Christian stupidity again

Christian stupidity again

Posted in the Christian Forum

Hello

New York, NY

#1 Dec 19, 2012
China detains 500-plus people for doomsday rumors
Associated Press - Tuesday, December 18, 2012

BEIJING (AP)— Chinese police have detained more than 500 people from a fringe Christian group for spreading rumors about the world's impending end, state media reported Tuesday.

In western China's Qinghai province alone, police arrested more than 400 members from the religious cult group, state-run China Central Television said Tuesday.

Police seized leaflets, video discs, books and other apocalyptic materials in the recent arrests of more than 500 people across eight provinces and regions, from the prosperous east coast to less developed western China, state media reports said.

The detentions come ahead of Friday, Dec. 21 — a date some say the Mayans prophesized would be the end of the world and which was the subject of the apocalyptic movie "2012."

Those detained are reported to be members of the group Almighty God, which is also called Eastern Lightning, after a phrase from the Bible's Book of Matthew. Widely regarded as a heretical Christian sect, the group preaches that Jesus has reappeared as a woman in central China. It has been accused of targeting Christians, kidnapping and beating them to force conversions.

Chinese society has been in tumult as decades of rapid free-market economic growth discredit communist ideology, loosen social controls and pull hundreds of millions from the countryside to the cities. Into the spiritual void have rushed traditional Buddhist groups and Daoist practices, as well as evangelical Christian churches and other spiritual groups, some with unorthodox and apocalyptic visions.

Eastern Lightning first appeared around 20 years ago, and the official Xinhua News Agency said that its members had "recently latched on to the Mayan doomsday prophesy to predict that the sun will not shine and electricity will not work for three days beginning on Dec. 21."

A public notice on the web site of Qinghai provincial government said local police are waging a "severe crackdown" on the group described as a cult with "strong political penchants." The government urged the public to inform the police of any illegal propaganda, gathering and preaching by the group.

The CCTV report called the group a cult and accused it of attacking the party and the government, though it did not give any specifics.

The state-run Huashang website last week, citing local authorities, reported that the group is urging followers to "exterminate the great red dragon" — a reference to the Communist Party — "and found a country under the rule of Almighty God."
Job

Santa Clara, CA

#2 Dec 19, 2012
Your title sounds a bit contradictory since it appears that a number of this cult's victims are Christians. Nothing like broad-brushing.

Buddhist stupidity again?

BANGKOK, Thailand -- Buddhist monks who allegedly murdered people, enjoyed sex with women and, in a macabre ritual, roasted a dead baby have wreaked hell on Thai society and its saffron-robed clergy.

On Monday (October 30), police arrested a Buddhist abbot for allegedly killing a woman whose body was found a week earlier inside a septic tank at a neighbor's home.

Police seized Abbot Adhikan Arn Wattanadhammo, 46, in Petchabun town while he reportedly tried to burn bloodstained clothing and destroy a ring inscribed with the dead woman's surname.

"Buddhist leaders face major crisis of faith," warned the respected Nation newspaper in an editorial.

"There was the monk who roasted dead babies in order to collect their oil to be used in spurious magical ceremonies," the editorial added. "And then there was the monk who committed necrophilia in coffins in his temple.

"These are but two of the most bizarre incidences in recent years which have caused the monkhood to suffer a serious loss of credibility." The paper lamented, "Barely a week goes by without some kind of monastic scandal."

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0011/S00003....
Hello

New York, NY

#3 Dec 26, 2012
Your point? There will always be some people behaving like screwballs-- they were arrested, Buddhism in no way support this kind of behavior...end of story. People even boycotted their temples.

Buddhism does not make ridiculous claims. Christianity states that by merely believing in Jesus you destroy all sins since Christ died for your sins.

So with this huge claim it is Christians who have to explain why they have so much evil by Christians who say Christ gave them their righteousness.

