Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 258484 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Webbunny tumblelog.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180393 Oct 17, 2013
chipped nails wrote:
Then why is it that you can't enjoy your atheism, your liberation from religion, and have a personal experience of never talking about God anymore?
Don't you want people discussing your god?

I think that what you'll find is that we discuss your religion and the damage that it does to people and the culture more than its god. Many of us think that Christianity misrepresents itself as a religion of love and charity, or as a source of moral teaching. Many of us find too many Christians the be just the opposite. How is that possible if they're filled with a Holy Spirit? It seems to be a false claim to me.

How about you? What kind of a person are you? Has Jesus filled your heart with love? Did you receive promised gifts of the spirit including, "love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control"?
chipped nails wrote:
you hopeless moron ... you cheap thinking atheist ... I'll await your angry response , full of bigotry and name calling since you are a (hateful atheist™)
I see.

So you think that it's the unbelievers that bring anger, bigotry, hatred and name calling to the thread? What was said to you to set that off?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180394 Oct 17, 2013
chipped nails wrote:
Carl Sagan is in Hell.
You'd better hope not.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180395 Oct 17, 2013
chipped nails wrote:
Thanks for sharing your bullshit with us.
Thanks for sharing the fruits of your faith with us. I'm looking for evidence of the power of Christ to transform the lives of Christians. How else can a skeptic judge whether you are on to something real or not?

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#180396 Oct 17, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>Don't you want people discussing your god?

I think that what you'll find is that we discuss your religion and the damage that it does to people and the culture more than its god. Many of us think that Christianity misrepresents itself as a religion of love and charity, or as a source of moral teaching. Many of us find too many Christians the be just the opposite. How is that possible if they're filled with a Holy Spirit? It seems to be a false claim to me.

How about you? What kind of a person are you? Has Jesus filled your heart with love? Did you receive promised gifts of the spirit including, "love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control"?

chipped nails wrote, "you hopeless moron ... you cheap thinking atheist ... I'll await your angry response , full of bigotry and name calling since you are a (hateful atheist™)"

I see.

So you think that it's the unbelievers that bring anger, bigotry, hatred and name calling to the thread? What was said to you to set that off?
Exactly!...and expect the same response to this post. They can't seem to type without name calling and anger.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180397 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
Part of me finds it [sad] you cross the line of challenging religions to just being against them.

What do you mean? What line is that? What do you find objectionable about my posting? I thought that I was asking good, legitimate and thought-provoking questions, and making reasonable observations supported by evidence and argument. If you think otherwise, I wish that you would take the time and make the effort to answer the questions and rebut the observations.

The only religion that I challenge in these threads is Christianity, unless a Muslim show up to promote that faith. Why would that bother you? You say that you're not a Christian. Do you admire the Christians? If so, what part?
Robert Stevens wrote:
In the end you strengthen religious groups mainly fundamentalist Christians
How do I strengthen them? And why would that be bad? Do you want them weaker? If so, why?

Aren't these good questions asked sincerely and in good faith? What possible legitimate objection could you or anybody else have to them? Don't these questions deserve answers?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180399 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
Yes, I do believe in a separate God from The Christian God, but still I have a lot of respect for that God too. I believe in both sorts of Gods, the one that created us, and the ones we create.
Why do you respect a god that you don't believe exists? How do you respect something that you don't believe exists?

You seem to respect belief in something - in anything - more than belief in something real.

=======

What is your objection to posting such as this that you called it "cross[ing] the line of challenging religions to just being against them"? Weren't those reasonable questions? Wasn't that a reasonable observation?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180400 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
4) You talk about what you claim to have no believe in and frequently.

Note #4 is a real biggie.
You said that you are not a Christian. Neither am I. Yet it is only Christianity that either have addressed in our posting to one another thus far. I couldn't have discussed your religion. I don't know what you believe, and never will if you choose to keep it private.

So how are you different from the people that you are criticizing there?

========

Incidentally, I believe that the Christian church is very real. And I believe that the harm it does is very real.

And though I do not believe that it is accurate, I also believe that the Christian bible is very real.

The things I discuss are quite real.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180401 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't see how you could call that not being tolerant. People lie about God, and when it portrays God as not being perfect it is a false statement. To make up a God and have him jealous, is your problem. It does not change God.
But we're not discussing your god. We're discussing the character of the Christian god as depicted in the bible and by the church. That god is jealous according to the Christians' own scriptures:

"You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me" - Exodus 20:5

Do you respect that character and those ethics? I don't. Are you aware that billions of people use the book that that comes from as a moral guide? The god may not be real, but the message attributed to it most definitely is. Is that not worth discussing?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180402 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
Did you know many people consider it rude to ask someone, to prove their faith, after they have admitted, it's their faith?
Why is it rude to challenge faith? Is it rude to challenge skepticism, it's opposite?

