BIBLE CONTRADICTION: Mark 4:11-12, 2 ...

BIBLE CONTRADICTION: Mark 4:11-12, 2 Peter 3:9

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#1 Jun 28, 2014
Mark 4:11-12: "(11)And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:(12)That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them."

2 Peter 3:9: "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."

How is this not a Bible contradiction?

Peace,
nunnies
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#4 Jun 30, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
Contradictions of the Gospels
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<quote text>
We are told to accept that Jesus existed based upon the Gospels of the Bible
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You don't have to take the Bible as testimony of Yeshua's existance. We can find it in Josephus, The Talmud, Pliny, Tacitus and Suetonius.
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<quote text>
1) How many generations were there between Abraham to David? Matthew 1:17 lists fourteen generations. Matthew 1:2 lists thirteen generations.
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Firstly you need to understand the difference between "from" and "between". The bible say from Abraham to David. Not only have you changed the wording but you have created a grammatical error. You see "from" and "to" go together. When you use "between" it is usual to name two things.
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First you have to understand what a contradiction is. You seem to think that information given from two viewpoints which don't actually say anything mutually exclusive is a contradiction. A contradiction must have mutually exclusive rhetoric. If you apply this to your second point you will see there is no mutually exclusive rhetoric. Also knowing the original language is beneficial, but a good bible dictionary can make the difference. In the case of the centurion, it is apparent that he was "approached" by the centurion through emissaries, which the KJV rendered "came to him". Again, no mutually exclusive rhetoric. Your problem is in understanding what was written as opposed to reading a translation. If a police officer was taking a report of an accident he wouldn't rely on one witness if he could find others and he wouldn't think one was a liar if his testimony didn't say exactly what another said. He would take all the information to see the big picture.
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<quoted text>
13) Who was the father of Joseph? Matthew 1:16 The father of Joseph was Jacob. Luke 3 :23 The father of Joseph was Heli. Christians shall try to LIE and tell you that one is the heritage of Mary and the other Joseph. This is utter bullshit, the Hebrew and Greek cultures NEVER regarded the bloodline of the mother. They were patriarchal societies which only concerned themselves with paternal lineage.
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Not so, in Judaism only the bloodline of the mother is relevant for Jewishness. Additionally since Yeshua was born of a virgin, his paternal line was irrelevant to make him of the seed of David.
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<quoted text>
14) How many generations were there from the Babylon captivity to Christ? Matthew 1:17 Fourteen generations, Matthew 1:12-16 Thirteen generations.
1. Salathiel
2. Zorobabel
3. Abiud
4. Eliakim
5. Azor
6. Sadoc
7. Achim
8. Eliud
9. Eleazar
10. Matthan
11. Jacob;
12. Joseph
13. Mary
14. Yeshua
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Your error is again with the translation where "aner" is rendered husband, when it actually means man. In this case "aner" is the father. We know this for multiple reasons.
1. If Joseph were the husband, we don't have 14 generations.
2. If Joseph is the husband we don't have a seed of David, since it is attested he was born of a virgin. This makes the whole genealogy irrelevant.
3. If Joseph is the husband, we don't need a contradictory lineage in Luke.
4. Church tradition says there is a levirate marriage in the genealogy which makes the term "aner" correct since Joseph or Joakim wouldn't have been the biological father, his brother would have been. Joseph could have been the legal father, not the biological one. Either way the seed concept is intact. In the case where Joseph is the biological Father his brother would have been the legal father.
5. Aner is only used in this verse in the entire geneaology giving us a textual irritant to clue us in to there is more than meets the eye.
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Conclusion: All the evidence points to 14 generations. Would you have us believe someone writing a fiction could not count up to 14? Why would someone write a lineage where Joseph is the father when the same author attests to Yeshua being born of a virgin?
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#7 Jun 30, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
<quoted text>
