Empathy... how do Christians have any?

Empathy... how do Christians have any?

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“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#1 Jun 17, 2013
I guess my question goes along the lines of this.

If you are a Christian and you believe in hell, a place of constant torment and punishment. How can you have Empathy?

How can your god be all love when he creates a place like this?

How can he be all knowing is he put Adam and Eve into a garden and he already knew when they would do? He let it happen anyways.

If he is all knowing he would know what they would do even before he created the Earth and went along with it anyways. And then punish people because of it.

Do you condone punishing a child because of the shortcoming of the parent? What lesson is learned by this? To me this is blatantly ridicules.

How can you have Empathy when you believe that the majority of people will suffer forever.

I am an Atheist. I do not believe in a god because of the things I have learned and the rationality that it would be evil to have such a place. Not to mention the fact that I work in the sciences.

Is it really fair for someone that was maybe a jerk for 60 years to spend countless billions in constant punishment and torture?

Is that Justice or love? What lesson is learned when there is no freedom from this place? What is the value of love, justice and mercy here?

These are some of the root philosophical issues I have with Christianity.
Job

Santa Clara, CA

#2 Jun 17, 2013
It seems as if you've become an atheist 'because' of what you read, experienced in relation to, the Bible.

Do you think it's possible that God exists as say, a deist may believe God exists? I doubt that you look at nature, and just think on how 'impossible' it would be for an intelligent creator to have been responsible. That 'evolution' is just written all over it.

Since: Oct 07

Manchester, UK

#3 Jun 17, 2013
no it is neither justice nor love .. Christ came and took the keys to death and hell and both will be destroyed

John 10:10
King James Version (KJV)
10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

Revelation 1:18
King James Version (KJV)
18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Romans 6:9
King James Version (KJV)
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

Revelation 20:13-15
King James Version (KJV)
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

John 5:
King James Version (KJV)28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation

Luke 20:38
King James Version (KJV)
38 For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#4 Jun 17, 2013
loveismygoal wrote:
no it is neither justice nor love .. Christ came and took the keys to death and hell and both will be destroyed
John 10:10
King James Version (KJV)
10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
Revelation 1:18
King James Version (KJV)
18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
Romans 6:9
King James Version (KJV)
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Revelation 20:13-15
King James Version (KJV)
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
John 5:
King James Version (KJV)28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation
Luke 20:38
King James Version (KJV)
38 For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.
Your comment only enforces what I said.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#5 Jun 17, 2013
Job wrote:
It seems as if you've become an atheist 'because' of what you read, experienced in relation to, the Bible.
Do you think it's possible that God exists as say, a deist may believe God exists? I doubt that you look at nature, and just think on how 'impossible' it would be for an intelligent creator to have been responsible. That 'evolution' is just written all over it.
Because of the things I know I do not believe in a deity. However, that does not say one does not exist, just that we have no proof of the existence.

I look at nature and life with much more passion, respect understanding then I did when I was a christian. You realize this is all you have so you really try to make the best of it. you realize there is no magical mystery worker so you need to be more self reliant. I became more caring of other people and races.

I don't ask a deity for forgiveness; I ask forgiveness from the person I wronged. It adds more accountability not less. It let me understand the word and her cultures better. It allows me to see through religious bickering and deal with the human element in everything.

In short, I feel that I have become a more rounded, better educated, more caring person than Christianity allowed me to be.

Another term I like to use instead of atheist is humanist.

“A JOURNEY OF A THOUSAND MILES”

Since: Aug 08

MUST BEGIN WITH A SINGLE STEP!

#6 Jun 17, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
<quoted text>
Because of the things I know I do not believe in a deity. However, that does not say one does not exist, just that we have no proof of the existence.
I look at nature and life with much more passion, respect understanding then I did when I was a christian. You realize this is all you have so you really try to make the best of it. you realize there is no magical mystery worker so you need to be more self reliant. I became more caring of other people and races.
I don't ask a deity for forgiveness; I ask forgiveness from the person I wronged. It adds more accountability not less. It let me understand the word and her cultures better. It allows me to see through religious bickering and deal with the human element in everything.
In short, I feel that I have become a more rounded, better educated, more caring person than Christianity allowed me to be.
Another term I like to use instead of atheist is humanist.
Nice, upfront and honest post.......and I would tend to agree with ya........leaving formalized religion was one of the best things I ever did:-)
Heathen bytch-fest

Houston, TX

#7 Jun 17, 2013
Job wrote:
It seems as if you've become an atheist 'because' of what you read, experienced in relation to, the Bible.
Do you think it's possible that God exists as say, a deist may believe God exists? I doubt that you look at nature, and just think on how 'impossible' it would be for an intelligent creator to have been responsible. That 'evolution' is just written all over it.
That's how brainwashed they are.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#8 Jun 18, 2013
Heathen bytch-fest wrote:
<quoted text>
That's how brainwashed they are.
What?

dollarsbill

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#9 Jun 18, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
I guess my question goes along the lines of this.
If you are a Christian and you believe in hell, a place of constant torment and punishment. How can you have Empathy?
All Christians were lost and going to Hell before obtaining salvation. How can we not have "Empathy"?