That's a major tenet in Christianity. Every Christian should be able to walk on water after getting baptized.
Job

Santa Clara, CA

#4 Dec 29, 2012
Hello wrote:
1. Your point? There will always be some people behaving like screwballs-- they were arrested, Buddhism in no way support this kind of behavior...end of story. People even boycotted their temples.

2. Buddhism does not make ridiculous claims. Christianity states that by merely believing in Jesus you destroy all sins since Christ died for your sins.

So with this huge claim it is Christians who have to explain why they have so much evil by Christians who say Christ gave them their righteousness.

3. That's a major tenet in Christianity. Every Christian should be able to walk on water after getting baptized.
1. This is totally contradictory. What makes you think Buddhists get a free pass when some of their own get caught in criminal activity? What makes you think Christianity supports the behavior of these fringe Christian cult groups? Why wouldn't the same rule apply for Christianity when maintaining that " There will always be some people behaving like screwballs"? And so what if these Buddhists were arrested, and temples boycotted? What would you expect?

Do you get my point now?

And by the way, fringe Christians groups are coming under scrutiny from the Chinese government, whereas true evangelical ministries within China are receiving favor.

2. Then you're misrepresenting Christianity because Christianity does not teach that. The Bible teaches that there is a war within the flesh, and believers can easily fall prey to the flesh. The Bible 'also' teaches that there are false Christians.

3. What in the world are you talking about?

By the way, is there anything within the teachings of Buddha that condemns false accusations?
Punisher

Bronxville, NY

#5 Dec 29, 2012
Job wrote:
Your title sounds a bit contradictory since it appears that a number of this cult's victims are Christians. Nothing like broad-brushing.
Buddhist stupidity again?
BANGKOK, Thailand -- Buddhist monks who allegedly murdered people, enjoyed sex with women and, in a macabre ritual, roasted a dead baby have wreaked hell on Thai society and its saffron-robed clergy.
On Monday (October 30), police arrested a Buddhist abbot for allegedly killing a woman whose body was found a week earlier inside a septic tank at a neighbor's home.
Police seized Abbot Adhikan Arn Wattanadhammo, 46, in Petchabun town while he reportedly tried to burn bloodstained clothing and destroy a ring inscribed with the dead woman's surname.
"Buddhist leaders face major crisis of faith," warned the respected Nation newspaper in an editorial.
"There was the monk who roasted dead babies in order to collect their oil to be used in spurious magical ceremonies," the editorial added. "And then there was the monk who committed necrophilia in coffins in his temple.
"These are but two of the most bizarre incidences in recent years which have caused the monkhood to suffer a serious loss of credibility." The paper lamented, "Barely a week goes by without some kind of monastic scandal."
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0011/S00003....
Monasticism...the last great stranglehold of Religions in these poor areas...those monks still manage to trick the locales into supporting their stupid lifestyles and practices. Relying on superstition and folklore...like all Religions.

But of course Xtianity never did anything like this...lol.
Punisher

Bronxville, NY

#6 Dec 29, 2012
Hello wrote:
Your point? There will always be some people behaving like screwballs-- they were arrested, Buddhism in no way support this kind of behavior...end of story. People even boycotted their temples.
Buddhism does not make ridiculous claims. Christianity states that by merely believing in Jesus you destroy all sins since Christ died for your sins.
So with this huge claim it is Christians who have to explain why they have so much evil by Christians who say Christ gave them their righteousness.
That's a major tenet in Christianity. Every Christian should be able to walk on water after getting baptized.
Come on now...Buddhism's best line is cause no harm/suffering. After that its all unproven BS. Enlightenment is a crock of Religious BS!

Monks - of all faiths - in most places are free-loaders living off the hard work of others and basically contribute zero to Humanity. Every now an then they come out and spin a magic wheel, or sprinkle flowers, burn more incense, or pour dyes on pilgrims, or do some other stupid ritual...and the people shyte themselves over it...

Xtianity has a similar line, Do unto others, etc...then it wanders off into the absurd.

Belief in magic pathways is what gets Humans into trouble all the time.

