Two Questions for Atheists/Evolutionists

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Punisher

Massapequa, NY

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#64
Aug 16, 2013
 

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Cisco Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
Wow! You just defined the fallacy of same sex 'marriage'.
Well since marriage is a legal and civil "institution", and since those can always be altered to mean what society desires - you'd be wrong. We can not legally make a dogs tail a leg.

Religious marriage has no legal or civil authority, let alone ownership of what a marriage is, or might be...
Punisher

Massapequa, NY

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#65
Aug 16, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
You know, it is ok to just admit that you have no answer to the questions. A couple people have done so about the origin of the universe, which means that they have at least been honest enough to admit that their science falls short. But I am not even going to invoke the creator here, let's keep this about reason and logic. Reason and logic dictate that there can only be one answer to the questions: either everything came about by some grand incredible series of accidents, which are so unlikely as to be 0 in possibility, or it did not come about that way. So if you say that it did come about that way, then you must be able to say how. So let's please see some actual answers. Try to refrain from lying about me and saying I am a name-caller, insulter, troll, etc., which is just your weak way of throwing out red herrings, and answer the questions. And NO, they have not been answered yet!
WTF?!!!

Are you not paying attention to your own posts!? I did exactly that and you called it a non-answer.

Stop trying to be a moron, just let it flow...!

Hey look every one, he learned about a red-herring...! Some of what we've said over the years has gotten thru...there is hope! Keep hope alive!
Punisher

Massapequa, NY

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#66
Aug 16, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
You know, it is ok to just admit that you have no answer to the questions. A couple people have done so about the origin of the universe, which means that they have at least been honest enough to admit that their science falls short. But I am not even going to invoke the creator here, let's keep this about reason and logic. Reason and logic dictate that there can only be one answer to the questions:

either everything came about by some grand incredible series of accidents,

which are so unlikely as to be 0 in possibility, or it did not come about that way. So if you say that it did come about that way, then you must be able to say how. So let's please see some actual answers. Try to refrain from lying about me and saying I am a name-caller, insulter, troll, etc., which is just your weak way of throwing out red herrings, and answer the questions. And NO, they have not been answered yet!
What a buffoon.

Define series of accidents.

Let me teach you something. Fire. You know how it works, right?(am I stretching here?) When a fire is lit by whatever means, once that spark ignites the "thing", the combustible, everything that follows IS NOT an accident. Let me repeat okay?

Once the spark ignites the material, etc - everything that follows right up to the crispy end is NOT AN ACCIDENT. Its a series of explainable events (chemical/physical reactions) all following the exact order they must due to the laws of Nature. Explained by the scientific method.

There are no accidents in Nature. Only humans know of accidents. Not Nature. A flood is NOT an accident. Now a human blowing up a berm, or building a faulty dam can be the cause - but the flood itself is no accident. Its what Nature must do, when certain catalysts meet various mediums. Accidents are a human thing, used to explain our fumblings.

Like what Xtian teen girls say so often, "It was an accident!" (pregnancy) No, there's no accident when sperm is ejaculated into the female love canal. Its gonna do what nature does. Create an embryo. No accident, the sperms didn't wander around and happen upon an egg. It didnt just shoot accidentally out of a random penis and accidentally land inside a Xtian girls womb while she was at the food court eating a whole pizza by herself.

Stop trying to anthropomorphize everything, its where you go off the rails.

There are no accidents in Nature.
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#67
Aug 16, 2013
 

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Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>
1. No you DON'T KNOW. It would not be called faith if you did.
I DO know because all of astronomy, geology, cosmology, etc. point to the creator. God said in His word HOW He did it: he spoke it into existence. Just like with your evo, there are somethings we are unable to answer, but the problem is this: evo. says that great amounts of time and chance could bring about the universe. Science is about what is OBSERVABLE and TESTABLE! You cannot observe or test the past or chance. Because you cannot test/observe these things, then YOU are also basing your beliefs on faith: faith in science, faith in scientists' interpretations, faith that millions and millions of years and totally improbable chance could have caused something to come from nothing. The universe HAD to have come from something if materialism is true. Life had to have begun from something non-living if materialism is true. Materialism is fallacious from the start because it suggests that the material world is all there is, and THAT clearly is not true. Your religion of science and its prophet, Darwin, is even MORE reliant upon faith than mine is!
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#68
Aug 16, 2013
 

