TEC to face financial truth

Jun 11, 2012 Read more: www.virtueonline.org 138

"Whatever General Convention will look like in 2015 and beyond, it will be a shadow of its formerly huge self. There is no money."

The Rt. Rev. Stacy F. Sauls, chief operating officer of the Episcopal Church, is right: this church spends too much money on administration and governance and too little on mission. The money is gone, and endowments are depleted ... Read more
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“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#1 Jun 11, 2012
from virtueonline:

"'We believe the past General Convention structure has slavishly copied in ecclesial ink the politics and legislative processes of American culture. Episcopalians are fond of saying that the men who wrote the U.S. Constitution also created the church's Constitution and Canons. It is an exaggeration but a telling one: General Convention looks and acts too much like Congress and not enough like a council of the Church.'

"Thus spake Victoria Heard and Jordan Hylden in a timely article titled Our Political Captivity in the latest issue of The Living Church. The writers are dead on target. When a church, yea a whole denomination, has no real mission except in socio-political terms, it functions more like a political body than a spiritual one ..."

“Plays well with others.”

Since: Jun 07

LIVING WELL*THE BEST REVENGE

#2 Jun 11, 2012
You really don't understand that bit about the eye of the needle, do you?

What has a man who gains the world but loses his SOUL?

NO amount of money in the world will ever make me turn away from what CHRIST COMMANDS...LOVE GOD LOVE OTHERS!
George

Jacksonville, FL

#3 Jun 11, 2012
"The money is gone, and endowments are depleted. Episcopalians are far older. "
Praise God from whom all blessings flow..........

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#4 Jun 11, 2012
George wrote:
"The money is gone, and endowments are depleted. Episcopalians are far older. "
Praise God from whom all blessings flow..........
God gives and God takes away.

You take your money and stick it in the bank, we'll stick with God whom our faith is in and who provides for us.

Now, what was Cain's sisters name, you know the one he married?

LOL...
George

Jacksonville, FL

#5 Jun 11, 2012
MiddleWay wrote:
<quoted.
" For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. 39 But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God.”
TEO's purposes are of human origin and its desire to reflect culture. It not only "will" fail, it already has failed. Welcome to the dung heap of history where TEO can take its rightful place among the perverse and immoral.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#6 Jun 11, 2012
George wrote:
... TEO's purposes are of human origin and its desire to reflect culture. It not only "will" fail, it already has failed. Welcome to the dung heap of history where TEO can take its rightful place among the perverse and immoral.
Some culture.

"... As long as the matter of homosexuality is framed by the church in terms of civil justice, we stand guilty of allowing our own fundamental teaching to be hijacked by secular trends."

courtesy of generousorthodoxy

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#7 Jun 12, 2012
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
Some culture.
"... As long as the matter of homosexuality is framed by the church in terms of civil justice, we stand guilty of allowing our own fundamental teaching to be hijacked by secular trends."
courtesy of generousorthodoxy
Well we all know YOU didn't think of it.

Who cares what some non-members think?

Sour grapes make bitter 'whine'.

Clean you own house.

Ooops, forgot, you don't have one.

Hypocritical liar....

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#8 Jun 12, 2012
George wrote:
<quoted text>
" For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. 39 But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God.”
TEO's purposes are of human origin and its desire to reflect culture. It not only "will" fail, it already has failed. Welcome to the dung heap of history where TEO can take its rightful place among the perverse and immoral.
Yawn.

Yes Mr Bible Scholar, I'm still waiting for you to inform us all about the holy God sanctioned marriage of Cain to his sister who somehow moved to Nod before Cain did.

LMAO..........
George

Jacksonville, FL

#9 Jun 12, 2012
MiddleWay wrote:
<quoted text>
Yawn.
Yes Mr Bible Scholar, I'm still waiting for you to inform us all about the holy God sanctioned marriage of Cain to his sister who somehow moved to Nod before Cain did.
LMAO..........
Darn! And I thought you were ignoring me. Anything I can say or do to get you to hold to yor promise?

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#10 Jun 12, 2012
George wrote:
<quoted text>
Darn! And I thought you were ignoring me. Anything I can say or do to get you to hold to yor promise?
Other than learning to spell?

Yes, answer the question regarding Cain and his sister/wife.

I'm sure your ignorance will repel me....
George

Jacksonville, FL

#11 Jun 12, 2012
MiddleWay wrote:
<quoted text>
Other than learning to spell?
Yes, answer the question regarding Cain and his sister/wife.
I'm sure your ignorance will repel me....
Sorry -- I can't hear you.

“Ecce! Sic transit gloria mundi”

Since: Oct 10

I See New Jerusalem From Here.

#12 Jun 12, 2012
George,

How to explain TEC's lower income in comparison to the US Government and the vast majority of states? All off them are all experiencing extreme income declines, forcing drastic budget cuts and many are new insolvency. It seems to be a fairly universal experience in the US at the moment. Even the Mega-churches are in decline and experiencing drops in membership and income.

Why are you so focused on materialism?

Matthew 6:19-21

Treasures in Heaven

19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal

20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.

21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

Matthew 19:20-22

20 “All these I have kept,” the young man said.“What do I still lack?”

21 Jesus answered,“If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#13 Jun 12, 2012
MiddleWay wrote:
<quoted text>
Well we all know YOU didn't think of it.
Who cares what some non-members think?...
So the Rev.(Ret.) Fleming Rutledge, one of the first women ordained into the Episcopal priesthood, is now a non-member of TEC?
George

Jacksonville, FL

#14 Jun 12, 2012
T McCabe wrote:
George,
How to explain TEC's lower income in comparison to the US Government and the vast majority of states? All off them are all experiencing extreme income declines, forcing drastic budget cuts and many are new insolvency. It seems to be a fairly universal experience in the US at the moment. Even the Mega-churches are in decline and experiencing drops in membership and income.
Why are you so focused on materialism?
Matthew 6:19-21
Treasures in Heaven
19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal
20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Matthew 19:20-22
20 “All these I have kept,” the young man said.“What do I still lack?”
21 Jesus answered,“If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.
I am not fixated at all on it. It is TEO's leadership that is focused upon it. Major cuts in mission and ministry but substantial increases in the costs of administration and salaries. Well done good and fatihful servants.

