Should religion play a role in politics?

“ ILKS r kewl ”

Since: Apr 09

Conch republic

#160 Sep 30, 2013
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Minnesota is gonna go in the shitter in part because it legalized SSM. Take a good look at Detroit and imagine Chicago five years from now. Many have and are fleeing and relocating to Mpls. even Duluth. Not necessarily looking for jobs but handouts. All is available is part time low paying jobs. The Dems ran Detroit right into the ground. They had everything going their way and they screwed it all up. Defy the laws of God and receive curses as a result. You won't find that in a Science textbook. Minnesota embraces wrong and calls it right and teaches wrong to children.
You mean that a light beam is all you can ride?

Pathetic!
Get OUT of the "shitter". you smell.
Big Al

Hibbing, MN

#161 Sep 30, 2013
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Minnesota is gonna go in the shitter in part because it legalized SSM. Take a good look at Detroit and imagine Chicago five years from now. Many have and are fleeing and relocating to Mpls. even Duluth. Not necessarily looking for jobs but handouts. All is available is part time low paying jobs. The Dems ran Detroit right into the ground. They had everything going their way and they screwed it all up. Defy the laws of God and receive curses as a result. You won't find that in a Science textbook. Minnesota embraces wrong and calls it right and teaches wrong to children.
Most people in this day and age have rejected religious superstition in favor of science. I see that you are one of those who haven't.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#162 Sep 30, 2013
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Minnesota is gonna go in the shitter in part because it legalized SSM. Take a good look at Detroit and imagine Chicago five years from now. Many have and are fleeing and relocating to Mpls. even Duluth. Not necessarily looking for jobs but handouts. All is available is part time low paying jobs. The Dems ran Detroit right into the ground. They had everything going their way and they screwed it all up. Defy the laws of God and receive curses as a result. You won't find that in a Science textbook. Minnesota embraces wrong and calls it right and teaches wrong to children.
Are you insane?

You have done nothing but spew ignorance and BS on here. Well, that along with dodge or ignore huge issues.

And this little bit:
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text>
Defy the laws of God and receive curses as a result. You won't find that in a Science textbook.
And never will.

All you have is threats and nonsense.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#163 Sep 30, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
<quoted text>What does Hitler and Martin Luther's Darwinian have to do with Christianity? Nothing. Any real Christian knows that the Jews are the chosen ones and that Jesus AND all 13 Apostles were Jews, including Matthias. The gay devil has been opposed to anything having to do with God, marriage, family, children, Jews and Christians, and this gay devil has hated anything that is contrary to him. Think about it.
God vs. the devil and gays, God will destroy the devil and says to kill all gays caught in the sin of homosexuality. Only delayed due to Christ.
God vs. the devil and gays, God says marriage is the union of wo and man, becoming one. Gays and the devil promote group sex and the idea of marriage being a promiscuous bat house event of many.
God vs. the devil and gays, God calls the family Holy. Gays and the devil both seek to destroy family. Many gays have told mom they would kill themselves, kill like the devil, if she did not accept, but gays would tell mom to kills herself if she said she would kill herself if they did not stop their nonsense and family hate. God loves children and want them free of sex, while the devil and gays tell children that they are homoSEXuals as early as 3 to 5 years of age. God loves Jews and Christians, the devil and gays hate both.
There you have it, the devil is gay and the father of gays.
Really? How do you explain hermaphrodites?

It is how some people are born... pull your head out of your a55.
The Doctor

San Fernando, CA

#164 Sep 30, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
<quoted text>
Really? How do you explain hermaphrodites?
It is how some people are born... pull your head out of your a55.
Ddi yuo think, wow, I did it when you posted this. Hermaphrodites actually cease to exist at puberty and they become intersexed. It has nothing to do with sexual oirentation. An intersexed male can be sexually oriented towards males or females. Very much like transgenders, which are only 75% homosexual.