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Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>Take your silly rules and shove 'em.
Anger? Not me...I don't waste such emotions on dolts like you. I'm laughing and smiling right now...resolute and extremely comfortable that I'm right and you are woefully wrong. Cause you got nothing, but a silly little book of old stories written by people afraid of the dark!
Now take your ball and go! Your Mommy wants to wash you before dinner...you know in those special places...
No, you're not showing any anger at all!
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#69
Aug 16, 2013
 

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Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>
What a buffoon.
Define series of accidents.
Let me teach you something. Fire. You know how it works, right?(am I stretching here?) When a fire is lit by whatever means, once that spark ignites the "thing", the combustible, everything that follows IS NOT an accident. Let me repeat okay?
Once the spark ignites the material, etc - everything that follows right up to the crispy end is NOT AN ACCIDENT. Its a series of explainable events (chemical/physical reactions) all following the exact order they must due to the laws of Nature. Explained by the scientific method.
There are no accidents in Nature. Only humans know of accidents. Not Nature. A flood is NOT an accident. Now a human blowing up a berm, or building a faulty dam can be the cause - but the flood itself is no accident. Its what Nature must do, when certain catalysts meet various mediums. Accidents are a human thing, used to explain our fumblings.
Like what Xtian teen girls say so often, "It was an accident!" (pregnancy) No, there's no accident when sperm is ejaculated into the female love canal. Its gonna do what nature does. Create an embryo. No accident, the sperms didn't wander around and happen upon an egg. It didnt just shoot accidentally out of a random penis and accidentally land inside a Xtian girls womb while she was at the food court eating a whole pizza by herself.
Stop trying to anthropomorphize everything, its where you go off the rails.
There are no accidents in Nature.
ac·ci·dent
[ak-si-duhnt]

noun
3.
any event that happens unexpectedly, without a deliberate plan or cause.

4.
chance; fortune; luck: I was there by accident.

5.
a fortuitous circumstance, quality, or characteristic: an accident of birth.

Evolution and origin theories are driven by "chance," "fortune," "unexpected" causality. If you say that the universe's origins, life's origins, and evolution are all NOT the products of design, then they HAVE to have come about without a design. That means they were undirected, chance incidents that somehow brought about everything.
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#70
Aug 16, 2013
 

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Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>I get it, we cant post a link, but you can refer us to a silly book.
BTW, I saw the author on CSPAN...just another myth believing idiot, using cliches and anecdotes to support a mythology. yawn!
Do you even know what ad hominem means?
Cisco Kid

Modesto, CA

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#71
Aug 16, 2013
 

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Punisher wrote:
<quoted text>
Well since marriage is a legal and civil "institution", and since those can always be altered to mean what society desires - you'd be wrong.
We can not legally make a dogs tail a leg.

Religious marriage has no legal or civil authority, let alone ownership of what a marriage is, or might be...
Be truthful to yourself, because I'm not lying to you.
The definition of marriage is the union of a man and a woman.

Anything else is like trying to call a dog's tail a leg.

If the law demands I call you my friend and I don't like you, does that really make you my friend?
Think about it.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#72
Aug 16, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you even know what ad hominem means?
Statement of Doctrine, Southern Evangelical Seminary
Norman L Geisler, co-founder, Frank Turek, alumnus

"We believe in the special creation of the entire space–time universe and of every basic form of life in the six historic days of the Genesis creation record. We also believe in the historicity of the biblical record, including the special creation of Adam and Eve as the literal progenitors of all people, the literal fall and resultant divine curse on the creation, the worldwide flood, and the origin of nations and diverse languages at the tower of Babel."

Punisher is right. They are afraid of the dark.

