Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 256552 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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Anon

Lakewood, OH

#183549 Nov 12, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>It would appear that as more people become educated in the sciences, childish religious belief evaporate. For every "God answer" that science supplies the "real" answer for, God becomes an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance.
Given enough time religion will cease to be important, and only a small pocket of delusional people will exist. Perhaps then, the divisiveness that religion has always caused will be no more, and people can finally realize the benefits of a cooperative society. One can only hope!!!
I have no idea as to what you're responding to. I'm an atheist. My rant is against fellow atheists emulating Christian services, including donations. The concept of atheist "churches" is absurd, yet it's catching on in England, and apparently some American losers are now joining the bandwagon. Read the original link.
Thinking

Royston, UK

#183550 Nov 12, 2013
I prefer to use the term "non belief" because you seem unable to absorb whole definitions.
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Happy to, Silky Pants.
But soon as I do, somebody will pop off and say "Atheism is a lack of belief".
Wait and see.

Since: Sep 08

Rocky Ford, CO

#183552 Nov 12, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Faith is a weak appeal, and rationality is superior. The success of rational skepticism has been stunning in the understanding of nature and in political philosophy, which is evidence for its validity. By contrast, there are no analogous successes for faith based thought, which has been sterile. This is evidence against such a way of thinking.
But this is not surprising. There is nothing that cannot be believed or asserted by faith, including its opposite.
I'm not sure who is an idiot, but being unable to distinguish between these radically different ways of thinking would be a good start.
You are too radicalized to be a rational skeptic.

It is something you try to associate yourself with, not practice. Plus you mistakenly associate it with "science". Science isn't "skeptical", it just tries to be rational.

You aren't a seeker of truth, IANS, you just react when the rest of the world doesn't meet your expectations. You are a frustrated elitist wannabe.

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Since: May 10

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#183553 Nov 12, 2013
EdSed wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, but Pew figures generally seem to suggest greater levels of superstition than the Gallop ones and even the Pew survey found 'decreasing religiosity'. I'd say that means decreasing levels of superstitious beliefs in gods. Generally, I think there are signs of improvement in the USA.
Many of those who still profess belief in god(s) now seem to subscribe to an amorphous, vague, initial 'creator'. Some of these 'nones' and agnostics don't even believe in an interventionist entity, much less one that is Abrahamic. Even LCNLin doesn't claim to be religious anymore.
I think that is the way it often goes. First, obviously silly Abrahamic gods and these ones...
godchecker.com
are rejected. Then increasing numbers realise there's no evidence of an interventionist god of any description or definition. Then, it is a small step to reality.
It took many years to overcome the acceptability of slavery in parts of the USA. Women's rights, anti-gay prejudice, etc, it all took time to overcome. I think religion is the last major bastion of superstition and we're looking at a gradual process of abandonment of it, not an event.
Established deities like the Abrahamic god(s) and its associated religions seem to be the ones losing out to the 'nones' and rationalists.
Religion = superstition
If a god exists, it has to be "amorphous".

Once linguistic symbols (words) try to encompass it, they are guaranteed wrong.

It is ineffable.

Still, people employ different symbolism for what they are convinced of, and I guess each is free to do that.

Even Ianus has professed the existence of spirituality.

That's something.

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#183554 Nov 12, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Buck doesn't recognize the concept of weak atheism.
Because it's a concocted dodge.

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#183555 Nov 12, 2013
Anon wrote:
This really has my blood boiling. Atheist mega-churches? Who are these idiots, and more importantly, why is this catching on? They're playing the same game as organized religion, right down to the collection plate. I shouldn't really be surprised, given enough time humans eventually screw everything up. I haven't been this pissed in years...
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/201...
You haven't been this pissed in years????

You live in Cleveland.

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Thinking

Royston, UK

#183556 Nov 12, 2013
Eff off.
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
It is ineffable.

Since: May 10

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#183557 Nov 12, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I suspect that you're looking from the perspective of somebody that has been taught that submission and the diminution of the self are virtues at somebody that has learned the opposite. To me, autonomy and self-actualization are virtues.
Christians tend to consider failure to submit an expression of inappropriate rebellion and foolish pride.
Christians missed the whole message.

We are in a self-centered age.

Is it resulting in contentment?

Seems like the opposite to me, if I read or watch the news.

There's a lesson in there.

I would state it, but then I'd be called stupid.

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Since: May 10

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#183558 Nov 12, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
So?
You did not read my post-- at all.
I agreed that the US is a religious country-- like Iran, Iraq and other theistic regimes.
It's the non-religious countries that are doing so much better than the US is.
In all the areas of civilization that **count**>
Sure. That's why so many are migrating away from the U.S. and none are immigrating in.

It's because other countries are doing so much better.

It's a wonder why our president left Kenya, huh?

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Since: Sep 08

Rocky Ford, CO

#183560 Nov 12, 2013
The defining characteristic of the standard issue of Topix atheist is their not listening to what others really say, but their lack of agreement with their emissions of dogma. Such lack of agreement then puts the other person into the opposing camp.

There was a lovely example of that yesterday.

Poor Anon must be scratching his head today. He has hardly been on the side of theists on this forum. But he made a mistake. He expressed disapproval of the atheist megachurches. Which is something a true intellectual and freethinking atheist would do. "Freethinkers" shouldn't need support groups such as that.

Go back and read some of the responses, notably the one by loony. Anon is now a fundie Christian in the eyes of Loony and a couple of others.

