads time. No papyrus even ...as Nile was far away...Don't you see even Moses carved words on stone slabs ????

Tell us what was Quran written on....original one and with what ?
Ohhhh....Abu might have written it on sand ....but believing that survived for 200 years ......oooops ....to be made in copies ?

Like Veda's, were written on fig leaves aor dome parchment- Proof is available, Egyptian used Papyrus- Proof is available, Babylonian (Baghdadis) used clay slates (using cuneiform )- proof is available......

For Bedouins ....? Till date I doubt they have any writing Techs....Buy paper from Non-desert country , hire Non-Arabs to write.....they only have Baakchodi Tech !

Otherwise revert with proof !
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
The Top line is that you are putting conditions on Quran which you cannot put on any other scriptural book in the world.
Who said it took 20 years for third Caliph to memorize the Quran?
The Quran was written down fully within two years of prophet's death by the First Caliph Abu Bakr.
Third Caliph made authentic copes of that Quran and send it to different cities and two of these copies survive to this day.
And you are not aware the importance of Quran in Muslim's lives, other wise you would not have dismissed the memorization part so easily.
This is the sickness and jealousy on your part. Since there is no proof of authenticity of any of your own scriptures you start putting absurd condition on Quran.
I am right , Quran is revealed by Allah and no book in the word can match it.
Rest of your post does not need any reply. It only shows your mean thoughts and uncouth words.
MUQ-

Shanghai, China

#38267 Feb 24, 2013
HK Sahib,
You are right...as Abu Bakr was also unlettered, aur ooskO bakri chodney sE phursat hi kanha thi .....see his name Bakr !
MUQ

Dammam, Saudi Arabia

#38268 Feb 24, 2013
Shamma wrote:
<quoted text>You are not realistic MUQ.
The Quran is compiled from scraps and pieces gathered together from unknown sources, and no one can verify they are words sent to Muhammad from God.
Then it would be child's play to write another book like it.

Just stand in a queue and bring something like Chapter 112 of Quran.

So easy problem solved, why we would be arguing?

But if you are unable to bring it?(And Quran says you will never ever be able to bring it,.... then fear Hell fire)!!

It is so simple when you are on true path!!

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#38269 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Then it would be child's play to write another book like it.
Just stand in a queue and bring something like Chapter 112 of Quran.
So easy problem solved, why we would be arguing?
But if you are unable to bring it?(And Quran says you will never ever be able to bring it,.... then fear Hell fire)!!
It is so simple when you are on true path!!
Religion and belief in a god or gods have been since the beginning of man.
All cultures have their own belief how the world began and how man came into being.

The social structure of the Arabs was based on their tribal laws.
In relation to their belief in a god or gods.
so their was already religious Scripture written before Muhammad was even born.

The beliefs of the Arabs was taught to Muhammad as he was growing up, so Muhammad had a foundation to build his beliefs on.

So gathering information to compile a book was not hard to come by.
Nor would it be hard for Muhammad to use that information he was taught to come up with a revelation in his mind to address a situation.

Much of the scripture in the Quran is taken from other religions.
So that is not original revelation from God to Muhammad.
Most every one in that area already heard it before.

So the revelations Muhammad said he received was already second hand information.

The only explanation is that Muhammad was narcissistic and demanded every one obey his commands or be killed.

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

AUSTRALIAN

#38270 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
The Top line is that you are putting conditions on Quran which you cannot put on any other scriptural book in the world.
Who said it took 20 years for third Caliph to memorize the Quran?
The Quran was written down fully within two years of prophet's death by the First Caliph Abu Bakr.
Third Caliph made authentic copes of that Quran and send it to different cities and two of these copies survive to this day.
And you are not aware the importance of Quran in Muslim's lives, other wise you would not have dismissed the memorization part so easily.
This is the sickness and jealousy on your part. Since there is no proof of authenticity of any of your own scriptures you start putting absurd condition on Quran.
I am right , Quran is revealed by Allah and no book in the word can match it.
Rest of your post does not need any reply. It only shows your mean thoughts and uncouth words.
Your words are wrong seeing you have told us that the Quran was written down whilst Muhhumud was still alive.