“Invisible Pink Unicorn”

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#7 Dec 29, 2012
Job wrote:
<quoted text>
1. This is totally contradictory. What makes you think Buddhists get a free pass when some of their own get caught in criminal activity? What makes you think Christianity supports the behavior of these fringe Christian cult groups? Why wouldn't the same rule apply for Christianity when maintaining that " There will always be some people behaving like screwballs"? And so what if these Buddhists were arrested, and temples boycotted? What would you expect?
Do you get my point now?
And by the way, fringe Christians groups are coming under scrutiny from the Chinese government, whereas true evangelical ministries within China are receiving favor.
2. Then you're misrepresenting Christianity because Christianity does not teach that. The Bible teaches that there is a war within the flesh, and believers can easily fall prey to the flesh. The Bible 'also' teaches that there are false Christians.
3. What in the world are you talking about?
By the way, is there anything within the teachings of Buddha that condemns false accusations?
sikkhapada or ‘step of training’

1. To abstain from taking the lives of living beings.
2. To abstain from taking that which is not given.
3. To abstain from sexual misconduct.
4. To abstain from telling falsehoods.
5. To abstain from distilled and fermented intoxicants, which are the occasion for carelessness

There is also a set of five positive practices, which correspond to them, thus forming a complete practice of virtue. They are:

1. Loving-kindness and compassion.
2. Patience in the right means of livelihood.
3. Contentment in married life.
4. Truthfulness.
5. Watchfulness.

There much more if you're interested look here:
http://www.abuddhistlibrary.com/Buddhism/B%20...
Punisher

Bronxville, NY

#8 Dec 29, 2012
Hello wrote:
China detains 500-plus people for doomsday rumors
Associated Press - Tuesday, December 18, 2012
BEIJING (AP)— Chinese police have detained more than 500 people from a fringe Christian group for spreading rumors about the world's impending end, state media reported Tuesday.
In western China's Qinghai province alone, police arrested more than 400 members from the religious cult group, state-run China Central Television said Tuesday.
Police seized leaflets, video discs, books and other apocalyptic materials in the recent arrests of more than 500 people across eight provinces and regions, from the prosperous east coast to less developed western China, state media reports said.
The detentions come ahead of Friday, Dec. 21 — a date some say the Mayans prophesized would be the end of the world and which was the subject of the apocalyptic movie "2012."
Those detained are reported to be members of the group Almighty God, which is also called Eastern Lightning, after a phrase from the Bible's Book of Matthew. Widely regarded as a heretical Christian sect, the group preaches that Jesus has reappeared as a woman in central China. It has been accused of targeting Christians, kidnapping and beating them to force conversions.
Chinese society has been in tumult as decades of rapid free-market economic growth discredit communist ideology, loosen social controls and pull hundreds of millions from the countryside to the cities. Into the spiritual void have rushed traditional Buddhist groups and Daoist practices, as well as evangelical Christian churches and other spiritual groups, some with unorthodox and apocalyptic visions.
Eastern Lightning first appeared around 20 years ago, and the official Xinhua News Agency said that its members had "recently latched on to the Mayan doomsday prophesy to predict that the sun will not shine and electricity will not work for three days beginning on Dec. 21."
A public notice on the web site of Qinghai provincial government said local police are waging a "severe crackdown" on the group described as a cult with "strong political penchants." The government urged the public to inform the police of any illegal propaganda, gathering and preaching by the group.
The CCTV report called the group a cult and accused it of attacking the party and the government, though it did not give any specifics.
The state-run Huashang website last week, citing local authorities, reported that the group is urging followers to "exterminate the great red dragon" — a reference to the Communist Party — "and found a country under the rule of Almighty God."
Eastern Lighting....sounds like a power company.

IF ONLY we did this in the US. Report to officials the End of Times morons...

