Should Billy Graham's legacy be rescued?

Feb 13, 2013 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: Q-Notes

President Barack Obama with Rev. Billy Graham at his house in Montreat, N.C., April 25, 2010.

Comments
821 - 840 of 1,638 Comments Last updated May 29, 2013

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#836 Mar 29, 2013
barry wrote:
<quoted text>you don't know? but you make the accusation anyway.
let me help you out.
barry wrote:
<quoted text>#3 "17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil."
"The law was not superseded by the Christian dispensation"
[these came from your post]
your idea that a "Christian dispensation supersedes the law" is flawed.
first of all the law is our teacher that shows us our need of a savior because no of us can keep [fulfill] the law.
[this comes from Galations 3 of the Bible]
second of all Christ is the only person who could fulfill the law. he was tempted in all points like as we are yet without sin.
[this comes from Hebrews 4 of the Bible]
but he also is the only person who fulfilled the law in all of its prophesies concerning the promised redeemer.
[Acts 3:18]
so yes, he did not destroy the law but rather fulfilled it.
those are my sources. you see i still read the Book.
did he 'fulfill' the part where god said it is OK to own slaves? that was always one of my favorite parts of the cult...

how does a god say it is Ok to own another human?

“you must not give faith”

Since: Jul 12

Nottingham, UK

#837 Mar 29, 2013
barry wrote:
<quoted text>that's funny
the point is they didn't need his approval to stone her. he said go ahead if you can but they didn't did they.
Jesus was not he proper authority to be the accusation to. they didn't even bother to take her to the authorities now did they?
so there is no contradiction because they didn't follow the law.
"that's funny" so are you...
"the point is they didn't need his approval to stone her. he said go ahead if you can but they didn't did they." Because Jesus said that the man without sin may throw the first stone, how can you say that Jesus wanted to make them seek his consent when making criteria such as the above implies you wish to limit something? I have to say you can’t.
"Jesus was not he proper authority" well thats not news to me... but this is "they didn't even bother to take her to the authorities now did they?" read it again...“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery” http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...
The Pharisees and the teachers of law are the authorities, it wasn’t some mob that dragged the woman to Jesus it was the authorities them self’s.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#838 Mar 29, 2013
Benjamin Frankly wrote:
<quoted text>
"that's funny" so are you...
"the point is they didn't need his approval to stone her. he said go ahead if you can but they didn't did they." Because Jesus said that the man without sin may throw the first stone, how can you say that Jesus wanted to make them seek his consent when making criteria such as the above implies you wish to limit something? I have to say you can’t.
"Jesus was not he proper authority" well thats not news to me... but this is "they didn't even bother to take her to the authorities now did they?" read it again...“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery” http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...
The Pharisees and the teachers of law are the authorities, it wasn’t some mob that dragged the woman to Jesus it was the authorities them self’s.
You have to excuse barry: he does not think the bible says what it >>actually<< says, but rather it only says what he >>wants<< it to say...

... even if he has to make up totally different meanings for most of the words...

“Handsome white and black men”

Since: Jan 10

Interracial love

#839 Mar 30, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Then?
You cannot POSSIBLY be a follower of your jesus character.
You hypocrite, you.
This post made me laugh. Humans have a way of creating restraints and creating ways to wriggle themselves free from those restraints. Christians, especially are like this.One moment they are devoted followers of Christ, the next, they are only half devoted to him.

“you must not give faith”

Since: Jul 12

Nottingham, UK

#840 Mar 30, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
You have to excuse barry: he does not think the bible says what it >>actually<< says, but rather it only says what he >>wants<< it to say...
... even if he has to make up totally different meanings for most of the words...
Thats a given. I've given up on changing his mind this is now about vaccinating the readers

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#841 Mar 30, 2013
emperorjohn wrote:
<quoted text>
This post made me laugh. Humans have a way of creating restraints and creating ways to wriggle themselves free from those restraints. Christians, especially are like this.One moment they are devoted followers of Christ, the next, they are only half devoted to him.
And that---what you just observed (and accurately) is, to me, the definitive proof that these people have no magical/telepathic connection to anything outside themselves.

No "divine inspiration" in other words-- for if there WERE a single entity giving them guidance?

Would not we see a gradual >>convergence<< as to what they believe?

And over widely separated groups of "the faithful"? Groups who had no direct contact?

Indeed: we would see exactly that-- moreover, after 2000 years or so, we would see pretty much a united front, with only scattered heretic groups here or there, a tiny percentage of the otherwise uniform whole.