“Free Speech in a Free World ”

Since: May 10

AUSTRALIAN

#38271 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Then it would be child's play to write another book like it.
Just stand in a queue and bring something like Chapter 112 of Quran.
So easy problem solved, why we would be arguing?
But if you are unable to bring it?(And Quran says you will never ever be able to bring it,.... then fear Hell fire)!!
It is so simple when you are on true path!!
You wouldn't believe it so what's the point in writing another

“FREEDOM OF MIND & SOUL-”

Since: Aug 08

MILKY WAY

#38272 Feb 24, 2013
ooops he has overlooked the fact that Mohammad -

1) continued getting revelation till his last breath.....

2) He never ordered anybody to jot down his Mumbo Jumbo.....as a matter of fact in his army of close 'companions' a lettered Secretary or steno was always missing. There are poofs that his companions were equally unlettered and many a times instructed by Mohammad to learn writing from prisoners......OOoooops quite an Idea !
Knowing that Gibril ordered Mohammad to read in very first revelation , and he preferred to remain unlettered till end , I would think he must have forgiven his companions also for disobeying !

3) The Arabic script as we know it today was unknown in the Prophet’s time (as Arabic writing styles have progressed through time) and the Qur'an was recorded in a scripta defective made up of simple lines and strokes. The method of keeping records at the time was predominantly orally. As Arab society started to evolve into using writing more regularly, writing skills evolved accordingly. Early Qur'anic Arabic lacked precision because distinguishing between consonants was impossible due to the absence of diacritical marks (a’jam). Vowelling marks (tashkil) to indicate prolongation or vowels were absent as well. Due to this there were endless possibilities in the meanings of verses and countless errors in transcription, if you were foreign to the text. The Arabic script as we know it today, the scripta plena, which has pointed texts and is fully vowelled was not perfected until the middle of the 9th century.

Bird songs were translated as Quran in 10th Century .

4) Quran means 'Recite' in Arabic (MUQ can Confirm). Gibril told Mohammad at very first encounter- Read......which he failed ! He commanded his followers "Recite".......I would have asked him -what the fkck to recite.....nothing is written ?

Is there any other religious book whose name is 'Recite'?

Probably Mohammad forgot to tell- like MUQ , in time machine I am seeing there will be a book in future- just recite it as it's name will be 'Recite'(Quran)!





3) Quaran
Neville Thompson wrote:
<quoted text>
Your words are wrong seeing you have told us that the Quran was written down whilst Muhhumud was still alive.
Dak-Original

Wakefield, UK

#38273 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ doctored my post and then posted a "response"!
Doctored material:
"DAKO wrote:
1.You assume that there is a conspiracy by Christian...and Hindu missionaries! Hindus do not prolethyse or even have any procedures? However, they will not demur if anyone commences to be "Hindu" in one way or another.

2. Christians used to give Christian names and that also was accompanied with Christian culture and food of one sort or another.

03. Now, your labeling all those with muslim names as "falsehood" ones is stupendously grotesque since

2.

04. Muslims do demand a change of name when one converts. A muslim name is always given but sometimes the convert continues (

05. I have known many cases where a man or woman marrying a muslim partner changes faith and

DAKO COMMENT: Why leave comments athalf sentence. This MUQ is as much mischief others while pretends to be a very thoughtful responder here.
Dak-Original