The more rational atheists on here may start to understand the calling into question of the mental states of some of our more exuberant atheists that occurs so frequently on here, and how they get caught in association with them by even the more rational middle of the roaders.

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Since: May 10

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#183561 Nov 12, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>It would appear that as more people become educated in the sciences, childish religious belief evaporate. For every "God answer" that science supplies the "real" answer for, God becomes an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance.
Given enough time religion will cease to be important, and only a small pocket of delusional people will exist. Perhaps then, the divisiveness that religion has always caused will be no more, and people can finally realize the benefits of a cooperative society. One can only hope!!!
We've seen those "cooperative societies", BlankBufoon.

The first thing that happens is the leaders start murdering their citizens.

The second thing is they begin to starve.

We'll send you some powdered milk. Good luck.

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Since: May 10

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#183562 Nov 12, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I think that you're telling me that I'm not an atheist unless I meet the definition for atheist that you prefer.
No, I'm telling you the definition of atheist.

If you believe there is no god, you are one.

If you believe otherwise, you might still call yourself one, and it troubles me not.

But it would be an imprecise claim.

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Since: Jun 07

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#183563 Nov 12, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I'm telling you the definition of atheist.
If you believe there is no god, you are one.
If you believe otherwise, you might still call yourself one, and it troubles me not.
But it would be an imprecise claim.
When you can prove the god your mental illness wills you to spread based on zero evidence, you won't need to spam the atheism forum with your disproven 2005 creationist rubbish.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#183564 Nov 12, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Faith is a weak appeal, and rationality is superior. The success of rational skepticism has been stunning in the understanding of nature and in political philosophy, which is evidence for its validity. By contrast, there are no analogous successes for faith based thought, which has been sterile. This is evidence against such a way of thinking.
But this is not surprising. There is nothing that cannot be believed or asserted by faith, including its opposite.
I'm not sure who is an idiot, but being unable to distinguish between these radically different ways of thinking would be a good start.
THAT'S IT!

Nothing could illustrate my point better than what you just said.

In your analysis, atheism is based on "rationality", and theism is based on "faith".

There's the cheat.

Both are based on faith.

Both infer an unknowable conclusion.

And that is precisely the reason for the attempts to dilute the meaning of "atheism" - so that a person can be an atheist and feel superiorly rational, or at least make the claim.

One side defines the terms to fashion their position and themselves into a sphere of intellect, knowledge, science, reason.

While delegating the other to "faith", as you just demonstrated.

It's perfect. The perfect example of the glaring fraud of this whole debate.

It is the fraud of Hitchens, Harris, Dawkins, etc.

I feel affirmed.

Anon

Lakewood, OH

#183565 Nov 12, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't been this pissed in years????
You live in Cleveland.
I actually live in the suburb of Lakewood, which is adjacent to the Cleveland border. My location suddenly changed to Cleveland about a month ago, probably something I did, but it's only Topix so who cares. If you're waiting for me to beat my chest and defend my city, well, I really can't so I won't. Even In prosperous times, Cleveland has always been a little behind, like someone's mildly retarded brother. If you have one of the Great Lakes in your backyard and you still can't produce a flourishing city, perhaps one should abandon all hope.
blacklagoon

Boston, MA

#183566 Nov 12, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
No devil.
Though my -ex comes close.
It's all in us - the divine and the diabolical.
The only devil is the ego.
Jesus said so, in so many words.
Oppps, most likely there was no such person as Jesus. Not a good idea to quote imaginary people. make you look.......err..crazy!!!
blacklagoon

Boston, MA

#183567 Nov 12, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Happy to, Silky Pants.
But soon as I do, somebody will pop off and say "Atheism is a lack of belief".
Wait and see.
Atheism is the LACK of belief, a REJECTION of the Theist claim that a God exists. Stupid IS forever by the way!!!!!

Since: Sep 08

Rocky Ford, CO

#183568 Nov 12, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>Atheism is the LACK of belief, a REJECTION of the Theist claim that a God exists. Stupid IS forever by the way!!!!!
Which proves you will live forever. Not here, but you are eternal after a fashion.

And you thought you were just a flash in the pan.

Nice to see there is a glimmer of rationality and intelligence buried in that ball of ego you are.

Since: Sep 08

Rocky Ford, CO

#183569 Nov 12, 2013
Anon wrote:
<quoted text>
I actually live in the suburb of Lakewood, which is adjacent to the Cleveland border. My location suddenly changed to Cleveland about a month ago, probably something I did, but it's only Topix so who cares. If you're waiting for me to beat my chest and defend my city, well, I really can't so I won't. Even In prosperous times, Cleveland has always been a little behind, like someone's mildly retarded brother. If you have one of the Great Lakes in your backyard and you still can't produce a flourishing city, perhaps one should abandon all hope.
Your ISP just moved the computer they use to connect to the internet. It's just a router.
blacklagoon

Boston, MA

#183570 Nov 12, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
We've seen those "cooperative societies", BlankBufoon.
The first thing that happens is the leaders start murdering their citizens.
The second thing is they begin to starve.
We'll send you some powdered milk. Good luck.
So I take it you do NOT agree that "God answers" when replaced by REAL science answers, that God become an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance?

I can see you're getting ready to invoke that tired old Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao argument. This is most usually done by those who understand little about the history involving those people. Do you count yourself as one of those ignorant to the history connected to these rulers?

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