But. If this "divine guidance" is entirely a local hallucinatory effect?

Then the effect would be >>divergence<< of the core message, with the result being 1000's of slightly different groups, spread over the world.

And looking around? That is >>exactly<< what we see.
Lincoln

United States

#842 Mar 30, 2013
posts the same nonsense
over and over
is this nut paid by the word.

“Citizen_Patriot_ Voter_Atheist!”

Since: May 09

Earth,TX

#843 Mar 30, 2013
Lincoln wrote:
posts the same nonsense
over and over
is this nut paid by the word.
The truth is, that the truth will set you free, but only if you are capable of seeing the truth for what it is, and that's the truth.

Gods who are vivisectioned, so that they might be adapted to fit within the confines of any number of man's own personal adaptations of a religion, are hardly gods. The Abrahamic god is a great example, he has been sliced and diced so often that even who he once was claimed to be, is hard to imagine by looking at what he is now. If he were indeed a god, there would be no bits and pieces of him spread out across the planet, and with all these individual pieces (claimed to be) functioning as if they were the only "real" god chunks.

The god is long dead, he was torn asunder by the wheels of progress, and the first rip was inflicted by the iron chariots of yesteryear
buckwheat

Tulsa, OK

#844 Mar 30, 2013
No

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#845 Mar 30, 2013
buckwheat wrote:
No
Agreed-- Billy Graham ought to be sent to the same ugly dustbin of history as the likes of other tyrants who abused their power, and stole from the gullible.
buckwheat

Tulsa, OK

#846 Mar 30, 2013
no doubt

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#847 Mar 31, 2013
Lincoln wrote:
posts the same nonsense
over and over
is this nut paid by the word.
your conscience is speaking again.

“you must not give faith”

Since: Jul 12

Nottingham, UK

#848 Apr 1, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Agreed-- Billy Graham ought to be sent to the same ugly dustbin of history as the likes of other tyrants who abused their power, and stole from the gullible.
Perhaps we can expand this topic to cover the thieving Albanian dwarf mother Teresa, she to stole from the gullible and as far as I can tell did more evil than Graham could hope to do.
P.S. The Missionary Position by Christopher Hitchens is to me a most read on how we can be fooled by evil people which have the poor not on the front but back of their minds…

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#849 Apr 1, 2013
Benjamin Frankly wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps we can expand this topic to cover the thieving Albanian dwarf mother Teresa, she to stole from the gullible and as far as I can tell did more evil than Graham could hope to do.
P.S. The Missionary Position by Christopher Hitchens is to me a most read on how we can be fooled by evil people which have the poor not on the front but back of their minds…
I agree re: the evil monster Teresa.

I've not read Hitchen's book, as by the time I learned of him, I was already a freethinker myself, and saw little need for anymore convincing.:)

But I'll give it a look.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#850 Apr 4, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually? He did >>exactly<< that.
You just keep forgetting that part.
Classic Salad-Bar Christian: you pick and choose from the buffet of the NT.
barry wrote:
<quoted text>he didn't call us to be Jews.

so if he did perhaps you can enlighten us as to where and how he did. after all you've apparently read the book 100's of times so you should probably have it memorized by now.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#851 Apr 4, 2013
barry wrote:
<quoted text>barry wrote:
<quoted text>he didn't call us to be Jews.
so if he did perhaps you can enlighten us as to where and how he did. after all you've apparently read the book 100's of times so you should probably have it memorized by now.
No I don't have it memorized-- I haven't read it in over 5 years, apart from finding juicy quotes to embarrass you True Believers™.

But why not?

Your Jesus specifically commanded you to hold >>all<< the OT commandments, with special emphasis on 2 (naturally).

At no time, can you find ANYWHERE that Jesus said you could ignore ANY of the OT commandments, and do as you like.

No, that would be the heretic Paul, who never met Jesus while he was alive-- and his ludicrous claims of "meeting" Jesus after he died? Well... nobody else saw that, did they? No, they did not.. so Paul was just conning people... again.

In any case? Your Jesus commanded you to be a Good Jew.