I suggest you keep your head in your a$$ because no one is born gay, they develop that way. I so love it when you gay types resort back to the gay gene lie or biological hormonal influence lie. That means you all have both rejected God and science.

I doubt this will help, but I will try. Dumb me: A baby girl is born with two healthy legs. The mom keeps the child in a crib, age 2, age, age 3, agte 5, age 7...finally age 13 and now she has to use a wheel chair. The legs fail to develop and now she comes out as a "wheel chair" person and joins Wheel Chair for Life" and they tell her that those who do not want her to be a wheel chair person are just "wheelchairphobes". She has sex in her wheel chair and she now claims it is normal and that walkers just do not want her to be happy.

Sounds like nonsense, well only because it has not been peddled like gay nonsense. If you research the gay movement back to 1973, you will discover the politics and the erasing of the Leona Tyler principle within the APA.

Please explain why the APA, unless it is because of gays, has Gay and Lesbian Help Centers, when they make the claim that homosexuality is not a mental or psychiatric condition. Irony is that this would be like having auto mechanics service refrigerators. Now, if an auto mechanic serviced trucks, then it would be why the APA services homosexuality when they deal will mental illness.

****AWH, forget what I posted, it was for people who do not like gay nonsense and prefer truth.
The Doctor

San Fernando, CA

#165 Sep 30, 2013
Big Al wrote:
<quoted text>
Most people in this day and age have rejected religious superstition in favor of science. I see that you are one of those who haven't.
Please explain your idiocy and how science and religion are in conflict? You atheists have tried to promote science as a conflicting belief contrary to religion and that is nonsense.

Science is simply the field of study. Scientists come in many forms, since they are human. They come to the field with bias, opinions, superstitions and nonsense, and that blinds them and renders them incapable of observing science. In fact, most of these atheist scientists come into the field with atheist superstitions and neanderthal beliefs.

The second you posted science as some type of idea and belief, you were exposed. Science is simply the field of study and what we observe. It is neither secular, Christian, atheist, agnostic, Islamic, Hindu, Judeo or any other religion. It supports neither and does not promote your ideology, yet then hand print of God can be found all throughout nature and before you. It is you who attempts to look billions of light years into a black hole, which you can not measure with time or observe with anything other than your imagination and superstitions.

Science? It appears that you have a problem with science and it is you who attempts to imagine something that you neither see, measure or observe.

“ ILKS r kewl ”

Since: Apr 09

Conch republic

#166 Sep 30, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
<quoted text>Please explain your idiocy
You first! Bet ya cant! LMAO
Big Al

Hibbing, MN

#167 Sep 30, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
<quoted text>Please explain your idiocy and how science and religion are in conflict? You atheists have tried to promote science as a conflicting belief contrary to religion and that is nonsense.
Science is simply the field of study. Scientists come in many forms, since they are human. They come to the field with bias, opinions, superstitions and nonsense, and that blinds them and renders them incapable of observing science. In fact, most of these atheist scientists come into the field with atheist superstitions and neanderthal beliefs.
The second you posted science as some type of idea and belief, you were exposed. Science is simply the field of study and what we observe. It is neither secular, Christian, atheist, agnostic, Islamic, Hindu, Judeo or any other religion. It supports neither and does not promote your ideology, yet then hand print of God can be found all throughout nature and before you. It is you who attempts to look billions of light years into a black hole, which you can not measure with time or observe with anything other than your imagination and superstitions.
Science? It appears that you have a problem with science and it is you who attempts to imagine something that you neither see, measure or observe.
I see no conflict between religion and science other than that created by creationists and other superstitious believers. Science deals with empirical evidence and natural phenomenon and religions deal with faith and the supernatural. Conflict only arises when religious believers deny science on the basis of their religious beliefs.

My response was to lightbeamrider who wrote…

“They had everything going their way and they screwed it all up. Defy the laws of God and receive curses as a result. You won't find that in a Science textbook.”

