Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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#180604
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
How informal?
Two band aids and a cork?
What style of fig leaf is in this fall?
Anything goes in The Holy Church of Catcher.

We even have our own thread.
Imhotep

Townsend, TN

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#180605
Oct 19, 2013
 

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In recent weeks, a spate of especially appalling jihadist attacks occurred—one on a shopping mall in Nairobi, where non-Muslims appear to have been systematically tortured before being murdered; one on a church in Peshawar; and one on a school playground in Baghdad, targeting children.

Whenever I point out the role that religious ideology plays in atrocities of this kind—specifically the Islamic doctrines related to jihad, martyrdom, apostasy, and so forth—I am met with some version of the following:“Bad people will always do these things. Religion is nothing more than a pretext.” This is an increasingly dangerous misconception to have about the human mind.

My pick for the most terrifying and depressing phenomenon on earth: A smart, capable, compassionate, and honorable person grows infected with ludicrous ideas about a holy book and a waiting paradise, and then becomes capable of murdering innocent people—even children—while in a state of religious ecstasy.

Needless to say, this problem is rendered all the more terrifying and depressing because so many of us deny that it even exists.
To imagine that one is a holy warrior bound for Paradise might seem delusional, but we live in a world where perfectly sane people are led to believe such floridly crazy things in the name of religion.
This is primarily a social and cultural issue, not a psychological one. There is no clear line between what members of the Taliban, al Qaeda, and al Shabab believe about Islam and the “true” Islam.

In fact, these groups have as good a claim as any to being impeccable Muslims. This presents an enormous threat to civil society, which apologists for Islam and secular liberals can now be counted upon to obfuscate.

Their determination that “moderate” Islam not be blamed for the acts of “extremists” causes them to deny that genuine (and theologically justifiable) religious beliefs can inspire psychologically normal people to commit horrific acts of violence.

Take a moment to consider the actions of the Taliban gunman who shot Malala Yousafzai in the head. How is it that this man came to board a school bus with the intention of murdering a 15-year-old girl? Absent ideology, this could have only been the work of a psychotic or a psychopath.

No doubt the assassin who tried to kill her believed that he was doing God’s work. He was probably a perfectly normal man—perhaps even a father himself—and that is what is so disturbing.

The fact that otherwise normal people can be infected by destructive religious beliefs is crucial to understand—because beliefs spread. Until moderate Muslims and secular liberals stop misplacing the blame for this evil, they will remain part of the problem. Yes, our drone strikes in Pakistan kill innocent people—and this undoubtedly creates new enemies for the West. But we wouldn’t need to drop a single bomb on Pakistan, or anywhere else, if a death cult of devout Muslims weren’t making life miserable for millions of innocent people and posing an unacceptable threat of violence to open societies.

Malala did not win a Nobel prize this week, and it is probably good for her that she didn’t. She absolutely deserved it—far more than several recent recipients have—but this recognition would have made her security concerns even more excruciating than they probably are already. Her nomination is said to have noticeably increased anti-Western sentiment in Pakistan—a fact that deserves some honest reflection on the part of Islam’s apologists. If for nothing else, we can be grateful to the Taliban for reminding us of what so many civilized people seem eager to forget: This is both a war of ideas and a very bloody war—and we must win it.

- See more at: http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/no-ordinar...

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#180606
Oct 19, 2013
 

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I_see_you wrote:
<quoted text>
Because those are the sub-topics that were brought up in this thread.... and if the title of this thread were in question form, the answer would be "No, it does not." I do not need much faith to understand what science has told me about the universe thus far and none of that points to a creator as of yet. If they show me some sign of a creator, or if someone else may be able to show me some sign of a creator, then it would take as much faith as religion.
There lies your problem, if you admitted you did need faith, THEN you could move on, and question those that claim they do not require faith. All these post are off topic. The truth is do to Atheist poor comprehension skills every single message tread any where, with any title has to be changed into "Intelligent design" and even then you turn it into strictly Christian Fundamentalist vs Atheist non believers/Fundamentalist. It makes me wonder if poor comprehension to a level of not recognizing you have a soul, is part of your religion.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#180607
Oct 19, 2013
 

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I_see_you wrote:
<quoted text>
Your loss.
I would feel the same way about you, but I think an atheist society sucks so much, you'd have tears and beg to come back here. It would be worse than burning in hell.