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#73
Aug 16, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
I DO know because all of astronomy, geology, cosmology, etc. point to the creator. God said in His word HOW He did it: he spoke it into existence. Just like with your evo, there are somethings we are unable to answer, but the problem is this: evo. says that great amounts of time and chance could bring about the universe. Science is about what is OBSERVABLE and TESTABLE! You cannot observe or test the past or chance. Because you cannot test/observe these things, then YOU are also basing your beliefs on faith: faith in science, faith in scientists' interpretations, faith that millions and millions of years and totally improbable chance could have caused something to come from nothing. The universe HAD to have come from something if materialism is true. Life had to have begun from something non-living if materialism is true. Materialism is fallacious from the start because it suggests that the material world is all there is, and THAT clearly is not true. Your religion of science and its prophet, Darwin, is even MORE reliant upon faith than mine is!
You're desperate now. We all know you don't know squat about science.

What about the tens of thousands of Christian clerics who accept evolution as the best explanation we have for the diversity of life on earth? Are they stupid and you're not?
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#74
Aug 16, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
I DO know because all of astronomy, geology, cosmology, etc. point to the creator.
Everything points to a creator for you because Mummy and Daddy and Pastor Billy Bob have pre-programmed you to believe in said creator, so naturally, everything points at him.
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
evo. says that great amounts of time and chance could bring about the universe.
No it doesn't LIAR. Science says no such thing.

And evolution is a biological theory -- it has NOTHING to do with cosmology, the age of the earth or universe, the "creation" of the cosmos, etc.
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
Science is about what is OBSERVABLE and TESTABLE! You cannot observe or test the past or chance.
Yes you CAN you MORON, how many times do you have to have it explained to you?

The observable, repeatable test and experiments of science can be run EITHER on the original event OR on the evidence left behind by that event -- in this case, fossils, geological strata, DNA genomes, etc. Ever heard of FORENSIC SCIENCE?

Evolution is BOTH observable and testable!
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
The universe HAD to have come from something if materialism is true.
A previous universe seems to be a rational, viable answer. Perhaps long string, maybe an eternal strong of previous universes.
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
Materialism is fallacious from the start because it suggests that the material world is all there is, and THAT clearly is not true.
"Materialism is fallacious from the start" because it disagrees with your fundamentalist Christian religious beliefs. That's all.
Cisco Kid

Modesto, CA

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#75
Aug 16, 2013
 
15th Dalai Lama wrote:
<quoted text>
Statement of Doctrine, Southern Evangelical Seminary
Norman L Geisler, co-founder, Frank Turek, alumnus

"We believe in the special creation of the entire space–time universe and of every basic form of life in the six historic days of the Genesis creation record. We also believe in the historicity of the biblical record, including the special creation of Adam and Eve as the literal progenitors of all people, the literal fall and resultant divine curse on the creation, the worldwide flood, and the origin of nations and diverse languages at the tower of Babel."

Punisher is right. They are afraid of the dark.
Me thin maybe dose dudes study at de Babel tower.żNo?
Cisco Kid

Modesto, CA

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#76
Aug 16, 2013
 
Gillette wrote:
<quoted text>
Everything points to a creator for you because Mummy and Daddy and Pastor Billy Bob have pre-programmed you to believe in said creator, so naturally, everything points at him.
..........
I gotta call red herring argument.
Gimme a break.
Any thinking person agrees that something happened a long time ago and then the Universe began.
We just don't have 'empirical' proof of the what.

There ain't too many plausible explanations for what.

Random chance?....Naah, too much order present.

Nobody plus nothing equaled something?
Fat chance for zero plus void creating stuff.

Alien beings playing around??
Then explain where they came from and where they've been lately.
Maybe just show me an ancient tome addressing it.

Divine intention by the all encompassing power we call God?
Syllogism dictates the logic of this sole proposition.