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#10 Jun 18, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
All Christians were lost and going to Hell before obtaining salvation. How can we not have "Empathy"?
How can you read my first statement and come to that conclusion?

Your statement does not mean you have empathy... it means you are scared for yourself... that is not empathy.

Empathy:
The ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

It is impossible to have empathy and overlook slavery , rape and the slaughter of children in your bible.

It is impossible to have empathy when your god has none. If he did, he would not have known the future and still enacted the things he did knowing what the outcome would be.

Why would he create Satan (as your story goes) if he knows all and already knew what Satan would do?

Why would he create Adam and Eve already knowing what they would do? Knowing that is would bring about the horrible events it would lead to.

If he knows all he knew all this would happen before he started the whole thing. Show me the empathy in that.

dollarsbill

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#11 Jun 18, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you read my first statement and come to that conclusion?
Your statement does not mean you have empathy... it means you are scared for yourself... that is not empathy.
Empathy:
The ability to understand and share the feelings of another.
It is impossible to have empathy and overlook slavery , rape and the slaughter of children in your bible.
It is impossible to have empathy when your god has none. If he did, he would not have known the future and still enacted the things he did knowing what the outcome would be.
Why would he create Satan (as your story goes) if he knows all and already knew what Satan would do?
Why would he create Adam and Eve already knowing what they would do? Knowing that is would bring about the horrible events it would lead to.
If he knows all he knew all this would happen before he started the whole thing. Show me the empathy in that.
Romans 9:11-13 (NKJV)
11 (for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls), 12 it was said to her, "The older shall serve the younger." 13 As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated."

18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who has resisted His will?" 20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#12 Jun 18, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
Romans 9:11-13 (NKJV)
11 (for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls), 12 it was said to her, "The older shall serve the younger." 13 As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated."
18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who has resisted His will?" 20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?
This answers nothing.

My point is you do not even know what empathy is.

Again... only enforcing what I said.

dollarsbill

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#13 Jun 18, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
<quoted text>
This answers nothing.
My point is you do not even know what empathy is.
Again... only enforcing what I said.
You wrote:

"If you are a Christian and you believe in hell, a place of constant torment and punishment. How can you have Empathy?

How can your god be all love when he creates a place like this?"

I NEVER said He is "all love".

"13 As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated."

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#14 Jun 18, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
You wrote:
"If you are a Christian and you believe in hell, a place of constant torment and punishment. How can you have Empathy?
How can your god be all love when he creates a place like this?"
I NEVER said He is "all love".
"13 As it is written, "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated."
1 John 4:8

New International Version (NIV)

8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

I see a contradiction here...

And you still don't know what Empathy is.

dollarsbill

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#15 Jun 18, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
<quoted text>
1 John 4:8
New International Version (NIV)
8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.
I see a contradiction here...
And you still don't know what Empathy is.
No contradiction. I know what "Empathy" means. Do you?
Ant

Alpharetta, GA

#16 Jun 18, 2013
Who is more in the wrong? A Christian or Atheists that deliberately start trouble with Christians hoping for any sort of response in order to say they are not being Christians like.

Empathy is putting yourself in the other persons shoes and trying to see what it must feel like to be in their position. While Christians may not be empathetic to atheists as to why they don't believe in God or think the bible has error and contradictions. Atheists too are not empathic to Christians as to why they believe in God and the bible.

I see more negative and nasty comments from atheists to Christians simply because they believe in the God and follow the bible. So don't be a hypocrite saying Christians are not empathetic or loving when you as atheist are neither of the 2 as well and instigate a lot of troubles on here.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#17 Jun 18, 2013
dollarsbill wrote:
<quoted text>
No contradiction. I know what "Empathy" means. Do you?
I quoted the meaning, you have proved it time and time again... you do not even understand the meaning of it... nor does your ridicules ramblings address the bigger issues...

God knowing everything and acting on it anyways.

It is a circle you have to live in... I don't. The "Pandora's box" that goes along with an all-knowing being is one that you open when you believe in this stuff.

“Vader2016!”

Since: Sep 10

The Deathstar

#18 Jun 18, 2013
Leviticus
25:17 Do not take advantage of each other, but fear your God. I am the Lord your God.

1 John 4:18 - There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Another contradiction.

The bible is full of them...
Ant

Alpharetta, GA

#19 Jun 18, 2013
10uhsee wrote:
Leviticus
25:17 Do not take advantage of each other, but fear your God. I am the Lord your God.
1 John 4:18 - There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.
Another contradiction.
The bible is full of them...
Leviticus is saying to fear God and the bible is quite clear that we are to fear God and follow his commandments.

John is just saying we should not live in fear.

Fearing God vs not living in fear about other things is different.
Punisher

Yonkers, NY

#20 Jun 18, 2013
Many Xtians do posses empathy...its just that their faith places their true natures in conflict with what they HAVE to believe.

Possessing empathy is another thing wholly due to our biology, not our faith or belief systems. You either have it, on a scale, or you do not...

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