Since: Sep 08

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#180608
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
No, it's your habit of patronizing, and demeaning.
Especially women.
I patronize?

Are you serious?

You are describing yourself, you egotistical, self righteous product of indoctrination. I know you can't help it, but you should really try harder to be a real and caring human being instead of a morality mouther for profit.

.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#180609
Oct 19, 2013
 

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It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Because you keep bringing it up, among other reasons. Here you are bringing it up again. It's also relevant to any discussion on religion or atheism.
<quoted text>
Then you consider a discussion of deities to be off topic in a thread about religion and faith? I don't.
<quoted text>
That is correct. It's also correct that there is no need to.
<quoted text>
Man evolved from ancestral apes. That is beyond debate except among people defending creation myths, who, like all other non-evolutionary scientists, have no say in the debate. Christian evolution deniers are not taken seriously outside of their own circles.
<quoted text>
Why do you keep posting things like that? You're having a little trouble staying on topic.
Ok don't ask about The Christian God. Tell the atheist that ask. No ****, I had one atheist who ask me all about my God, then ball me out for not answering his questions, later ball me out for answering someone else's questions. Saying "I was off Topic" The 2nd time this worm meat did this, I actually predicted it would happen. The truth is we all have faith, until mankind knows all, that is just the way it is.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#180611
Oct 19, 2013
 

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It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You'll just have to get over it. It's a dominant theme in Western culture at this time, and the purpose of these threads. You seem to disapprove. I can easily imagine why, but I'll let you speak for yourself if you care to.
<quoted text>
You've said that before - just before you rejected my claim that I advocate for democracy, political freedom, peace, and tolerance, and lumped me with brutal authoritarians.
<quoted text>
Why point that out? Who's requesting you or anybody else to go down my road? Choose whatever road make sense to you. What I do is help others make better decisions in that department by pointing out the failuresand hypocrisies of Christianity.
In regards to your last response. Please stop acting so stupid. Why else would you want to challenge someone after they confessed they have faith not absolute proof. It makes all else you say so under handed. See you go beyond being anti-religion when you do that. Now you are trying to persuade, attempt to claim the absolute proven answer. That my friend is a religious movement. It is exactly why I would understand someone being anti-religion. In my book you offer the worse part of religion, without any of it's good. That is why I would never vote for someone of your sort. When you know what hits the fan, your sort will not be able to maintain their populist. You bitch about GW, and I never voted for him, but now you could see how good of a job he did keeping his populist quiet.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#180612
Oct 19, 2013
 

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It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
In what sense? Don't you reject science's position on the evolution of the universe and the evolution of life on earth?
You appreciate science the way I appreciate Christianity.
You are assuming I do believe in evolution and it does not prove that there is no God. The truth is the best answer is, the human race was created by an advance race. This could be so hard on some fans of science, that they deny there is a God period.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

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#180613
Oct 19, 2013
 

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EdSed wrote:
<quoted text>
And
<quoted text>
Page 8662.
An atheist is simply someone who believes in one fewer god than you.
Not really. 1st off. You could be anti-religious and believe in God. 2nd I do believe in every single God, therefore which God is the one you don't believe in?

Perhaps you do worship a God. It is the soul crusher. An effort to evolve into a lesser being without a soul.

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#180614
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
You are assuming I do believe in evolution and it does not prove that there is no God. The truth is the best answer is, the human race was created by an advance race. This could be so hard on some fans of science, that they deny there is a God period.
As usual, defeated creationists have a lot of ignorant opinions to share, but NO proof of god.