Oh wait...no need to report them...they write stupid books and make stupid TV shows that people gobble up...! but these kooks go unmolested...while the Occupy Wall St folks get spied on by the FBI.

http://www.justiceonline.org/commentary/fbi-f...
Punisher

Bronxville, NY

#9 Dec 29, 2012
Job wrote:
<quoted text>
1. This is totally contradictory. What makes you think Buddhists get a free pass when some of their own get caught in criminal activity? What makes you think Christianity supports the behavior of these fringe Christian cult groups? Why wouldn't the same rule apply for Christianity when maintaining that " There will always be some people behaving like screwballs"? And so what if these Buddhists were arrested, and temples boycotted? What would you expect?
Do you get my point now?
And by the way, fringe Christians groups are coming under scrutiny from the Chinese government, whereas true evangelical ministries within China are receiving favor.
2. Then you're misrepresenting Christianity because Christianity does not teach that. The Bible teaches that there is a war within the flesh, and believers can easily fall prey to the flesh. The Bible 'also' teaches that there are false Christians.
3. What in the world are you talking about?
By the way, is there anything within the teachings of Buddha that condemns false accusations?
And this teaching about the War of the Flesh is what ruins so many people lives. They actually fall for it, and blame themselves and/or very often their lack of faith to BEAT it back.

Its whats behind these moronic Xtian gay-conversion centers.

The "flesh" does not have an agenda, and its most certainly not to get us to fall into sin. Thats Religious prattle that the flesh is doing anything to Us. We are the flesh, we're not two entities in one container.
Hello

New York, NY

#10 Dec 29, 2012
Job wrote:
<quoted text>
1. This is totally contradictory. What makes you think Buddhists get a free pass when some of their own get caught in criminal activity? What makes you think Christianity supports the behavior of these fringe Christian cult groups? Why wouldn't the same rule apply for Christianity when maintaining that " There will always be some people behaving like screwballs"? And so what if these Buddhists were arrested, and temples boycotted? What would you expect?
Do you get my point now?
And by the way, fringe Christians groups are coming under scrutiny from the Chinese government, whereas true evangelical ministries within China are receiving favor.
2. Then you're misrepresenting Christianity because Christianity does not teach that. The Bible teaches that there is a war within the flesh, and believers can easily fall prey to the flesh. The Bible 'also' teaches that there are false Christians.
3. What in the world are you talking about?
By the way, is there anything within the teachings of Buddha that condemns false accusations?
Protestant Christian missionaries supported by church funds go around converting people saying they will go to hell if they don't believe in Jesus, otherwise their sins will not be pardoned and damned for eternity.

Christians constantly use apocalypse stories, including their own end of times stories to gain converts.

Is this a misrepresentation of Christian teachings? All of this can be justified using scriptures, which Christians claim are without error.

Can you say I am misrepresenting a large segment of Christians who believe this way?
Hello

New York, NY

#11 Dec 29, 2012
Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>Come on now...Buddhism's best line is cause no harm/suffering. After that its all unproven BS. Enlightenment is a crock of Religious BS!
Monks - of all faiths - in most places are free-loaders living off the hard work of others and basically contribute zero to Humanity. Every now an then they come out and spin a magic wheel, or sprinkle flowers, burn more incense, or pour dyes on pilgrims, or do some other stupid ritual...and the people shyte themselves over it...
Xtianity has a similar line, Do unto others, etc...then it wanders off into the absurd.
Belief in magic pathways is what gets Humans into trouble all the time.
Jammercolo's post contains the training vows of a lay person.

Monks are supposed to keep the teachings and actually help people learn meditation and take training vows to help stabilize the mind.

Actually monks who are dedicated don't need a monastery. Real Buddhist monks are hermits who live in the forest and don't need your support.

The monks/nuns in monasteries and temples are people who are not tough enough to survive the jungles.

Monastaries do help people get away from the world, as long as the monks therein are not corrupt.

Monks and nuns are as corrupt as the society they come from or as upright.

In Buddhism integrity is key.

NDanger

“Third Eye”

Since: Nov 10

You can't get there from here.