hey moron, josephus never met any jesus .his work was a forgery..neither did tacitus...
Scholarly opinion on the total or partial authenticity of the reference in Book 18, Chapter 3, 3 of the Antiquities, a passage that states that Jesus the Messiah was a wise teacher who was crucified by Pilate, usually called the Testimonium Flavianum, varies.[5][6][3] The general scholarly view is that while the Testimonium Flavianum is most likely not authentic in its entirety, it is broadly agreed upon that it originally consisted of an authentic nucleus, which was then subject to Christian interpolation or forgery
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It isn't required that a historian meet everyone he writes about. What you are trying to do is rewrite how history is written. Sorry I'm not buying it and neither is any historian.
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Even your posting about Josephus concludes that it has a historical core. In case you don't know what that means, it means Yeshua existed.
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#8 Jun 30, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
by the way einstein, James Cameron discovered the tomb of jesus, his wife and kids.....that's a hell of lot more authentic that some copies of stories 2000 years ago...
The Lost Tomb of Jesus, a new documentary produced by Academy Award-winning director James Cameron, claims that an ancient family tomb, unearthed in 1980 during construction of a Jerusalem apartment complex, once held the bones of Jesus' family, including His mother, Mary, His "son" (Judah) and Mary Magdalene, supposedly Jesus' wife.
Despite widespread ridicule from scholars, "The Lost Tomb of Jesus" drew more than 4 million viewers when it aired on the Discovery Channel on 4th March 2007. A companion book, "The Jesus Family Tomb," has rocketed to sixth place on The New York Times nonfiction best-seller list. The film and book suggest that a first-century ossuary found in a south Jerusalem cave in 1980 contained the remains of Jesus, contradicting the Christian belief that he was resurrected and ascended to heaven. Ossuaries are stone boxes used at the time to store the bones of the dead. The filmmakers also suggest that Mary Magdalene was buried in the tomb, that she and Jesus were married, and that an ossuary labeled "Judah son of Jesus" belonged to their son.
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As you have pointed out scholars aren't buying what your spreading around (I think you can catch my drift).
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As you can see from the facts, this tomb was discovered 30 years ago. Why is this an issue now? I will tell you why. People today are ready to buy fiction as truth. Also they can't remember why this is not the body of Jesus. Just looking at a website http://www.jesusfamilytomb.com/ you can see the deception if you are familiar with the facts. Saying "Tombs with the names Maria, Jesus son of Joseph". What they don't tell you is that name is on an ossuary of James brother of Jesus, son of Joseph. You bought that it is Jesus in the tomb, when there is no evidence that he is. I don't know if it is even possible to determine who is in the tomb outside of what is written on the ossuaries. Judah could just as easily be James' son or any of his relatives. But people want to hear about Jesus. As they say in investigations "Just follow the money".
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Next you will be telling us "The DaVinci Code" is not fiction.
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#12 Jul 1, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
The Teachings and Personality of Jesus
Let us look now at the teachings of Jesus. First we note that many of the sayings attributed to Jesus are demonstrably false.
From this collection of sayings we can summarize a few things about the teachings of Jesus:
they were meant for the Jews only.
they were fundamentally about the imminent "coming of the kingdom of God" and not much else.
the atonement, the idea that Jesus died for the sins of the world, such a central part of Christian theology, did not originate from Jesus.
his ethical lessons were unimpressive and unoriginal.
From these collection of sayings, we can also discern something about the personality of the Galilean peasant. We find that he:
did not have a great intellect.
has a personality probably not much different from other peasant preachers of his era.
Some psychologists even went as far as to say he was insane!
Almost all Christian denominations claim that Jesus is God. Yet when we look at the authentic sayings of Jesus, taken from the synoptics, we find that he never claimed to be God. We find many examples where Jesus expressly affirmed his subordination to the divine. Part of the confusion comes from an early misunderstanding among the church fathers of the terms Son of Man and Son of God. We also conclude that, in all probability, the "I am" sayings in the gospel of John are unhistorical. We do not know what he actually claimed himself to be. We are not sure if he even claimed to have been the Jewish messiah.