When will these bitter losers realise that opinions never convert anyone but FACTs do?

And the fact is that you're liars with no proof of god. It always comes back to this undeniable fact.

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#180615
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I patronize?
Are you serious?
You are describing yourself, you egotistical, self righteous product of indoctrination. I know you can't help it, but you should really try harder to be a real and caring human being instead of a morality mouther for profit.
.
Creationist loser who wants us all to believe that jesus rode on the backs of dinosaurs while keeping a straight face.

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#180616
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Not really. 1st off. You could be anti-religious and believe in God. 2nd I do believe in every single God, therefore which God is the one you don't believe in?
Perhaps you do worship a God. It is the soul crusher. An effort to evolve into a lesser being without a soul.
There is no such thing as anti religious, because there is no such thing as god in the first place.

Atheists are not anti-religious - we just ignore the mentally ill ramblings of disproven crap which you've been peddling for years with ZERO results and evidence.

You find the truth insulting because your cult has brainwashed you into believing you are right, when you have no evidence whatsoever and are lying.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#180617
Oct 19, 2013
 

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blacklagoon wrote:
I do know that the bible is the number one seller, but of course one has to take into consideration the fact that every hotel room in the world contains a Gideon Bible.
Not, if I've been there, it don't... I always take those ugly books for re-use as other stuff.

Common uses for a Gideon bible
(Warning! Do not read it-- it will make an atheists out of you)

## propping up a crooked table leg-- an adjustable prop, simply discard any excess pages until it's the perfect thickness

## propping up Junior at a table, so he can reach his plate-- it's also absorbent, in case of any accidental "spills". Use two or three if needed (duct tape them together so they don't slip)

## as a handy step-up to get to things on the high shelves-- use two if needed, interlace the covers to help keep them from slipping

## as emergency toilet paper-- I recommend keeping a couple of gideons in the bathroom, on the top of the tank, just in case you run out of the regular kind. Hint: if you rip out the pages, then crumple them up, then re-smooth, then repeat? It softens the pages, and makes them more absorbent too.

## as rolling papers for your friends who like to make their own tokes

## as emergency note-paper-- you can typically write in the margins-- useful for those last minute list-making, or emergency license plate write-downs (especially after you've just been hit-and-run by a car sporting those warning-fish symbols-- those are the worst)

## as an excellent source of craft paper for your paper machiae projects. The super-thin paper really conforms to your project's needs, especially when saturated with glue.

## those pages really make for the most excellent paper airplanes-- super light, but take folding quite well.

## Isn't it time you took up Origami? The super-thin rice paper in those gideons is perfect for those intricate paper-folding projects

## emergency liquid absorbers-- see the one about emergency toilet paper for tips on how to make those gideons even more absorbent

## shims-- when installing new windows or doors, who remembers to buy those thin wooden shims, to center the window/door in the frame? Use pages from an old gideon instead--it's perfectly customizable for the exact thickness needed. And the holding nails go right through without a problem.(irony noted)

## Roof patches-- bothered by sudden punctures in your roof? But it's raining, and you cannot safely patch the hole? Tear out several pages from a gideon, and roll it into a sharp cone-- force that into the hole, to temporarily stop the rain.

## emergency diapers for Junior-- out and about, and you run out of diapers for Junior? And you need a quick substitute? Simply tear out pages from that old gideon, and use that to wrap Junior's neither parts, use his regular (outer) pants to hold it all on, until you get home. Be generous-- there are plenty more gideons where that came from.

------

These are just a few suggestions for re-purposing those old bibles.

Just don't READ it-- reading it'll make an **atheist** out of you!

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#180618
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
You are assuming I do believe in evolution and it does not prove that there is no God. The truth is the best answer is, the human race was created by an advance race. This could be so hard on some fans of science, that they deny there is a God period.
Atheists don't deny god, because denial assumes you've already proved your god, which you haven't.