“Ecce! Sic transit gloria mundi”

Since: Oct 10

I See New Jerusalem From Here.

#15 Jun 12, 2012
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
So the Rev.(Ret.) Fleming Rutledge, one of the first women ordained into the Episcopal priesthood, is now a non-member of TEC?
WHo cares? People come and people go blessed be the Name of the Lord!

Mark 4
New King James Version (NKJV)

The Parable of the Sower

4 And again He began to teach by the sea. And a great multitude was gathered to Him, so that He got into a boat and sat in it on the sea; and the whole multitude was on the land facing the sea. 2 Then He taught them many things by parables, and said to them in His teaching:

3 “Listen! Behold, a sower went out to sow.

4 And it happened, as he sowed, that some seed fell by the wayside; and the birds of the air came and devoured it.

5 Some fell on stony ground, where it did not have much earth; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of earth.

6 But when the sun was up it was scorched, and because it had no root it withered away.

7 And some seed fell among thorns; and the thorns grew up and choked it, and it yielded no crop.

8 But other seed fell on good ground and yielded a crop that sprang up, increased and produced: some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some a hundred.”

9 And He said to them,“He who has ears to hear, let him hear!”

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#16 Jun 12, 2012
T McCabe wrote:
<quoted text>
WHo cares? People come and people go ...
... but you have no where else to be.

“Plays well with others.”

Since: Jun 07

LIVING WELL*THE BEST REVENGE

#17 Jun 12, 2012
Joe DeCaro wrote:
<quoted text>
So the Rev.(Ret.) Fleming Rutledge, one of the first women ordained into the Episcopal priesthood, is now a non-member of TEC?
prove it.

“... truth will out.”

Since: May 08

Stratford, Connecticut.

#18 Jun 13, 2012
Selecia Jones- JAX FL wrote:
<quoted text>prove it.
google it.

“The Kingdom of God Begins NOW!”

Since: May 07

The Mountain Empire

#19 Jun 13, 2012
Matthew 6:24
24 No one can be slave to two masters; for he will either hate the first and love the second, or scorn the second and be loyal to the first. You can’t be a slave to both God and money.

Luke 16:13
“There is no servant who can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will honor the one and he will neglect the other. You cannot serve God and money.”

Why would anyone care about money, do the birds of the air?

Matt:6 25-34
25 “Therefore, I tell you, don’t worry about your life — what you will eat or drink; or about your body — what you will wear. Isn’t life more than food and the body more than clothing? 26 Look at the birds flying about! They neither plant nor harvest, nor do they gather food into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Aren’t you worth more than they are? 27 Can any of you by worrying add a single hour to his life?

28 “And why be anxious about clothing? Think about the fields of wild irises, and how they grow. They neither work nor spin thread, 29 yet I tell you that not even Shlomo in all his glory was clothed as beautifully as one of these. 30 If this is how God clothes grass in the field — which is here today and gone tomorrow, thrown in an oven — won’t he much more clothe you? What little trust you have!

31 “So don’t be anxious, asking,‘What will we eat?,’‘What will we drink?’ or ‘How will we be clothed?’ 32 For it is the pagans who set their hearts on all these things. Your heavenly Father knows you need them all. 33 But seek first his Kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34 Don’t worry about tomorrow — tomorrow will worry about itself! Today has enough tsuris already!

You either have faith, or you don't......

“Ecce! Sic transit gloria mundi”

Since: Oct 10

I See New Jerusalem From Here.

#20 Jun 13, 2012
MiddleWay wrote:
Matthew 6:24
24 No one can be slave to two masters; for he will either hate the first and love the second, or scorn the second and be loyal to the first. You can’t be a slave to both God and money.
Luke 16:13
“There is no servant who can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will honor the one and he will neglect the other. You cannot serve God and money.”
Why would anyone care about money, do the birds of the air?
Matt:6 25-34
25 “Therefore, I tell you, don’t worry about your life — what you will eat or drink; or about your body — what you will wear. Isn’t life more than food and the body more than clothing? 26 Look at the birds flying about! They neither plant nor harvest, nor do they gather food into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Aren’t you worth more than they are? 27 Can any of you by worrying add a single hour to his life?
28 “And why be anxious about clothing? Think about the fields of wild irises, and how they grow. They neither work nor spin thread, 29 yet I tell you that not even Shlomo in all his glory was clothed as beautifully as one of these. 30 If this is how God clothes grass in the field — which is here today and gone tomorrow, thrown in an oven — won’t he much more clothe you? What little trust you have!
31 “So don’t be anxious, asking,‘What will we eat?,’‘What will we drink?’ or ‘How will we be clothed?’ 32 For it is the pagans who set their hearts on all these things. Your heavenly Father knows you need them all. 33 But seek first his Kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34 Don’t worry about tomorrow — tomorrow will worry about itself! Today has enough tsuris already!
You either have faith, or you don't......
AMEN!

Even Saul of Tarsus knew that all the faith in the world and all the gifts of the Holy Spirit united in one person had no meaning if there was no love.

1 Corinthians 13

13 If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.

2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.

3 If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast,but do not have love, I gain nothing.

And

8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears.

And

12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.

13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

You all know what a great fan I am of ggod old Saul of Tarsus; however, in this case he spoke the truth.

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