You are just too lazy to do that: classic hypocrisy.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#852 Apr 4, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
Thy can call their time whatever they so please but all they are doing is taking their name and extending it back centuries. We see many wacky new Christian churches pop up and they claim they are the one and only true Christians going back to the apostles.
Anyone can make any such crazy claim and it is of no consequence without the documentation to back it up.
The oldest secular documented mention of the Pharisees were by Josephus late in his life towards the end on the first century.
It even admits this from your own link.
Sorry but I deal in fact, actual documented fact.
This makes the Jesus myth all the more silly as the term Rabbi was used to replace Pharisee and yet Jesus' followers on the bible supposedly called him Rabbi which clearly shows how late these texts were written.
<quoted text>
if we are arguing over the term Pharisee then you are right it was a name given to them.
however there is old evidence of them and they are referred to by other names. for example h&#259;bûrâ or the Perisha or Assidaeans. the name pharisee may have come from the aramaic "perisayya" which means seperated. so it actually may have been a name given to them by their detractors which they in turn embraced with pride as they called for a holy separated life.

" They called their members "&#7717;aberim" (brothers), while they passed under the name of "Perishaya," or "Perushim." Though originally identical with the &#7716;asidim, they reserved the title of "&#7717;asid" for former generations ("&#7717;asidim ha-rishonim"; see Essenes), retaining, however, the name "Perishut" (='&#913;&#956;&#9 53;&#958;&#943;&#9 45; = "separation," in contradistinction to '&#917;&#960;&#953 ;&#956;&#953;&#958 ;&#943;&#945; = "intermingling") "
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/12...

if that is the case then they are traced by their practices and doctrines. a dog is still a dog no matter what his pedigree. no pun intended.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#853 Apr 4, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
No I don't have it memorized-- I haven't read it in over 5 years, apart from finding juicy quotes to embarrass you True Believers™.
But why not?
Your Jesus specifically commanded you to hold >>all<< the OT commandments, with special emphasis on 2 (naturally).
At no time, can you find ANYWHERE that Jesus said you could ignore ANY of the OT commandments, and do as you like.
No, that would be the heretic Paul, who never met Jesus while he was alive-- and his ludicrous claims of "meeting" Jesus after he died? Well... nobody else saw that, did they? No, they did not.. so Paul was just conning people... again.
In any case? Your Jesus commanded you to be a Good Jew.
You are just too lazy to do that: classic hypocrisy.
so, you have no reference where Jesus commands us to be "good jews"
not even a reference where he said we had to follow all the OT commandments.

barry wrote:
<quoted text>barry wrote:
<quoted text>he didn't call us to be Jews.
so if he did perhaps you can enlighten us as to where and how he did. after all you've apparently read the book 100's of times so you should probably have it memorized by now.

your just a classic lazy wind bag.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#854 Apr 4, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
Your cherry picked spam doesn't change the fact that the story has been rewritten and that we have no documentation of the term Pharisee until the time of Josephus.
And Pharisee was replaced with Rabbi later on.... And what does the bible say Jesus was called?
Rabbi.
<quoted text>
when you refer to the name pharisee being replaced by the term rabbi you fail to acknowledge the evolution of the term. at that time it was an honorary title for the scribes. today it is used out of respect for anyone who would stand to read in the jewish houses of worship.

"RABBI, a Hebrew word meaning "my master," "my teacher." It is derived from the adjective rab (in Aramaic, and frequently also in Hebrew, "great"), which acquired in modern Hebrew the signification of "lord," in relation to servants or slaves, and of "teacher," "master," in relation to the disciple. The master was addressed by his pupils with the word rabbi (" my teacher"), or rabbenu (" our teacher"). It became customary to speak of Moses as Moshe rabbenu ("our teacher Moses"). http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Rabbi

jewish proselytizers were sent out to make twelve disciples and to teach them so that they could be sent out as apostles. sound familiar? guess what those disciples called their teacher? why it would be teacher/rabbi. we don't do that so much anymore here in America but if you travel to mexico the profesors are called "profi" so it would not be unusual or unheard of for a "rab" to be called a "rabbi" simply because it was recognized that he had a group of disciples.

so there is all kinds of documentation of the word existing even befor the time of Christ, it just wasn't really used as a title that was restricted to an honored position held by a distinct class of people.
barry

Rainsville, AL

#855 Apr 4, 2013
Reason Personified wrote:
<quoted text>It does answer the question: Could he write?. And the answer, apparently so. So why are these "pivotal to all mankind, words of Jesus" never scribbled down so that there could be no doubts as to his orders, to man*.
*Jewish man and Jewish woman, and Jewish children of a certain age, at which they became counted members of the tribe. All other humans(Gentiles) are as dogs. LOL! Just ask Jewsus. The savior mocks man's best friend and most of (mankind?).
because they were only "pivotal" to those present. the greater significance is why he wrote in the dirt. they being students of the "law" completely understood that by doing so he was actually keeping the law while condemning them. they themselves actually were trapped as being the law breakers.

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