#12 Dec 29, 2012
Hello wrote:
<quoted text>
Jammercolo's post contains the training vows of a lay person.
Monks are supposed to keep the teachings and actually help people learn meditation and take training vows to help stabilize the mind.
Actually monks who are dedicated don't need a monastery. Real Buddhist monks are hermits who live in the forest and don't need your support.
The monks/nuns in monasteries and temples are people who are not tough enough to survive the jungles.
Monastaries do help people get away from the world, as long as the monks therein are not corrupt.
Monks and nuns are as corrupt as the society they come from or as upright.
In Buddhism integrity is key.
Sounds like the "key" was misplaced there bucko...
Hello

New York, NY

#13 Dec 29, 2012
NDanger wrote:
<quoted text>
Sounds like the "key" was misplaced there bucko...
All in good time. The key can be found in dedicated monks and nuns as well as lay people who practice. They are able to demonstrate active development of their brains through mri's which will get more people to meditate.

Everything runs in cycles, ignorance leads to decay which leads to loss of integrity, which leads to breakdown in society and spiritual traditions as you are seeing.

However, all you need are a few good people with integrity to train and discipline themselves for the restoration of society.
Punisher

Yonkers, NY

#14 Dec 30, 2012
Hello wrote:
<quoted text>
Jammercolo's post contains the training vows of a lay person.
Monks are supposed to keep the teachings and actually help people learn meditation and take training vows to help stabilize the mind.
Actually monks who are dedicated don't need a monastery. Real Buddhist monks are hermits who live in the forest and don't need your support.
The monks/nuns in monasteries and temples are people who are not tough enough to survive the jungles.
Monastaries do help people get away from the world, as long as the monks therein are not corrupt.
Monks and nuns are as corrupt as the society they come from or as upright.
In Buddhism integrity is key.
Integrity is not something faith of any sort can hand you. It may help some people get to a place of integrity, over time, maybe - but its not a thing Faith or Religious adherence gives you. IMO, a person has an innate sense of integrity or they dont...or they waffle all over the place...Faith may only help the integrity-less keep themselves in check, but not rid themselves of their base tendencies.

And as we see by these stories of zero integrity, zero morality and any sort of ethical method of thinking and behaving...its more likely in a Monastic setting that it will corrupt many people.

Monks or nuns, or priests, or whatever their title of any faith are not as moral or corrupt as the society they come from...that would mean by default all your precious Asian Buddhist monks are much more likely to support sex-ploitation of children over say American monks, nuns...where pedophilia is more likely to be heavily prosecuted and persecuted.

And one doesnt need a Religious Faith to either create or attend a monastery. I have visited several (Buddhist and Xtian)over the course of my life...and its there that I was most profoundly struck and moved towards by my Atheistic POV.
Punisher

Yonkers, NY

#15 Dec 30, 2012
Hello wrote:
<quoted text>
All in good time. The key can be found in dedicated monks and nuns as well as lay people who practice. They are able to demonstrate active development of their brains through mri's which will get more people to meditate.
Everything runs in cycles, ignorance leads to decay which leads to loss of integrity, which leads to breakdown in society and spiritual traditions as you are seeing.
However, all you need are a few good people with integrity to train and discipline themselves for the restoration of society.
What are these spiritual traditions, and which ones would you say are the better ones...most productive for a society to nurture...?
Hello

New York, NY

#16 Dec 31, 2012
Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>Integrity is not something faith of any sort can hand you. It may help some people get to a place of integrity, over time, maybe - but its not a thing Faith or Religious adherence gives you. IMO, a person has an innate sense of integrity or they dont...or they waffle all over the place...Faith may only help the integrity-less keep themselves in check, but not rid themselves of their base tendencies.
And as we see by these stories of zero integrity, zero morality and any sort of ethical method of thinking and behaving...its more likely in a Monastic setting that it will corrupt many people.
Monks or nuns, or priests, or whatever their title of any faith are not as moral or corrupt as the society they come from...that would mean by default all your precious Asian Buddhist monks are much more likely to support sex-ploitation of children over say American monks, nuns...where pedophilia is more likely to be heavily prosecuted and persecuted.
And one doesnt need a Religious Faith to either create or attend a monastery. I have visited several (Buddhist and Xtian)over the course of my life...and its there that I was most profoundly struck and moved towards by my Atheistic POV.
integrity does not come about from faith, it does come about from people who KNOW and UNDERSTAND true value in integrity. The value of integrity in terms of mind training, development, developing society is emphasized only in Buddhism.