Likewise, you commented earlier that I "cross the line of challenging religions to just being against them." You seem to be for religions. Have you crossed the line of defending religions to just being for them? Why is my being opposed to Christianity any less valid a position than you being for it? It seems to be nothing more than an arbitrary and unjustified declaration of self-goodness and other-badness.

We find a lot of this double standard. A Christian says Merry Christmas and considers it an act of good cheer. A non-Christian says Happy Holidays and is accused of waging a war on Christmas. That opinion assumes self-goodness and other-badness.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180403 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
My God just grant mankind free will.
How do you know about your god? How do you know that your god had any choice in the matter?

How do you know that your god is even aware of us? How do you know how it feels about us?

How do you know that your god isn't a race of gods?

Are those valid questions, or hatred of your religion?

Incidentally, if the Christian god and hell exist, then granting us free will was a horrible curse. It will have resulted in billions of souls needlessly going to hell to be tortured forever. Wouldn't creating us to love him the way we are created to love ourselves have been a greater gift?

Was that not also a good and valid question, or was that blind hatred of religion and the Christian god?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#180404 Oct 18, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
But what is love according to Christianity? It's highest form involves excruciating torture and death for no apparent reason.
Eagle 12 wrote:
One need not ask what is love if one has experienced love.
I think I know what love is, and I think that I have experienced it. It doesn't involve things like damnation or torture. Nor worship. What kind of love is involved in creating a hell and a devil, or in keeping souls conscious after death just so that they can suffer forever in the service of no legitimate purpose?

I find the Christian notion of love to be quite deformed, and not just what is called the god's love of man. How about the other direction - the love of God by man?

Is not love is a selfless act given for the benefit of the object loved? The Christian's love of god is entirely for the benefit of the one doing what is called loving. That's not authentic love to me, just like loving chocolate ice cream isn't authentic love.

And how about the Christian love of his fellow man? I think it's despicable the way the church scapegoats gays and atheists, driving both into closets by describing them as vile abominations that displease a good god. That's called love, too - you know, "love the sinner, but hate the sin."

Anyway, none of the three seems like love to me, which is why I asked the question, "what is love according to Christianity?"

Is this also hatred of religion, or are these legitimate issues worthy of discussion? Don't people have a legitimate interest in how their neighbors are being taught to think by the tens of millions?

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#180405 Oct 18, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
My God just grant mankind free will. The lack of perfection you note, is just man's blame for his own failures. I get the idea atheist life with their parents longer than the average person. they would never cooperate with survey, and they don't respect it as science, unless of course it favors their thought.
Can why your cult creates such ignorant and judgemental people? Why does it introduce this evil into the world?

I mean you can't prove your god, you're frustrated at science for showing up your cult every day of the week with hard evidence.

What kind of life is this?

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#180406 Oct 18, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
It’s ironic the very people who condemn God are the very ones that support the continuous murder of unborn children. Hypocritical to say the least. But I will not shy away from giving you an answer.
God ordered during “war” time the killing of Amaleks. A bitter enemy of Israel. Everyone including babies were to be killed. So you are correct.
Now let us go to modern times. The United States dropped two nuclear bombs on Japan during war time. Killing civilian populations including children and infants. They were vaporized and many died of radiation poisoning. But your rants don’t accuse the United States, your country of killing babies.
But your country did kill babies Doctor, and millions are still being killed because of the liberals who don’t see a problem with it. Oh unless God ordered it during war time. Then the hypocrites have a problem with it. In Vietnam the US Military was involved in killing of civilians. Remember the “My Lai” Massacre?
I don’t like it and don’t agree with it but it happened. You were a Army Vet Doctor. War is ugly and horrendous. There’s nothing clamorous about killing the enemy. But if you don’t kill him. He is going to hunt you down and kill you and your family. As we have been attacked by terrorist. Even in the city you now live in.
If our nation is ever attack by chemical or biological weapons. And we know who did it and the nations that supported it. I would hope our President would release the launch codes to the nuclear weapons hiding in the deep ocean in our submarines. Yes, I would be ok with mass destruction of the enemy.
And furthermore I would have at least considered nuclear weapons when innocent civilians were murdered on 911 by the thousands. If used the enemy would understand we mean business. Doctor, God meant business with Amaleks because he was tired of their sh*t.
Yes God did order the killing of the enemy. The same thing the United States did. And the very same thing the US Army did in Vietnam. And just about every major war in history it has happened. So now lets get real personal Doctor. What do you think about the millions of healthy infants being murdered by late term abortions because they are not wanted?
Tell us the truth Doctor, what is your opinion of killing babies during abortions?
While reading your post, I got that sinking feeling you get when you get bad news. The notion that there are millions of people out there that think like you is absolutely terrifying. You're OK with the possibility of a nuclear response to a chemical weapons attack (nice to see that bit of propaganda working out well), and you would have been OK with a nuclear response to 9/11, but you whine about abortions. And you try to use this nonsense to justify an act of genocide committed by your god.