I take that as the same type of religious superstition that said the plague was a punishment from “God” or that lightning bolts were the wrath of “God”. Most people in this day and age recognize that when bad things happen they are the result of natural causes and are not curses from “God”.
little lamb

South Yarra, Australia

#168 Sep 30, 2013
Big Al wrote:
<quoted text>
You say that unless I have been "born of the spirit" I will not see "the Kingdom of God". You "believe" that being "born of the spirit" is some sort of mystical process that will enable some part of me to survive the death of my physical body and continue to live in some unknown place called the "Kingdom of God". The Egyptians, Greeks and Norse also "believed" that their sacred rituals would enable some part of them to continue to exist in some unknown place after the death of their physical bodies.
Of course neither you nor I believe that the Egyptians, Greeks and Norse who lived and died believing in the mystical power of their sacred rituals are still alive in the Egyptian Netherworld, Elysium or Valhalla. I simply accept the reality that neither you nor I or the Egyptians or the Greeks or the Norse knows what happens after the death of our physical bodies. I can accept the possibility that death is simply the end (something believers cannot do) as well as the possibility of some sort continuation after death, but I don't pretend to know anything about the nature of such an existence - I'll find out when the time comes.
Difference with faith in Christ and these other religions

Is salvation in Jesus name is today

Today is the day of salvation..today is the day to be saved

religion says later..because they can't step out of the boat [ comfort zone ] onto the 'water

We are called to acquire the glory of Christ.

We are to put him on...
The Doctor

Torrance, CA

#169 Sep 30, 2013
Cookie_Parker wrote:
<quoted text>
Please do list the "secular atheist organizations" which get tax exemptions.
Here goes.

The American Humanist Association (AHA) was founded with an educational tax exemption in 1941. In the 1960's, without specific board authorization, a religious tax exemption was successfully attained from the Internal Revenue Service to enable the organization to provide benefits to humanist celebrants seeking to comply with state marriage laws. Those who considered themselves "religious humanists" rejoiced at this move that appeared to affirm their leanings, while other humanists were repelled.

http://www.americanhumanist.org/hnn/archives/...

Because of its religious tax exemption, the AHA had to develop another tact for such debates, and struck upon one that proved ultimately to be very effective. It is important to note that the religious right defines humanism essentially as anything contrary to their own views. To them it's a synonym for "heathen" or "worldly person."

The International Humanist and Ethical Union (IHEU) is the world union of more than one hundred Humanist, rationalist, irreligious, atheistic, Bright, secular, Ethical Culture, and freethought organizations in more than 40 countries. The "Happy Human" is the official symbol of the IHEU as well as being regarded as a universally recognised symbol for those who call themselves Humanists. Secular humanist organizations are found in all parts of the world. Those who call themselves humanists are estimated to number between four and five million people worldwide.
The Doctor

Torrance, CA

#170 Sep 30, 2013
Big Al wrote:
<quoted text>
I see no conflict between religion and science other than that created by creationists and other superstitious believers. Science deals with empirical evidence and natural phenomenon and religions deal with faith and the supernatural. Conflict only arises when religious believers deny science on the basis of their religious beliefs.
My response was to lightbeamrider who wrote…
“They had everything going their way and they screwed it all up. Defy the laws of God and receive curses as a result. You won't find that in a Science textbook.”
I take that as the same type of religious superstition that said the plague was a punishment from “God” or that lightning bolts were the wrath of “God”. Most people in this day and age recognize that when bad things happen they are the result of natural causes and are not curses from “God”.
Science does not deal with swat. Science it what is studied and observed. You are another go-along fooled soul. It is merely scientist, men/women, who have defined what they observe or fail to observe in scientific terms, without evidence, or in religious terms with Biblical evidence. The problem is that scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results. They are required to observe the ape in his habitat and observe it as an ape, not as a human with human motivations and thoughts.