A sincere Buddhist is to meditate on the Noble Eightfold Path and if they have broken any precepts EVERY MOMENT.
Job

Santa Clara, CA

#17 Jan 1, 2013
Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>
And this teaching about the War of the Flesh is what ruins so many people lives. They actually fall for it, and blame themselves and/or very often their lack of faith to BEAT it back.
Its whats behind these moronic Xtian gay-conversion centers.
The "flesh" does not have an agenda, and its most certainly not to get us to fall into sin. Thats Religious prattle that the flesh is doing anything to Us. We are the flesh, we're not two entities in one container.
I'm assuming you're referring to guilt (to some degree or another). I think guilt can be a 'life-saver', just as physical pain can be as well. Who's to say how many people are 'not' in prison because they 'don't' succumb to temptations that they fight, that no one else may even know about? If they give in to a given temptation (like a desire to 'rape'), you may not want to refer to it as giving into sin, or a war between the flesh and the spirit, but it's a conflict between 2 opposing positions any way you wish to look at it.

As far as gay conversion centers, I don't know much about them. I would say that a lot of 'gay' conversions to Christianity came about by personal "free-will" decision. There are ministries run by by 'former' homosexuals who obviously know far more about various gay related issues than any straight person. I think it's just assumed that they've all made their decision based on guilt complex, guilt trips, etc.
Job

Santa Clara, CA

#18 Jan 1, 2013
Hello wrote:
<quoted text>
Protestant Christian missionaries supported by church funds go around converting people saying they will go to hell if they don't believe in Jesus, otherwise their sins will not be pardoned and damned for eternity.
Christians constantly use apocalypse stories, including their own end of times stories to gain converts.
Is this a misrepresentation of Christian teachings? All of this can be justified using scriptures, which Christians claim are without error.
Can you say I am misrepresenting a large segment of Christians who believe this way?
For one, not all conversions involve missionaries. Sometimes it's by somehow gaining access to scripture. The obvious problem with your assessment is that if there 'is' a Hell (as I believe there is), it would be more of a crime 'not' to tell others about the Gospel message. I think it's also important to emphasize that when referring to modern missionaries, we are no longer talking about 'colonization'.

As an example, Christianity is not growing in Thailand as it is in say, China and South Korea. But there 'are' Christians, and Christian missionaries in Thailand. And the reason that there 'are' missionaries in Thailand is because the independent nation of Thailand's government 'allows' for it. And this bothers a number of western expats living in Thailand who are not Christians, who in my opinion should just be thankful the Thai government allows 'them' to reside there (and receive various expat privileges), who often are invoking some type of western commercialism. I don't like Mormonism. And Mormon missionaries are all over Asia. But it's not may call to say whether they should be there or not.

So in other words, it's up to the individual to believe the Gospel message or not. They have the right to convert and believe no matter how other westerners feel about it.
Flygerian

Oklahoma City, OK

#19 Jan 1, 2013
Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>
And this teaching about the War of the Flesh is what ruins so many people lives. They actually fall for it, and blame themselves and/or very often their lack of faith to BEAT it back.
Its whats behind these moronic Xtian gay-conversion centers.
The "flesh" does not have an agenda, and its most certainly not to get us to fall into sin. Thats Religious prattle that the flesh is doing anything to Us. We are the flesh, we're not two entities in one container.
So what do you say of drug addicts that cannot get off drugs but want to? Is this not a battle with the flesh wanting to do something that the spirit (or mind since you may or may not believe in the spirit) does not want to?
Anglo saxon 18

UK

#20 Jan 2, 2013
These groups may have crank type
views, but the fact the chinks can lock you up for em is even worse, a person has the right to be a crank in my book

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