Also, how have you not yet learned how to write in complete sentences?

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#180407 Oct 18, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Awe...survey? ;)
I thank you for the straight-line set up! ;)
Your God would like to thank you for your belief and patronage. In order to better serve your spiritual needs, He asks that you take a few moments to answer the following questions for his annual survey.
Please keep in mind that your responses will be kept completely confidential, and that you need not disclose your name or address unless you prefer a direct response to comments or suggestions.
1. How did you find out about your Deity?
___ Newspaper
___ Bible
___ Torah
___ Book of Mormon
___ Koran
___ Divine inspiration
___ Dead Sea Scrolls
___ My mama done tol' me
___ Near-death experience
___ Near-life experience
___ National Public Radio
___ Tabloid
___ Burning shrubbery
___ Other (specify):________
2. Which model Deity did you acquire?
___ Yahweh
___ Father, Son & Holy Ghost [Trinity Pak]
___ Jehovah
___ Jesus
___ Krishna
___ Zeus and entourage [Olympus Pak]
___ Odin and entourage [Valhalla Pak]
___ Allah
___ Satan
___ Gaia/Mother Earth/Mother Nature
___ God 1.0a (hairy thunderer)
___ God 1.0b (cosmic muffin)
___ None of the above; I was taken in by a false god
3. Did your God come to you undamaged, with all parts in good working order and with no obvious breakage or missing attributes?
___ Yes
___ No
If no, please describe the problems you initially encountered here. Please indicate all that apply:
___ Not eternal
___ Finite in space/Does not occupy or inhabit the entire cosmos
___ Not omniscient
___ Not omnipotent
___ Not infinitely plastic (incapable of being all things to all creations)
___ Permits sex outside of marriage
___ Prohibits sex outside of marriage
___ Makes mistakes (Glenn Beck, OJ Simpson)
___ Makes or permits bad things to happen to good people
___ When beseeched, doesn't stay beseeched
___ Requires burnt offerings
___ Requires virgin sacrifices
___ Plays dice with the universe
4. What factors were relevant in your decision to acquire a Deity? Please check all that apply.
___ Indoctrinated by parents
___ Needed a reason to live
___ Indoctrinated by society
___ Needed focus in whom to despise
___ Imaginary friend grew up
___ Wanted to know Jesus in the Biblical sense
___ Graduated from the tooth fairy
___ Hate to think for myself
___ Wanted to meet girls/boys
___ Fear of death
___ Wanted to piss off parents
___ Needed a day away from work
___ Desperate need for certainty
___ Like organ music
___ Need to feel morally superior
___ Thought Fred Phelps was cool
___ My shrubbery caught fire and told me to do it
5. Have you ever worshipped a Deity before? If so, which false god were you fooled by? Please check all that apply.
___ Mick Jagger
___ Rajanish
___ Baal
___ The almighty dollar
___ Bill Gates
___ Left-wing liberalism
___ The radical right
___ Ra
___ Beelzebub
___ The Great Spirit
___ The Great Pumpkin
___ The sun
___ Elvis
___ The moon
___ TV news
___ Burning shrubbery
___ Other:_________
If you are able to complete the questionnaire and return it to one of our conveniently located drop-off boxes by October 31 you will be entered in the One Free Miracle of Your Choice drawing (chances of winning are approximately one in 6.023 x 10 to the 23d power, depending on number of beings entered).
Haha... nice.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#180408 Oct 18, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
___ Wanted to know Jesus in the Biblical sense
Ahahahahaah.