Again, in your unscientific mind, you try to define what is today based on what was professed and proclaimed years ago. Your imagination is like trying to call monkeys in a zoo's behavior natural or trying to look at the behavior of pet dogs and call that natural or even on the human side taking slaves and chaining them and saying that is a natural behavior of unchained humans. This type of nonsense, is what caused bigots to look at black slaves over centuries and make conclusions about black behaviors absent of slavery.

For instance, these people can not factor in that the pyramids were built by great black kings, the first double genius was a black African king, there are 53 countries in Africa, at once 65% of black Africans were Christians, the church of Alexandria which was before the church of Rome, is in Africa.

Explanations absent of facts and truths are bias and bigoted long before studies are made, and thus fixed and designed for politics.
The Doctor

Torrance, CA

#171 Sep 30, 2013
Troth for Leogere wrote:
<quoted text>You first! Bet ya cant! LMAO
You got me, I can't. I bet you can explain yours, since in fact it is yours.
Big Al

Hibbing, MN

#172 Oct 1, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
<quoted text>Science does not deal with swat. Science it what is studied and observed. You are another go-along fooled soul. It is merely scientist, men/women, who have defined what they observe or fail to observe in scientific terms, without evidence, or in religious terms with Biblical evidence. The problem is that scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results. They are required to observe the ape in his habitat and observe it as an ape, not as a human with human motivations and thoughts.
Again, in your unscientific mind, you try to define what is today based on what was professed and proclaimed years ago. Your imagination is like trying to call monkeys in a zoo's behavior natural or trying to look at the behavior of pet dogs and call that natural or even on the human side taking slaves and chaining them and saying that is a natural behavior of unchained humans. This type of nonsense, is what caused bigots to look at black slaves over centuries and make conclusions about black behaviors absent of slavery.
For instance, these people can not factor in that the pyramids were built by great black kings, the first double genius was a black African king, there are 53 countries in Africa, at once 65% of black Africans were Christians, the church of Alexandria which was before the church of Rome, is in Africa.
Explanations absent of facts and truths are bias and bigoted long before studies are made, and thus fixed and designed for politics.
I don't see the fact that "scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results" as a being problem. I see it as the main reason for the success of science in making new discoveries about the world we live in. Science understands very well the tendency of human beings to be influenced by preconceived ideas and personal biases. That's why they instituted double blind experiments, peer review and the idea that the results of experiments must repeatable.

Science is hard work. Scientific discoveries do not come about by means of divine revelation or simply reading an ancient text. Copernicus did not figure out that the earth and planets revolve around the sun by spending his evenings with his nose in a Bible. He spent his evenings observing and recording the positions of the 5 visible planets. By applying logic and reason to his observations he was able to determine that these motions made sense only if the sun was the central point around which the earth and planets revolved.

I don't know what you're smoking but try leaving it alone for at least a few hours before you try to write something.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#173 Oct 1, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
<quoted text>Ddi yuo think, wow, I did it when you posted this. Hermaphrodites actually cease to exist at puberty and they become intersexed. It has nothing to do with sexual oirentation. An intersexed male can be sexually oriented towards males or females. Very much like transgenders, which are only 75% homosexual.
I suggest you keep your head in your a$$ because no one is born gay, they develop that way. I so love it when you gay types resort back to the gay gene lie or biological hormonal influence lie. That means you all have both rejected God and science.
I doubt this will help, but I will try. Dumb me: A baby girl is born with two healthy legs. The mom keeps the child in a crib, age 2, age, age 3, agte 5, age 7...finally age 13 and now she has to use a wheel chair. The legs fail to develop and now she comes out as a "wheel chair" person and joins Wheel Chair for Life" and they tell her that those who do not want her to be a wheel chair person are just "wheelchairphobes". She has sex in her wheel chair and she now claims it is normal and that walkers just do not want her to be happy.
Sounds like nonsense, well only because it has not been peddled like gay nonsense. If you research the gay movement back to 1973, you will discover the politics and the erasing of the Leona Tyler principle within the APA.
Please explain why the APA, unless it is because of gays, has Gay and Lesbian Help Centers, when they make the claim that homosexuality is not a mental or psychiatric condition. Irony is that this would be like having auto mechanics service refrigerators. Now, if an auto mechanic serviced trucks, then it would be why the APA services homosexuality when they deal will mental illness.
****AWH, forget what I posted, it was for people who do not like gay nonsense and prefer truth.
You made a straw man argument.