This lie is your favourite one. Even though its been explained to you that atheists don't deny, they disbelieve in your lying cult crap. And with good reasons.

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#180619
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
You are assuming I do believe in evolution and it does not prove that there is no God. The truth is the best answer is, the human race was created by an advance race. This could be so hard on some fans of science, that they deny there is a God period.
Evolution is a fact - the people that deny the fact of evolution are deluded fools who are scared of going to their doctor to get DNA evidence in their faces.

Your god myth is no substitute for years of hard evidence showing evolution to be true and undeniable - or at least among mentally well people.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

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#180620
Oct 19, 2013
 

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chipped nails wrote:
<quoted text>
It took a proctologist with a nutcracker to find your brain.
At least I **have** a brain...

... you?

Not so much.

I guess it was too much Jesus what damaged your brains.

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#180621
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
I do have solid proof of God
Not only is this complete bullsh*t, but you know it too and know that you are lying about this - completely shamelessly, with not a shred of evidence.

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#180622
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
In regards to your last response. Please stop acting so stupid. Why else would you want to challenge someone after they confessed they have faith not absolute proof. It makes all else you say so under handed. See you go beyond being anti-religion when you do that. Now you are trying to persuade, attempt to claim the absolute proven answer. That my friend is a religious movement. It is exactly why I would understand someone being anti-religion. In my book you offer the worse part of religion, without any of it's good. That is why I would never vote for someone of your sort. When you know what hits the fan, your sort will not be able to maintain their populist. You bitch about GW, and I never voted for him, but now you could see how good of a job he did keeping his populist quiet.
Your ignorance is at best astonishing and at worst, willfully deceptive.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

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#180623
Oct 19, 2013
 

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Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
No book has ever outsold the Bible in the history of Print.
Lie.

It's a lie that is easily refuted, too.

For example: the Harry Potter series? Easily outsold all the bibles in all the languages, in all the versions, for many years in a row.

And the #1 DIFFERENCE?

People bought the Harry Potter books.... to READ.

In contrast to the bibles, of which 90% were purchased to put into pews unread, or to be given away (again--unread) or to lie gathering dust on someone's shelf (unread).

The ***majority*** of bibles printed? WERE NEVER-EVER EVEN READ BY ANYONE.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

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#180624
Oct 19, 2013
 
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Agree
Some are entertaining, others bizarre, some are hate filled and blame us for societies ills.
I cannot - take serious... Gods.
'Our' theists add trouble, subtract pleasure, divide attention, and multiply ignorance. ;)
Simple LOGIC seems to annoy them.
They yearn for immortality yet fail to really consider paradise problems.
Hmm
Toilets in heaven?
Who cooks the food?
Those that renounce their earthly evil ways but get free admission... Provided they beg forgiveness PRIOR to death.
What a 'steaming pile of dogma'.
The Religious-Right wants to keep deformed fetuses and vegetable state victims alive while they approve of the killing of innocent women, children, and men in their "moral" wars, and thorough their cutting of social services.
Harrumph!
These religious institutions are in irreversible decline. They are ruled by moral and intellectual trolls. They have become arrogant and self-absorbed. Their sins are many. They protected criminals. They pandered to the lowest common denominator and illusions of personal fulfillment and surrendered their moral authority. They did not fight the corporate tyrants who have impoverished us. They refused to denounce a caste of Christian heretics embodied by the Christian right and have, for their cowardice, been usurped by bizarre proto-fascists clutching the Christian cross.
They have nothing left to say. And their aging congregants, who are fleeing the church in droves, know it. But don’t think the world will be a better place for their demise.But it's a good start!
Indeed.

The modern Tea Party, for example?

Everything they stand for-- is the exact opposite of the Traditional Bible's Jesus.

The exact opposite.

Yet?

If you ask a typical tea-bagger if he follows Jesus? He will tell you he does-- and at length, with side-paragraphs too.....

.. wait... what...?

It's sad that these people demonstrate such cognitive dissonance.

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