Of course all these considerations have not stopped fundamentalists from coming up with proofs of Jesus' messianic status or divinity. One of the most commonly used proofs is the claim that details about Jesus and his life were predicted by Old Testament prophecies. We see that these claims are clearly false.
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This is even more spurious than the last cut and paste job. Can you support any of this?
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What you need to do is do your own thinking, not read from websites which do not support their assertions with evidence.
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#14 Jul 1, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
<quoted text>
oh, they support it very well...they have an extensive bibliography....
http://www.rejectionofpascalswager.net/jesus....
now let's see your evidence, not using fundie sites with a lot of faith based assertions..
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<quoted text>
We also conclude that, in all probability, the "I am" sayings in the gospel of John are unhistorical.
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I accept your challenge, show me the evidence of the above statement. Now don't be lazy, find it and document it.
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#17 Jul 1, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
<quoted text>
there is a whole page regarding the gospel of John...and links and references provided on that page....
http://www.rejectionofpascalswager.net/crucif...
now you show me the original bible... the original signed gospels of the apostles and where they are kept...
let me save you the time and effort, THERE IS NONE.. but you keep looking...
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Like I said, give me your best shot. Can't you think for yourself? Do you need others to tell you what the truth is?
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#18 Jul 1, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
http://www.rejectionofpascalsw ager.net/jesus.html#sources
all the gospels are bull$chit....
./
Just another assertion which you can't or won't defend.
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#20 Jul 1, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
<quoted text>
when you grow up and get to high school and beyond, you will learn that when you perform research you utilize credible sources like the encyclopedias, science books, almanacs and other credible verified sources....you don't try to interpret and study what professionals have spent decades working on...
you want to rely on your personal fundie sites and extrapolate your preconcieved conclusions based upon opinions of religious dimwits then by all means... I gave you the links and sources... not going to waste time educating you on basic logic and common sense....
I asked you for signed originals of the gospels and where they are kept,...you deflected again with your bullschitt....
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<quoted text>
when you grow up and get to high school and beyond, you will learn that when you perform research you utilize credible sources like the encyclopedias, science books, almanacs and other credible verified sources....you don't try to interpret and study what professionals have spent decades working on...
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Based upon this we should believe in Piltdown man, Nebraska man, additionally we still have Haeckel’s drawings in textbooks even though they were fraudulent.
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Haeckel’s drawings never fooled expert embryologists, who recognized his fudgings right from the start. Haeckel’s drawings, despite their noted inaccuracies, entered into the most impenetrable and permanent of all quasi-scientific literatures: standard student textbooks of biology... Once ensconced in textbooks, misinformation becomes cocooned and effectively permanent, because…textbooks copy from previous texts....
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True science can stand the scrutiny of constant evaluation. As we can see from history if something is true it can handle the questioning.
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You on the other hand would have us believe in a earth centered solar system since we shouldn't question prior paradigms.
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<quoted text>
I asked you for signed originals of the gospels and where they are kept,...you deflected again with your bullschitt.
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Gee that was big of you. I suppose you picked on scrawny kids at school because you couldn't challenge an athlete. Why haven't you answered the many questions I have put to you? Is it because you can't articulate your own position and you couldn't google my questions to find a website that could do your thinking for you?