You want to assume that being gay is a defect that gets "fixed."

I take it you do not know many gay people.

Hormones and chemicals in the body is what makes someone gay. that is why us "regular" people don't look at the same sex and get anything out of it.

It is the way they are. Nobody "chooses" to be gay anymore then they "choose" to be strait. Just like you don't choose like or not like certain foods that someone else might love. You either like it or you do not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermaphrodite

Humans
Main article: Intersex

Aside from having an ambiguous-looking external genitalia, true hermaphroditism in humans differs from pseudohermaphroditism in which the person's karyotype has both XX and XY chromosome pairs (47XXY, 46XX/46XY, 46XX/47XXY or 45X/XY mosaic) and having both testicular and ovarian tissue. One possible pathophysiologic explanation of this rare phenomenon is a parthenogenetic division of a haploid ovum into two haploid ova. Upon fertilization of the two ova by two sperm cells (one carrying an X and the other carrying a Y chromosome), the two fertilized ova are then fused together resulting in a person having dual genitalial, gonadal (ovotestes) and genetic sex.

Another common cause of hermaphroditism is the crossing over of the SRY from the Y chromosome to the X chromosome during meiosis. The SRY is then activated in only certain areas, causing development of testes in some areas by beginning a series of events starting with the upregulation of SOX9, and in other areas not being active (causing the growth of ovarian tissues). Thus, testicular and ovarian tissues will both be present in the same individual.[17]

And no, the sex organs of a hermaphrodite do not just "go-away" at puberty.

Point is, if they are capable of developing organs why is it so far fetched to believe that people can be born with different hormones?
Big Al

Hibbing, MN

#174 Oct 1, 2013
little lamb wrote:
<quoted text>
Difference with faith in Christ and these other religions
Is salvation in Jesus name is today
Today is the day of salvation..today is the day to be saved
religion says later..because they can't step out of the boat [ comfort zone ] onto the 'water
We are called to acquire the glory of Christ.
We are to put him on...
And in the days of the Egyptians, the Greeks and the Norse the way to the Netherworld, Elysium and Valhalla was through Amun Ra, Zeus and Odin in what was "today" to them.

I think it is those who believe in imaginary gods and places of eternal bliss that refuse to leave the comfort zone.

"I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides." - Carl Sagan
The Doctor

Torrance, CA

#176 Oct 1, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
<quoted text>
You made a straw man argument.
You want to assume that being gay is a defect that gets "fixed."
I take it you do not know many gay people.
Hormones and chemicals in the body is what makes someone gay. that is why us "regular" people don't look at the same sex and get anything out of it.
It is the way they are. Nobody "chooses" to be gay anymore then they "choose" to be strait. Just like you don't choose like or not like certain foods that someone else might love. You either like it or you do not.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermaphrodite
Humans
Main article: Intersex
Let me first dispense of your original point, which was about hermaphrodites. Obviously you do not know that humans do not remain hermaphrodites but become intersexed. As I explained, intersexed does not mean straight or gay as they can be either. It has nothing to do with sexual attraction and thus your argument fails.

Unless, you are prepared to be schooled, by an expert, me, I suggest you leave this conversation, because your denial with scream and whine.

Hormones do not cause attractions and there are also no gay genes. Try to catch up.

The friends of the gays, the APA, now says to all of you, that the primary causations for homosexual orientation are environmental and socialization but that exact causes are unknown. Yet, you focus on what could only be a menial part if at all, hormones.