Wakefield, UK

#38274 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
B. Truth and Falsehood
a, You say why I call all those who are Non Muslims as “following falsehood”…. This is terminology of Quran which says “After Truth what else is left but falsehood”
b. So every one who has got the message of Islam, understood it and then rejected it, is indeed following false hood.
c. And we can see that all Non Muslim groups join and support each other whenever there is any action and fights against Muslim.
d. So much so that a “giant like India which sees itself as a future world superpower” has to go and learn at the hand of that Tiny Isreal, which is fighting for its survival itself!!
e. There is no country that has expertise in Anti Terrorism except Isreal and of “all countries in the world” it is more than eager to teach every thing to India.
What else is the basis of cooperation between India and Isreal, except this Anti Islamic bias?
Accepting Islam because of Matrimonial Reasons:
a. Those who accept Islam change their names (voluntarily or involuntarily), like Dharmendra and Hema Malini got New Muslim name after “converting” to Islam!!
b. Many Hindus accept Islam to have second marriage and these people are actually criminals and should be punished, because they are giving bad names to both Islam and their own religion.
c. Such type of “convenience type” of conversions are become a routine in India.
d. Islam does not permit names which are against Islam and point to some idol or false god, but if they are free from these defects, then it is OK. But usually new converts request new names so as to become part of Universal brotherhood of Islam.
Allah Knows Best.
As regards"truths and falsehoods" this MUQ knows that creation tales are falsehoods.
As regards matrimonial reasons, MUQ misconstrued my comment. Again: In the west most of those who marry a muslim partner do not give up being muslim whilst they are still in a matrimonial union. Many again are not practising muslims but they become muslim in order that is is acceptable to the muslim partner (reasonable) or her relations.
Dak-Original

Wakefield, UK

#38275 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
B. Truth and Falsehood
a, You say why I call all those who are Non Muslims as “following falsehood”…. This is terminology of Quran which says “After Truth what else is left but falsehood”
b. So every one who has got the message of Islam, understood it and then rejected it, is indeed following false hood.
c. And we can see that all Non Muslim groups join and support each other whenever there is any action and fights against Muslim.
d. So much so that a “giant like India which sees itself as a future world superpower” has to go and learn at the hand of that Tiny Isreal, which is fighting for its survival itself!!
e. There is no country that has expertise in Anti Terrorism except Isreal and of “all countries in the world” it is more than eager to teach every thing to India.
What else is the basis of cooperation between India and Isreal, except this Anti Islamic bias?
Accepting Islam because of Matrimonial Reasons:
a. Those who accept Islam change their names (voluntarily or involuntarily), like Dharmendra and Hema Malini got New Muslim name after “converting” to Islam!!
b. Many Hindus accept Islam to have second marriage and these people are actually criminals and should be punished, because they are giving bad names to both Islam and their own religion.
c. Such type of “convenience type” of conversions are become a routine in India.
d. Islam does not permit names which are against Islam and point to some idol or false god, but if they are free from these defects, then it is OK. But usually new converts request new names so as to become part of Universal brotherhood of Islam.
Allah Knows Best.
This post does tell us all that there is an attack by the jihadists on non-believers. Attack merely on belief matters?!!!!
Dak-Original

Wakefield, UK

#38277 Feb 24, 2013
Agnostic Muslim wrote:
<quoted text>
Definitely Not by Real IMI2000. His IQ Level is not so low that he can't figure out which post is of Harminder and which is not.
What a water ! LOL !!
IMI has erred about Harminder before. This is not the first "Not Harminder" (parrot fashion)!
Dak-Original

Wakefield, UK

#38278 Feb 24, 2013
MUQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Ans.
Dear Mahmood Sahib
Let us forget about MY Problem let us discuss about YOUR problem.
Why are you hiding info about your parents and how much religious education they gave you?
Is there any feeling of shame associated with it?
Why are you changing your stand? First you said that you started having doubts about Quran at the age 11 . Now you "extended" it to 21!!
Why did you not ask Muslim scholars of your city of your doubts? Why did you not started learning Arabic to find out the truth?
Why did you think that books written by Christian Scholars about Quran and prophet and Islam are "more authentic" than written by Muslims?
Would any Christian, Jew or Hindu accept translations done by Muslims of their own scripture more authentic than what their own scholars did?
You are not telling your full story; to me it seems that you are hiding some thing.
Open up a little more about your "doubting years"?
May be we could still straighten out your "kink"
PS:
And do not think that you will annoy me with your little 'puns'. I can see when you are cornered.
You want to get out of the whole by using these verbal juggleries.
How many Mahmoods in nations like Pakistan/Iran/Pakistan/S Arabia/etc dare not speak put? Mahmood lives in Canada andI cannot see ever move to a muslim majority nation. India, maybe but as we note that "muslim vote bank"'s first interest is Islam.
areaa

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