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#21 Jul 2, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
<quoted text>
there is a whole page regarding the gospel of John...and links and references provided on that page....
http://www.rejectionofpascalswager.net/crucif...
now you show me the original bible... the original signed gospels of the apostles and where they are kept...
let me save you the time and effort, THERE IS NONE.. but you keep looking...
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Went to the link did a control f typed in I am and guess what "no hits"
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Not only were you lazy and not provide the evidence, you sent me on a wild goose chase. That is the last time I will believe a link posted by you. Next time if you don't provide the link and cut and paste out the relevant section, I will not believe you since you have deceived me on this instance.
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But I did sniff out something on that site:
As Craveri pointed out [2] this account cannot be historical because we know from other sources that places of crucifixion were closely guarded and it was not allowed for anyone to go close to them.
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Where is the evidence of this? Any historical record? Probably not.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#22 Jul 7, 2014
PRINCE OF DARKNESS wrote:
Contradictions of the Gospels
We are told to accept that Jesus existed based upon the Gospels of the Bible, yet the Gospels are so poorly written that a logical person is at best left to ponder if Jesus even existed. The Gospels are consistently contradictive, filled with mathematic errors and don’t compliment each other on very important details. This page shall serve as an example for just how unreliable the Gospels are.
Gospel Contradictions:
1) How many generations were there between Abraham to David? Matthew 1:17 lists fourteen generations. Matthew 1:2 lists thirteen generations.
2) Is Paul lying? In Acts 20:35 Paul told people "to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said,'It is more blessed to give than to receive.'" Since Jesus never made such a biblical statement, isn’t Paul guilty of deception?
3) When did the leper become not a leper?(Matthew 8:13 & 8:14) Jesus healed the leper before visiting the house.(Mark 1:29-30 & 1:40-42) Jesus healed the leper after visiting Simon Peter’s house.
4) Who approached Jesus?(Matthew 8:5-7) The Centurion approached Jesus, beseeching help for a sick servant.(Luke 7:3 & 7:6-7) The Centurion did not approach Jesus. He sent friends and elders of the Jews.
5) Was she dead or just dying?(Matthew 9:18) He asked for help, saying his daughter was already dead.(Luke 8:41-42) Jairus approached Jesus for help, because his daughter was dying.
6) Just what did Jesus instruct them to take?(Matthew 10:10) Jesus instructed them not to take a staff, not to wear sandals.(Mark 6:8-9) Jesus instructed his disciples to wear sandals and take a staff on their journey.
7) When did John find out Jesus was the Messiah?(Matthew 11:2-3) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the messiah.(Luke 7:18-22) While imprisoned. John the Baptist sent followers to Jesus to inquire if Jesus was the Messiah.(John 1 :29-34,36) John already knew Jesus was the Messiah.
8) Who made the request?(Matthew 20:20-21) Their mother requested that James and John, Zebedee’s children, should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom.(Mark 10:35-37) James and John, Zebedee’s children, requested that they should sit beside Jesus in his Kingdom.
9) What animals were brought to Jesus?(Matthew 21:2-7) two of the disciples brought Jesus an ass and a colt from the village of Bethphage.(Mark 11:2-7) They brought him only a colt.
10) When did the fig tree hear of its doom?(Matthew 21:17-19) Jesus cursed the fig tree after purging the temple.(Mark 11:14-15 & 20) He cursed it before the purging.
11) When did the fig tree keel?(Matthew 21:9) The fig tree withered immediately. and the disciples registered surprise then and there.(Mark 11:12-14 & 20) The morning after Jesus cursed the fig tree, the disciples noticed it had withered and expressed astonishment.
If what Jesus said matters, then only the twelve original disciples had total recall of all the Teachings. You noted some variants - rightly so for the most part. Taking out Luke and Mark and Hebrews, all of Paul's books and 2 Peter - which may be a fake epistle - you might find that the true record is not so inconsistent.
It's what I've determined so far anyway....
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#23 Jul 7, 2014
Also, the genealogy of Matthew is not in the oldest manuscripts and should not be in the book....
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#24 Jul 7, 2014
And yes, most don't recognize it, but Paul lied - repeatedly in fact.