Homosexuality is a character and developmental disorder, very much like failing learning to walk and talk. Before you go screaming that homosexual behavior has been observed in over 1500 species and prove that you are a media robot, please explain how anything homo or human can be observed in non-human animals. Let us move forward, what they further explain is that homosexual orientation is virtually nonexistent any other animals and at best would be a rarity. we can not assign human motivations to base animal extincts of aggression like mounting and even eating their young.

As for your assertion that it is I who does not know many gays, I challenge your lie and expose your lack. 70% of prisoners admit to consensual gay sex, so your idea about attraction is baseless. Also, gays have long had this term "turning out", which is when a gay turns a straight into a gay. Now imagine, an older gay sibling who molests a younger or a parent who does the same, urges and feelings become confused.

How many people do you know that are asexual or vibrator sexual? Well, most people, male and/or female are more attracted to their hand than they are the same or opposite sex and that vibrator gets more Friday and Saturday night dates than can be counted.

Now, if you want a clue, then you need to go uncover the scientific evidence that the APA used to develop it's position of homosexuality being natural and not disordered. Here is a hint, so your search can be short, there is none and it was all political.

This is not cause to hate or attack gays, it is the truth, that many ex-gays have told. Also, if you knew many gays you would know that most were sexually abused at a young age and most had sexual attractions to the opposite sex. The question is not whether a straight would have gay sex, paedo sex, necro sex or zoophilia sex, but whether each of these groups would have heterosexual. That answer is emphatically yes.
Just a Thought

El Cerrito, CA

#177 Oct 1, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
Could you possibly try posting one truthful comment?You just wasted space posting this garbage because it is nothing but lies.
The Doctor

Torrance, CA

#178 Oct 1, 2013
Big Al wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't see the fact that "scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results" as a being problem. I see it as the main reason for the success of science in making new discoveries about the world we live in. Science understands very well the tendency of human beings to be influenced by preconceived ideas and personal biases. That's why they instituted double blind experiments, peer review and the idea that the results of experiments must repeatable.
Science is hard work. Scientific discoveries do not come about by means of divine revelation or simply reading an ancient text. Copernicus did not figure out that the earth and planets revolve around the sun by spending his evenings with his nose in a Bible. He spent his evenings observing and recording the positions of the 5 visible planets. By applying logic and reason to his observations he was able to determine that these motions made sense only if the sun was the central point around which the earth and planets revolved.
I don't know what you're smoking but try leaving it alone for at least a few hours before you try to write something.
I don't see the fact that "scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results" as a being problem, but you must since most of what you spew is not based on application of science rules. Again, you do not even understand science and scientists, and you constant display that ignorance. Once again, science is what is observed and measured. It simply is and it does nothing except wait to be observed and measured, by some scientist who is incapable of being accurate and designed to be flawed.

Repeating scientific experiments among idiots is not a measure of anything. It is like white men conducting case studies about blacks and Asians, and finding agreement among themselves. A flawed idea is a flawed idea, even if everyone confirms that it is not.

Perhaps, more scientists should use divine revelations and Albert Einstein himself said that much of scientific discoveries come from divine inspiration and a desire to discover the unknown. He said that sadly what we often see are groups of scientists who set out to prove what they already decided they would see, and they insert and add so as to achieve those results.

Until, you can understand the basic idea that they are individual bias scientists, some religious and some atheists, then your use of the word 'science' is juvenile and reveals you as a neophyte.

As for Copernicus, Darwin and Einstein, each one of them came to science with a search for truth which was inspired by the Bible. So, try again. In fact, while you atheist fools were standing still hoping not to spin off the earth or walk off it, religious men, often the doctors, scientist, and psychiatrists, were telling you all that the earth was a sphere.

While you are at it, with all those black holes, alleged to be over one million in our galaxy, you should be able to observe, quantify and measure at least one of them.

Also, while you are measuring the occurrence which you call the Big Bang, please explain what unit of measurement you are using to measure it with. Do not say light years, unless you can explain how and how you are able to do it without the laws of physics operating.