“going back”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#180409 Oct 18, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
Can why your cult creates such ignorant and judgemental people? Why does it introduce this evil into the world?
I mean you can't prove your god, you're frustrated at science for showing up your cult every day of the week with hard evidence.
What kind of life is this?
Do you all have any faults? I am at a lose as to what my faith is called, But I know the spirit of something is in me. It is good and with so much grace. I never need to fight for it. I do not even need to explain it, I am just curious why people here are so sure of the comments you make regarding a higher power. Do you ever convince people like me? I am guilty of debating topic at times. It is just because I know the truth? I do agree with what you say, But all religions and beliefs are not without sin. I see so much judgment and anger in the choice not to consider maybe there is a God. I am not going to argue about it. You are pretty stubborn. No I am not educated may not make since, Is everyone like you without uneducated being?

/

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#180410 Oct 18, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Sweetness, you are horribly confused.
Nope. Each and every point can be shown to be valid from the norm of the BB theory, the current scientific understanding of the universe and cosmology, through duplicating your own words to describing my dislike of people like you and your selective version of freedom

No confusion whatsoever. However your inability to see the facts and deliberate ignorance may give you that impression (think on that) but that’s you problem, not mine.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#180411 Oct 18, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, my dearest lovey, NASA is noe back on line. An excerpt for your edification, or is that education?
"According to the theories of physics, if we were to look at the Universe one second after the Big Bang, what we would see is a 10-billion degree sea of neutrons, protons, electrons, anti-electrons (positrons), photons, and neutrinos. Then, as time went on, we would see the Universe cool, the neutrons either decaying into protons and electrons or combining with protons to make deuterium (an isotope of hydrogen). As it continued to cool, it would eventually reach the temperature where electrons combined with nuclei to form neutral atoms. Before this "recombination" occurred, the Universe would have been opaque because the free electrons would have caused light (photons) to scatter the way sunlight scatters from the water droplets in clouds. But when the free electrons were absorbed to form neutral atoms, the Universe suddenly became transparent. Those same photons - the afterglow of the Big Bang known as cosmic background radiation - can be observed today."
http://science1.nasa.gov/astrophysics/focus-a...
A seed, sweetie pie. Expanded and then settled down to grow according to a pre-established pattern.
Look up seed imbibtion. There is a temperature increase to start the process.
BTW, neutral matter is a tiny portion of the total matter. Plasma is about 99%. It is the stuff that does the forming, and is quite sensitive to EM.
Now, pick up your cellphone and call someone, triggering a series of events over distance requiring EM to initiate and accomplish such through pre-arranged matter to channel it, and through random movement of matter in the atmosphere. Perhaps the person, or device, on the other end will do what you want. Maybe not.
Sorry, I had to cut some of your rant to make this response.
You seem to be missing one vital point in the quote you supplied, the word “AFTER”

There is nothing about the status of any singularity, which you have often and repeatedly claimed.

So who is the confused one?

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#180412 Oct 18, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
I would hope our President would release the launch codes to the nuclear weapons hiding in the deep ocean in our submarines. Yes, I would be ok with mass destruction of the enemy.
And furthermore I would have at least considered nuclear weapons when innocent civilians were murdered on 911 by the thousands. If used the enemy would understand we mean business.
Okay, now who would you have used these nuclear weapons on?

Since Al Qaeda is very sparse and many living in caves, or hidden in populations or city's full of innocent people. You have a choice here, use a tactical nuke worth millions of dollars... to kill a couple of them or at best a half dozen of them hidden in caves. Or use a ICBM worth tens of millions of dollars to kill several of them and at best maybe a dozen to a couple dozen along with tens to hundreds of thousand's innocent people.

I can say to do the second would be a war crime in the least, and the start of WWIII at worst.
The first would be a terribly inefficient way to achieve any retribution.

But you saying is the same as saying you're considering being as evil and ruthless as the enemy.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#180413 Oct 18, 2013
chipped nails wrote:
<quoted text>
Then why is it that you can't enjoy your atheism, your liberation from religion, and have a personal experience of never talking about God anymore?
I'll even count it as proof there is no God if you would try it and succeed by never posting about religion and nagging about a God you don't believe in ever again.
Right now you are proving to us you are fearful that your faith in atheism is just too damn weak and insufficient.
Oh, and science does prove there is a God as nothing can explain scientific laws outside of the fact God created science, the elements, the order of matter, and put the laws of science in place, you hopeless moron. Only God could have done this from the beginning, you cheap thinking atheist.
*I'll await your angry response , full of bigotry and name calling since you are a (hateful atheist™)
Because fools like you won’t let him?

Do you actually have any comprehension of the hypocrisy in your post?

No of course not because you consider that your god is on your side so screw the facts.

You vomit spite and abuse and expect an angry response and then no doubt you will act all surprised, innocent and incredulous when that response upsets you

Wrong, E=MC^2 proves that no god as described in KJV Revelation 19:6 can exist in this universe at the same time as you.

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