jesuswordsonly.com

Since: Jun 14

Location hidden

#25 Jul 8, 2014
Peace,

I wont be posting anymore. The One True God has caused me or allowed me to see that I shouldn't talk the way that I do. By the "One True God" I mean the God of Elijah Muhammad and Louis Farrakhan, Who is the God of the Bible and Holy Qur'an. I am NOT a Muslim however.

Peace.
nunnies
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#26 Jul 8, 2014
nunnies wrote:
Peace,
I wont be posting anymore. The One True God has caused me or allowed me to see that I shouldn't talk the way that I do. By the "One True God" I mean the God of Elijah Muhammad and Louis Farrakhan, Who is the God of the Bible and Holy Qur'an. I am NOT a Muslim however.
Peace.
nunnies
.
Aren't they the group that murdered Malcolm X?
jesus is

Doonside, Australia

#27 Jul 16, 2014
BIBLE CONTRADICTIONS ANSWERED:
https://answersingenesis.org/contradictions-i...

There are so many links that answer "Bible Contradictions" and I have been answering them here for years.

Just type 'Bible Contradictions Answered' into your search engine and save me the effort.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#31 Jul 24, 2014
There should be a time in life when we can honestly face the fact that the tooth fairy is not real - that it was made up.

The gospel accounts are inconsistent and the inconsistencies are grounds for investigators to reject what is in the Bible as suspect. After all, is God the author of confusion? The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth - not the author of untruth.

Just yesterday I noted another reason to suspect Luke as Paul's side-kick to subvert the truth taught by Y'shua. Luke 7 has Him telling the sinful woman that she was saved by faith - a peculair doctrine taught by Paul and not supported in any of the prophecies of the OT for the Messiah and not according to Matthew, John, or Peter - and certainly at odds wth what He says in Revelation.

So how is it that Luke puts Paul's teachings into the mouths of both Peter and Jesus? In Acts, Luke says Peter said we are sanctified by faith in Jesus, in I Peter, Peter says we are sanctified by obedience to God and Christ - the word of God - which is what Y'shua said: "Sanctify them by Thy truth; Thy word is truth."

I think we should ignore Luke if we want to actually know the truth.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#32 Jul 24, 2014
Mark has no place to be counted as an equal gospel account either. Isn't Mark also a side-kick of Paul? I'm starting to see a picture here - that the scribes, or whoever is supposed to have check things thoroughly to be according to the commandments of God about who to hear - have been duped by Paul and his group of disciples.

And if I am wrong -

Show reason by the instruction of God in Scripture - leave out the suspected false witnesses and prove your point by the true witnesses, which is what God commands.

http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/recommendedread...
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#33 Jul 24, 2014
Barnsweb wrote:
There should be a time in life when we can honestly face the fact that the tooth fairy is not real - that it was made up.
The gospel accounts are inconsistent and the inconsistencies are grounds for investigators to reject what is in the Bible as suspect. After all, is God the author of confusion? The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of truth - not the author of untruth.
Just yesterday I noted another reason to suspect Luke as Paul's side-kick to subvert the truth taught by Y'shua. Luke 7 has Him telling the sinful woman that she was saved by faith - a peculair doctrine taught by Paul and not supported in any of the prophecies of the OT for the Messiah and not according to Matthew, John, or Peter - and certainly at odds wth what He says in Revelation.
So how is it that Luke puts Paul's teachings into the mouths of both Peter and Jesus? In Acts, Luke says Peter said we are sanctified by faith in Jesus, in I Peter, Peter says we are sanctified by obedience to God and Christ - the word of God - which is what Y'shua said: "Sanctify them by Thy truth; Thy word is truth."
I think we should ignore Luke if we want to actually know the truth.
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Or you could understand that faith and obedience are tied together. This way we have two aspects of what our salvation requires, not just one without the other.
messianic114

Calgary, Canada

#34 Jul 24, 2014
Barnsweb wrote:
Mark has no place to be counted as an equal gospel account either. Isn't Mark also a side-kick of Paul? I'm starting to see a picture here - that the scribes, or whoever is supposed to have check things thoroughly to be according to the commandments of God about who to hear - have been duped by Paul and his group of disciples.
And if I am wrong -
Show reason by the instruction of God in Scripture - leave out the suspected false witnesses and prove your point by the true witnesses, which is what God commands.
http://www.jesuswordsonly.com/recommendedread...
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<quoted text>
Isn't Mark also a side-kick of Paul?
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No he wasn't, he was a sidekick of Barnabas. Paul refused to take him along after he had abandoned them in a prior missionary journey.
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<quoted text>
And if I am wrong -
Show reason by the instruction of God in Scripture - leave out the suspected false witnesses and prove your point by the true witnesses, which is what God commands.
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The word of G-d tells us that by the mouth of two or more witnesses shall truth be established. We have the testimony of many witnesses. If one disagrees with you, you brand them a false witness. That wouldn't hold up in court or with the apostles. We also have their silence about these so call lies. Why? When Paul was accused of abandoning the law, he was questioned about it and found innocent. Who are you to 2,000 years later retry him? Where are your witnesses? Where are his witnesses? I'll tell you... unavailable and that is enough to let the matter stay as it has always been.
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Lastly there is nothing in the TNK about a suspected witness.

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