BY the way, your deluge into attacks is consistent with a whipped cretin who wishes to divert the conversation away from areas you feel challenged in. You know, brain usage.
The Doctor

Torrance, CA

#179 Oct 1, 2013
Big Al wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't see the fact that "scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results" as a being problem.
Here is an example, some scientists say that the universe is 14.5 billion years old and the earth and sun are 4.5 billion years old. Foolish, huh? You see, they have taken light years and tried to equate it into annual years. You have 10 billion alleged years that the universe was supposedly evolving without a unit of measurement.

How do you measure a light year?
In: Astronomy
Answer:
A light year is the distance light travels in a vacuum in one Julian year. Figuring light travels at 186,000 miles a second how many miles will it travel in a year? A rough estimate would be: 60 x 60 x 24 x 365.25 x 186,000. In 1 minute it would travel 60 X 186,000 miles; in 1 hour it would travel 60 times that number of miles, and so on. It comes close to 9.5 trillion kilometers, or about 5.9 trillion miles.

In astronomy, a Julian year (symbol: a) is a unit of measurement of time defined as exactly 365.25 days of 86,400 SI seconds each.[1][2][3][4] The Julian year is the average length of the year in the Julian calendar used in Western societies in previous centuries, and for which the unit is named.

OKAY, SINCE THE JULIAN YEAR COULD ONLY BEGIN WITH A SUN AND THE EARTH, HOW CAN YOU MEASURE THE UNIVERSE USING A JULIAN YEAR BEFORE IT EXISTED?

WE live with flaws and areas, for instance the Native Americans are not Indians, yet most will call them that and it is often taught as such. So simple to correct, but so arrogantly adhered to without cause or reason.
Big Al

Hibbing, MN

#180 Oct 1, 2013
The Doctor wrote:
<quoted text>I don't see the fact that "scientists are required to use only observable, duplicatable and measured results" as a being problem, but you must since most of what you spew is not based on application of science rules. Again, you do not even understand science and scientists, and you constant display that ignorance. Once again, science is what is observed and measured. It simply is and it does nothing except wait to be observed and measured, by some scientist who is incapable of being accurate and designed to be flawed.
Repeating scientific experiments among idiots is not a measure of anything. It is like white men conducting case studies about blacks and Asians, and finding agreement among themselves. A flawed idea is a flawed idea, even if everyone confirms that it is not.
Perhaps, more scientists should use divine revelations and Albert Einstein himself said that much of scientific discoveries come from divine inspiration and a desire to discover the unknown. He said that sadly what we often see are groups of scientists who set out to prove what they already decided they would see, and they insert and add so as to achieve those results.
Until, you can understand the basic idea that they are individual bias scientists, some religious and some atheists, then your use of the word 'science' is juvenile and reveals you as a neophyte.
As for Copernicus, Darwin and Einstein, each one of them came to science with a search for truth which was inspired by the Bible. So, try again. In fact, while you atheist fools were standing still hoping not to spin off the earth or walk off it, religious men, often the doctors, scientist, and psychiatrists, were telling you all that the earth was a sphere.
While you are at it, with all those black holes, alleged to be over one million in our galaxy, you should be able to observe, quantify and measure at least one of them.
Also, while you are measuring the occurrence which you call the Big Bang, please explain what unit of measurement you are using to measure it with. Do not say light years, unless you can explain how and how you are able to do it without the laws of physics operating.
BY the way, your deluge into attacks is consistent with a whipped cretin who wishes to divert the conversation away from areas you feel challenged in. You know, brain usage.
"For me the Jewish religion like all others is an incarnation of the most childish superstitions.”— Albert Einstein

“Thus I came - though the child of entirely irreligious (Jewish) parents - to a deep religiousness, which, however, reached an abrupt end at the age of twelve. Through the reading of popular scientific books I soon reached the conviction that much in the stories of the Bible could not be true. The consequence was a positively fanatic orgy of freethinking…”- Albert Einstein

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