You don't even need a holy book to reach this conclusion, just a working brain.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#77
Aug 17, 2013
 
Cisco Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
Divine intention by the all encompassing power we call God?
Syllogism dictates the logic of this sole proposition.
A syllogism with one or more unproven, refutable or simply false premises, sure.
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#78
Aug 17, 2013
 
15th Dalai Lama wrote:
<quoted text>
You're desperate now. We all know you don't know squat about science.
What about the tens of thousands of Christian clerics who accept evolution as the best explanation we have for the diversity of life on earth? Are they stupid and you're not?
They have compromised themselves. It doesn't matter how many people call themselves Christian, they can still make mistakes and believe in erroneous information. Just because they all believe a thing doesn't mean the thing must be true!
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#79
Aug 17, 2013
 
Cisco Kid wrote:
<quoted text>
I gotta call red herring argument.
Gimme a break.
Any thinking person agrees that something happened a long time ago and then the Universe began.
We just don't have 'empirical' proof of the what.
There ain't too many plausible explanations for what.
Random chance?....Naah, too much order present.
Nobody plus nothing equaled something?
Fat chance for zero plus void creating stuff.
Alien beings playing around??
Then explain where they came from and where they've been lately.
Maybe just show me an ancient tome addressing it.
Divine intention by the all encompassing power we call God?
Syllogism dictates the logic of this sole proposition.
You don't even need a holy book to reach this conclusion, just a working brain.
Good! I would ignore this person as he/she has no common decency of interaction, but since you did, I like and agree completely with you!
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#80
Aug 17, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
They have compromised themselves. It doesn't matter how many people call themselves Christian, they can still make mistakes and believe in erroneous information. Just because they all believe a thing doesn't mean the thing must be true!
And just because they accept the scientific findings because of the voluminous EVIDENCE behind it doesn't mean they are bound for hell.

Indeed, you are likely to be standing right next to some of these Baylor biology and geology professors in heaven for all eternity as you caterwaul your absolutely dreadful non-denom, megachurch praise songs in the direction of Jesus' throne.

I wonder if Jesus has considered that he will need to keep his Holy Ears covered constantly for all eternity. LOL

“Wear white at night.”

Since: Jun 09

Albuquerque

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#81
Aug 17, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
They have compromised themselves. It doesn't matter how many people call themselves Christian, they can still make mistakes and believe in erroneous information. Just because they all believe a thing doesn't mean the thing must be true!
Exactly. Just 'cause y'all believe the entire fate of humanity hinges on an argument over a pomegranate between a naked lady and a talking snake doesn't mean it must be true.

In the interest of full discloser, I cast my lot with the smart people rather than a bunch of backwater hicks.

God bless you.
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#82
Aug 17, 2013
 
Update: still no reasonable answers to the questions.

1. The universe had to have had a beginning, and the rule of causality says that anything that begins must have a cause. If it had a cause, then it HAD to have had an agent of that cause. There is nothing in science that can explain how that supposed singularity itself came to be. Something had to have come before this singularity! If you cannot explain what came before it, then you cannot rule out anything that could explain it, unless there is irrefutable evidence against it (and that means just because YOU don't believe in the supernatural, negates its existence!).

2. Saying that some bacteria show the ability to exchange dna in some way other than through cell division does NOT illustrate how at some point two lower species could somehow develop the necessary sex organs, male and female AT THE SAME TIME, to be able to begin sexual reproduction. Also, evo scientists cannot explain what would cause such a thing to even need to come about, the natural selection factor, except by saying that some aspects of sexual reproduction are more advantageous. And what sort of mutation could occur to bring about the highly advanced method of sexual reproduction, which would require added information to the genome?! Information has never been observed to be added a genome from mutation. Mutation can result in positive advances, but not because the mutation itself is positive or adds information!
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#83
Aug 17, 2013
 
15th Dalai Lama wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly. Just 'cause y'all believe the entire fate of humanity hinges on an argument over a pomegranate between a naked lady and a talking snake doesn't mean it must be true.
In the interest of full discloser, I cast my lot with the smart people rather than a bunch of backwater hicks.
God bless you.
You will find out the truth one day. I hope you will see the light before it is too late!

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